Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 16, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *mom arrested* #45

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sunflowerchick said:
Respectfully snipped by me...

Does anyone have thoughts about TD's text to Chad? If I said "good for you" in a text reply to the text Chad sent, it would be a sarcastic tone because I'm mad about something. She also didn't reply "love you too". I wonder if she suspected anything at that point?
Click to expand...

No doubt suspected he was a man child.

MOO
 
Perhaps the reason some parts of the investigation were earlier sealed is because of these snippets about witnesses' children/spouses/ex spouses etc being called dark or zombies. I can see where such comments would be taken as a possible threat to their safety, or an intimidation tactic. Even if the comments were relayed earlier in the timeline, LE (and the courts) might still view such info seriously.


The new Lori Vallow charges are "Conspiracy to commit destruction, alteration, or concealment of evidence" along with Chad Daybell and Alex Cox listed as co-conspirators.

Very interesting. This leaves them open to go further with more serious charges if more evidence uncovered over time.
 
Ohmeohmy said:
Justin Lum Fox 10 Phoenix
Justin Lum Fox 10 Phoenix
7 mins ·
BOUDREAUX CASE: Brandon Boudreaux has just filed a few responses in the custody battle with Melani Pawlowski, Lori Vallow’s niece.

Here are my takeaways from the new documents. Pages 1-3 show an affidavit of Gilbert PD detective Ryan Pillar. He’s investigating the murder attempt on Boudreaux from 10/2/19. In the affidavit, he calls Pawlowski a “person of interest” and not a suspect in the case. Pillar says Boudreaux never kept his or his children’s whereabouts from law enforcement. In October, Boudreaux was informed there were concerns over his and his kids’ safety. The day after the shooting, Pillar made contact with Pawlowski to let her know what happened. On 10/16/19, Pillar says Pawlowski contacted him regarding her kids but never again after that.

On page 4 in this post, Boudreaux cites Madison County Prosecutor Rob Wood who is the special prosecutor in both cases against Lori Vallow and Chad Daybell. He says Wood calls Pawlowski a person of interest in other felonious acts as well as the disappearance of JJ Vallow and Tylee Ryan who are both now dead.

Important to note there is a protection ordered petitioned by Natalie Pawlowski against her ex-husband Ian (now married to Melani). The order protects their two kids and Ian can only have supervised parenting time. Documents say since the renewed Protection Order on 6/5/20, Ian has not had any contact with his kids.

In another response, Brandon Boudreaux says Melanie Gibb (Lori Vallow’s former best friend) was told by Pawlowski that two of her own kids are “zombies.” Gibb is supposed to testify in the case. According to Boudreaux, Gibb also tells him Pawlowski allegedly said he went from “dark” to “zombie” and that he was once in Hitler’s tight group of friends when Hitler was alive.

The next hearing is set for July 1 in Maricopa County Family Court

**I am disgusted with this entire group and now add in a Hitler reference! MOO
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My 2 favorite parts
MP is a POI in other felonious acts, INCLUDING the disappearing children who are now both confirmed deceased.

MP's media interviews throughout this litigation are filled with conflicting statements from one interview to the next.

Well, yeah,,,we've been discussing this with each interview, listening to her word salad and contradicting herself all over the place.
Keep talking and getting on TV MBP-- you are helping the case.

On a side note- it was sad to read the IP has not bothered to see his kids -- so another family harmed and affected by these selfish, awful, crazy bunch.
 
sunflowerchick said:
Respectfully snipped by me...

Does anyone have thoughts about TD's text to Chad? If I said "good for you" in a text reply to the text Chad sent, it would be a sarcastic tone because I'm mad about something. She also didn't reply "love you too". I wonder if she suspected anything at that point?
Click to expand...

CD was noted as telling LVD that Tammy was jealous, and was upset the day she died. I do not think it a big leap that she knew or suspected. CD may have even tried to sell her on it - after all he appears to be lazy, LVD is too prissy to do work, who would have kept up everything for him? Unmasking a narcissist is immensely dangerous. If she knew or he tried to sell her on being a sister wife and she acted disappointed he would practically be required to get rid of her. The damage to his ego would be too immense to deal with her disappointment.
 
Spartygirl said:
My 2 favorite parts
MP is a POI in other felonious acts, INCLUDING the disappearing children who are now both confirmed deceased.

MP's media interviews throughout this litigation are filled with conflicting statements from one interview to the next.

Well, yeah,,,we've been discussing this with each interview, listening to her word salad and contradicting herself all over the place.
Keep talking and getting on TV MBP-- you are helping the case.

On a side note- it was sad to read the IP has not bothered to see his kids -- so another family harmed and affected by these selfish, awful, crazy bunch.
Click to expand...

I keep hoping that IP who called his ex-wife and told her to protect the kids is still in him somewhere. Dude is a total simp. :p
 
The First Article said:
General observation - in general men and women here are seeing Tammy's interactions and behaviours very differently about with the degree of suspected covert abuse Tammy was subjected to. The men are giving far more leeway to Chad being normal in his interactions with Tammy than the women are in general.

You are getting women's perspective that what the men in general are seeing as not that bad, not really abusive, we cannot judge a married couple, and women giving the usual room that you might be right....

