IN - Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #164

[FrostedGlass]

One more after this one, then I'm done going through the documents.
The *** after an entry is a note to myself indicating an important one.

https://fox59.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/21/2023/06/DelphiDocumentsCombined.pdf

212 = Def Supplemental Motion for Discovery 29 items (Dec 30, 2022)
219 = Def Motion to Continue Bail Hearing and Trial Date (Feb 7, 2023)
221 = Appearance by Attys in a Civil Case (June 19, 2023) See # 208 for first part
227 = Motion for Change of Venue (Nov 26, 2022) ***
232 = Order Setting Due Process Hearing ... NOT dated or signed
233 = Def Request to Prohibit Access to 4 Motions to Quash Subpoena (May 3, 2023)
234 = Def Request to Probibit Access to Motion to Reconsider + Due Process (May 3 2023)
235 = Granting Protective Order on Discovery NO File Date or Signature
236 = State's Response to Let to Bail (Jan30, 2023)
239 = Order on Motion to Reset Bail Hearing and Trial NOT Signed or Dated
240 = Order to Westville to Release Health Records to Def NOT Signed or Dated
241 = Def Emergency Motion to Modify Safekeeping Order 20 Items (Apr 5, 2023)
248 = Def Motion for Restraining Order and Preliminary Injunction (May 15, 2023) ***
252 = Def Seeking Order on Continuing Disclosure of Ra's Medical Records (Jun 7, 20230
254 = Def Motion in Limine Regarding Ballistics (Jun 13, 2023) ***
256 = Def Motion to Quash McL's Apr. 20 Subpoena (May 3, 2023) ***

 

[NoSpoonFeeding]

I hope this is a hoax and that prison guards and staff know better than to compromise prosecution by doing this kind of thing.

Isn’t RA under 24 hr. surveillance via camera and/or a fellow inmate when he’s in the cell? The exercise yard must have cameras, too.

MOO So far, it seems that RA is the only person in Indiana that is in a prison and "being treated the same as other inmates" when he is not convicted, and he is not an inmate, he is an in-custody defendant awaiting trial. Prison "banter" between inmates and with Corrections Officers is not reported to anyone and prisoners are allowed to verbally harass each other. I kind of doubt that anyone in this prison is concerned or even aware that their normal behavior could adversely affect a pretrial defendant or trial.
When a guard is not available, a convicted inmate sits outside the cell, to report if RA attempts self-harm. I've never heard of secret recordings in a prison or a jail cell (without a warrant) as certainly, there is a right to privacy for certain conversations that even a warrant can't authorize. Recordings of phone conversations are not from listening devices in the cells. Mere surveillance is not going to expose what guards/inmates have been saying to RA.

This post has nothing to do with what anyone thinks of RA or what his attorneys have claimed about his treatment. Interest in a "smooth" trial, if there even will be one, is my concern when it comes to the subject of RA not being housed in a county jail, where many other high-profile, reviled, and threatened defendants stay. MOO

 

[Megnut]

I could not understand why if LE has DNA evidence they would not put that in the PCA? If the killer was muddy and bloody, I would have thought something related to DNA evidence would have been mentioned in the PCA.

In another case, a tooth consistent with the victim was recovered from a fire pit -- that information was not included in the AA or the preliminary as I recall. Came out at trial.

The Prosecution may be saving the best for last. There are warrants and such that remain sealed..... IMO there'll be a lot there.

Jmo

 

[Megnut]

MOO So far, it seems that RA is the only person in Indiana that is in a prison and "being treated the same as other inmates" when he is not convicted, and he is not an inmate, he is an in-custody defendant awaiting trial. Prison "banter" between inmates and with Corrections Officers is not reported to anyone and prisoners are allowed to verbally harass each other. I kind of doubt that anyone in this prison is concerned or even aware that their normal behavior could adversely affect a pretrial defendant or trial.
When a guard is not available, a convicted inmate sits outside the cell, to report if RA attempts self-harm. I've never heard of secret recordings in a prison or a jail cell (without a warrant) as certainly, there is a right to privacy for certain conversations that even a warrant can't authorize. Recordings of phone conversations are not from listening devices in the cells. Mere surveillance is not going to expose what guards/inmates have been saying to RA.

