IN - Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #168

[sunshineray]

I believe that is exactly what it was since the were begging to remain on the case according to Baldwin's filing as of 10 am this morning.

JMO

It seems the actual person who copied the crime scene photos is now going to help the new lawyers get up to speed? There was no mention in court today of the horrific action of someone presently (as of early Oct 23) in the Baldwin and Rossi law firm being charge or sanctioned for making public crime scene photos of two children brutally murdered. Is there no penalty for disclosing court sealed extremely sensitive documentation of minors? It's outrageous if there's not. I don't need or want to know a name, just that whomever copied and leaked those photos faces some kind of professional penalty.
AJMO

 

[FrostedGlass]

One thing we did learn today is, because of their appearance in the courtroom, that it's highly likely RA's wife and mom are still supporting him.

Also in this article is this quote:

Gull indicated the situation was outside of their control and apologized to the court Thursday afternoon.

Richard Allen attorneys announce withdrawal, leaving Delphi murders suspect without representation

The withdrawal comes two days after Indiana State Police said they would investigate an evidence leak, allegedly at the hands of one attorney's team members.

www.wthr.com

 

[Derph]

Unfortunately correct Frosted.

Justice delayed is justice denied and it's been far too long for these young girls. This isn't about the dumbo Defense or even RA, it's about prosecuting and getting a conviction for the murder(s) of the innocent young girls.

#Justice4Abby&Libby

Oh it is absolutely about RA just as much as it is those poor girls. I want the right person(s) prosecuted for this crime. I want the truth and I'm willing to bet friends and family of Abby and Libby are wanting the same thing. If it's RA then I want an air tight case that will convict him without a shadow of a doubt. As it stands right now there is PLENTY of doubt. If it's not RA and he has nothing to do with it then I want him released and forgiven.

Bottom line is I want the right people to pay for their crimes. If it's RA then so be it. But if it's not him and his life has been ruined by incompetence by both sides of the law, well then, that is almost as bad as if he had been murdered himself. The worst type of crime is prosecuting the wrong person in my opinion. Make sure the right person(s) pay for this heinous crime! THAT is true justice for Abby and Libby!

 

[MistyWaters]

Is it possible they were given the option to withdraw or be withdrawn? Like “we will allow you to resign to save face”? Idk if that is even legal, just trying to stop my head from spinning.

I think that might‘ve been so considering the avalanche of happenings over the past few months. Aside from the defence already admitting responsibility for the past leak (how many warnings do they get?) I do wonder how the judge felt about that hugely inflated 136 page memo as well.

The vast majority of it had absolutely no connection with the motion it should’ve been supporting - the Frank’s Hearing. It just took the opportunity to go for it, as a means to also put confidential information into the public realm such as describing the crime scene in a very detailed way…..as if boldly and deliberately thumbing their noses, literally mocking, any confidentially agreements or gag orders. It can never be a good thing to rile the Judge.

JMO

 

[sunshineray]

Oh it is absolutely about RA just as much as it is those poor girls. I want the right person(s) prosecuted for this crime. I want the truth and I'm willing to bet friends and family of Abby and Libby are wanting the same thing. If it's RA then I want an air tight case that will convict him without a shadow of a doubt. As it stands right now there is PLENTY of doubt. If it's not RA and he has nothing to do with it then I want him released and forgiven.

Bottom line is I want the right people to pay for their crimes. If it's RA then so be it. But if it's not him and his life has been ruined by incompetence by both sides of the law, well then, that is almost as bad as if he had been murdered himself. The worst type of crime is prosecuting the wrong person in my opinion. Make sure the right person(s) pay for this heinous crime! THAT is true justice for Abby and Libby!

I want to know if, as the prosecutor has previously stated there are likely others involved...is the investigation into "others" ongoing? I would think especially the Carroll County community would want some clarification on that. JMO

 

[sunshineray]

I think that might‘ve been so considering the avalanche of happenings over the past few months. Aside from the defence already admitting responsibility for the past leak (how many warnings do they get?) I do wonder how the judge felt about that hugely inflated 136 page memo as well.

The vast majority of it had absolutely no connection with the motion it should’ve been supporting - the Frank’s Hearing. It just took the opportunity to go for it, as a means to also put confidential information into the public realm such as describing the crime scene in a very detailed way…..as if boldly and deliberately thumbing their noses, literally mocking, any confidentially agreements or gag orders. It can never be a good thing to rile the Judge.

JMO

That Franks memorandum was publically posted and then days later sealed. That says a lot to me about the judge's feelings. AJMO

 

[FrostedGlass]

Oh it is absolutely about RA just as much as it is those poor girls. I want the right person(s) prosecuted for this crime. I want the truth and I'm willing to bet friends and family of Abby and Libby are wanting the same thing. If it's RA then I want an air tight case that will convict him without a shadow of a doubt. As it stands right now there is PLENTY of doubt. If it's not RA and he has nothing to do with it then I want him released and forgiven.

