IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #46

[Deleted member 155000]

I still lean toward simple and most likely:

-That it is a local familiar with the area.

-That the perp killed them on or very near the site where they were found, in the immediate 30 mins or so after preventing them from leaving.

-That he covered their bodies a little bit before leaving them.

-That one or more people have submitted tips about the person, but so far they appear to check out (again, look at Jeffrey Willis, whose van and appearance was reported by a coffee shop employee here in Michigan, but when checked, convinced officers he had just had his van cleaned due to "cigarette smoke.")

-That police sometimes lock people up for unrelated charges while looking for more evidence or accomplices. And that police sometimes release persons of interest so they can more closely watch them with the hopes they will trip themselves up.


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[Burnt Toast]

True. I've always been of the theory that they were later placed there. But you have a 200 pound person who may not have been the initial target. As others have thought, I think Abby was the target. And then you count they are heavier dead (hate typing that) than alive. But it wouldn't surprise me if he left one girl dead and took the other away.

what makes you think abby was the "target"?

 

[Burnt Toast]

I agree with that, its a great physical effort to carry two bodies, if he kill the girls in the bridge.

if they were killed on the bridge then "down the hill" would have had to occur before that.

 

[Lilowlet]

I know that this has been almost beaten to death, but after viewing this image I found. I think there is probably a very good chance that Abby was in fact edited out of the one image. Especially if these stills were taken in close sequence of one another. I think that there is a good chance Abbys grey sleeve in the one image and in the other one she has been edited out. Maybe I am way off here, but to me it would also explain some of the shadows and eraser marks that some others have pointed out as well. I dont know why but seeing these two images side by side it jumped out at me and smacked me in the face ...JMO

source
http://www.wthr.com/article/police-set-up-new-number-for-delphi-murder-tips

I sort of wondered if not Abby but, maybe Libby s sleeve or cuff was in the photo. If I get nervous or scared my hands shake, I would have to hold a phone recording or snapping a pic with two hands. Maybe someone else suggested it already if so sorry for saying again. I keep hearing of a tie-dye shirt. But wonder if something like long sleeve plaid or other pattern was worn over due to weather even if unseasonably warm. I pick up my son from middle school and see lots of kids with these types of styles of clothing. Idk all IMO and speculations.

 

[Burnt Toast]

Where is the source for the claim that one of the children weighed 200 pounds?

their weights are on the FBI posters. Libby is 200 pounds and Abby is 100 pounds.

 

[Jo in Calif]

It sure would be interesting to know what RL was wearing when he went to the ts.
LE knew that the time he went to the ts had nothing to do with the girls. Wonder what time he told them he went to Lafayette? If he told them he went there at say around 2:30-3:00 and it checked out why would they have served a pcsr? Nothing was mentioned in the pv warrant as his trip to Lafayette, did he have someone drive him there? Something isn't adding up.

 

[Burnt Toast]

Since there has not been any New developments in the case, do you think they will release some of the video to help the public try to identify, BG..

i don't think they will. It is my belief that they know who it is and are just building their case. Their silence has been deafening.

 

[Lilowlet]

if they were killed on the bridge then "down the hills" would have had to occur before that.

This is something I keep coming back to. Some say it sounds like a calm command and hear "get" or "godown" etc. I keep wondering if this was a I lost my "dog" or other situation I saw him run someone asks where and BG says right down there get down the hill. To me some situation of this nature wouldn't even require control for a certain amount of time. To me, it would explain that if BG was 70-80 feet away from the bridge end. That they possibly waited for BG took a vid... Didn't suspect too much at the time. Not saying I believe this. I have no clue tbh. I just can't wrap my head around it. All IMO and speculations.

 

[BlueShoe]

I think LE knows who BG is. As some others have pointed out, it has been a while since public statements asking for identification of the man in the photos. Instead, all I've seen (and I have not seen everything) is more general, "keep the tips coming," kinds of statements. In addition, the disappearance of most billboard notices, etc. Whoever BG turns out being, identifying him is not enough to get a conviction for murder. LE has stated the voice recording may not be him, which means that a positive ID cannot be made with BG and the voice. Although the voice recording may have something disturbing on it, we are not privy to what that is, and it may not be enough to establish murder either. In my view, LE is searching for more evidence. They need to tie BG to something more. If nothing else is found on RL's property, car or home to implicate either him or someone else who was on his property, or in his car or home, then IMO the police will be back to square one. I do wonder if evidence was discovered in the bin across the road or in the vicinity of RL's car parked there. I am also apparently the only one interested in the movements of RL's car either around the time of the murders or in general. Was his car ever at or near the other areas that were searched? Did other people usually drive him around in his car? Was that permitted under his probation? Just my own interest because I've looked at the property and the photos so many times that I'm just trying to think of other things to consider. Was his car ever returned? Where is it now? MOO

 

[Spiritecho]

Are gofund me accounts allowed to be posted? I tried to look through the rules...I will alert.

