Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 17, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *mom arrested* #44

[gumchew]

Maybe Alex the truck driver had a way of getting fentanyl?

That's plausible. Good call, I hadn't considered that.

 

[GoneGoldfishin']

Here's the thing: when you look at the murders/deaths of Charles, Tammy, Tylee, and JJ, CD and LV each have something to gain from them, apart from any supposed religious motivations.

To me, AC killing these four people (two whom he appeared to care deeply for, and one whom he may not have ever even met) solely out of religious fervor... feels like we're missing something. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm don't recall reading anything about AC being a particularly religious/spiritual person prior to all this, and just the fact that he had facial hair makes me suspect he wasn't strongly invested in the LDS community (here in Utah, that's usually a fairly good sign someone isn't LDS).

I wonder if there was some other sort of manipulation (blackmail, even?) at play here. I mean, I love my siblings, but there are limits to what I'd do for them, and watching the police footage of LV's attitude after CV's death, she doesn't seem concerned in the least bit at the possibility that her brother may be facing murder charges. I know we've mentioned how unfeeling she seemed toward CV, but the fact is, she doesn't really seem to be going out of her way to protect AC, either.

MOO

I was just pondering the same thing.. Alex certainly did not have the same kind of motivation to participate in the murders . It has to be more than just an unhealthy dedication to his sister, and I dont buy that he believed in the zombie garbage "100%" like Melanie claims (she is a snake as well, IMO). I too feel like we are missing something. I do have to say, the mention of facial hair as an indication of not being LDS made me laugh, I have never heard of that, and my brother who is in the bishopric in his ward frequently grows a full beard. Moo.

 

[wnk]

I do have to say, the mention of facial hair as an indication of not being LDS made me laugh, I have never heard of that, and my brother who is in the bishopric in his ward frequently grows a full beard. Moo.

Does he live in ID/UT/AZ? Maybe it's not so much a thing outside of that corridor? It's definitely a thing in our area!

 

[GoneGoldfishin']

Yes we are in AZ.

 

[gumchew]

I'm not a lawyer either, but my guess is sure he can. Defense is a strategy that has to be discussed and decided upon, I believe. Remember Jose Baez framing Casey's defense on blaming George Anthony for Caylee's death? Surely he knew that wasn't true.

I think this is referred to as "suborning perjury", and it's a crime. For a lawyer specifically, it's not only a crime, but a very serious ethical offense that would result in some kind of disciplinary action, maybe even disbarment in a high profile case like this one. @vislaw or @AZlawyer please correct me if I'm getting it wrong.

ETA: I just realized @vislaw already answered the original question, and talked about how defense counsel could "suggest" things in a roundabout way to LVD. So I guess there is "wiggle room" here. But if counsel knowingly encourages her to lie, and is artless enough to be obvious and careless enough to be caught, I'm pretty certain that suborning perjury would be on the charge sheet.

 

[indicolite22]

Here's the thing: when you look at the murders/deaths of Charles, Tammy, Tylee, and JJ, CD and LV each have something to gain from them, apart from any supposed religious motivations.

To me, AC killing these four people (two whom he appeared to care deeply for, and one whom he may not have ever even met) solely out of religious fervor... feels like we're missing something. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm don't recall reading anything about AC being a particularly religious/spiritual person prior to all this, and just the fact that he had facial hair makes me suspect he wasn't strongly invested in the LDS community (here in Utah, that's usually a fairly good sign someone isn't LDS).

I wonder if there was some other sort of manipulation (blackmail, even?) at play here. I mean, I love my siblings, but there are limits to what I'd do for them, and watching the police footage of LV's attitude after CV's death, she doesn't seem concerned in the least bit at the possibility that her brother may be facing murder charges. I know we've mentioned how unfeeling she seemed toward CV, but the fact is, she doesn't really seem to be going out of her way to protect AC, either.

MOO

It doesn't matter so much if he was religious before, at the time of the murders he appeared to strongly believe in the cause. MBP told IP that "Al had great faith and never wavered in his trust in the Lord. No task would be too difficult or great for him." Alex himself told MG that he believed in zombies. It is likely that he was the one who shot at BB. That could have been another murder.

 

[vislaw]

I think this is referred to as "suborning perjury", and it's a crime. For a lawyer specifically, it's not only a crime, but a very serious ethical offense that would result in some kind of disciplinary action, maybe even disbarment in a high profile case like this one. @vislaw or @AZlawyer please correct me if I'm getting it wrong.

