Deceased/Not Found IL - Yingying Zhang, 26, Urbana, 9 June 2017 #10 *Still Missing*

[Stratescoop]

Thank you all for the updates this week, very helpful. So sad for YYs family.

Tough to figure out the Michelle testifying angle. Thanks for all the thoughts posted to try and figure it out.

Following is just MVHO:

The U of I mental health folks that testified were likely coached very heavily by the U of I attorneys on what to say and what not to say as much as possible while also being truthful due to the pending civil case. Likely told to say the very minimum while answering the questions posed to them. Which is understandable.

My gut feeling is that in the end the U of I will settle out of court with YYs family to avoid trial even if the attorneys for the U of I think they are in the clear because:

1. The U of I just wants this case settled and off the front pages ASAP.

2. The U of I doesn't want to damage their reputation with the substantial number of future Chinese students and families. Foreign student tuition is a large source of funding for the Univ.

During my days at the the U of I, I never used the services of the Univ mental health services. I'm not sure I even knew that service was available but I did go to the U of I McKinley Health Center a few times for minor health issues. The McKinley doctors that I saw, the hassles of trying to schedule an appointment, and the services in general were all less than good (to say it as nicely as possible) from my personal experiences. I ended up just using my family dr since my hometown was fairly close.

Other students I knew shared my views and the humorous nickname that was commonly used for the U of Is McKinley Health Center was "McKillme" (no disrespect intended for the current case, this was a long time ago).

Anyway, I think they will settle out of court with YYs family for an undisclosed sum (in the low $millions) and confidentiality agreement for the above stated reasons. The U of I may also have some kind of blanket liability insurance to cover costs of a settlement like this.

Again, just MVHO. No amount of money will bring YY back, sadly for her family and friends.

 

[Raptors001]

U Of I Colleagues Describe Christensen As Promising Student Who Lost His Way
there's a link in this to Brendt's babyphotos.. I just read it.. looked at them... good luck
Exhibits | Central District of Illinois | United States District Court

You gotta be kidding !? Baby photos ? Did they put baby photos of yyz? This case is as crazy as the murder itself.

 

[Raptors001]

Wow. He had bad dreams as a child. He was" quiet ". Hard worker. Even a flippin excellent triple jumper??!#
Who gives a flyin flick?? Bsstard killed and mutilated an innocent small girl.
And doesn't even have the decency to let her parents have her remains.
Know what is the most disheartening, saddest part of all of this ?
Many of us have wondered and searched and quetioned...where could she be?
Right?
I'm just kinda realizing that having her remains...is the Zhangs family's best case scenario.
Omg. I mean..yeah BC is gonna be punished..one way or the other...but does that really help them heal?

The defense is trying to paint what a great person bc is 9 years before the murder ? What kind of defense is that ? Anyone ?

 

[Raptors001]

Thank you all for the updates this week, very helpful. So sad for YYs family.

Tough to figure out the Michelle testifying angle. Thanks for all the thoughts posted to try and figure it out.

Following is just MVHO:

The U of I mental health folks that testified were likely coached very heavily by the U of I attorneys on what to say and what not to say as much as possible while also being truthful due to the pending civil case. Likely told to say the very minimum while answering the questions posed to them. Which is understandable.

My gut feeling is that in the end the U of I will settle out of court with YYs family to avoid trial even if the attorneys for the U of I think they are in the clear because:

1. The U of I just wants this case settled and off the front pages ASAP.

2. The U of I doesn't want to damage their reputation with the substantial number of future Chinese students and families. Foreign student tuition is a large source of funding for the Univ.

During my days at the the U of I, I never used the services of the Univ mental health services. I'm not sure I even knew that service was available but I did go to the U of I McKinley Health Center a few times for minor health issues. The McKinley doctors that I saw, the hassles of trying to schedule an appointment, and the services in general were all less than good (to say it as nicely as possible) from my personal experiences. I ended up just using my family dr since my hometown was fairly close.

Other students I knew shared my views and the humorous nickname that was commonly used for the U of Is McKinley Health Center was "McKillme" (no disrespect intended for the current case, this was a long time ago).

Anyway, I think they will settle out of court with YYs family for an undisclosed sum (in the low $millions) and confidentiality agreement for the above stated reasons. The U of I may also have some kind of blanket liability insurance to cover costs of a settlement like this.

