Found Deceased IN - Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #160

[taylorss]

…., I'm very open to the possibility that RA, while acting alone in the woods that afternoon, perhaps shared in some of these online behaviors and connections. That is much more believable to me than anyone being involved in "real life." JMO.

ITA & have for a long time
… tho I’ll admit (feel like I’ve posted this a bunch of times recently so sorry if I’m boringly repeating myself!) the arrest of RA, by answering question of who did this, made me move onto other questions… & I realized how little I know about the actual crime scene … in fact IDK anything expect that there were aspects that conveyed a lot of info & were intended to do so - “staging,” “signatures”

Knowing that this evidence of means / motive etc is out there & that idk any of it… I’ve lost faith in my earlier assumptions on such things… JMO.

Like normally I’d assume the beast who did this was engaging in shameful, secretive behavior he believed to be beyond his control. But y’know what, for all I know there could’ve been three clear sets of different footprints at the CS (made up illustrative example! speculation, not saying this was true) or any number of other things that would immediately disprove my assumptions. So now I guess I have no idea!!
MOO

 

[taylorss]

OK I give up
Time will tell.

This is exactly how I feel about this story now too!!!

 

[TL4S]

ITA & have for a long time
… tho I’ll admit (feel like I’ve posted this a bunch of times recently so sorry if I’m boringly repeating myself!) the arrest of RA, by answering question of who did this, made me move onto other questions… & I realized how little I know about the actual crime scene … in fact IDK anything expect that there were aspects that conveyed a lot of info & were intended to do so - “staging,” “signatures”

Knowing that this evidence of means / motive etc is out there & that idk any of it… I’ve lost faith in my earlier assumptions on such things… JMO.

Like normally I’d assume the beast who did this was engaging in shameful, secretive behavior he believed to be beyond his control. But y’know what, for all I know there could’ve been three clear sets of different footprints at the CS (made up illustrative example! speculation, not saying this was true) or any number of other things that would immediately disprove my assumptions. So now I guess I have no idea!!
MOO

I totally get it. DC has described this case as very complex and with tentacles, the prosecutor is telling the judge there are likely others involved, and with sealed/unsealed documents and gag orders, it's like there must be far more to the story than any of us has imagined. The PCA, as interesting as it was, really only contained a handful of details that pertained directly to RA, not anyone else, because it was RA they wanted to arrest and charge.

It's only my opinion that an online element would definitely make the investigation complex, but I'm also coming from the perspective that all the signs point to RA finding out the girls were going to the bridge and him heading there specifically targeting them.

Long ago, before I believed there was an online connection, I always had a sense that the killer was a stalker-type. The way he waited until they crossed the bridge, rather than abducting them on the north side and into the woods, like he was cornering them...it's always bothered me. I've also long suspected he could have seen them dropped off at the bridge and was triggered, and in a way, I still think he was triggered by knowing they would be dropped off at the bridge. He was watching them, via the internet at first. But maybe the reason RA was seen driving from east to west past Hoosier Harvestore was because he had sort of been lingering around L's house, following her SM because he knew they might head out to do something that day due to earlier conversations, and when he learned about the bridge, he drove there from her house before they left so he could get situated. IDK...it's all conjecture.

 

[Gemmie]

Why would the murderer choose this particular property?

It's a much better choice than your local Starbucks or McDonald's. Can't murder and do whatever was done to the girls out in the open at a SB, McD's, etc. It's a hiking trail, with places others can't see you at. For someplace small like Delphi, I'm thinking it's the ideal place for something like this, unfortunately.

 

[Dotta]

It's a much better choice than your local Starbucks or McDonald's. Can't murder and do whatever was done to the girls out in the open at a SB, McD's, etc. It's a hiking trail, with places others can't see you at. For someplace small like Delphi, I'm thinking it's the ideal place for something like this, unfortunately.

It was PRIVATE.

And yet, he obviously felt much at home there doing what he did.

JMO

 

[Gemmie]

Yet it appears he asked for the alibi before the murders were known. If true this gives me pause.

And don't forget... he didn't ask for an alibi when he drove to the transfer station earlier that morning (if this was all about him getting an alibi because he was driving without a license). He only cared about NOT being on his property, which was the site the murder was committed, at the EXACT time the murders went down. Talk about things that make ya go Hmmmm....