This post has nothing to do with what anyone thinks of RA or what his attorneys have claimed about his treatment. Interest in a "smooth" trial, if there even will be one, is my concern when it comes to the subject of RA not being housed in a county jail, where many other high-profile, reviled, and threatened defendants stay. MOO

A sticky situation --

How do you keep an arrestee safe, when he at high risk from others and to himself? County jail isn't going to have the staff/resources to monitor, treat protect IMO.

One might argue that, if he needs 24/7 monitoring, neither jail nor prison is the right place for him. Psych hold. But I'm guessing he doesn't meet the criteria for that

I get the feeling that, when such a thing was preferred, he suddenly shaped up, started showering, changing clothes, sleeping, and eating foodstuffs and not paper.

Maybe he ought to be in county lockup with a private security detail 24/7. On the State's dime. Prison is practical, the resources are already in place and budgeted.

He's kept clean, safe and alive.

Vital -- so that he's able to face a jury of peers at trial.

Jmo

 

[CharlesRedding]

I still don't know what his motive was. From what I understand there wasn't a clear you know what motive.

 

[Betty P]

MOO So far, it seems that RA is the only person in Indiana that is in a prison and "being treated the same as other inmates" when he is not convicted, and he is not an inmate, he is an in-custody defendant awaiting trial. Prison "banter" between inmates and with Corrections Officers is not reported to anyone and prisoners are allowed to verbally harass each other. I kind of doubt that anyone in this prison is concerned or even aware that their normal behavior could adversely affect a pretrial defendant or trial.
When a guard is not available, a convicted inmate sits outside the cell, to report if RA attempts self-harm. I've never heard of secret recordings in a prison or a jail cell (without a warrant) as certainly, there is a right to privacy for certain conversations that even a warrant can't authorize. Recordings of phone conversations are not from listening devices in the cells. Mere surveillance is not going to expose what guards/inmates have been saying to RA.

This post has nothing to do with what anyone thinks of RA or what his attorneys have claimed about his treatment. Interest in a "smooth" trial, if there even will be one, is my concern when it comes to the subject of RA not being housed in a county jail, where many other high-profile, reviled, and threatened defendants stay. MOO

Agree, its a difficult situation for the state to keep him locked up securely, but still safe.

My earlier comment was in response to posts about a letter sent from a (former) inmate who alleged that RA was being physically and otherwise abused by prison guards and fellow inmates.

We don't know if that's true, but hopefully prison guards and staff refrain from anything that will compromise successful prosecution of RA, especially physical abuse.

 

[ArianeEmory]

It looks like the house was sold at sheriff's sale and that buyer sold it to the A's a couple of months later. I don't see an indication of a mortgage; do we know for sure if they had one?

I’m going from memory only, but I believe at the time of his arrest someone determined the house had been bought by the Allens in cash. A lot of people were surprised by this, but it was also a long time ago, and I think there was speculation that it might have been proceeds of the sale of another house.

(If someone else remembers what I’m talking about please let me know.)

 

[TheVisual]

For those having issues reading docs:
Here is the property receipt of items collected from 1967 Whiteman Dr. Delphi, Indiana and from the car acquired at that property.

----------------------------

MC8 Sealed cardboard box containing one black Sig Sauer P226 .40 Calmer handgun. Serial Number U625627.

MC9 Sealed plastic bag containing one .40 caliber S&W cartridge found in wooden keepsake box on dresser between both closets in master bedroom.

MC10 Sealed plastic bag containing one .40 caliber S&W cartridge found inside Sig Sauer P226 handgun

MC11 Sealed plastic bag containing two magazines, one filled with nine .40 caiiber cartridges and one
with eight .40 caliber cartridges.

MC12 Sealed paper bag containing one black Sig Sauer handgun case containing one trigger lock with two keys.

MC13 Sealed paper bag containing a papa: wrapped wooden weave box containing two 'Audiovox" device. one siiver Motoroia flip phone MSN:86530XP771, one siiver Motoroia flip phone MSNfloSBDXPGZi, 4 car chargers, three wall outlet chargers

MC14 Sealed plastic bag containing one Lexar compact flash 1 GB memory card.

DRV104 Sealed paper bag containing one pair of dirty Thorogood boots size 7.5 mens.

DRV105 Sealed paper bag containing one pair of dirty black boots, size 6.5 regular

DRV106 Sealed envelope containing one silver double edged knife in a silver metal sheath.

DRV107 Sealed envelope containing one brown gold and silver folding knife.

DRV108 Sealed envelope containing black sheath containing one brown gold and silver folding knife.

DRV109 Sealed envelope containing one black sheath containing one black handled silver bladed imperial knife.