Again, just MVHO. No amount of money will bring YY back, sadly for her family and friends.

Yes.

 

[Raptors001]

I just had a thought. Did she help him dispose of the remains and she would be implicated if they were found? Is that why he won't tell? Is that why she stood there naked when the FBI called? Why is she still supporting him otherwise?

The Paul Bernard case with with Karla homolka rings a bell for me when you mention this. ... tag team ... Karla got 12 years as an accomplice and now has a few kids of her own after she help kill. How do you like that?.

What do you think mz life is going to be after ?

 

[Raptors001]

was wondering about that.. think she wore red today too from court sketch.

Now I have heard said in woowoo circles that wearing red gives one confidence and power... But I think it highly unlikely BC moved in woowoo circles.. but it may form part o many martial arts training theories too... why was she under subpnoea?

From my psych class, red supposed to attract attention and people would be more likely listen to you.
Don't they both like to wear black ?

 

[Raptors001]

Ben

elicia Li, with the UI Counseling Center, said she consulted with the intern who interviewed Christensen Match 21, 2017. (

Said they discussed voluntary hospitalization, but Christensen wasn't willing to do that (2/10)

Said there was no clear intent and plan for suicide. she called him the next day to make sure he was OK. "I called bc I was concerned about his safety," she said, after he didn't call them. (3/1

Said she wasn't aware at that point about Christensen's specific plans for suicide, his thoughts and plans of harming others or his fascination with serial killers (4/10)

They believed that he would return for his next appointment, which he did nine days later. (5/10

ennifer Maupin, a former clinical counselor, then testified. She focused on Christensen's alcohol issues. She said a group of four clinicians/students reviewed his case before he returned. (6/

Maupin met with him and then he met with another counselor, and he was referred to Rosecrance, which he apparently never went to. She said the UI counseling center is meant to be for short term care. (7/1

Defense trying to show that UI Counseling Center didn't follow its own policies. At one point, they were going over the student code with Li, who said, "this is actually the first time I've seen the student code." (8/1

Now on break for lunch. Two more witnesses expected today. Another UI counselor and an expert to testify about what she thinks UI counselors should've done with Christensen. (9/1
(this is BS, they're dragging in the civil case)

This is all sensitive testimony because the counselors are being sued by Ms. Zhang's family for negligent and wrongful death. (10/1

Did yyz estate Sue this mz ? Mz can write a book to help bc ...profit off the death of yyz..

 

[tresir2012]

The Paul Bernard case with with Karla homolka rings a bell for me when you mention this. ... tag team ... Karla got 12 years as an accomplice and now has a few kids of her own after she help kill. How do you like that?.

What do you think mz life is going to be after ?

I'm also following the Sydney Loofe trial which has been happening side by side with this trial. The perp in that is desperate to save his co accused and has admitted lying 85% of the time. In this trial, the accused has said nothing except for the taped confession. I am not ruling out he had some help.
MOO.

 

[Raptors001]

You are describing the END of the marriage -the last year/year and a half. They want to paint a picture of the entire marriage and try and show that Brendt was basically a good guy, who just hit a downward spiral and it culminated on June 9th. If Michelle comes off as an unsympathetic character, they won't give credit to ANY of the good things she says about him -they'll only remember the bad last part of the marriage, and not buy or care about her characterization of Brendt earlier in the marriage and when they were dating...

For them to have her paint him in a positive light (outside of his BS on the 9th of June), they have to have her seen in a positive light. Thus, the character rehabilitation.....

There are many reasons why a woman want someone else. .Better....just saying...

 

[kittythehare]

Thank you all for the updates this week, very helpful. So sad for YYs family.

Tough to figure out the Michelle testifying angle. Thanks for all the thoughts posted to try and figure it out.

Following is just MVHO:

The U of I mental health folks that testified were likely coached very heavily by the U of I attorneys on what to say and what not to say as much as possible while also being truthful due to the pending civil case. Likely told to say the very minimum while answering the questions posed to them. Which is understandable.

My gut feeling is that in the end the U of I will settle out of court with YYs family to avoid trial even if the attorneys for the U of I think they are in the clear because:

1. The U of I just wants this case settled and off the front pages ASAP.

2. The U of I doesn't want to damage their reputation with the substantial number of future Chinese students and families. Foreign student tuition is a large source of funding for the Univ.