Bottom line is I want the right people to pay for their crimes. If it's RA then so be it. But if it's not him and his life has been ruined by incompetence by both sides of the law, well then, that is almost as bad as if he had been murdered himself. The worst type of crime is prosecuting the wrong person in my opinion. Make sure the right person(s) pay for this heinous crime! THAT is true justice for Abby and Libby!

What is the absolute worst is when the victim's family isn't convinced that the one found guilty is guilty.

In one case I followed, the family was in tears, literally begging the judge to not sentence the man to LWOP because they didn't believe he was the one who killed their loved one. That is just one more burden they now have to carry.

 

[MistyWaters]

That Franks memorandum was publically posted and then days later sealed. That says a lot to me about the judge's feelings. AJMO

Yes and the description of the crime scene along with details about the victims bodies as described in the memo were just as disgusting as leaks of crime scene photos IMO. in fact it seems it was more of the same.

 

[MistyWaters]

Memorandum of possible disqualification or sanctions - Filed 10/19/2023 10:07AM by Attorney Hennessy (Baldwin’s attorney)

p. 1

“Continuity of counsel is critical for adequate representation. Article 1 Section 12 of the Indiana Constitution must also be given consideration. Mr. Allen has developed a strong and trusting bond with Mr. Baldwin. Disqualification of either of his court appointed attorneys would greatly prejudice his right to counsel and a timely trial.”

p. 2

“Disqualification of counsel is an extreme remedy for any alleged or perceived violation of a court’s order. Most if not all cases concerning disqualification of counsel involve conflicts of interest. There is no case allowing disqualification when an individual not part of the attorney’s office or staff surreptitiously purloins information from the attorney and disseminates it without permission or the attorney’s knowledge.
Furthermore, any sanction first requires proof of knowing, willful or intentional conduct, as do the rules of Professional Conduct. Here the attorney’s trust and office were violated without his knowledge.”

Just bumping up the motion that was filed by Baldwin’s attorney this morning. Now I see, yes they had every intention of continuing to represent RA, confident of continuing with nothing more than a little tap on the knuckles. “The attorney‘s trust and office were violated without his knowledge.”

Only a few hours later, by the time the hearing was about to begin something very significant had occurred. Baldwin verbally withdrew, the Judge is awaiting Rozzi’s letter.

I wonder if the ex-associate who was given access to the crime scene photos, the one accused of violating, has been questioned by ISP yet?

JMO

 

[photographer4]

Just bumping up the motion that was filed by Baldwin’s attorney this morning. Now I see, yes they had every intention of continuing to represent RA, confident of continuing with nothing more than a little tap on the knuckles. “The attorney‘s trust and office were violated without his knowledge.”

Only a few hours later, by the time the hearing was about to begin something very significant had occurred. Baldwin verbally withdrew, the Judge is awaiting Rozzi’s letter.

I wonder if the ex-associate who was given access to the crime scene photos, the one accused of violating, has been questioned by ISP yet?

JMO

Isn't he the one who committed suicide just after having been questioned by the police in this matter?

 

[zh0r4]

Just catching up with the news, wow! I’m sort of shocked but not really. I think Baldwin’s reputation suffered due to the leaks reflecting negatively on qualities such as integrity and trust so perhaps Rozzi as well thought it better to leave RA with a clean slate. By walking there’s little reason for anyone to dig into the leak and that might’ve been a factor under consideration as well. If that is so, IMO it indicates there was deep concern over what would be unearthed.

Hopefully the newly appointed defence don’t follow in the path of the circus train.

Mostly I empathize with the family members of Libby and Abby who must be dizzy by all the ups and down this case has taken over the years.

Greenlee - “I think it was pretty clear that today was going to end with both defense attorneys off of this case…..because of the severity of leak of crime-scene photographs”

Cain added that they did not expect themselves to "preemptively withdraw themselves," especially because Baldwin brought Hennessy in to defend him. "Obviously, their plans changed quite a lot," Cain said…”

Delphi murders suspect Richard Allen's defense team withdraws from case after alleged leaked photos

Delphi murders suspect Richard Allen's defense attorneys quit the case Thursday after allegations that someone tied to an attorney's office leaked sensitive photos.

www.foxnews.com

I find it interesting podcasters who appear more bias than neutral and whom are monetarily profiting, are predicting future outcomes that reiterate a specific narrative in this investigation. I’ve never seen this level of astroturfing in a homicide case. JMO.

 

[zh0r4]

One thing we did learn today is, because of their appearance in the courtroom, that it's highly likely RA's wife and mom are still supporting him.

Also in this article is this quote:

Richard Allen attorneys announce withdrawal, leaving Delphi murders suspect without representation

The withdrawal comes two days after Indiana State Police said they would investigate an evidence leak, allegedly at the hands of one attorney's team members.

www.wthr.com

Does anyone know where the documents with the alleged phone call where RA confesses to his wife are? Are they in the fox59 doc dump or somewhere else?

 

[Batgirl 2.0]

Just bumping up the motion that was filed by Baldwin’s attorney this morning. Now I see, yes they had every intention of continuing to represent RA, confident of continuing with nothing more than a little tap on the knuckles. “The attorney‘s trust and office were violated without his knowledge.”

