Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 16, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *Arrests* #51

[Forever Young]

And we know AxC had a gun as he kept it in a drawer in the bedroom when he Murdered CV.
So he may have carried one on himself or in his vehicle.
ALSO, CD may have had one at the house and carried one.
So, if there was a gunshot that day, per CD text to TD, then that is more than likely what happened, they used it on Tylee.
If there was NOT a gunshot that day but just a lie CD told TD to explain the dug up yard, then Tylee probably was NOT shot.
JMO

Since Lori's excuse with MG seems to be that everyone was trying to kill her, I have wondered if that won't be Lori's excuse concerning Tylee, too. "I had to shoot her in self-defense!"

Playing with ideas here, Lori could have told both Alex and Chad that Tylee was a suicide due to teenage angst.

If I really and truly thought my life was in danger, I may have had a gun and some training myself.

 

[Forever Young]

I basically agree with you. I think most people, myself included, just think "be kind". We've had a couple of instances here where people got all up in arms over roadside memorials being cleaned up by the highway department. Well, I understand someone lost their life there but it was becoming a distraction and a danger. Jmo

Also on private property, which puts the property owners liable for any accidents occurring there however that might happen, and it was sure to happen eventually. IMO

 

[CSIDreamer]

Also on private property, which puts the property owners liable for any accidents occurring there however that might happen, and it was sure to happen eventually. IMO

Hopefully, the mystery will be solved. I really do hope whoever took it down saved it to hand over to the children's families. Jmo

 

[fuzzybutter]

Another important element was Lori's claim that Alex didn't know the children's whereabouts, but Lori did. This could be used when Lori and Chad try to blame the children's deaths on Alex.

This a great example of what will get Lori—her constantly shifting stories. She does think well on her feet and she quickly spews out seemingly reasonable answers, but she doesn’t remember what she said yesterday. I bet there is an analyst somewhere noting all of her contradictions and inconsistencies.

 

[Nurse Gen]

Unless Alex packed a gun in his truck.... MOO.

Not caught up so apologies if this has already been pointed out, but AlC told LE that he always carries his gun with him. It's in the LE bodycam video of from the LEO interviewing AlC immediately after CV was killed

 

[Onsdag]

What you are saying is all fine. BUT...once they heard CD speaking of their moms death on that phone call and knowing he LIED to them, then they know he is a liar. Period. Did you listen to the call? He said he and Garth were with her when she died. He said his kids arrived within 20 minutes.

But, on a post right after her death, he said he awoke at 6 am Alone and she was already dead. The coroner came and said she had been dead since 2 am. He said on the call Tammy was sick with heart issues. Her children and parents said she was healthy and preparing for a marathon.

Which is it Chad?

As I recall, one of his sons (G?) was living in the same house with Chad and Tammy when she died. And his other children (excepting the missionary) were living nearby and could easily have been there within 20 minutes of learning of her death. I don't think he lied about any of that. And to make a distinction about when Tammy died and when they discovered her, while important, is perhaps being a little too pedantic in this situation. Chad and the one son would indeed have been there when she died, even if her death wasn't discovered for some hours.

Personally, there's more about the situation and Chad's narrative that bothers me than timing. For example, in one narrative he paints a picture of her dieing peacefully and unexpectedly in her sleep, almost as a sleeping beauty story, laying down serenely with a smile on her face and then simply not waking up. In another narrative we are informed that she was coughing and vomiting throughout the night, fell out of bed, and was found on the floor with pink foam coming out of her mouth. One story is of a peaceful happy passing, whereas the other depicts a quite disturbing and almost violent passing. Both taken together are contradictory. The fact that Chad claims he never woke up until several hours later, to me is suspect, if the details he shared are true of the more violent death. If she was coughing and vomiting violently throughout the night, tossing and turning, falling out of bed, etc., and these details come from Chad himself, then how is it possible that he wasn't concerned that something was wrong, or that he was able to fall asleep peacefully himself and not be disturbed or awoken sometime during the night (presumably sleeping in the same bed as her), until hours after she had already died? I call foul play based on that alone.

 

[Forever Young]

Plus she may have been getting SSI for JJ due to his autism, add that to the death benefit from CV and the death benefit from JR=she is getting a lot of federal govt money.
JMO

My understanding is that while JJ would have qualified for a Social Security payment due to CV's death, Lori herself would not. She was too young. Additionally, the benefit would have been less than the full amount since Charles was only 62, which is below full retirement age for SS. All this assuming that Charles had opted for taking early benefits. He may not have.

Even if at some point she would have qualified for a widow's benefit, upon re-marriage, she would lose that since she was no longer a widow.