During my days at the the U of I, I never used the services of the Univ mental health services. I'm not sure I even knew that service was available but I did go to the U of I McKinley Health Center a few times for minor health issues. The McKinley doctors that I saw, the hassles of trying to schedule an appointment, and the services in general were all less than good (to say it as nicely as possible) from my personal experiences. I ended up just using my family dr since my hometown was fairly close.

Other students I knew shared my views and the humorous nickname that was commonly used for the U of Is McKinley Health Center was "McKillme" (no disrespect intended for the current case, this was a long time ago).

Anyway, I think they will settle out of court with YYs family for an undisclosed sum (in the low $millions) and confidentiality agreement for the above stated reasons. The U of I may also have some kind of blanket liability insurance to cover costs of a settlement like this.

Again, just MVHO. No amount of money will bring YY back, sadly for her family and friends.

Check out The Court Listener Reports regarding what they would or would not say and the ensuing legal arguments and debates.
There were certain questions they agreed to answer and there were stipulations imposed by court on what they could be asked, this is all to do with patient confidentiality.
They were, in effect almost hostile witnesses,.
This is not the civil case yet.
\that's a separate case and I read the filing last night and the lawyers representing the Zhang family really need to try to keep up here, much of what they filed was incorrect and they failed to mention several relevant points which were brought up yesterday during testimony... like an appointment with the addiction centre which he failed to keep, most likely because he had no intention of quitting alcohol and the entire thing was a mere charade... he went and he lied. That is not a serious cry for help. He waffled all the rest of it and the reality of his life was not accurately presented to the therapists there....
Under those circumstances, I think it's highly unlikely the college can accept any kind of responsibility for his malingering. He did not present as an acute emergency requiring hospitalisation, not even close.

I think her family should receive compensation but I dont know who should be paying it.
Other countries pay victim compo without the requirement for the victim to sue.
I think the case is weak.
I hope fervently they dont go home with nothing.
They have v little as is.
They are not a wealthy family.
All they had were their 2 kids.
Now they only have one and his young life has been changed forever.
This is by no means a black and white case.

 

[altojack]

I might be wrong, but I seem to recall reading something that said other jurors were crying during YY's mom's video. It wasn't just the one juror. She was just so overcome she had to get out......

Yes, I read that too but only a couple of days ago. You'd have to be a cold hard hearted bstard to sit through that and not be hit with emotion, man or woman.

 

[Raptors001]

Didn't quite get that! Defense

In my opinion, it is not the telling to the officers that he used a half tank of petrol an attempt to help him. It is clarifying that she out of her own volition filled up the tank prior to leaving that does. Had she filled the tank at his request or had he done it himself would be at least an indication of further premeditation in so far as he knew he would be driving a ways to dump a body that weekend so he gassed up.

Good thinking. I won't gas up if I'm leaving town for a few days. As long as there are some, it is all good ! Why did she gas up ? So he can drive around hunting ?

 

[Raptors001]

This afternoon, Susan Zoline testified as an expert in psychology ethics about what she thought UI counselors could've done. She said "optimal care was not provided" (1

Said she would've considered his case "serious" after his initial visit, but not an imminent threat and wouldn't have hospitalized him involuntarily (2/

But she said they could've asked if they could talk with his psychiatrist who was prescribing him medications he was abusing. (3

And she said they could've asked him for consent to notify the campus threat response team, though prosecutors said that could backfire. She said it could depend how it was presented to him. (4/11)

And she said they should have said, "here's your recommended treatment" instead of asking what treatment he prefers (5/11

And she said she would've reviewed the intern's assessment very closely bc the intern would be operating under her license. The counselors seemed unaware this morning of some of the more alarming parts of his interview with the intern. (6/11)

And she said their communications about follow up care should've mentioned his homicidal and suicidal thoughts, instead of just his alcohol and substance abuse. (7/11)

He did talk with someone nine days after first visit about his homicidal thoughts, but she said his subsequent missed meeting should've then been even more alarming. (8

She couldn't say the crime could've been prevented if he had better care, but said there's "a possibility that that could have been helpful and may have prevented the tragedy that occurred." (9/11

"I don't believe he received the help that he deserved and should've received," she concluded. (10/1

On cross, prosecution noted that she's being paid $250/hr to testify for the defense, trying to claim bias. In response, the defense noted $250/hr is low for an expert witness (11/11

Not! It is high, what about her civil duty ?