Only a few hours later, by the time the hearing was about to begin something very significant had occurred. Baldwin verbally withdrew, the Judge is awaiting Rozzi’s letter.

I wonder if the ex-associate who was given access to the crime scene photos, the one accused of violating, has been questioned by ISP yet?

JMO

Just bumping up the motion that was filed by Baldwin’s attorney this morning. Now I see, yes they had every intention of continuing to represent RA, confident of continuing with nothing more than a little tap on the knuckles. “The attorney‘s trust and office were violated without his knowledge.”

Only a few hours later, by the time the hearing was about to begin something very significant had occurred. Baldwin verbally withdrew, the Judge is awaiting Rozzi’s letter.

I wonder if the ex-associate who was given access to the crime scene photos, the one accused of violating, has been questioned by ISP yet?

JMO

“The attorney’s trust and office were violated without his knowledge.”

I just would like to say that IMO, Baldwin is no victim here. He has a professional duty to secure his office and the contents inside to protect client records, including his computer, and it appears that duty was violated. It happened under his watch.

 

[zh0r4]

“The attorney’s trust and office were violated without his knowledge.”

I just would like to say that IMO, Baldwin is no victim here. He has a professional duty to secure his office and the contents inside to protect client records, including his computer, and it appears that duty was violated. It happened under his watch.

Since the defense was court appointed and working under the state just like the prosecution, does anyone know if they share an office space/building? Or do they work from different spaces?

 

[Observer33]

That Franks memorandum was publically posted and then days later sealed. That says a lot to me about the judge's feelings. AJMO

To me it shows the judges incompetence. She should have made the clerk hold all filings for her review prior to publication especially after issuing a gag order. She is in over her head as much as the prosecutor and LE is.

If the detective lied or mislead in the SWA and they don't throw it out, the fix is in. If LE can't follow the law and rules, then they can't expect the public to be able to either. I believe they rushed to make an arrest prior to the election. What was the hurry? RA wasn't going anywhere. He owned a house, had a job and was established in the community. I also think the unspent round analysis is hocus pocus and junk science. IMO, they are a long way from proving beyond a reasonable doubt that RA committed this crime especially if the courts act with ethics and integrity instead of being in bed with the state.

 

[Observer33]

Since the defense was court appointed and working under the state just like the prosecution, does anyone know if they share an office space/building? Or do they work from different spaces?

They were working out of their private offices in Franklin I beleive.

 

[Emma Peel]

More crazy today.
None of the family members sitting in that courtroom should have been subjected to that shocking crazy announcement today.

So here's what I think is fair: I think that it's fair that if todays hearing was crazy, and stuff wasn't disclosed ... then ... we get to offer crazy theories. (But just once per customer.)
Here's mine any JMHO:

We know contents:
#1. Baldwin's attorney's submission on the Leak; Baldwin strenuously arguing to remain D counsel.

We don't know contents:
#2. SEALED affidavit from RA.
#3. Letter from Prosecutor.

#2, #3 above were reviewed in Chambers, or just prior in the AM.

Baldwin arrived having submitted #1 - prepared to fight to move forward.
Baldwin's mind appears to have abruptly changed once in Chambers.
Baldwin "orally" resigns from the case in Chambers.

WTH happened in Chambers?

Its likely the answer as to Baldwin's abrupt ORAL resignation lies with #2 or #3 above.

#2 - we expect to be RA supporting to keep his attorneys (but we don't know - it was a sealed affidavit from RA). I expect this was a supporting document for the Baldwin's attorney submission on the Leak. Supporting assertion that RA is pleased with and wishes to keep his counsel.

#3 - Letter from Prosecutor. Did this document contain LE investigation narrative that diametrically opposed the Baldwin letter? (So ... did LE disclose that we will see a Baldwin investigation?/arrest?) (Did the Judge give Baldwin an ultimatum? Quit or I'll remove you?) (Did Baldwin just immediately resign b/c he's being investigated/charged?)

Wondering if Rozzi - resigning in the normal form (by letter) tomorrow - feels it's best for RA -the client to have a clean slate b/c the Baldwin thing became a BIG THANG. Rozzi may be a witness if Baldwin is under investigation.

Counsel has agreed to transition to new DA's that Judge will appoint.

We have not heard the end of the Baldwin LEAK fiasco. Somethin' went down fast.
And whatever it was - was characterized as not being "under the Court's control".

 

[MistyWaters]

Isn't he the one who committed suicide just after having been questioned by the police in this matter?

No, according to MS it was “M” , the ex-associate who took pics of the crime scene photos and then passed them to “R”. “R” later died by suicide. It was “R” who had passed the photos on to “Mark” and a female. MS received the photos from “Mark” along with the request to report it to LE.

 

[Megnut]

I guess we now get a trial without the odinism after all

I'm relieved that the trial won't be runed.

 

[MistyWaters]

I'm relieved that the trial won't be runed.

Ha, witty!