DRV110 Sealed envelope one black sheath containing one fold'able knife with a red! gold handle.

DRV111 Sealed envelope one sheath containing two Ozark Trail knives.

DRV112 Sealed envelope one black sheath containing one knife with a wood! ivory handle and gold guard.

DRV113 Sealed envelope containing one rusted "Old Timer' folding knife, one 'Sharp' 2 bladed folding I knife, one black folding "Gerber" knife, and one black folding knife.

DRV114 Sealed envelope containing one red handled' Crosley" multi-tool, one blue multi-tool, one green I and gold lndiana National Guard multi-tool. and one black multi~tool.

DRV115 Sealed envelope containing one black sheath containing a brown handled, silver bladed "Sabre" bowie knife.

DRV116 Sealed paper bag containing one blue jacket with red stripes- ADiDAS.

DRV117 Sealed paper bag containing one blue 1/4 zip sweatshirt.

DRV118 Sealed paper bag containing one black and green 'FOX' hooded sweatshirt.

DRV119 Sealed paper bag containing one black and gray "North End" coat.

DRV120 Sealed paper bag containing one blue 'Carhartt" coat

DRV121 Sealed paper bag containing one pair timberland boots. Size 8.

DRV122 Sealed paper bag containing one pair of blue "Arizona" jeans size 34x29

DRV123 Sealed paper bag containing one pair of blue "Arizona" jeans size 34x29.

DRV124 Sealed paper bag containing one pair of blue "Arizona" jeans size 34X29

DRV12S Sealed paper bag containing one pair of blue Levi Strauss jeans size 34x29

DRV126 Sealed paper bag containing one pair of blue Levi Strauss jeans size 34x29

DRV127 Sealed paper bag containing one winter gray hat with fur like fibers.

DRV128 Sealed paper bag containing one black and red "UFC" hooded sweatshirt with a full zip.

DRV129 Sealed paper bag containing one 1/4 zip "George" sweatshirt.

DRV139 Sealed paper bag containing one black/blue 1/4 zip 'Waimart" sweatshirt.

DRV131 Sealed paper bag containing one blue "George" sweatshirt, U4 Zip.

DRV132 Sealed paper bag containing one blue "Kenneth Cole" sweatshirt.

DRV133 Sealed paper bag containing one blue "Fruit of the Loom" sweatshirt.

DRV134 Sealed 'paper bag containing one blue "Starter" sweatshirt.

DRV135 Sealed paper bag containing one black "Spider" hooded sweatshirt.

DRV136 Sealed paper bag containing one blue sweatshirt with an old label.

DRV137 Sealed paper bag containing one blue Adidas sweatshirt.

DRV138 Sealed paper bag containing one brown fitted cap with a small bill.

DRV139 Sealed paper bag containing one black WRI stocking cap, one black 'NASCAR' Ford Racing stocking cap, one black "ADiDAS" stocking cap, one red/white, and gray/brown Canada stocking cap.

DRV140 Sealed paper bag containing one gray and black "ADIDAS" skull cap

DRV141 Sealed paper bag containing one gray and white NFL Colts skuil cap

DRV142 Sealed paper bag containing one brown Carhartt stocking cap.

DRV143 Sealed paper bag containing ten pairs of gloves and 1 extra giove.

DRV144 Sealed paper bag containing one blue fabric strap, and one blue/green fabric strap/

DRV14S Sealed cardboard box containing one HP laptop Serial: CN3051 i779

DRV146 Sealed cardboard box containing one HP Pavilion Laptop Serial: CNF7496KTS

DRV147 Sealed paper bag containing one plastic bag containing multiple headbands.

DRV148
Sealed paper bag containing one cardboard phone box containing misc cellular information

DRV149 Sealed paper bag containing one Winchester Supreme Elite empty ammo box.

DRV150 Sealed envelope containing one smaller envelope containing one cruzer micro 268 flash drive with Rick on the back.

DRV151 Sealed envelope containing a 1TB western digital hardrive.

DRV152 Sealed envelope containing one Samsung phone in a floral case.

DRV153 Sealed envelope containing miniature katana with a red tassel.

DRV154 Sealed envelope containing one black sheath and one Rapala filet knife from garage.

DRV155 Sealed envelope containing one black sheath and one "The Best Defense' knife from garage.

DRV156 Sealed envelope containing one black external hard drive and cord. Serial WX20A99F4518.