 

[kittythehare]

Didn't quite get that! Defense

Good thinking. I won't gas up if I'm leaving town for a few days. As long as there are some, it is all good ! Why did she gas up ? So he can drive around hunting ?

People generally do gas up periodically.
Are you trying to imply that Michelle gassed up so that BC could use the car to bury a body he was about to kill?
Do you have any evidence at all to that effect?
I didn't find any and I'm all over it.
The police aren't stupid and if there was the slightest chance she was even remotely involved they would have found proof and charged her already

Instead why dont we put the speculation into a location for her remains?
She is still a missing person.
That's what her parents need most and they are victims here.
Now, just because there was half a tank of gas missing, it's quite possible this macabre creature used it for a more nefarious purpose than driving from A to B.

It is highly unlikely that sham of a penalty trial is going to lead to the discovery of her remains or even proof that they are irretrievably gone forever, no more than they will lead to a diagnosis of whatever psychiatric illness he deems to be flavor of the month.

The police didn't need Michelle for anything- they had no reason to protect her. She already tod them everything and those were the words BC used to Tb when describing Michelle's encounter with the police.
It did not lead to the discovery of her remains. It did not lead to the discovery that no remains exist any longer.

Bringing in new suspects will not help locate those remains.
That is what her parents need- her body or whatever is left of it, if anything.

 

[Raptors001]

I dont think so.
He lied during those sessions.
He was claiming alcohol made his fantasies worse when in fact alcohol curbed them competely.
He did not use alcohol on the day he killed YY.
He even referred to that in one convo with Bullis.. that it would not have happened had he been drinking.
Michelle, his meal-ticket was about to leave and he was terrified at the prospect of having to get a job and support himself.
He attended in an attempt to keep his marriage/meal-ticket.
He even lied in the course of his second therapy session, said he had no thoughts of hurting anybody because he had not imbibed alcohol for a month.
He was still having the affair with the facebook friend, since 2016 so he lied when he told them Michelle was the only one for him.... etc.
I think it's more he got documented than escalated following the sessions.
At the opening the prosecution stated they had interviewed multiple sexual partners of his, so he was lying there too.
See facebook convo evidence for a better track of his antics and games.

My teddy bear made me do it ? Lol

I would have a hard time doing what he did to yyz. Very hard. Can't even imagine it. He is a monster

 

[Raptors001]

It gets put to sleep that same day.

Edit to add: question isn't relative as I would never have a Pitbull.

It is because to me because* it* killed a human being...

 

[Laughing]

It is because to me because* it* killed a human being...

Planned to, prepared for, killed a human being, lied about it repeated, and still keeping location of remains a perverted, power-mad, sick, controlling secret.

JMHO YMMV

 

[Tssiemer]

have a look at the vid of his counseling session, the first one is on the exhibit list and there is a transcript too.
I do not now what else they could have done after the details disclosed today.

I am definitely a "better safe than sorry social worker". I've had one client complete suicide under my caseload and another juvenile client beat his father within an inch of his life with a baseball bat with no warning at all! It's a crap-shoot. It really is.

 

[Laughing]

I am definitely a "better safe than sorry social worker". I've had one client complete suicide under my caseload and another juvenile client beat his father within an inch of his life with a baseball bat with no warning at all! It's a crap-shoot. It really is.

BC was legally an adult. They can recommend, but really cannot require him to do anything.

If LE finds him in public, with behavior dangerous to self or others, LE can lock him up. Counselors cannot.

Upthread, someone mentioned BC also seeing a psychiatrist during this time & misusing a prescription? Did I miss that? Did BC mention this to the UofI counselors? If so, that practitioner should be on the stand as well....

 

[kittythehare]

BC was legally an adult. They can recommend, but really cannot require him to do anything.

If LE finds him in public, with behavior dangerous to self or others, LE can lock him up. Counselors cannot.

Upthread, someone mentioned BC also seeing a psychiatrist during this time & misusing a prescription? Did I miss that? Did BC mention this to the UofI counselors? If so, that practitioner should be on the stand as well....

No cos they cannot use a mental health defense...they signed away that right...
this is just the defense grasping a straws, they have done an entire haystack at this stage...
they're seeking mitigation via neglect.... from a liar that 'visited ' therapy, as a visitor, not as an honest participant...
Blame game.