Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #112

[Boxer]

I have never really been onboard with the retaliation/drugs/snitch idea, but I have to admit there is something that possibly points in that general direction, and it keeps bugging me. Robert Ives was the prosecutor in the 2014 and 2015 drug cases against DG. He's also the one who filed a Petition to Seal Autopsy Report for the girls on March 28, 2017. Then, as I understand it, he retired/stepped away? But at some point he said if there was ever a break in the girls' murder case, he'd come back? Is that correct? And he was back by the April PC.

Doesn't it seem like a conflict of interest for a prosecuting attorney to work a murder case, where one of the victims was the daughter of the man he once put in jail? Or is he there because there's a connection?

Or is this nothing?

I would say nothing.
DA's duty is to protect citizens, the girls are citizens. The father was a threat to citizens so the DA's duty was to prosecute.

 

[TL4S]

And then her battery power was gone, so no pinging would have helped. My phone keeps a great charge but I'm not familiar with the iPhone's battery life. It might not have had a full charge when they left the house, who knows.

Plus she had been be snapchatting, videoing, recording...

I wonder, too, if she dropped the phone somewhere along the way, or in the water (I don't know if that would turn it off right away, or not) while it was still recording, which is why the attack wasn't captured?

This information was posted by @Spy Versus Spy long ago, when I asked about it:

It's from Episode 10 of the Renner series of interviews : Virtually a Detective: Case #101 Delphi.


@1m.17s

Renner : Is the attack itself on the recording?

Leazenby: Err...No.

 

[Charlot123]

JMO but DG is seriously morbidly obese and could not be BG so his weight is somewhat of an alibi in and of itself

I did not want to mention it. AFAIK he is tall, too. In my wildest dream would I not take him for BG. I am merely pointing out that their story is their story, and has not been confirmed by the police either. BTW, I think he was at the bridge, but maybe later, because he is not too organized? A possibility. This could widen the time frame of the crime.

 

[Boxer]

Yes, and if you forget the case and only think of the phones...no calls from Libby’s phone, allegedly a call from BP’s phone to DG’s phone, then DG calls BP’s phone that doesn’t answer, then silence, then they alert the PD at 5:30? And BP’s phone is pinging all around the town?

So when was the last time Libby’s own phone was active?

BTW, I think it is a tragic coincidence, but very unusual. It is unusual for the kids who are secretive at this age to take parents’ phones. Unless there was a reason. Was Libby afraid that her own cell would be traced?

Interesting. My experience is kids will take any phone if theirs isn't behaving.

 

[Boxer]

I did not want to mention it. AFAIK he is tall, too. In my wildest dream would I not take him for BG. I am merely pointing out that their story is their story, and has not been confirmed by the police either. BTW, I think he was at the bridge, but maybe later, because he is not too organized? A possibility. This could widen the time frame of the crime.

Did DG come alone in his car to the trailhead?

 

[Tippy Lynn]

I had no idea Libby had just done a factory reset of her phone! Does that erase all the information? Texts, etc? Or does the phone company still have records?

If the phone company does keep texts, what about apps like Whatsapp and Snapchat? I am sure there are more that teenagers use. Is all the info gone with a factory reset?

I have not thought too much into the catfish theory or someone she knew well because I assumed all her communication had been thoroughly looked at. If not, that opens up a lot of possibilities!

A factory reset will erase all the information on the phone. However, there are ways to get info off the phone even after a factory reset. Not by the average person, but it can usually be done. If the phone was backed up to the Cloud all the information will be in the Cloud, but a warrant would need to be issued to get the info and Apple is very strict about it. The phone carrier would have records of text, calls and data usage, etc., but it's not likely they would have what was said or done on apps, that would need to be recovered from the actual phone itself and a warrant would have likely been needed to do that. It would be great to know what has been done to recover the cell phone info and translations.

Edited to add Cloud info.....

 

[TL4S]

I would say nothing.
DA's duty is to protect citizens, the girls are citizens. The father was a threat to citizens so the DA's duty was to prosecute.

I agree on that, for sure. Was he the DA, and not just a prosecutor in the DA's office? If so, I can see why he would be involved in a double homicide of children. Maybe the DA himself needs to file a Petition to Seal Autopsy Reports?

It still seems like conflict of interest. If someone was charged with the girls' murders, and acquitted, couldn't DG come back with the argument that RI didn't do his job because he was biased against DG due to prior cases? I don't know. I'm reaching, I guess.

 

[TL4S]

A factory reset will erase all the information on the phone. However, there are ways to get info off the phone even after a factory reset. Not by the average person, but it can usually be done. The phone carrier would have records of text, calls and data usage, etc., but it's not likely they would have what was said or done on apps, that would need to recovered from the actual phone itself and a warrant would have likely been needed to do that. It would be great to know what has been done to recover the cell phone info and translations.

In the last GH video with KG, KG basically said she believe LE had exhausted the SM angle and it doesn't appear to have anything to do with it. Of course, KG doesn't know everything LE knows...

 

[Boxer]

I agree on that, for sure. Was he the DA, and not just a prosecutor in the DA's office? If so, I can see why he would be involved in a double homicide of children. Maybe the DA himself needs to file a Petition to Seal Autopsy Reports?

It still seems like conflict of interest. If someone was charged with the girls' murders, and acquitted, couldn't DG come back with the argument that RI didn't do his job because he was biased against DG due to prior cases? I don't know. I'm reaching, I guess.