DRV157 Sealed envelope containing one smaller envelope containing one black lPod serial 716016DTJT.

DRV158 Sealed envelope containing one smaller envelope containing one 32MB 50 card and one 256MB I SD card.

DRV159 Sealed cardboard box containing one black sheath with an animal imprinted on the front and one I large wooden handled knife with a rusted blade from garage.

DRV160 Sealed paper bag containing five miscellaneous vehicle chargers.

DRV161 Sealed paper bag containing nine miscellaneous wall outletchargers.

DRV162 Sealed paper bag containing miscellaneous phone accessories.

DRV163 Sealed paper bag containing one HP laptop charger.

DRV164 Sealed paper bag containing two pagers, one black and one blue.

DRV165 Sealed paper bag containing three Motorola and one LG flip phones.

DRV166 Sealed envelope containing one LG Verizon smart phone.

DRV167 Sealed paper bag containing one cardboard box containing one LG Verizon side slide smart phone.

DRV168 Sealed envelope containing one Motorola Verizon smart phone.

DRV169 Sealed envelope containing three older cell phones. one Aodiovox, one Nokia, and one Motorola.

DRV170 Sealed paper bag containing one cardboard box containing one Nokia 7705 Twist cell phone and documents.

DRV171 Sealed cardboard Garmin box containing one Garmin StreetPliot c340 device, two cords, and I documentation.

DRV172 Sealed cardboard box containing a plastic bag containing a custom vehicle operations motorcycle cover bag containing a motorcycle cover.

DRV173 Sealed manila envelope containing a black Pixel 3a XL cellphone MEiD 35964309505164 with a black Otterbox case

DRV174 Sealed manila envelope containing a black Samsung Galaxy A42 56 Serial Number: RSCRSONHEA with a brown case

DRV175 Sealed paper bag containing a sealed paper bag sealed by Steve Mullin containing one Aquafina water bottle

DRV176
Sealed manila envelope containing a silver, LG, Cingular wireless flip phone

MC15 Sealed envelope containing a cutting of a carpeted area underneath the spare tire of the Ford Focus.

MC16 Sealed envelope containing two plastic wrappers containing one swab from a driver lap belt and one swab of the driver shoulder belt of the Ford Focus.

MC17 Sealed envelope containing two plastic wrappers containing two swabs from the passenger side carpeted floor boards.

I'm surprised LE didn't take hair samples of the small dog (maybe chihuahua) that we've seen in the pictures of RA lately. Could it have been the dog in his jacket? Check out Michael. Gartley( verified expert in imaging science) on the image thread at the very beginning in 2017 Page 13 and # 252. "Save as desktop" on your computer. This picture moves and in the middle frame (cb x 2.5) which is white you can see a two lead dog leash hanging on his left leg( the long part of the leash goes around the shoulder like a cross body purse would hang). Also in the closeup of BG's gun, I believe with he has a remote control for the shock collar on the dog. Take a look. Also I wonder if any of the hats that LE took, do any of them have the bend in the bill that we see. Any of the pictures of RA I've seen with a ballcap there is no bend. This is a preference thing for someone. JMO

For those having issues reading docs:
Here is the property receipt of items collected from 1967 Whiteman Dr. Delphi, Indiana and from the car acquired at that property.

----------------------------

MC8 Sealed cardboard box containing one black Sig Sauer P226 .40 Calmer handgun. Serial Number U625627.

MC9 Sealed plastic bag containing one .40 caliber S&W cartridge found in wooden keepsake box on dresser between both closets in master bedroom.

MC10 Sealed plastic bag containing one .40 caliber S&W cartridge found inside Sig Sauer P226 handgun

MC11 Sealed plastic bag containing two magazines, one filled with nine .40 caiiber cartridges and one
with eight .40 caliber cartridges.

MC12 Sealed paper bag containing one black Sig Sauer handgun case containing one trigger lock with two keys.

MC13 Sealed paper bag containing a papa: wrapped wooden weave box containing two 'Audiovox" device. one siiver Motoroia flip phone MSN:86530XP771, one siiver Motoroia flip phone MSNfloSBDXPGZi, 4 car chargers, three wall outlet chargers

MC14 Sealed plastic bag containing one Lexar compact flash 1 GB memory card.

DRV104 Sealed paper bag containing one pair of dirty Thorogood boots size 7.5 mens.