Warrant for reference to back my facts: https://interactive.wthr.com/pdfs/logan-warrrant.pdf

 

[raja]

I was always sure RL was NOT involved …. cuz he’s clearly not BG IMO & I always figured the crime was one man’s rage-filled rampage. Now that we’re in a new world of likely conspiracy (per LE statements, plus only man arrested is complete imbecile IMO), that opens it all back up again imo

So…. best arg I know for RL involvement is:

- He sought a false alibi for the precise time of the kidnapping (“2/2:30”) even tho his problematic conduct (driving in violation of parole) actually happened an hour or two later (fish store receipt showed time around 5pm) and

- he sought this alibi on the morning of the 14th, before the girls were found on his property, arguably suggesting he knew they would be found there

IMO… it does look like maybe he was trying to take himself out of suspicion for the crime… but that doesn’t nec mean he was involved. He knew it had happened near his land even if not on his land & could obvs expect to be questioned. Maybe he wasn’t an especially upstanding guy & was more interested in avoiding trouble than giving an honest accounting. And if so maybe he knew he needed his cousin to lie about giving him a ride, so figured he’d make it easier on himself by including the crucial time in question? Moo

As to how he could’ve known the timeframe at that point… even if there wasn’t official info out about it yet, people had been searching all around, incl on RL’s land, for half a day already - likely he would’ve at least heard from word of mouth what the time of disappearance was … JMO

At this point who knows what to think …. but RL was 78/79 at the time. what would his motive have been to offer up his property for such a scandalous crime against two local little girls?? And why was no evidence ever found of his involvement?

I guess IMO hard to believe he had any involvement beyond maybe the most minor role…. like maybe the other perp(s) told him ‘stay off this part of your land on this day, don’t come down no matter what you hear, & you’ll get paid off later’ (just imo made-up speculation as example)

JMO

I agree, I never thought RL was involved but as I said before the alibi gives me pause for all the reasons you listed plus he did not see a need for one earlier in the day. I don’t really know if people thought the girls were murdered before the were found or just missing, possibly hurt somewhere. Jmho

 

[Gemmie]

Yes, but don't you think a lot of people suspected something bad had happened when they weren't found that night?

That's very true, but a lot of people didn't ask a family member or friend for an alibi that they weren't even in Delphi starting between 2-2:30 the day of the murders. Only RL did that.

Warrant for reference to back my facts: https://interactive.wthr.com/pdfs/logan-warrrant.pdf

 

[Gemmie]

Understand, but I really think that he got scared because of the police activity on and around his property.
I would assume that the huge presence along with news helicopters and such prompted him to inquire on what was happening.
I am sure by evening the time of the girls disappearance was widely known

It seems trivial to us that he would worry about getting in trouble for driving, but as an older man that was in his 70s, he knew he would face a lengthy jail time.

JMO

Good points. Except he specifically asked for an alibi (which was a lie) that he was picked up between 2-2:30 to go to Lafayette.

And he didn't feel the need to cover his behind when he went to the transfer station that morning. Just felt a need to cover his behind at the times the murders went down.

Warrant for reference to back my facts: https://interactive.wthr.com/pdfs/logan-warrrant.pdf

 

[iamnotagolem]

I don’t really have a strong theory on whether RL was involved, him asking for an alibi during the murders but not when he was actually driving seems so suspicious to me.

But what I really wanted to mention is that IF RL was involved then him wearing the BG outfit during his interview seems so odd. Was it intentional? Was he trying to deflect attention from RA since RL was clearly far too tall to be BG? Was it to help promote the “everyone wears that” conversation that we’ve heard on repeat for the past 6 years?

Just something I’ve been thinking about.

 

[MistyWaters]

And don't forget... he didn't ask for an alibi when he drove to the transfer station earlier that morning (if this was all about him getting an alibi because he was driving without a license). He only cared about NOT being on his property, which was the site the murder was committed, at the EXACT time the murders went down. Talk about things that make ya go Hmmmm....

Warrant for reference to back my facts: https://interactive.wthr.com/pdfs/logan-warrrant.pdf

Without reading the interview we don’t know if he asked where he was during that specific timeframe which LE was most interested in, or if he was asked to account for his broader whereabouts throughout the entire day. What he did that morning wasn’t relevant to the murder investigation.

In getting approval of a search warrant from a Judge, LE naturally is going to only include incriminating information that best supports that approval. That’s not dishonest but it may not necessarily provide the full picture and the fact is we do know nothing came of it as RL was never charged.

JMO

 

[Prime8]

Interesting to me about the call made at 2:09pm was the fact RL's PCA says (1) he was in the vicinity of his property/the bridge at the time that call was made, and (2) he had asked his cousin the next morning for an alibi (before the girls were found) and lie for him and tell LE that he drove RL to Lafayette between 2:00-2:30. That's just.... odd. Sorry but something is up with that IMO!

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According to the one off vid that MadMcGoo approved and posted a few days back from Chris of the Mob Crew/Monsters Under our Bed (linked below)... Libby takes a pic of the bridge @ 2:05 (6:33 in) and they reached the end of the bridge shortly before 2:13 (7:15 in). Just posting those notes here of what was going on with A & L when RL was making a call @ 2:09 from his property/bridge area, when he asked for an alibi for that time frame. Might mean nothing, then again it might. For the record... RMA wasn't on the bridge at that time. He was on his way back there after following witness #4. (6:49 in)

https://interactive.wthr.com/pdfs/logan-warrrant.pdf

The problem with these theories of RL is that they are based on very little information. Yes, LE looked into RL, of course they did, the girls were found on his property, he's going to be high up on the suspect list. Any search warrant is going to have language that implies that the person is involved.

