ID - DeOrr Kunz Jr, 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #15

[ILOKAL]

Yes, IIRC, it was DK that bolsterd the story of "the newer black Rubicon". The creep in a jeep?

Yes, but that was all "according to Vilt".

 

[Leader6518]

Yes, but that was all "according to Vilt".

That was my point. The expensive looking black Rubicon all came from Vilt. It was never mentioned prior to this. There was extensive conversation going on about the creepy looking man staring that made the parents uncomfortable not being mentioned when DeOrr first went missing. It was only after the "woman" called in her account that the parents suddenly remembered the creepy man and the expensive looking Rubicon. My hinky meter went up with the use of "expensive" in both their descriptions.

 

[ClaireNC]

I guess Bessie was mistaken on this point. However, it is true JM didn't originally say she saw it but attributed it to the clerk at the store. Now...did the clerk at the store really say it? The Sheriff didn't mention anything about it and said the clerk saw a child with that description either. What he did say about the store was the clerk was probably too busy, IIRC. This indicates to me the story didn't come from the clerk in the first place.

This could also account for the classification of the story being a "farce" as Klein put it: There was no black truck...Rubicon or otherwise. (Except for DeOrr Sr's black truck)

I'm not really sure why this is confusing people. During the initial interview JM and DK said that a clerk at the store had reported a man in a black truck with a dirty child was in the store at around 6:00 pm the day Deorr Jr. disappeared. The sheriff later said that this supposed tip from the store clerk was never confirmed.

Two months go by and Vilt gets involved in the case and starts digging around for proof that Deorr was abducted. He gets the tip from the couple in Swan Valley who report a creepy guy in a black jeep. At some point JM says that there was a creepy guy at the store in Leadore staring at her and Deorr jr. when they were there at 12:00 noon the day he disappeared. According to Vilt, DK claimed that he remembers seeing a black jeep there during that noon visit.

It was two different stories about black vehicles that were in no way related. One black jeep that was reported to be there at noon and one black truck that a clerk might have seen at 6:00 pm that evening. LE and Klein have been unable to confirm either story.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

Another element in the farce. I mean, why on earth, if you just kidnapped a kid, would you TAKE HIM OUT IN PUBLIC to BUY CANDY, especially when he was crying? I mean, is this the most inept and amateur kidnapper ever? (Of course, he's a figment of the imagination, so . . . )

My thought has always been TMI. People making such claims when they are not true often tend to add tiny details to make the story seem more plausible.

ETA: Every time I use multiple quotes, it continues to pop up every time I quote people. Grrrr.

 

[ILOKAL]

That was my point. The expensive looking black Rubicon all came from Vilt. It was never mentioned prior to this. There was extensive conversation going on about the creepy looking man staring that made the parents uncomfortable not being mentioned when DeOrr first went missing. It was only after the "woman" called in her account that the parents suddenly remembered the creepy man and the expensive looking Rubicon. My hinky meter went up with the use of "expensive" in both their descriptions.

Yeah, I think that was Vilt's description, attributed to both women, IMO.

 

[giagreen]

I'm not really sure why this is confusing people. During the initial interview JM and DK said that a clerk at the store had reported a man in a black truck with a dirty child was in the store at around 6:00 pm the day Deorr Jr. disappeared. The sheriff later said that this supposed tip from the store clerk was never confirmed.

Two months go by and Vilt gets involved in the case and starts digging around for proof that Deorr was abducted. He gets the tip from the couple in Swan Valley who report a creepy guy in a black jeep. At some point JM says that there was a creepy guy at the store in Leadore staring at her and Deorr jr. when they were there at 12:00 noon the day he disappeared. According to Vilt, DK claimed that he remembers seeing a black jeep there during that noon visit.

It was two different stories about black vehicles that were in no way related. One black jeep that was reported to be there at noon and one black truck that a clerk might have seen at 6:00 pm that evening. LE and Klein have been unable to confirm either story.

Thanks you. Thats exactly how I remember it. Seems clear enough for me. I was just to lazy to chime in and say it.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

Vilt sure tried to muddy the water in this case. He wanted fingers pointed in every other direction except at the 4 people at the campsite. Much of what he said was unbelievable to me from the onset. I took it as him trying to come up with scenarios to keep his clients out of the spotlight while continuing to string them along.

I don't get the feeling Klein is doing the same at all. He really appears to be following the leads of the investigation instead of driving it where he would like it to go.

 

[TheTruthWillOut]

Vilt sure tried to muddy the water in this case. He wanted fingers pointed in every other direction except at the 4 people at the campsite. Much of what he said was unbelievable to me from the onset. I took it as him trying to come up with scenarios to keep his clients out of the spotlight while continuing to string them along.

I don't get the feeling Klein is doing the same at all. He really appears to be following the leads of the investigation instead of driving it where he would like it to go.

Though I tend to agree about Vilt, he wasn't the sole problem IMO. At least re: The black Jeep story.

 

[iluvmua]

I wonder when LE will speak out like KI has?

 

[Little Ol Me]

https://www.facebook.com/KleinInvestigations/?fref=nf,

In the post regarding the east Idaho story, KIC comments that they were not saying that JM lied about the Jeep Rubicon.

There was another comment yesterday, that is not there today, implying that the Rubicon "farce" stemmed from Mr. Vilt.

As far as the forensic evidence, it's nothing new. We've known about that for a long time.
SB said that he had sent evidence to the FBI for analysis some months back.