DRV105 Sealed paper bag containing one pair of dirty black boots, size 6.5 regular

DRV106 Sealed envelope containing one silver double edged knife in a silver metal sheath.

DRV107 Sealed envelope containing one brown gold and silver folding knife.

DRV108 Sealed envelope containing black sheath containing one brown gold and silver folding knife.

DRV109 Sealed envelope containing one black sheath containing one black handled silver bladed imperial knife.

DRV110 Sealed envelope one black sheath containing one fold'able knife with a red! gold handle.

DRV111 Sealed envelope one sheath containing two Ozark Trail knives.

DRV112 Sealed envelope one black sheath containing one knife with a wood! ivory handle and gold guard.

DRV113 Sealed envelope containing one rusted "Old Timer' folding knife, one 'Sharp' 2 bladed folding I knife, one black folding "Gerber" knife, and one black folding knife.

DRV114 Sealed envelope containing one red handled' Crosley" multi-tool, one blue multi-tool, one green I and gold lndiana National Guard multi-tool. and one black multi~tool.

DRV115 Sealed envelope containing one black sheath containing a brown handled, silver bladed "Sabre" bowie knife.

DRV116 Sealed paper bag containing one blue jacket with red stripes- ADiDAS.

DRV117 Sealed paper bag containing one blue 1/4 zip sweatshirt.

DRV118 Sealed paper bag containing one black and green 'FOX' hooded sweatshirt.

DRV119 Sealed paper bag containing one black and gray "North End" coat.

DRV120 Sealed paper bag containing one blue 'Carhartt" coat

DRV121 Sealed paper bag containing one pair timberland boots. Size 8.

DRV122 Sealed paper bag containing one pair of blue "Arizona" jeans size 34x29

DRV123 Sealed paper bag containing one pair of blue "Arizona" jeans size 34x29.

DRV124 Sealed paper bag containing one pair of blue "Arizona" jeans size 34X29

DRV12S Sealed paper bag containing one pair of blue Levi Strauss jeans size 34x29

DRV126 Sealed paper bag containing one pair of blue Levi Strauss jeans size 34x29

DRV127 Sealed paper bag containing one winter gray hat with fur like fibers.

DRV128 Sealed paper bag containing one black and red "UFC" hooded sweatshirt with a full zip.

DRV129 Sealed paper bag containing one 1/4 zip "George" sweatshirt.

DRV139 Sealed paper bag containing one black/blue 1/4 zip 'Waimart" sweatshirt.

DRV131 Sealed paper bag containing one blue "George" sweatshirt, U4 Zip.

DRV132 Sealed paper bag containing one blue "Kenneth Cole" sweatshirt.

DRV133 Sealed paper bag containing one blue "Fruit of the Loom" sweatshirt.

DRV134 Sealed 'paper bag containing one blue "Starter" sweatshirt.

DRV135 Sealed paper bag containing one black "Spider" hooded sweatshirt.

DRV136 Sealed paper bag containing one blue sweatshirt with an old label.

DRV137 Sealed paper bag containing one blue Adidas sweatshirt.

DRV138 Sealed paper bag containing one brown fitted cap with a small bill.

DRV139 Sealed paper bag containing one black WRI stocking cap, one black 'NASCAR' Ford Racing stocking cap, one black "ADiDAS" stocking cap, one red/white, and gray/brown Canada stocking cap.

DRV140 Sealed paper bag containing one gray and black "ADIDAS" skull cap

DRV141 Sealed paper bag containing one gray and white NFL Colts skuil cap

DRV142 Sealed paper bag containing one brown Carhartt stocking cap.

DRV143 Sealed paper bag containing ten pairs of gloves and 1 extra giove.

DRV144 Sealed paper bag containing one blue fabric strap, and one blue/green fabric strap/

DRV14S Sealed cardboard box containing one HP laptop Serial: CN3051 i779

DRV146 Sealed cardboard box containing one HP Pavilion Laptop Serial: CNF7496KTS

DRV147 Sealed paper bag containing one plastic bag containing multiple headbands.

DRV148
Sealed paper bag containing one cardboard phone box containing misc cellular information

DRV149 Sealed paper bag containing one Winchester Supreme Elite empty ammo box.

DRV150 Sealed envelope containing one smaller envelope containing one cruzer micro 268 flash drive with Rick on the back.

DRV151 Sealed envelope containing a 1TB western digital hardrive.

DRV152 Sealed envelope containing one Samsung phone in a floral case.