Here's what we know- RL made a call around the time the girls went missing. RL had a history of OWI, he wasn't allowed to drive. If he was caught driving, he was looking at serious jail time.

Here's what we don't know- RL's phone patterns. Does he make 1 call a week, 1 call a day or 20 calls a day? Who did he call? We don't know but police do. If they didn't know, I bet that would be included in the warrant to bolster suspicion. What conversations to RL have with police and when, when did RL know that there was something serious going on?

 

[Salah11]

I think nothing had planned out for LE hence why they went back to the beginning and that’s when RA was flagged. That’s why they went back over everything as they literally had nothing IMO.

 

[Vern]

And don't forget... he didn't ask for an alibi when he drove to the transfer station earlier that morning (if this was all about him getting an alibi because he was driving without a license). He only cared about NOT being on his property, which was the site the murder was committed, at the EXACT time the murders went down. Talk about things that make ya go Hmmmm....

Warrant for reference to back my facts: https://interactive.wthr.com/pdfs/logan-warrrant.pdf

IMO, because he did not NEED alibi for the morning. The girls' whereabouts were confirmed by family and others in the afternoon to be at the trail.

They were KNOWN to have disappeared in the afternoon. Why the heck would he need an alibi for a morning that LE wouldn't be reviewing camera footage for; a time period that we know was irrelevent to the crime?

Besides the fact that LE has since stated RL was not involved. They searched his house - looking for electronics, USBs etc and yet ... nada stick of child *advertiser censored* etc was discovered else he'd have been charged with that back then too. But nada.

IMO,RL is only being brought up again, by the Daily Fail at that, because someone needs to increase book sales of a book that was doomed the minute LE announced their arrest of RA. Craziness.

 

[Gemmie]

Without reading the interview we don’t know if he asked where he was during that specific timeframe which LE was most interested in, or if he was asked to account for his broader whereabouts throughout the entire day. What he did that morning wasn’t relevant to the murder investigation.

SBMFF

It wasn't that LE may, or may not have asked him about his whereabouts that day... My point was that RL specifically sought out an alibi for the time of the murders. That was done before the girls were found. And he didn't feel the need to have a fake alibi when he drove to the transfer station that morning. Even LE thought that was a tad suspicious.

Asking for an alibi:



Didn't ask for an alibi when driving before murders were committed:



Cousin admitting RL asked him to lie to LE:



LE with raised eyebrows about that:

https://interactive.wthr.com/pdfs/logan-warrrant.pdf

 

[TL4S]

I think nothing had planned out for LE hence why they went back to the beginning and that’s when RA was flagged. That’s why they went back over everything as they literally had nothing IMO.

If they literally had nothing, though, why would they still be telling the court that they believe others are involved? That's a really bold statement to make by the prosecutor if without merit. JMO.

 

[Gemmie]

IMO, because he did not NEED alibi for the morning. The girls' whereabouts were confirmed by family and others in the afternoon to be at the trail.

They were KNOWN to have disappeared in the afternoon. Why the heck would he need an alibi for a morning that LE wouldn't be reviewing camera footage for; a time period that we know was irrelevent to the crime?

SBMFF

Exactly my point. He only felt the need for an alibi at the time when things went down.

 

[Prime8]

Without reading the interview we don’t know if he asked where he was during that specific timeframe which LE was most interested in, or if he was asked to account for his broader whereabouts throughout the entire day. What he did that morning wasn’t relevant to the murder investigation.

In getting approval of a search warrant from a Judge, LE naturally is going to only include incriminating information that best supports that approval. That’s not dishonest but it may not necessarily provide the full picture and the fact is we do know nothing came of it as RL was never charged.

JMO

Thank you! Exactly. Anything is possible in this case but I think people are not looking at the bigger picture and don't understand that we know very little about the interactions RL had with LE.

 

[MistyWaters]

I think nothing had planned out for LE hence why they went back to the beginning and that’s when RA was flagged. That’s why they went back over everything as they literally had nothing IMO.

Yes and considering many have view the search warrant that was released as proof of absolute guilt, how easy would’ve it been for LE to close the file as the suspect is now deceased? But they didn’t do that, they went back through it all.

I say it’s a very good thing search warrants aren’t routinely released to the public especially without knowing anything about the entire point of a search warrant - - the results of the search. JMO

 

[Vern]

Thank you! Exactly. Anything is possible in this case but I think people are not looking at the bigger picture and don't understand that we know very little about the interactions RL had with LE.

Well, we know that based on their interactions with him and since the search of his house they have stated that RL was not involved. That's a pretty important tidbit of fact to ignore if looking at the "bigger picture".