Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #145

[TL4S]

I just can't move past the suspicious activity:

Before Vegas trip (approx. 2/13/17 to 2/21/17):

• KAK thinking he's f'ed and packing an extra bag with intentions on going back to Vegas after returning from trip with Dad. (KAK admitted this)

During Vegas trip (approx. 2/22/17 to 2/25/17):

• Reading Delphi murder snapchat articles, then minutes later looking up if IP addresses could be traced from SM. (KAK admitted this)
• Still communicating with L as a_shots while in Vegas, knowing full well she was dead. (KAK says that's a group messaging thing, but the interview suggests something specific, which isn't outright said, so I don't know what it was)

After Vegas trip (and right after returning from polygraph test):

• Looking up how long DNA lasts (KAK admitted this)
• Deleting missing then found iPhone 5 apps and search history from 2/10 - 2/15/2017 before handing over to LE. (KAK admitted this)

In the years between search and arrest:

• 2018, Dad FB posts picture of KAK, claiming he hadn't been home for 2 years.
• May, 2020, KAK FB posts saying he started new job in Vegas on 2/12 or 2/13/2017 (I've read both dates).

Any question about other users of the a_shots account is put to rest by KAK's digital activity in Vegas, imo, where the only other person with possible access was TK.

It appears to me that the general idea was for it to look like KAK was in Vegas from just prior to the murders, proven by his communications with L from Vegas, where it seemed a_shots (and therefore KAK) didn't know she was dead, the FB start date for his new job in Vegas, his dad's FB not seeing him since sometime in 2016, and no digital evidence from his device, from 2/10 - 2/15, to prove otherwise. It seems the plan was put into action before and during the Vegas trip, and carried on with for several years by father and son, even before KAK's CSAM arrest. It's those actions taken prior to LE's various involvements with the Ks that stands out the most, imo.

What is most perplexing, though, is how KAK told LE on 2/25/17 that he was with his dad all day 2/13/2017, in Peru, and maybe at his grandparents. So all this Vegas stuff isn't to fool LE, because he knows they already know he was in IN. I'm curious what was the goal in this fabricated tale then? I'm beginning to wonder if maybe he was trying to convince possible witnesses, or people they thought LE might talk to, or other online users. Clearly, even as late as May, 2020, he/they were concerned that KAK was still being eyed for the Delphi murders. I wonder why, when he hadn't even been arrested for the CSAM yet? Were people getting interviewed by LE and word was filtering down to KAK and TK?

 

[Prime8]

I just can't move past the suspicious activity:

Before Vegas trip (approx. 2/13/17 to 2/21/17):

• KAK thinking he's f'ed and packing an extra bag with intentions on going back to Vegas after returning from trip with Dad. (KAK admitted this)

During Vegas trip (approx. 2/22/17 to 2/25/17):

• Reading Delphi murder snapchat articles, then minutes later looking up if IP addresses could be traced from SM. (KAK admitted this)
• Still communicating with L as a_shots while in Vegas, knowing full well she was dead. (KAK says that's a group messaging thing, but the interview suggests something specific, which isn't outright said, so I don't know what it was)

After Vegas trip (and right after returning from polygraph test):

• Looking up how long DNA lasts (KAK admitted this)
• Deleting missing then found iPhone 5 apps and search history from 2/10 - 2/15/2017 before handing over to LE. (KAK admitted this)

In the years between search and arrest:

• 2018, Dad FB posts picture of KAK, claiming he hadn't been home for 2 years.
• May, 2020, KAK FB posts saying he started new job in Vegas on 2/12 or 2/13/2017 (I've read both dates).

Any question about other users of the a_shots account is put to rest by KAK's digital activity in Vegas, imo, where the only other person with possible access was TK.

It appears to me that the general idea was for it to look like KAK was in Vegas from just prior to the murders, proven by his communications with L from Vegas, where it seemed a_shots (and therefore KAK) didn't know she was dead, the FB start date for his new job in Vegas, his dad's FB not seeing him since sometime in 2016, and no digital evidence from his device, from 2/10 - 2/15, to prove otherwise. It seems the plan was put into action before and during the Vegas trip, and carried on with for several years by father and son, even before KAK's CSAM arrest. It's those actions taken prior to LE's various involvements with the Ks that stands out the most, imo.

What is most perplexing, though, is how KAK told LE on 2/25/17 that he was with his dad all day 2/13/2017, in Peru, and maybe at his grandparents. So all this Vegas stuff isn't to fool LE, because he knows they already know he was in IN. I'm curious what was the goal in this fabricated tale then? I'm beginning to wonder if maybe he was trying to convince possible witnesses, or people they thought LE might talk to, or other online users. Clearly, even as late as May, 2020, he/they were concerned that KAK was still being eyed for the Delphi murders. I wonder why, when he hadn't even been arrested for the CSAM yet? Were people getting interviewed by LE and word was filtering down to KAK and TK?

I agree that it could have been changing strategy or they just aren't that smart or weren't communicating well and their lies just started to build and contradict each other. Lying online can be easier to control/organize, but when you start having to mix in friends/family and then LE, you may find you've dug yourself in too deep.