DRV153 Sealed envelope containing miniature katana with a red tassel.

DRV154 Sealed envelope containing one black sheath and one Rapala filet knife from garage.

DRV155 Sealed envelope containing one black sheath and one "The Best Defense' knife from garage.

DRV156 Sealed envelope containing one black external hard drive and cord. Serial WX20A99F4518.

DRV157 Sealed envelope containing one smaller envelope containing one black lPod serial 716016DTJT.

DRV158 Sealed envelope containing one smaller envelope containing one 32MB 50 card and one 256MB I SD card.

DRV159 Sealed cardboard box containing one black sheath with an animal imprinted on the front and one I large wooden handled knife with a rusted blade from garage.

DRV160 Sealed paper bag containing five miscellaneous vehicle chargers.

DRV161 Sealed paper bag containing nine miscellaneous wall outletchargers.

DRV162 Sealed paper bag containing miscellaneous phone accessories.

DRV163 Sealed paper bag containing one HP laptop charger.

DRV164 Sealed paper bag containing two pagers, one black and one blue.

DRV165 Sealed paper bag containing three Motorola and one LG flip phones.

DRV166 Sealed envelope containing one LG Verizon smart phone.

DRV167 Sealed paper bag containing one cardboard box containing one LG Verizon side slide smart phone.

DRV168 Sealed envelope containing one Motorola Verizon smart phone.

DRV169 Sealed envelope containing three older cell phones. one Aodiovox, one Nokia, and one Motorola.

DRV170 Sealed paper bag containing one cardboard box containing one Nokia 7705 Twist cell phone and documents.

DRV171 Sealed cardboard Garmin box containing one Garmin StreetPliot c340 device, two cords, and I documentation.

DRV172 Sealed cardboard box containing a plastic bag containing a custom vehicle operations motorcycle cover bag containing a motorcycle cover.

DRV173 Sealed manila envelope containing a black Pixel 3a XL cellphone MEiD 35964309505164 with a black Otterbox case

DRV174 Sealed manila envelope containing a black Samsung Galaxy A42 56 Serial Number: RSCRSONHEA with a brown case

DRV175 Sealed paper bag containing a sealed paper bag sealed by Steve Mullin containing one Aquafina water bottle

DRV176
Sealed manila envelope containing a silver, LG, Cingular wireless flip phone

MC15 Sealed envelope containing a cutting of a carpeted area underneath the spare tire of the Ford Focus.

MC16 Sealed envelope containing two plastic wrappers containing one swab from a driver lap belt and one swab of the driver shoulder belt of the Ford Focus.

MC17 Sealed envelope containing two plastic wrappers containing two swabs from the passenger side carpeted floor boards.

 

[DeDee]

It looks like the Careys defaulted, Kennedy bought it, sold it to the Allens and they paid off their mortgage in 2013?

05/23/2013	Current	removed mortgage 92/2826 13/14 rel 2013/001237
12/20/2011	Current	removed mortgage deduction for 11/12 92/2732
01/10/2008	Current	Name: Richard M & Kathy A Allen Homestead credit refund amount: $171.26 refund ck payable to Carey Land owner as of 3-1-06..th

From paying off the house mortgage on May 23, 2013 til the day he murdered the two girls on FEB, 13, 2017 is less than four years.

That's not nearly enough time to enjoy the freedom of being without a mortgage payment. Life was easy w two incomes, three people. Wonder why he threw it all away?

Did Allen always look over his shoulders after the murders? I recall the short video of his wife walking up to their car in the parking lot. As she got closer to the car, she screamed: Boo! She was recording as he jumped from being spooked by her. So, I think he'd at least become a bit jumpy during the ensuing years.

 

[Yemelyan]

I could not understand why if LE has DNA evidence they would not put that in the PCA? If the killer was muddy and bloody, I would have thought something related to DNA evidence would have been mentioned in the PCA.

The PCA lays out probable cause for an arrest, not all the evidence to convince you "beyond all reasonable doubt" that someone committed a crime. For this reason, when you read PCAs you will often see included somewhere in it a phrase like this by the sworn affiant: "this document does not contain all facts known to me or others that have been developed in the course of this investigation." The wording varies but you will usually see a line like this included somewhere in the document.

The PCA should present strong evidence to support an arrest but it doesn't have to include every single thing LE knows. If you have some cases you've followed closely that have already gone to trial, go back and look into the PCAs for them. Then think about what evidence was shared in the PCA vs what eventually came out in the trial. Keep in mind that at the time the PCA is written all forensic testing might not be completed so there could be very significant evidence of guilt that doesn't make it in there but is developed as the post-arrest investigation continues. This could be true of DNA analysis as well.