This is why I have long thought that Lori's and Chad's marriage may not have been legally registered with the state because she could no longer claim any type of widow's benefit.

 

[mommacass]

All below MOO.

I thought that phone call was extremely interesting from a psychological standpoint. Almost like a professional interviewer would do.

I was cringing when it appeared that Lori knew something was up, (first starting at 6:10..escalates....) and questioned MG as to if she was taping or working with the police later in the call. And am I hearing things as it sounds like someone scribbling in background a few times at 10:15, and hard scribbling at 10:26... and 11:04 and 11:53 and other times, and like a piece of paper being torn at 12:05??? etc @ 14:45, 15:45 up through 18:05... always more scribbling it sounds like 18:40... Was Chad writing for Lori, or DW writing for MG?

There seemed to be a looooooooooong pause and I thought that from then on, Lori would be 100% guarded in her answers.
Snipped to shorten:

I too heard all the sounds. Some of them definitely resemble taking screen shots - that click click. I bet Chad was furiously writing what Lori should say. And Melani was taking notes, right by the recording phone. All IMO

 

[indicolite22]

Good post!

I heard the fast writing on paper in the background too (and now I'm going to go back and listen for the timing of that underlining!). I assume the writer was Chad, who is a little faster on the uptick than Lori is, so with MG's change in approach toward the two of them he more quickly became suspicious that MG might be questioning and/or recording for police.

When Chad subsequently piped in with his story about Tammy's failing health...and about conspiracy theories from his sister-in-law (Tammy's sister?), well he should have just kept his mouth closed because advancing false narratives about the victims of her crimes is the balayage blonde cheerleader's schtick, not his. Hanging back for most of the call and than speaking up to interject that preemptive defense tale just revealed his own consciousness of guilt about his part in Tammy's demise. Had it been heard in a full courtroom, guffaws would have been heard all around. "Hand caught in the cookie jar and mom's not buying you meant to reach into the chore jar."

That call by MG was a stroke of genius. MG took a bat to that "I can do and say anything without consequence and you can't question it because I'm a god" pedestal Chad had hoisted Lori on, it shattered to pieces beneath her, and Lori dumped out words like ballast in her attempt to stay aloft as she tumbled down to earth. Bravo.

Apparently days earlier there was a shorter call (before Dec 6, not recorded?, source is first EIN interview) from MG and DW to Chad's phone about Lori not having "testimony" (corroboration) for her religious claims and also about the children's whereabouts. Lori and Chad must have known they were being recorded on the second, longer call.

 

[mrjitty]

Another important element was Lori's claim that Alex didn't know the children's whereabouts, but Lori did. This could be used when Lori and Chad try to blame the children's deaths on Alex.

Yes.

That is why the conspiracy aspect is Important event if AC did the actual murders

LV took actions in relation to the joint venture before and after ...

Especially because the murders are separated by 2 weeks she has conspiratorial actions that happen before the murder of JJ

 

[nhmemorymaker]

Speculation going around that it could have been given away randomly to help or even just one special person here. But again it’s speculation. So I have no clue. All jmo moo

Edit to add: do not blame them, I honestly don’t know just ramblings I’ve heard. Looking for physical picture evidence.

Edit a second time: I removed the bolded letters. Will update further down in a new post.

Clever, SleuthD

 

[Forever Young]

Another important element was Lori's claim that Alex didn't know the children's whereabouts, but Lori did. This could be used when Lori and Chad try to blame the children's deaths on Alex.

Apparently days earlier there was a shorter call (before Dec 6, not recorded?, source is first EIN interview) from MG and DW to Chad's phone about Lori not having "testimony" (corroboration) for her religious claims and also about the children's whereabouts. Lori and Chad must have known they were being recorded on the second, longer call.

Yes, but.....

There is no law when it comes to lying to your friend about what someone else knows, and Lori was not under "oath". She has lied so much, that casts shade on anything she says, IMO.

If any other phone calls were made that appeared "adversarial", as Lori says in this conversation, why would they talk with MG to begin with? Sweet Melanie? She was lucky they picked up the call at all.

Doesn't sound like Chad and Lori had been questioned by MG about JJ before this, or challenged on why Lori told police that MG had him in her care.

 

[Campizi67]

I personally did not think that this call revealed much of anything, except that Lori admits she lied in telling police that JJ was with MG, and lied to MG about sending JJ to live with Kay.

I have thought to myself that if it were me who made that phone call that I would have been looking for more than just exonerating myself for lying to police. I think I would have offered to go check on JJ for Lori and offered to take him myself for a while. I would be wondering who was closer to Lori than myself.

While I sympathize with MG for being drawn into this by someone who she thought was a friend and who she though "loved" her, my personal opinion is that MG shows very little concern at this time for JJ, and more for herself for being in trouble for lying to police about having sent JJ back home with Lori.