 

[Prime8]

If there was anyone fully capable of committing a double homicide on two young girls, JBC would probably be it, imo. It's just a matter of whether being capable is the same as being guilty, in his case. There might be some "small town USA" stuff linking him to the Ks, or fb bridge coincidences, etc., but only LE knows if there's anything truly solid. Either way, society is safer as a whole with him behind bars, imo.

But I'm going to go out on a limb here. I theorize that BG and ski mask peeper are one in the same.

If LE is being truthful about the Galveston girl giving her address to a_shots, then maybe so did L. The girls were seemingly at the same sleepover when they communicated with a_shots (if I'm interpreting the interview correctly). A_shots communicated with both girls regularly for an extended period of time, over hours and days (maybe even months). The Delphi murders and the ski mask incident happened one week apart, on the same day of the week, same time of day, within an hour or so, and to girls who were connected not only to each other (I think), but to a_shots. It appears as if both girls had planned meetups with a_shots, as well. There's a lot of parallels in those two incidences, and it all leads back to KAK's device. I'm going to guess JBC did not have that kind of full access to KAK's device, so unless he was being fed the information in real-time, it's hard for me to connect him. I'm willing to keep an open mind, however.

Personally, I think what we saw was an escalation from 2015/16 CSAM exchanges and communicating with local girls, to grooming and stalking from afar, to then finally showing up in person, with intentions. And all of that activity traced back to one location...the Peru house, KAK's devices. Maybe knowing a trip to Vegas right around the corner was enough motivation to make that final jump. Remember, after the murders, and after a guy almost got busted in a ski mask, suddenly KAK thinks he's "f'ed" and brought an extra bag along on that Vegas trip, so he could skip town when they got back. Why?

I do think that the Vegas trip could have originally had nothing to do with anything but then became convenient to a plan that was hatched later.

It also sprang to mind that there are cases where whatever the killer wanted to do wasn't satisfied with the first crime and they very quickly offend again to quench that urge. So it could be that whatever the plan was with the girls, didn't happen the way A_S wanted it to. So he's all amped now, almost in a frenzy and decides to strike again later with the girl from Galveston.

 

[TL4S]

It's also very curious to me about how KAK says he found the Samsung 5, like it was just laying on the seat of a cab in Vegas, or something. So he did a reset on it on 2/23/17, presumably to erase it and claim it for his own use. I don't believe it was made clear which phone the Delphi stuff was being searched on in Vegas, but it seems maybe a_shots was communicating with L (after her death) via the iPhone 5 since the search affidavit specifies the chat conversations on the Samsung were in regards to meeting people in Vegas and prostitution. So really? He just found a cell phone, factory reset it, added it to his account, and started using it in Vegas? Just another odd detail...

 

[TL4S]

I do think that the Vegas trip could have originally had nothing to do with anything but then became convenient to a plan that was hatched later.

It also sprang to mind that there are cases where whatever the killer wanted to do wasn't satisfied with the first crime and they very quickly offend again to quench that urge. So it could be that whatever the plan was with the girls, didn't happen the way A_S wanted it to. So he's all amped now, almost in a frenzy and decides to strike again later with the girl from Galveston.

Yes. I ask myself what kind of conversations did the girl from Galveston and L have about a_shots? It seems to me they were at the same sleepover, a_shots continued to communicate with them both, and both girls wanted to meet up with him. Was there a competition between the girls, or was a_shots asking them to be secretive? Was this Galveston girl the one we've always heard rumored to be the girl who was going to join A&L at the bridge that day, but couldn't come? Who was the intended target, and was the motive the same for both? So many questions...

 

[Yuletide]

I suspect something akin to this. I think Libby became a 'threat', not a 'nuisance'.

I agree. Thus the reason there was inuendo that With Libby’s death, it was personal and the reference to her fighting so hard. She connected the dots. She figured him out.

 

[Facinatingtimes]

I agree. Thus the reason there was inuendo that With Libby’s death, it was personal and the reference to her fighting so hard. She connected the dots. She figured him out.

And she had taken that crime/forensics class.

 

[Ozoner]

I agree. Thus the reason there was inuendo that With Libby’s death, it was personal and the reference to her fighting so hard. She connected the dots. She figured him out.

And she had taken that crime/forensics class.

This theory is possible but highly speculative.

I'm not convinced that KAK or TK is BG, but if anything I would lean towards TK first. KAK just looks to corpulent compared to BG. TK might be a possibility if LE really screwed the pooch when it came to estimating BG's height and weight.

 

[Facinatingtimes]

And she had taken that crime/forensics class

I need to edit this - I don’t know if she took a crime/forensics class. I know she was interested in the topics, and took science-type camps/classes at Purdue.

 

[carbuff]

I agree. Thus the reason there was inuendo that With Libby’s death, it was personal and the reference to her fighting so hard. She connected the dots. She figured him out.

That might be plausible. If she threatened to go to the police, that might be what triggered him to murderous rage. Or fear.