 

[FrostedGlass]

He's speaking about the State's subpoenas for RA's mental health records; medical records; employment records; and any and all records from the DOC.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1675688715916648450

Hoosier Public Defender
@publicdefender_
5h
The State’s subpoena for Allen’s mental health/medical records was quashed. Nevertheless, it is worth noting the State failed to comply w/ Indiana law in attempting to obtain Allen’s mental health records.
Hoosier Public Defender
@publicdefender_
5h
Indiana law requires a petition, not a subpoena, be filed to obtain one’s mental health records.
Hoosier Public Defender
@publicdefender_
5h
A hearing must then be conducted to determine if the moving party (in this case the State) has proven by a preponderance of the evidence that 1) other reasonable methods to obtain info are not available or effective and 2) disclosure outweighs potential harm to patient.
Hoosier Public Defender
@publicdefender_
5h
Also note the publicly disclosed motions featured Allen’s SSN. All the more reason to have determined the release of these documents individually rather than a mass release.

 

[FrostedGlass]

The Grand Finale! Why are we seeing Judge Gull's orders with no signatures or dates or filing dates?

https://fox59.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/21/2023/06/DelphiDocumentsCombined.pdf

258 = Def Motion to Quash McL's Subpoena to Westville for RA's Medical Records (May 3, 2023)
260 = Def Motion to Quash McL's Subpoena to Westville for RA's all Other Communications (May 3, 2023)
262 = Def Motion to Quash McL's Subpoena Duces Tecum to CVS (May 3, 2023)
264 = State's Motion Requesting Protective Order Governing Discovery (Feb 13, 2023)
266 = Def Motion to Reconsider and Due Process Hearing (May 3 2023) ***
269 = Court's Temporary Restraining Order NOT Signed, Dated or Filed ***
270 = Black and White Pic of RA and Dog (Apr 5, 2023)
271 = Black and White Pic of RA in Prison Garb (Apr 5, 2023)
272 = Def Subpoena to IN DOC to Allow Attys Entry into Facility for Inspections (May 19, 2023)
273 = Def Request for Prodction to Non-Party #Relates to #272 (May 17, 2023)
275 = Def Subpoena to Robert Baston to Appear at June 15 Hearing (Jun 9, 2023)
276 = Certificate of Analysis: Item 122 which is 40 S&W Cartridge (Jun 13, 2023)
278 = Certificate of Analysis: More Gun Stuff (Jun 13, 2023)
281 = Def Notice of Discovery to Westville (May 19, 2023)
282 = Court Order for Release Mental Health Records to Def NOT Signed, Dated, Filed
283 = Gull Supplemental Order on Safekeeping NOT Signed, Dated or Filed

 

[FromGermany1]

269 = Court's Temporary Restraining Order NOT Signed, Dated or Filed ***

For whom because of whom?

 

[Marzipan]

The Grand Finale! Why are we seeing Judge Gull's orders with no signatures or dates or filing dates?

https://fox59.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/21/2023/06/DelphiDocumentsCombined.pdf

258 = Def Motion to Quash McL's Subpoena to Westville for RA's Medical Records (May 3, 2023)
260 = Def Motion to Quash McL's Subpoena to Westville for RA's all Other Communications (May 3, 2023)
262 = Def Motion to Quash McL's Subpoena Duces Tecum to CVS (May 3, 2023)
264 = State's Motion Requesting Protective Order Governing Discovery (Feb 13, 2023)
266 = Def Motion to Reconsider and Due Process Hearing (May 3 2023) ***
269 = Court's Temporary Restraining Order NOT Signed, Dated or Filed ***
270 = Black and White Pic of RA and Dog (Apr 5, 2023)
271 = Black and White Pic of RA in Prison Garb (Apr 5, 2023)
272 = Def Subpoena to IN DOC to Allow Attys Entry into Facility for Inspections (May 19, 2023)
273 = Def Request for Prodction to Non-Party #Relates to #272 (May 17, 2023)
275 = Def Subpoena to Robert Baston to Appear at June 15 Hearing (Jun 9, 2023)
276 = Certificate of Analysis: Item 122 which is 40 S&W Cartridge (Jun 13, 2023)
278 = Certificate of Analysis: More Gun Stuff (Jun 13, 2023)
281 = Def Notice of Discovery to Westville (May 19, 2023)
282 = Court Order for Release Mental Health Records to Def NOT Signed, Dated, Filed
283 = Gull Supplemental Order on Safekeeping NOT Signed, Dated or Filed

Just THANK YOU to all of you who carry the load of finding and combing through the whole legal system and these documents for the rest of us and then tell the rest of us what they mean.