Jose Baez made the claim against George Anthony in his opening statement, which is not evidence. I believe his tactic was unprofessional but it was not suborning perjury and, to my knowledge, he was not subject to any bar complaint for the ploy.

Here's an interesting comment made by an analyst:

The law professor and others agreed that Baez danced on the line of what is proper for a defense lawyer and perhaps went over that line a few times, placing his career at risk to some extent for his client.

He tried to introduce expert testimony not previously disclosed to the state - and may still face sanctions for that behavior.

He repeatedly attempted to have witnesses talk about documents not in evidence. He called out the prosecution - especially retiring Assistant State Attorney Jeff Ashton - a few times in open court. He delivered a startling opening statement accusing Casey Anthony’s father George of molesting his daughter and covering up his granddaughter’s death.

It’s a statement that will not be soon forgotten - especially because so much of what was claimed was not proven during the trial. But in the end, it did not matter. As he noted in his closing, Baez didn’t have the burden of proof, the state did.​

It is a MUCH different situation when an attorney suborns perjury and he/she absolutely may NOT put a client on the stand if they know the client will testify falsely. Alex Cox is not going to be of much help to this pair as a scapegoat given the extraordinary provable involvement both had with him and his conduct.

 

[Diddian]

It doesn't matter so much if he was religious before, at the time of the murders he appeared to strongly believe in the cause. MBP told IP that "Al had great faith and never wavered in his trust in the Lord. No task would be too difficult or great for him." Alex himself told MG that he believed in zombies. It is likely that he was the one who shot at BB. That could have been another murder.

CD assigned Alex the level of 2 in LV's "Family History," at least one full level below every other member of LV's family by blood. In Chad's chart, that level includes billions of people, including most LDS.

I wonder what CD taught was the fate of those who were 2's during the "trials and tribulations" and whether that teaching factored in to Alex deciding to take on a role as a special "angel who can make bodies disappear" (as LV described to CV) so that he could raise his level above that fate.

 

[MdlAgedCatLady]

Regarding the satellite imagery shown on the KSL broadcast, I've spoken to the reporter and he advises that there is a second image taken on that date by the Pléiades satellite. Unfortunately, it has cloud cover obscuring the property. I discussed obtaining the October imagery to look at JJ's site and he says it appears the only suitable image is late October and the station, at this time, has decided it doesn't merit the cost of acquiring the image given the time elapsed from the burial date. He said that may change as things heat up.

You are just awesome. Thank you so much for contributing to this group!

 

[RBofHV]

Had the chance to stop by the Daybell property on my way home from Montana. This property is right by the road, not hidden at all from view. But this is a country road and does not have very much traffic. I saw a few people drive by also looking at the property. It is so sad to see all the signs, bows, posters, and teddy bears all along the fence line. Chad would have been seeing this every time he was at that house. I saw on the door of one of the homes right across the street a sign that said “No Press”.

 

[CSIDreamer]

Had the chance to stop by the Daybell property on my way home from Montana. This property is right by the road, not hidden at all from view. But this is a country road and does not have very much traffic. I saw a few people drive by also looking at the property. It is so sad to see all the signs, bows, posters, and teddy bears all along the fence line. Chad would have been seeing this every time he was at that house. I saw on the door of one of the homes right across the street a sign that said “No Press”.

Now his family members who live in that house see this everyday. I wonder what they think of that. Jmo

 

[Synergizer Bunny]

Maybe the release of the photo doesn't mean anything in particular...

Did the FBI say where they found this photo? If not, maybe, they found it on one of the many burner phones that were confiscated.

By releasing this photo, it was a message to CD and LVD that they have the phones and have recovered the data on them.

JMO.

 

[gumchew]

But is that MNN in the prison?

I hope someone who knows pipes in here... I have wondered at times, about what cable channels are permitted in prisons, and which may not be permitted. I have daydreamed about "what if prisoners watched Fox news all day", or Court Tv, or Dateline. you get the gist....are their restrictions.

I think -- maybe I totally misread it! -- that the reference to "MNN" mean "the grapevine" (i.e. informal communication) among Mormons, via word-of-mouth. If we assume that the prison's demographics follow the state's demographics, then around 1/4 of the prisoners could be assumed to identify as Mormon. It's an effective, if not super efficient, communication newtork.