 

[Yuletide]

That might be plausible. If she threatened to go to the police, that might be what triggered him to murderous rage. Or fear.

Agreed

 

[Stormy415]

I just finished reading the transcript, and you know what? KAK is a stinking liar!!

I looked at the picture of him at the Hoover Dam, I'm "almost" convinced that he is BG. He was thinner and so was BG at that time. And, since his mugshot, he has put on significant weight. Maybe to change his appearance??

 

[Spartygirl]

Yes. I ask myself what kind of conversations did the girl from Galveston and L have about a_shots? It seems to me they were at the same sleepover, a_shots continued to communicate with them both, and both girls wanted to meet up with him. Was there a competition between the girls, or was a_shots asking them to be secretive? Was this Galveston girl the one we've always heard rumored to be the girl who was going to join A&L at the bridge that day, but couldn't come? Who was the intended target, and was the motive the same for both? So many questions...

Not sure who the girl from galveston is with the peeping tom or KAK but the gal that was invited to go to the bridge is from Delphi IIRC.\JMO

 

[ScumbagTrav]

Hey guys, I don't remember the time given on HLN and I'm having difficulty finding it in any episode recap or discussion.

But on the Feb HLN "Special" what times were given as "reveals" during the show? Was it the photo was taken at 2:07 and the video was 43 seconds long?

I cant remember for sure.

 

[zencompass]

This theory is possible but highly speculative.

I'm not convinced that KAK or TK is BG, but if anything I would lean towards TK first. KAK just looks to corpulent compared to BG. TK might be a possibility if LE really screwed the pooch when it came to estimating BG's height and weight.

Dear @Ozoner,

Yes, there are so many possibilities in this case. I suppose that is why the case
leads to speculation (highly or otherwise) because, alas, we have so few details.

There is a reason that L.E. have removed the height range from their poster. I am glad that they did, for whatever reason, because there are too many variables in the outdoors to determine the most accurate height range - in my own opinion.

I have hope that this case will be solved at some point. I guess there's a reason why the L.E. have stated that this case is "complicated".

Is there a theory or possibility that you tend to lean towards?

I go back and forth with "theories" and speculation - but we just know so little really - in my opinion.

May this case be solved soon. My heart is with Abby's and Libby's families.

JMO

 

[Imvp2]

I just finished reading the transcript, and you know what? KAK is a stinking liar!!

I looked at the picture of him at the Hoover Dam, I'm "almost" convinced that he is BG. He was thinner and so was BG at that time. And, since his mugshot, he has put on significant weight. Maybe to change his appearance??

KAK weight gain = "hiding in plain sight"

 

[Ozoner]

Dear @Ozoner,

Yes, there are so many possibilities in this case. I suppose that is why the case
leads to speculation (highly or otherwise) because, alas, we have so few details.

There is a reason that L.E. have removed the height range from their poster. I am glad that they did, for whatever reason, because there are too many variables in the outdoors to determine the most accurate height range - in my own opinion.

I have hope that this case will be solved at some point. I guess there's a reason why the L.E. have stated that this case is "complicated".

Is there a theory or possibility that you tend to lean towards?

I go back and forth with "theories" and speculation - but we just know so little really - in my opinion.

May this case be solved soon. My heart is with Abby's and Libby's families.

JMO

I am unsure. KAK seems like a possibility, but he doesn't look like BG to me. TK isn't young enough to match the young BG sketch.

If I have to put all of my chips on one theory, I'll say that neither KAK nor TK is BG and that the crime is unrelated to the anthony_shots account an that BG targeted the location, not these girls in particular.

 

[zencompass]

I am unsure. KAK seems like a possibility, but he doesn't look like BG to me. TK isn't young enough to match the young BG sketch.

If I have to put all of my chips on one theory, I'll say that neither KAK nor TK is BG and that the crime is unrelated to the anthony_shots account an that BG targeted the location, not these girls in particular.

Thanks @Ozoner for sharing your theory!

I always like hearing others' thoughts on this case. Other's viewpoints and various theories are fascinating to me, especially because any of these could be what really happened - or close to what happened.

Your theory is one which I bounce back and forth to. It falls into the Occam's Razor view and I've read other members' posts who find this theory the most plausible.

The other theory on my mind lately is that someone who associated with KAK or TK learned of the communications KAK had with L.G., as well as other young girls in that area. That person could be BG. I could be wrong in considering this (I'm wrong at least 3 times a day!) but it is yet another theory.

This case feels like a huge puzzle to me and sometimes I think I'm making it more complicated than it is.

JMO

 

[M. Kay]

May I respectfully disagree about the crime not being related to the Anthony Shots account? I think it is. The 'new' young BG sketch revealed at the press conference matches the "young male model" now an adult in LE. They were asking public for other young girls who had similar experiences. BG probably was set up for the meeting on the bridge through the K's CP network...and the released transcript of younger K. interrogation fits the facts .

 

[Always Stay Hopeful]

I think "annoying" is KAK's euphemism for "unattractive".

Something I've wondered was if he was trying to get pictures of her but she wasn't comfortable with it, and that was annoying to him.