Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #125

[Howcanppldosuch]

I haven’t been following consistently this or any of the 3 cases over the last yr, but I used to like YouTube but this case has got bizarre videos lately. What makes this case draw out the wacky? Why this case.? Is it random or does something bring that odd element?

 

[Yemelyan]

The hatchet has been mentioned in articles, so anyone can speak about it. But had it not been, or had Nr 6 mentioned the weapon similar to the real one used, kilt or no kilt, that would be a concerning tip, MOO.

Except the ISP says they DON'T want tips like #6. They aren't interested in any tips that contain investigative angles like "check out the Boy Scouts."

They clarified that here: Indiana State Police releases clarification points on Delphi murder suspect

They are specifically asking for tips pertaining to the identity of the person on the bridge and they want the following information: name and age, connection to Delphi, current or past addresses.

See this article for reference: ISP asks for more specific information in tips regarding murder of two Delphi girls

 

[StarryStarryNight]

I haven’t been following consistently this or any of the 3 cases over the last yr, but I used to like YouTube but this case has got bizarre videos lately. What makes this case draw out the wacky? Why this case.? Is it random or does something bring that odd element?

This case draws out wacky ideas because there is almost no real information that has been shared by LE. With no boundaries set by evidence or information, speculation can fly in unlimited directions.

 

[Charlot123]

Except the ISP says they DON'T want tips like #6. They aren't interested in any tips that contain investigative angles like "check out the Boy Scouts."

They clarified that here: Indiana State Police releases clarification points on Delphi murder suspect

They are specifically asking for tips pertaining to the identity of the person on the bridge and they want the following information: name and age, connection to Delphi, current or past addresses.

See this article for reference: ISP asks for more specific information in tips regarding murder of two Delphi girls

@Yemelyan, the article, probably, would help people following the case, and planning to submit a tip (it is not me), but this is not what I meant at all.

(Forget the Boy Scout part). I personally have no clue about the weapon, but from the time of DN, mainstream media was discussing the “hatchet” angle. So the hatchet is known, and any tip mentioning it is likely useless.

But imagine the hatchet was not mentioned? Or, IRL, it was not a hatchet, but a machete, or something very special?

Then the tip suddenly mentioning the weapon would be very interesting, even with the paranoid Boy Scout or kilts angle.

 

[mimimarge]

And this:


'There was a lot more physical evidence than that at the crime scene,' Ives said. 'And it's probably not what you would imagine, or what people would think I'm talking about.'

'It was just not your normal "a person was killed here" crime scene, that's probably all I can say about it,' Ives said.

BBM. I'm fascinated by that stsatement. What is he talking about?????

Also about "staging":

"However, Ives raised the possibility that elements of the scene had been staged in an attempt to trick investigators by sending them down a false path."

The staging remark is a quote from the reporter. I don't think Ives even implied it.

 

[TheVisual]

When it comes to tips I figure they have to wade thru a high percentage of nonsense. Like my neighbor in Fla is a weirdo. Like I saw the picture and I think it is a woman. Those type things. I bet 80% are nonsense. Heck, I remember a year to two back on this forum someone seriously thought the guy had a pet goat in his jacket.

Ives:'There was a lot more physical evidence than that at the crime scene,' Ives said. 'And it's probably not what you would imagine, or what people would think I'm talking about.'

So maybe this is something Ives was referring to when he said" and it's not what you would imagine" (pet goat, dog) Something way out of the ordinary.

 

[Yemelyan]

@Yemelyan, the article, probably, would help people following the case, and planning to submit a tip (it is not me), but this is not what I meant at all.

(Forget the Boy Scout part). I personally have no clue about the weapon, but from the time of DN, mainstream media was discussing the “hatchet” angle. So the hatchet is known, and any tip mentioning it is likely useless.

But imagine the hatchet was not mentioned? Or, IRL, it was not a hatchet, but a machete, or something very special?

Then the tip suddenly mentioning the weapon would be very interesting, even with the paranoid Boy Scout or kilts angle.

Any tip mentioning a critical fact about the crime that LE had purposely held out of public knowledge would, I'm sure, be flagged by Pyramid, the program they use for sorting and assigning priority to incoming tips.

But because anybody could guess at the murder weapon or other crime scene circumstances and potentially be correct, they are not assigning high priority to these tips if they don't also include information about the identity of the person on the bridge or, lacking that, the person's connection to Delphi.

 

[somequestions]

Except the ISP says they DON'T want tips like #6. They aren't interested in any tips that contain investigative angles like "check out the Boy Scouts."

They clarified that here: Indiana State Police releases clarification points on Delphi murder suspect

They are specifically asking for tips pertaining to the identity of the person on the bridge and they want the following information: name and age, connection to Delphi, current or past addresses.

See this article for reference: ISP asks for more specific information in tips regarding murder of two Delphi girls

I agree. Police want specific tips. If it does not have specific information in it, police probably are not going to investigate it. That does not mean the tip might not have something important, only that police officers are human beings. Look at it from their perspective. Would you investigate tips like "I think it was a group of rogue bikers terrorizing the Delphi region." LE has other things going on besides the Abigail Williams and Liberty German case.