If I totally misread the meaning of this, then I apologize in advance

 

[GRT]

I was just pondering the same thing.. Alex certainly did not have the same kind of motivation to participate in the murders . It has to be more than just an unhealthy dedication to his sister, and I dont buy that he believed in the zombie garbage "100%" like Melanie claims (she is a snake as well, IMO). I too feel like we are missing something. I do have to say, the mention of facial hair as an indication of not being LDS made me laugh, I have never heard of that, and my brother who is in the bishopric in his ward frequently grows a full beard. Moo.

Maybe it's more popular in some geographical areas than in others. I know when I grew up, my friend's dad and brother had to be clean-shaven. But, maybe not all LDS choose to observe that.

 

[Jankee]

That's plausible. Good call, I hadn't considered that.

DEA controlled substances were shipped for incineration under VERY rigorous guidelines, not likely any driver coud have easily gotten this as each container is inventoried and sealed and accompanied with a chain of custody form.

 

[gumchew]

Did the FBI say where they found this photo? If not, maybe, they found it on one of the many burner phones that were confiscated.

By releasing this photo, it was a message to CD and LVD that they have the phones and have recovered the data on them.

JMO.

After looking closely at the photos and @vislaw's analysis and the histogram, I think it most likely they were both taken by the same person on the same phone and I feel pretty strongly that it's an iPhone.

My thought is the first photo was retrieved from a secondary location such as a computer device or web-based account (hence lower resolution), which explains the decreased resolution, and the second photo was retrieved directly from her personal iPhone. This is maybe meant to signal that they have the *actual phone* that was used that day (where they may not have previously).

This latter bit assumes that LE would go to the trouble to silently "signal" anything at all.

 

[Synergizer Bunny]

...This latter bit assumes that LE would go to the trouble to silently "signal" anything at all.

If there is damning evidence on the phone, it may get the weakest link to break. Just speculating, of course.

JMO.

 

[BingleBongle]

LVD & Zulema must be working overtime (albeit I think their aim is off).

4.6-magnitude earthquake hits near Stanley

There have been quite a few aftershocks this size in the area after the 6.1 on March 31. I installed the Quakefeed app on my phone that day (our house shook in SW Idaho!) and it beeps at me pretty often! I haven't felt any more of them at my house, but friends in Nampa have felt the 4-ish magnitude ones.

 

[BuySellTrade]

Here's the thing: when you look at the murders/deaths of Charles, Tammy, Tylee, and JJ, CD and LV each have something to gain from them, apart from any supposed religious motivations.

To me, AC killing these four people (two whom he appeared to care deeply for, and one whom he may not have ever even met) solely out of religious fervor... feels like we're missing something. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm don't recall reading anything about AC being a particularly religious/spiritual person prior to all this, and just the fact that he had facial hair makes me suspect he wasn't strongly invested in the LDS community (here in Utah, that's usually a fairly good sign someone isn't LDS).

I wonder if there was some other sort of manipulation (blackmail, even?) at play here. I mean, I love my siblings, but there are limits to what I'd do for them, and watching the police footage of LV's attitude after CV's death, she doesn't seem concerned in the least bit at the possibility that her brother may be facing murder charges. I know we've mentioned how unfeeling she seemed toward CV, but the fact is, she doesn't really seem to be going out of her way to protect AC, either.

MOO

For some time I have wondered if LVD controlled AxC by blackmail. There is the incident where LVD was angry at AxC and aid that he brought shame on the family. What if LVD blackmailed AxC over being gay (which had not been as accepted in LDS and associated to the degree of society as a whole)? Realizing that AxC was an older brother then wondered if something darker and deeper was a factor, specifically incest gong back to childhood. If so, this explains much about LVD and how she acts out as an adult and the love-hate angel-protector-hitman relationship between LVD and AxC. I think AxC became a risk and a burden and was murdered too.

 

[wenwe4]

Maybe it's more popular in some geographical areas than in others. I know when I grew up, my friend's dad and brother had to be clean-shaven. But, maybe not all LDS choose to observe that.

I know someone who refused to accept the Bishop position for nearly 1 year and a previous Bishop had to cover after moving out of the area until this man finally agreed to shave his beard. Maybe the "rule" becomes a "suggestion" the further you move away from SLC? IMO