 

[ClaireNC]

Vilt sure tried to muddy the water in this case. He wanted fingers pointed in every other direction except at the 4 people at the campsite. Much of what he said was unbelievable to me from the onset. I took it as him trying to come up with scenarios to keep his clients out of the spotlight while continuing to string them along.

I don't get the feeling Klein is doing the same at all. He really appears to be following the leads of the investigation instead of driving it where he would like it to go.

I don't think Vilt intentionally tried to muddy the waters. He came into the case to help a friend and to get into the spotlight. After all, he is a politician. It seems like he bought into the idea that an abduction had occurred and took measures to investigate that possibility. He believed DK and JM's story and IMO he pulled out when he began to see that it was full of holes. We don't know if his actions hurt the case or helped it. For all we know, it might have been him that first scratched the surface of the "thing" that lead those that investigated after him to get to the point where they now are.

KIC took a very different approach and looked at the case with no preconceived notions. It seems like that approach might have worked.

<modsnip>

 

[kammiemc]

https://www.facebook.com/KleinInvestigations/?fref=nf,

In the post regarding the east Idaho story, KIC comments that they were not saying that JM lied about the Jeep Rubicon.

There was another comment yesterday, that is not there today, implying that the Rubicon "farce" stemmed from Mr. Vilt.

As far as the forensic evidence, it's nothing new. We've known about that for a long time.
SB said that he had sent evidence to the FBI for analysis some months back.

It's true. That was said very early on. I think the only difference is that we didn't know then that forensic evidence pointed to the fact that little boy is deceased.


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[kammiemc]

I wonder when LE will speak out like KI has?

I have wondered that too. They seem to be letting him be the current spokesperson for the investigation, just by remaining quiet. LE has fallen under such public scrutiny by some on SM (really wild accusations) I wonder if they might feel it is a good tact right now to have an independent party working on behalf of the family reiterate what they have said and add to it so that it will be more believable to those who have surmised that LE is biased and working against the family (or not up to par on their working knowledge of wildlife, haha)


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[CoverMeCagney]

I'm mighty confused about all these vehicles as your terminology is different so I've had a google and tried to English-ise them. Please correct me if I'm mistaken.

Rubicon = 4x4 like a Landrover/Range Rover (mainly owned by country folk or city slickers clogging up pavements on the school run!)
Truck = pick up truck with a cab and flat open back (mainly used by farmers / labourers, not a family vehicle as only has front seats)
Camper = like a campervan / small winnebago (used for touring holidays)
Suburban = looks like a mix between a 4x4 and an estate car. (don't know what to call this in the UK )

So which of the vehicles were driven by whom to the campsite? DK in the truck? Was IR driving? Was Grandpa driving? (surely not) Someone mentioned Grandpas camper and Suburban which has really confused me. Help!

 

[ILOKAL]

It's true. That was said very early on. I think the only difference is that we didn't know that that forensic evidence pointed to the fact that little boy is deceased.


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I don't BELIEVE it's the type of "forensic" evidence that would indicate such. IMO

 

[Lilibet]

I'm mighty confused about all these vehicles as your terminology is different so I've had a google and tried to English-ise them. Please correct me if I'm mistaken.

Rubicon = 4x4 like a Landrover/Range Rover (mainly owned by country folk or city slickers clogging up pavements on the school run!)
Truck = pick up truck with a cab and flat open back (mainly used by farmers / labourers, not a family vehicle as only has front seats)
Camper = like a campervan / small winnebago (used for touring holidays)
Suburban = looks like a mix between a 4x4 and an estate car. (don't know what to call this in the UK )

So which of the vehicles were driven by whom to the campsite? DK in the truck? Was IR driving? Was Grandpa driving? (surely not) Someone mentioned Grandpas camper and Suburban which has really confused me. Help!

BBM

Some trucks have extended cabs and rear seats.

A "camper" is actually an enclosed shell that fits in the bed of a pickup truck. It can be low or high, empty or with bed and kitchen.

A small Winnebago would be called an RV= recreational vehicle. I don't think one of these was at the campsite.

 

[Aunt_Tulip]

I'm mighty confused about all these vehicles as your terminology is different so I've had a google and tried to English-ise them. Please correct me if I'm mistaken.

Rubicon = 4x4 like a Landrover/Range Rover (mainly owned by country folk or city slickers clogging up pavements on the school run!)
Truck = pick up truck with a cab and flat open back (mainly used by farmers / labourers, not a family vehicle as only has front seats)
Camper = like a campervan / small winnebago (used for touring holidays)
Suburban = looks like a mix between a 4x4 and an estate car. (don't know what to call this in the UK )

So which of the vehicles were driven by whom to the campsite? DK in the truck? Was IR driving? Was Grandpa driving? (surely not) Someone mentioned Grandpas camper and Suburban which has really confused me. Help!

Lots of families have trucks. They have extended cabs, some have four doors, back seats. Its not unusual at all for a family vehicle to be a truck around here.

 

[TheTruthWillOut]

We've never seen the Suburban/camper but below is what I thought the setup was:



Regards whom was driving what I would guess: DK/JM/DK Jr in the Pick-up truck and GGP/IR in the Suburban. Does IR even drive? I believe GGP does/did.

 

[renarde]

Full video of news piece posted earlier, Klein interview... social media can be very dangerous. It sounds like possible witnesses may have requested anonymity.

http://www.localnews8.com/video/private-investigator-interview-on-deorr-kunz-jr-case/37525224

 

[Hoosier952]

The term camper is used to cover both the pull behind type like the photo above or a camper (shell or topper) that fits over the back of a truck bed here. Maybe a regional thing?