Found Deceased IN - Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #160

[GoBuckeyes]

A "bullet" was not found by the bodies. And unspent cartridge (which includes a bullet) was found by the bodies.

The defense is not going to speculate about how the unspent cartridge got there.

They're going to challenge the scientific validity of the identification of RA's gun as the only gun that could have left the marks on the cartridge—full stop.

If the defense can impeach that technique, RA walks (unless these have more forensic evidence that has yet to be divulged).

All IMHO.

Well said.

 

[Justice101]

Agree.
The scramble up the embankment. Probably tried to smear his prints as he went. Looks like pretty impressionable soil though

They probably took soil samples too from the bank and compared them to what maybe was left on his boots or clothing.

 

[Boxer]

<modsnip: unnecessary snark> they do not need to prove a single thing about the unspent cartridge. All the actions making up the crime RA is charged with (kidnapping / felony murder) occurred on the bridge & were captured on Libby’s video. The prosecution could literally not even mention the unspent cartridge.

The only aspect of the crime that needs to be proven but isnt on Libby’s video is that the girls’ deaths were by homicide. Nothing else needs to be shown about the murders - simply that they were murders (and not eg death by natural causes).

It’s a nice cherry on top maybe for the prosecution to use the unspent cartridge & further prove RA’s participation. But it’s not essential in any way.

Imo

Agree. The crime that started on the bridge is felony murder MOO and is beyond a reasonable doubt.

 

[Boxer]

Delphi murder suspect granted private hearings to discuss how to pay for lawyers

The man charged with the Delphi murders will get closed-door hearings to discuss how to pay for his lawyers. Richard Allen's attorneys are asking for more public funding to prepare for his trial. He's charged with murdering Abby Williams and Libby German in Delphi. A judge has granted a request...

www.953mnc.com

Allen’s lawyers wanted the private hearings so that they would not be forced to reveal their defense strategy to the prosecutors.
———-
Pretty sure we know the defense strategy:
Not me (attack eye witnesses)
Not my bullet (attack via experts)

Agree. I would not as a judge allow this. Discovery both ways.

 

[asyousay]

Delphi murder suspect granted private hearings to discuss how to pay for lawyers

The man charged with the Delphi murders will get closed-door hearings to discuss how to pay for his lawyers. Richard Allen's attorneys are asking for more public funding to prepare for his trial. He's charged with murdering Abby Williams and Libby German in Delphi. A judge has granted a request...

www.953mnc.com

Allen’s lawyers wanted the private hearings so that they would not be forced to reveal their defense strategy to the prosecutors.
———-
Pretty sure we know the defense strategy:
Not me (attack eye witnesses)
Not my bullet (attack via experts)

Well as he has admitted he was on the bridge that won’t work. He placed himself on that first platform watching fish. I wonder what his eye sight is like because you would have to have X-ray vision to spot fish from that high up.

He isn’t even a convincing liar which should help them get a conviction imo

 

[FrostedGlass]

@Boxer Here are a couple of snips from the news article. This is where I got the idea that they had search dogs out.

"The two arrived at the fire station shortly after 11 a.m., gathered maps of the search area and set out with a team of strangers to search fields near the school, nearly 2 miles away from the Monon High Bridge.
...
They had been instructed to stay away from the area where the girls had last been seen because search dogs were out. Authorities told volunteers they didn’t want to chance contaminating the scene.
...
The fields were muddy and ..

UPDATED: Foul play suspected after bodies found along Deer Creek in Delphi; vigil held

DELPHI — Police found two bodies on the edge of Deer Creek in Delphi around midday Tuesday after hundreds of volunteers had spent the morning scouring the region for two

www.pharostribune.com

 

[GoBuckeyes]

Judge grants defense motion for closed-door hearings

The Delphi double homicide suspect will get closed-door hearings to discuss paying for his representation.

www.wlfi.com

"Richard Allen's attorneys want the hearings to argue for expenses to cover the cost of their investigation, including payment of expert witnesses."

Surely they are not considering some form of insanity / mental incapacity defense?

What other possible defense experts would they want to hide?