So if you submit a tip that says you saw someone who looks like the bridge guy a few weeks ago at Walmart and it made you feel nervous, police are not going to investigate it. You have given no specific information about the specific day, time of day, whether you are referring to the video, sketch 1 or sketch 2, or even an approximate age. I do not think police do anything with these tips other than add them to the pile. When I had reservations about sending my tip in, this was why. I looked at my tip and thought to myself it has nothing specific in it that can be used to quickly track down. I sent it in anyway because that is what the families asked for people to do.

I can only imagine the amount of tips LE has got that refers to someone who thinks they have seen the bridge guy. Even when people have specific information like a name or address, that does not mean the person they saw is the bridge guy. So much time probably gets wasted even when police do chase down these tips.

So in my opinion if you want LE to take you seriously I would make sure that any tip submitted has specific identifying information in it. Or else it is just going to get added to the pile they might look at later, if at all.

 

[sunshineray]

One more from the DM article today:

'Ives said: 'Even though at the crime scene there was a lot of physical evidence of one sort of another which would lead logically to one person or another, it never led to one particular person.''

Maybe the DNA found led to a Delphi family tree? Hiding in plain sight, does live, used to live, comes home occasionally, works there?

 

[sunshineray]

I think they have what they need at this point besides a confession and additional forensic experts/data scientists to sort through all the tips/data. Considering the volume of info they received, it's not surprising its taking this long. As I posted upthread, my amateur speculation is that the Perp is in those existing tips or may have already been interviewed and quickly dismissed in the triage process. It's time to take a second pass on that initial data triaging. They need the best data scientists they can find working on this...it's all about the data, the correlations, and being able to see what isn't obvious.

Amateur opinion and speculation

I also think what they have already IS what they needed to identify. I believe that LE has determined the who but have not the smoking gun evidence they need to get a conviction. Without that there will be no arrest. AJMO

 

[sunshineray]

Anybody watch the Amazon show "The Eleven" about cold case serial killings in Galveston, TX area in the 70's? Interesting in that this serial killer choose two young teen girls to abduct and kill together like Abby and Libby, but he did three times! The bodies or remains were always discovered in water.

40+ years later the best suspect is an incarcerated man who's history includes him being a college grad, married his college sweetheart, had three kids, co-owned a very successful local business, is a convicted rapist, molester, masterbating flasher who always got off with just treatment until he killed a man who approached and reproached him while he flashed a group of kids. After posting bail he fled and was a fugitive for 14 years later being arrested, convicted and sentenced.

Years later while in prison he sent confessions to LE saying he killed "The Eleven" murdered girls. LE and the prosecutor decided it was without value, guy was a nutcase, filed confession away. I only mention this program because it shows how an investigation can get sidetracked and stalled for many years...until new eyes reviewed it all. I know some here believe that's needed in the Delphi case.

 

[Rhiannon Gray]

"We are one tip away from success," Indiana State Police Superintendent Doug Carter told "Good Morning America" in an interview airing Wednesday.
Authorities have not released information about how the girls died, but Carter said he believes the killer is hiding within the close-knit Delphi community. He said someone knows who the killer is but is afraid to come forward.

"Somebody that commits a horrific crime like this against two little girls probably has shown signs of violence in the past … he didn't just all of a sudden decide to do this one day," Carter said.
Carter said he believes the killer lives in, works in or frequents the Delphi area, but he declined to elaborate on why he believes that.
Carter said the case keeps him up at night.

"We're going to continue to push and push and push until we get that final piece of information," he said. "We know significantly more [information], but we're not going to talk about that because the only other person who knows that is the killer."

These are all statements That DC made in an interview given to Good Morning America in May of 2019.

I know that there are so many varying opinions on whether or not the suspect is actually known to the police.
When I read these things, I can't help but believe that do know..but there is something that prevents them from making the arrest.
But what?
What is it? Why can't they take this guy into custody.
This case , I really believe, haunts me more than any other.
There HAS to be resolution, and soon.

My opinions and my observations.

 

[Rhiannon Gray]

Carter says, "we believe this person is from Delphi, currently or has previously lived here, visits Delphi on a regular basis or works here." He adds, "We believe the suspect is between 18 and 40 years old but may appear younger."

I know there are valid reasons for the belief that the suspect is from Delphi or that he visits or works there. What reasons would they believe this?
Because of the seeming familiarity he has to the trail?
Because of his escape route?
Because of something at the CS?

They believe the suspect is between 18 and 40, but may appear younger?

THIS is when , if I was interviewing DC, I would ask questions.
They would be..
Do you believe the killer to be between 18 and 40 NOW? Or that was the age when they committed the crime?
18 today , would have been 16 when the crimes were committed. As pert the date of this release) 18 when the crimes committed and 21 now?
It may seem trivial, but often times, a male does not finish his growing until the age of 18- so this may have changed?