But most know the men doing this are wrong. :) Just so you all know you're really just getting women doing the usual and backing down a bit from it while in their head knowing the men doing this don't get it. We get lots of practice at it. Diminishing abusive tendencies in other men even in the face of enormous evidence of his aberrant behaviour is ... weird. Normal but not great. CD isn't not "usual men" so granting him the grace you would a bro is inappropriate.

In this case, men may want to give some room for women probably having a better idea of what is going on with another woman dealing with a guy who thinks he knows everything and diminishes everything about her.

I am using you here but I mean this in a more generalized comment meant for rhetorical purposes. As some people have noted already many of the people on this thread seem to have some overlapping experience and covert abuse diminishment and normalizing abusers in such an extreme case is likely to start going sideways. Hoping that an early warning about it might head off a disaster.
Click to expand...

I value greatly your insights here and elsewhere into the psychological dynamics of abusive relationships. I think they're important and easy to overlook or discount, and I have no doubt that you speak from experience and research. I also agree that men and women will have different perspectives based on their own experiences. Both generally by gender, also by age group, other demographics, and especially by individual experiences.

Still, I stand by what I said and I think it applies equally to all of us. You can only gain so much insight from 3 words in the only text conversation you've ever seen between two individuals you've never met (unless, of course, you are psychic and/or can commune with the dead!). Tone is very hard to interpret from any text-based conversation, and this is well-documented. The likelihood in doing so without sufficient context, in my experience, is that you will often simply be projecting your own feelings or insecurities onto what you're reading. I am guilty of doing this more often than I'd like to admit.

JMOO and I do respect what you're saying.
 
ZoriahNZ said:
Perhaps the reason some parts of the investigation were earlier sealed is because of these snippets about witnesses' children/spouses/ex spouses etc being called dark or zombies. I can see where such comments would be taken as a possible threat to their safety, or an intimidation tactic. Even if the comments were relayed earlier in the timeline, LE (and the courts) might still view such info seriously.


The new Lori Vallow charges are "Conspiracy to commit destruction, alteration, or concealment of evidence" along with Chad Daybell and Alex Cox listed as co-conspirators.

Very interesting. This leaves them open to go further with more serious charges if more evidence uncovered over time.
Click to expand...

Fair. When the way to "help" a zombie kid is to kill their body to release their soul and that is the only way to do so, that threat is quite credible. Particularly since she was clearly already okay with exactly that. She may be trying to get those kids to "release" their souls from limbo. It was obviously okay with her with other children.
 
The First Article said:
CD was noted as telling LVD that Tammy was jealous, and was upset the day she died. I do not think it a big leap that she knew or suspected. CD may have even tried to sell her on it - after all he appears to be lazy, LVD is too prissy to do work, who would have kept up everything for him? Unmasking a narcissist is immensely dangerous. If she knew or he tried to sell her on being a sister wife and she acted disappointed he would practically be required to get rid of her. The damage to his ego would be too immense to deal with her disappointment.
Click to expand...
Tammy would not have suspected Chad of anything up until the day he told her a dead ancestor told him to tell her to drive to Springville alone. If she did, she would have thought he was not righteous enough to be communicating with dead ancestors. Any suspicions she had would have had to have been after her return from her parents, if she had any at all. I feel quite solid in saying that as of October 5th at least, Tammy did not know anything was up or that there were strange goings on that she believed in. MO
 
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The First Article said:
I tried the Wayback Machine and the podcasts and their mirrors still don't show up. The pages do, but the videos and podcasts are gone.
Click to expand...

I may run a crawler to see if I can grab copies of these, though it's a little trickier with media files. I'd expect a lot of this stuff to show up in trial but that may be a long wait.
 
scapa said:
I may run a crawler to see if I can grab copies of these, though it's a little trickier with media files. I'd expect a lot of this stuff to show up in trial but that may be a long wait.
Click to expand...

If you find some I'd love to know how you got at them. My curiosity and annoyance at the CYA of the supposed righteous people around CD is pretty enormous at the moment.
 
Spartygirl said:
My 2 favorite parts
MP is a POI in other felonious acts, INCLUDING the disappearing children who are now both confirmed deceased.

MP's media interviews throughout this litigation are filled with conflicting statements from one interview to the next.

Well, yeah,,,we've been discussing this with each interview, listening to her word salad and contradicting herself all over the place.
Keep talking and getting on TV MBP-- you are helping the case.

On a side note- it was sad to read the IP has not bothered to see his kids -- so another family harmed and affected by these selfish, awful, crazy bunch.
Click to expand...
Totally agree with your side note. I thought the same thing, BUT if IP is choosing to remain with MP knowing EVERYTHING that has come out now, then those poor children will be better off in the long run. Still very sad situation for all of these innocent children involved in this mess!
MOO
 
pizzaman12 said:
Can we sticky this. Ha ha
Click to expand...

Zombie raccoons are no joke:

"Picture in your mind the movie Elf, starring Will Ferrell, and think of the scene where Buddy finds a raccoon and tries to give it a hug. Not wanting to be touched, the raccoon rips Buddy apart.

Animal control officials say that’s what can happen when someone approaches a raccoon with Canine Distemper."

Zombie raccoons in Provo? A warning from Provo police
 
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