Would love to hear your ideas!

I hope the judge will severely limit any hearings that exclude the prosecution. It may be legal but seems like dirty pool to a layperson like me.

JMO

*Ballistics
*Criminal Psych/Behavioral Analyst
*Expert on evidence collection, proper procedures, etc.
*Eye witness testimony expert
*Data Analyst
*Audio/Video expert
*Pysics expert
*Cellphone Data expert

 

[Le Singe]

Well stated. Seems many of us are not taking into consideration that all of the phones involved will be data mined and used, if not already, to geo-locate and map all of their timelines/stories. This will be hard to overcome, hopefully.

does all the necessary data still exist 6 years later?

 

[GoBuckeyes]

They probably took soil samples too from the bank and compared them to what maybe was left on his boots or clothing.

Opinion only, I don't think he's going to leave mud on his Carhart or boots for 5.5 years.

 

[Justice101]

Opinion only, I don't think he's going to leave mud on his Carhart or boots for 5.5 years.

If you have a pair of boots with those treads, you NEVER get ALL of the mud out of them from all the nooks and crannies. Been there, done that.

 

[Le Singe]

They probably took soil samples too from the bank and compared them to what maybe was left on his boots or clothing.

6 years later?

 

[Ontario Mom]

I'm curious, is there anyone here who doesn't think RA is BG, and/or the person who murdered the girls?

 

[Boxer]

@Boxer Here are a couple of snips from the news article. This is where I got the idea that they had search dogs out.

"The two arrived at the fire station shortly after 11 a.m., gathered maps of the search area and set out with a team of strangers to search fields near the school, nearly 2 miles away from the Monon High Bridge.
...
They had been instructed to stay away from the area where the girls had last been seen because search dogs were out. Authorities told volunteers they didn’t want to chance contaminating the scene.
...
The fields were muddy and ..

UPDATED: Foul play suspected after bodies found along Deer Creek in Delphi; vigil held

DELPHI — Police found two bodies on the edge of Deer Creek in Delphi around midday Tuesday after hundreds of volunteers had spent the morning scouring the region for two

www.pharostribune.com

MOO Sheriff missed the chance to to track the killer’s exit. So too bad.


IIRC KAKs phone was on Country Club Rd. in Peru near his grandparents house.
His alibi was “I was watching p*rn at my grandparents house”

 

[Prime8]

TrialLurking said:
Just a thought. I wondered if after the first lady turned around, he walked away from the bridge. Perhaps, behind her. He sees the two young girls coming and passes by them. He continues walking away from the bridge, but turns back towards the bridge. I think once the two young girls got closer to the south side of the bridge, he moved rather quickly towards them. I am sure they felt trapped by him, and were unsure where to proceed. I think that is why one victim took the video. Her senses were keen enough to know that something felt off.

CNYDarkStar said:​

Wondering.? That's exactly what/how it happened.

______
We don't know exactly what happened in terms of BG exact movements. You can't say exactly what happened. I'm sure LE has a better idea, LG may have had a lot more pictures/videos that can paint a better picture.

 

[TL4S]

MOO Sheriff missed the chance to to track the killer’s exit. So too bad.


IIRC KAKs phone was on Country Club Rd. in Peru near his grandparents house.
His alibi was “I was watching p*rn at my grandparents house”

Now that we know about RA's presence on the trail that day, let's look at a couple of timing issues in regards to what was said, true or not, during the 2020 KAK interview:

1) Around 8 AM on Feb. 13, 2017, at KAK's house in Peru, there were two devices rapidly logging on and off of the a_shots account. BP has said in interviews that L and A were up into the early morning hours (I recall seeing 2:45 AM), then slept in until 10 AM. I do not know whether the girls were awake at 8 AM.

2) The user of KAK's phone was looking up *censored stuff* at the house at Country Club RD. Iirc, that was happening during the time of the murders, proving at least the user of the phone wasn't at the crime scene.