I am confused, how is sealing an autopsy prejudicial?

 

[Torch Carrier]

It was in an interview BP did on youtube she mentioned L's phone glitched, was reset, that L had BP's phone that day due to ongoing pros IIRC.

 

[FinePrint]

Why would she have issues with the phone company if it was her phone?

I'm confused. I thought Libby's phone had to be reset but she continued using it afterwords. I never heard that Libby had BP's phone. When did that come out?

 

[Tippy Lynn]

In the last GH video with KG, KG basically said she believe LE had exhausted the SM angle and it doesn't appear to have anything to do with it. Of course, KG doesn't know everything LE knows...

I don't think they should exhaust anything at least not until BG is found. And like you said, KG and GH don't know everything.

 

[TL4S]

I am confused, how is sealing an autopsy prejudicial?

I don't mean that it is. I don't know anything about the legal system, so I'm just wondering if any prosecutor can seal an autopsy, or if it has to be the DA.

My question is, since RI seems to be involved in the case, if BG is ever caught and tried, would RI be the prosecutor? Barring he's still working at that time.

 

[Tippy Lynn]

I'm confused. I thought Libby's phone had to be reset but she continued using it afterwords. I never heard that Libby had BP's phone. When did that come out?

That's what I remember too.

 

[FinePrint]

JMO but DG is seriously morbidly obese and could not be BG so his weight is somewhat of an alibi in and of itself

Yes exactly and I hate to say this but his state also makes me doubt he walked down to the water, back up to the trail head and then to the Freedom Bridge. Its a hike! I too wonder if FSG account is the same as DG. That he saw him at the trail head and later near the Freedom Bridge...just saying.

 

[PaulaDC]

I just posted a link a few posts back here it is again.

If the brother lived in Kentucky at that time this is an odd quote from DB:
"Family called from Delphi to see if Libby had come to Flora and if we had seen her' he said. 'The first thing on our minds was that she might have ran away, maybe she was trying to get to her mom's [in Kentucky].

'You don't know – a 14-year-old girl, she could have had an argument. Things like that go through your mind.

'Or maybe Abby got into a fight with someone and they were hiding out at her 18-year-old brother's house?

'And then they'll get tired and come back tomorrow morning or they'll call. Something like that."

 

[tresir2012]

It was in an interview BP did on youtube she mentioned L's phone glitched, was reset, that L had BP's phone that day due to ongoing pros IIRC.

I must have missed that point so have you got a link? All I remember is that BP phoned the phone company and they advised she needed to have the phone to put the Find my phone app on it and she was trying to explain that they had not got the phone. I don't remember it being her phone or Libby's but the phone company should have been able to do something. LE later pinged the phone but that didn't work either so it was either destroyed or the battery had run down.

 

[PaulaDC]

If the brother lived in Kentucky at that time this is an odd quote from DB:
"Family called from Delphi to see if Libby had come to Flora and if we had seen her' he said. 'The first thing on our minds was that she might have ran away, maybe she was trying to get to her mom's [in Kentucky].

'You don't know – a 14-year-old girl, she could have had an argument. Things like that go through your mind.

'Or maybe Abby got into a fight with someone and they were hiding out at her 18-year-old brother's house?

'And then they'll get tired and come back tomorrow morning or they'll call. Something like that."

"Liberty's Mother Carrie Timmons, is his wife Christina's daughter from her first marriage.

Timmons lives in Kentucky with her husband and daughters, Alexis and Hayden. Liberty also has two other sisters, Kelsi German and Glenna Myers, who live in Delphi.

Liberty was raised by her grandparents, Michael and Becky Patty, and her father, Derrick German, who live in Delphi.

'Kelsi is the oldest girl and then Libby, from Carrie's first marriage,' the grandfather said. 'Then there's Alexis and today is her birthday. She's 11 today. "

 

[bradfordsleuth]

Per this video, it was Libby's phone, not B.P's.

Just in the best interest of trying to keep misinformation from spreading on this thread.

@JudgeJudi transcribed this from the video a while back in Thread #104.

"Now I don’t remember a lot of the walking because at that point in time I called AT&T because Libby had reset her phone the week before because it kept glitching, it just kept catching, it kept freezing up on her. So she reset the phone to factory reset, but when she did that, she didn’t reset some of the different apps. So I called AT&T to ask them if they could ping or trace her phone because if you have, you know, like that thing, Trace My Phone or whatever it is as an app, you can – they can do it. So I know that they probably could trace her phone. "

 

[tresir2012]

If the brother lived in Kentucky at that time this is an odd quote from DB:
"Family called from Delphi to see if Libby had come to Flora and if we had seen her' he said. 'The first thing on our minds was that she might have ran away, maybe she was trying to get to her mom's [in Kentucky].

'You don't know – a 14-year-old girl, she could have had an argument. Things like that go through your mind.

'Or maybe Abby got into a fight with someone and they were hiding out at her 18-year-old brother's house?

'And then they'll get tired and come back tomorrow morning or they'll call. Something like that."

I don't know where Abby's brother lived but why do you think it was Kentucky? That was Libby's mum and siblings that lived in Kentucky. I think Grandfather Bridge was just speculating and he says right at the end what he really thinks, that Libby would be somewhere if she said she would. (Posted earlier).