Half the phone call is then filled with quoting Mormon scripture, which is just filler to the actual content.

IMO

I agree with your thinking. I also believe there were a lot of people in their circle who knew something was up and knew they had not seen the kids in a while but "chose" to brush it off or look the other way.

I have observed families having a tendency to look the other way in certain situations. When there is an obvious sign of a problem with or without an involvement of children, a family member or close friend may start discussing this secretly and then when it's suggested to do something about it, it is hindered by; well, if you say something we may never get to see them again or if you say something it may cause problems or fighting.... So, nothing is said.

Then when something horrible happens there is guilt, regret and silence.

I'm not saying this is the case with this situation but... if it walks like a duck....

 

[dixiegirl1035]

Very interesting!! After watching CD "Assist" Prior, during the prelim,
I mean we all saw it, he was directing and taking notes, etc.... and now that you have presented this thought, I think it's completely possible that CD was passing LV notes guiding her narrative during that recorded call with MG.

Even though we suspect LV to be a manipulator, CD as cowardly and weak as he may seem, he likes to control narratives.

He is the "author" in the group. Imo I think he just may have been the one directing the narrative all along. Someone with a better grasp on the timeline may be able to refute or support this idea.

I think that this was a shock for many to hear that were not shared prior, including Chad's family.

But yet, I have now listed to again and again and again, and MOO there is someone on the two ends of the line that is writing and scribbling to give notes to the other. MOO, I have my opinion strongly as to who it was.

 

[indicolite22]

As I recall, one of his sons (G?) was living in the same house with Chad and Tammy when she died. And his other children (excepting the missionary) were living nearby and could easily have been there within 20 minutes of learning of her death. I don't think he lied about any of that. And to make a distinction about when Tammy died and when they discovered her, while important, is perhaps being a little too pedantic in this situation. Chad and the one son would indeed have been there when she died, even if her death wasn't discovered for some hours.

I don't know if their children would agree that Tammy's health had been failing her for a while and that she was "physically falling apart" (Chad's words), while refusing to go see a doctor. I seriously doubt the children expected Tammy to die. There was zero mention of Tammy's known, worsening and untreated physicall illnesses in the media before MG's recording.

 

[nhmemorymaker]

I don't think it has been proven that she left Yellowstone alive. I keep thinking about that.

same here. They are so specific as to Yellowstone being the last sighting.

 

[nhmemorymaker]

I don't think it has been proven that she left Yellowstone alive. I keep thinking about that.

same here. They are so specific as to Yellowstone being the last sighting.

I don't know if their children would agree that Tammy's health had been failing her for a while and that she was "physically falling apart" (Chad's words), while refusing to go see a doctor. I seriously doubt the children expected Tammy to die. There was zero mention of Tammy's known, worsening and untreated physicall illnesses in the media before MG's recording.

We did get an idea of her being either very sad or disturbed the day before she died. That thought always makes me disturbed and sad... I just feel she knew something......

 

[mickey2942]

I’ll never understand how CV could have wanted her back. Nobody is *that* good a cook, if you get my drift.

He was addicted. Codependent relationship. My heart goes out to his family, who just watched the spiral and couldn't do anything to help him.

If you read about addictive relationships, they actually affect the brain, flooding the receptors with endorphins, when there is the "euphoric" high of making up. It can be as addictive as heroin. And just as deadly.

 

[mommacass]

On last night's show with Tricia, she offered the script of Chad and Lori's phone call the day the children's remains were found. Is it on this site somewhere? Many thanks for helping me locate it.

 

[Forever Young]

I agree with your thinking. I also believe there were a lot of people in their circle who knew something was up and knew they had not seen the kids in a while but "chose" to brush it off or look the other way.

I have observed families having a tendency to look the other way in certain situations. When there is an obvious sign of a problem with or without an involvement of children, a family member or close friend may start discussing this secretly and then when it's suggested to do something about it, it is hindered by; well, if you say something we may never get to see them again or if you say something it may cause problems or fighting.... So, nothing is said.

Then when something horrible happens there is guilt, regret and silence.

I'm not saying this is the case with this situation but... if it walks like a duck....

You are preaching to the choir here! People if they can avoid it at all will choose not to be involved for all kinds of excuses. What if they are wrong after all and end up looking like the fool?

I have myself called CPS on someone, but only after careful discussion with other witnesses. It is not something to be done lightly.

But, it happened to me and my sister back in the 1960s when things like child abuse were never discussed and a man's home was his castle. Very hard 50 years later to figure out all the other adults, including my mother, who should have known something and did absolutely nothing. I'm afraid it happens more often than not.