So some questions I have:

1) Had the girls posted to SC or other SM platform during the night, and a_shots was logging in to see them that morning? Was he messaging L? LE said, true or not, that he was one of the last people to talk to L before she died. Was it that morning? Overnight? Around 1pm, right before they left for the bridge? Knowing that information would be crucial, imo, and I'm sure LE does.

2) Had the girls posted overnight that they had the day off and hoped to go do something fun? Had they mentioned the bridge or other specific thing, or just sort of made a general statement?

3) Did KAK, in fact, look up Marathon gas station in Delphi on Feb. 13, 2017, and if so, at what time did he do that?

4) Was there any indication of who was using KAK's phone on Country Club Rd? Is there any surveillance footage from town to show one of the K's vehicle driving towards or on CCR that day? What about driving home?

 

[CNYDarkStar]

TrialLurking said:
Just a thought. I wondered if after the first lady turned around, he walked away from the bridge. Perhaps, behind her. He sees the two young girls coming and passes by them. He continues walking away from the bridge, but turns back towards the bridge. I think once the two young girls got closer to the south side of the bridge, he moved rather quickly towards them. I am sure they felt trapped by him, and were unsure where to proceed. I think that is why one victim took the video. Her senses were keen enough to know that something felt off.

CNYDarkStar said:​

Wondering.? That's exactly what/how it happened.

______
We don't know exactly what happened in terms of BG exact movements. You can't say exactly what happened. I'm sure LE has a better idea, LG may have had a lot more pictures/videos that can paint a better picture.

True. But the basic sentiment is what I'm referring to.

 

[FrostedGlass]

I think what a previous commenter noted could be the reason he used it, he saw a fish that day so he's just going with something that rang true. I've visited the trails and actually saw some fish in the creek, even noted it to a local we were chatting to on the trails.

Big fish; probably suckers or carp.

 

[Boxer]

Now that we know about RA's presence on the trail that day, let's look at a couple of timing issues in regards to what was said, true or not, during the 2020 KAK interview:

1) Around 8 AM on Feb. 13, 2017, at KAK's house in Peru, there were two devices rapidly logging on and off of the a_shots account. BP has said in interviews that L and A were up into the early morning hours (I recall seeing 2:45 AM), then slept in until 10 AM. I do not know whether the girls were awake at 8 AM.

2) The user of KAK's phone was looking up *censored stuff* at the house at Country Club RD. Iirc, that was happening during the time of the murders, proving at least the user of the phone wasn't at the crime scene.

So some questions I have:

1) Had the girls posted to SC or other SM platform during the night, and a_shots was logging in to see them that morning? Was he messaging L? LE said, true or not, that he was one of the last people to talk to L before she died. Was it that morning? Overnight? Around 1pm, right before they left for the bridge? Knowing that information would be crucial, imo, and I'm sure LE does.

2) Had the girls posted overnight that they had the day off and hoped to go do something fun? Had they mentioned the bridge or other specific thing, or just sort of made a general statement?

3) Did KAK, in fact, look up Marathon gas station in Delphi on Feb. 13, 2017, and if so, at what time did he do that?

4) Was there any indication of who was using KAK's phone on Country Club Rd? Is there any surveillance footage from town to show one of the K's vehicle driving towards or on CCR that day? What about driving home?

Good questions.

 

[taylorss]

KAK said in the interview that on the 13th he was at his grandparents’ house watching pro wrestling with his father… but LE challenged that, telling him he was in the grandparents’ area but not at their house - he was actually somewhere else nearby…. FWIW

 

[Trebor5591]

SBMFF

Yes, if you meant RMA (I'm thinking that's who you meant when you asked about a RW? If not, who is RW?). 5 people said they saw RMA.

Persons 1-3 (juveniles):
View attachment 387072

Person #4 (woman walking the bridge):
View attachment 387080

Person #5 (Driving on 300N):
View attachment 387077

That makes 5. All in RMA's PCA.

Here's what we learned from the redacted court documents on why Richard Allen was arrested in the Delphi murders

The 12 pages of court documents include the decision to release a redacted version, murder charges and probable cause affidavit.

www.wthr.com

Thanks for correcting my use of initials--yes I meant RA, not RW!