 

[girlhasnoname]

I don’t think LE ever had usable DNA.

Or maybe partial DNA that didn't contain enough markers to specifically identify BG.

 

[girlhasnoname]

He's speaking about the State's subpoenas for RA's mental health records; medical records; employment records; and any and all records from the DOC.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1675688715916648450

Hoosier Public Defender
@publicdefender_
5h
The State’s subpoena for Allen’s mental health/medical records was quashed. Nevertheless, it is worth noting the State failed to comply w/ Indiana law in attempting to obtain Allen’s mental health records.
Hoosier Public Defender
@publicdefender_
5h
Indiana law requires a petition, not a subpoena, be filed to obtain one’s mental health records.
Hoosier Public Defender
@publicdefender_
5h
A hearing must then be conducted to determine if the moving party (in this case the State) has proven by a preponderance of the evidence that 1) other reasonable methods to obtain info are not available or effective and 2) disclosure outweighs potential harm to patient.
Hoosier Public Defender
@publicdefender_
5h
Also note the publicly disclosed motions featured Allen’s SSN. All the more reason to have determined the release of these documents individually rather than a mass release.

Yes, the States subpoena for RA's medical records was quashed which doesn't surprise me, but any notes, observations or recordings by or to anyone other than medical personnel were allowed, as well as RA's employment records for CVS.

IF RA plans on bringing some type of diminished capacity or mitigating mental defect, those records will have to come in anyway won't they?

MOO

 

[girlhasnoname]

I still don't know what his motive was. From what I understand there wasn't a clear you know what motive.

Rage, sadistic, SA would be my guess. Why would a man kidnap and murder 2 young girls (with articles of clothing found elsewhere) if there wasn't some type of sexual motive involved, whether SA occurred or not.

JMO

 

[Justice101]

I’m going from memory only, but I believe at the time of his arrest someone determined the house had been bought by the Allens in cash. A lot of people were surprised by this, but it was also a long time ago, and I think there was speculation that it might have been proceeds of the sale of another house.

(If someone else remembers what I’m talking about please let me know.)

No, I think it was just a legal record of the mortgage being paid off when they refinanced with another loan. Happens all the time when you refinance for a low rate or longer term

 

[photographer4]

The Grand Finale! Why are we seeing Judge Gull's orders with no signatures or dates or filing dates?

https://fox59.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/21/2023/06/DelphiDocumentsCombined.pdf

258 = Def Motion to Quash McL's Subpoena to Westville for RA's Medical Records (May 3, 2023)
260 = Def Motion to Quash McL's Subpoena to Westville for RA's all Other Communications (May 3, 2023)
262 = Def Motion to Quash McL's Subpoena Duces Tecum to CVS (May 3, 2023)
264 = State's Motion Requesting Protective Order Governing Discovery (Feb 13, 2023)
266 = Def Motion to Reconsider and Due Process Hearing (May 3 2023) ***
269 = Court's Temporary Restraining Order NOT Signed, Dated or Filed ***
270 = Black and White Pic of RA and Dog (Apr 5, 2023)
271 = Black and White Pic of RA in Prison Garb (Apr 5, 2023)
272 = Def Subpoena to IN DOC to Allow Attys Entry into Facility for Inspections (May 19, 2023)
273 = Def Request for Prodction to Non-Party #Relates to #272 (May 17, 2023)
275 = Def Subpoena to Robert Baston to Appear at June 15 Hearing (Jun 9, 2023)
276 = Certificate of Analysis: Item 122 which is 40 S&W Cartridge (Jun 13, 2023)
278 = Certificate of Analysis: More Gun Stuff (Jun 13, 2023)
281 = Def Notice of Discovery to Westville (May 19, 2023)
282 = Court Order for Release Mental Health Records to Def NOT Signed, Dated, Filed
283 = Gull Supplemental Order on Safekeeping NOT Signed, Dated or Filed

I really hope this means we are seeing a copy and not a final order!!

 

[FrostedGlass]

For whom because of whom?