Younger looking than 40 can mean a wide age range- he could appear 38, or even 18.
Younger than 18 could mean he looks like a middle school student.

I have so many questions!

My opinions and my observations.

 

[Rhiannon Gray]

"Please be patient with us please. We're just beginning. We're just now beginning. We will not stop." DC 2019

There is something that I have convinced myself of with this statement. Here it goes:
In 2018, on the anniversary of the murders, DC said
"I believe that we are one piece of the puzzle away from figuring out who this individual is. Then the real work begins."

As optimistic as I may be , I see something in these 2 statements that to me is clear.

The real work started a year and a half a go.
I believe it because it was stated that once they knew who it was, the real work would begin.

I HAVE to believe that an arrest will be made and that they know what they are doing.

I refuse to believe that they do not have any idea.
I will not.

My opinions and observations.

 

[sunshineray]

"We are one tip away from success," Indiana State Police Superintendent Doug Carter told "Good Morning America" in an interview airing Wednesday.
Authorities have not released information about how the girls died, but Carter said he believes the killer is hiding within the close-knit Delphi community. He said someone knows who the killer is but is afraid to come forward.

"Somebody that commits a horrific crime like this against two little girls probably has shown signs of violence in the past … he didn't just all of a sudden decide to do this one day," Carter said.
Carter said he believes the killer lives in, works in or frequents the Delphi area, but he declined to elaborate on why he believes that.
Carter said the case keeps him up at night.

"We're going to continue to push and push and push until we get that final piece of information," he said. "We know significantly more [information], but we're not going to talk about that because the only other person who knows that is the killer."

These are all statements That DC made in an interview given to Good Morning America in May of 2019.

I know that there are so many varying opinions on whether or not the suspect is actually known to the police.
When I read these things, I can't help but believe that do know..but there is something that prevents them from making the arrest.
But what?
What is it? Why can't they take this guy into custody.
This case , I really believe, haunts me more than any other.
There HAS to be resolution, and soon.

My opinions and my observations.

MHO...Lack of forensic evidence of the killer's physical presence at the crime scene.

 

[Rhiannon Gray]

We’re seeking the public’s help to identify the driver of a vehicle that was parked at the old CPS/DCS welfare building in the city of Delphi that was abandoned on the east side of County Road 300 North next to the Hoosier Heartland Highway between the hours of noon to five on February 14th, 2017 [Note: It has been updated that the date was misspoken- it should be February 13th, not 14th].

If you were parked there or know who was parked there, please contact the officers at the command post at The Delphi City Building.

2019 Press Conference , DC

Why???? Thoughts?
What value does this hold?
Is this the killer? Is it a witness?
It was brought up for a reason.

My opinions and my observations.

 

[Falling Down]

We’re seeking the public’s help to identify the driver of a vehicle that was parked at the old CPS/DCS welfare building in the city of Delphi that was abandoned on the east side of County Road 300 North next to the Hoosier Heartland Highway between the hours of noon to five on February 14th, 2017 [Note: It has been updated that the date was misspoken- it should be February 13th, not 14th].

If you were parked there or know who was parked there, please contact the officers at the command post at The Delphi City Building.

2019 Press Conference , DC

Why???? Thoughts?
What value does this hold?
Is this the killer? Is it a witness?
It was brought up for a reason.

My opinions and my observations.

I've said it before here and I'll say it again, I don't understand why no vehicle description has been given. The only explanation I can think of is maybe only one or two people gave credible descriptions, meaning they would have needed one or two more (I'm referencing the Iowa case. here), in order to release a vehicle description.

Why even bring it up?

JMO

 

[SMK777]

The real work started a year and a half a go.
I believe it because it was stated that once they knew who it was, the real work would begin.

I HAVE to believe that an arrest will be made and that they know what they are doing.

I refuse to believe that they do not have any idea.
I will not.

I’d sure like to believe this.

One thing I do know about police investigations (not only from reading a lot of true crime, but from having been privy to cases connected with people I knew) is that it can look like something is over, finished, dead - months and months of silence and inactivity.

And then, boom, a headline about an indictment/arrest/trial etc.

It’s the silence and inactivity before that which drives you crazy.

 

[sunshineray]

Does anyone know, when does the grand jury for Carroll County meet? Once a month, every 3 months?

 

[StarryStarryNight]

I've said it before here and I'll say it again, I don't understand why no vehicle description has been given. The only explanation I can think of is maybe only one or two people gave credible descriptions, meaning they would have needed one or two more (I'm referencing the Iowa case. here), in order to release a vehicle description.

Why even bring it up?

JMO

Some folks a while back pointed out that LE was seeking information about the driver of the car parked at the old CPS building not the car itself and that that might indicate that LE already had information on the car, at least probably the color. They then theorized LE didn’t mention the color etc of the car so they would know when someone called in, if they were talking about the right car and the right driver. It made sense to me.