 

[Shiressleuth]

Going along with the theory that the girls were placed by the river the same day or later that night.... Perhaps one of the girls remained by the river overnight and the other placed nearby the next morning. As I recall from the search parties and description of the girls on the 13th, Libby weighed close to 200 pounds. Sadly she could have possibly been murdered 1st and her body remained in the same place. Abby could have been taken out of the area for several hours and then her body returned on the 14th in the early hours before search party resumed.

Difference in body weight of the girls makes me question my initial theory they could have been taken out of the area. But with lighter Abby, it's possible. I don't see someone taking a 200 pound person to and from an area so easily.

That makes sense. Both make a run for it across creek L gets killed (shot?) on opposite bank, A gets caught and taken back to vehicle leaving L on opposite bank. A is taken from scene and brought back later via car and cemetery track (carried) explaining one set of tracks only from cemetery to CS.

 

[Bemused]

ocgrad, the reporter in this media piece from the evening of 2/13 says "she" when referring to the relative who was due to pick the girls up. Did the reporter make an assumption or did she get the info from LE?

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Tfi2WI9fo5o

ocgrad
I've always thought it may be significant that they identify the person who dropped them off as Libby's sister but have not identified the person who was to pick them up except as a family member. I'm not saying I think a family member is directly involved, just that the way one was identified and one was not stood out to me.

 

[St. Anthony2017]

HLN weekend express has story about RL and how he will be sentenced on Monday on Probation violation.

 

[JnRyan]

I still lean toward simple and most likely:

-That it is a local familiar with the area.

-That the perp killed them on or very near the site where they were found, in the immediate 30 mins or so after preventing them from leaving.

-That he covered their bodies a little bit before leaving them.

-That one or more people have submitted tips about the person, but so far they appear to check out (again, look at Jeffrey Willis, whose van and appearance was reported by a coffee shop employee here in Michigan, but when checked, convinced officers he had just had his van cleaned due to "cigarette smoke.")

-That police sometimes lock people up for unrelated charges while looking for more evidence or accomplices. And that police sometimes release persons of interest so they can more closely watch them with the hopes they will trip themselves up.


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Yeah, I can see that. I would not be at all surprised if LE has actually talked with BG and he is either on their list or he convinced them otherwise. With the large task force and over 13K tips, LE has probably talked to hundreds of folks.

 

[kodi]

This video by Julie Melvin IMO shows a more accurate view of the river bank at the crime scene, You will notice there is no steep hill in the background.

visible about 57 seconds in

[video=youtube;yQCv3TeNayk]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yQCv3TeNayk[/video]

I know that some feel the girls may have been up off the ground; in reviewing this particular video you can clearly see the crime tape surrounding the crime scene. Do you suppose there would be evidence markers or some other indication within the trees, if in fact, the girls were located in one of them versus on the ground?

I realize there are visual limitations as there is not full video of the entire crime area, but the question did pop into my mind.


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[Falling Down]

To the lady who asked about whether police can find social media or texts, there are sometimes ways of messaging that can't be easily checked. There are texting apps that let you send texts without giving away your number. There are also social media platforms that let you broadcast "live" and you can choose to let these disappear after you stop broadcasting. I don't necessarily have reason to think those play into this case, but it shows how fluid social media is.




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^^^^Great points.

I've read accounts of stuff described above being used to harass people, as well as to lure or bait people. The first platform I heard about being used for it is Skype. Users can make untraceable phone calls on Skype.

For example, a perp could use a random landline phone number, or the victim's own number, to call 911. Stuff like that. Strange and sad, but it happens. I hope there wasn't an online connection in this case, but we just don't know, yet.

 

[AFTM]

That makes sense. Both make a run for it across creek L gets killed (shot?) on opposite bank, A gets caught and taken back to vehicle leaving L on opposite bank. A is taken from scene and brought back later via car and cemetery track (carried) explaining one set of tracks only from cemetery to CS.

I believe it would be to risky to murder one child take another and then bring one back later and kill that one and leave body at the same place on the same night when search parties were out looking for the girls.... BG is not an idiot...

Sorry but I don't believe it happened that way. He killed one child. Then did what he wanted to the other maybe. Then thought he killed that one and left maybe leaving in a hurry. I have been hearing stories that one child was still warm when found. So evidently had died later.

Moo said the cow...

 

[TheVisual]

This is something I keep coming back to. Some say it sounds like a calm command and hear "get" or "godown" etc. I keep wondering if this was a I lost my "dog" or other situation I saw him run someone asks where and BG says right down there get down the hill. To me some situation of this nature wouldn't even require control for a certain amount of time. To me, it would explain that if BG was 70-80 feet away from the bridge end. That they possibly waited for BG took a vid... Didn't suspect too much at the time. Not saying I believe this. I have no clue tbh. I just can't wrap my head around it. All IMO and speculations.

Exactly Lilowlet!

 

[Bemused]

So, is your theory that he killed them and then went to go buy fish? Afterwards?

You didn't address this to me but that's my theory.

If I murdered two people in "my backyard" as the PO has referred to it, I wouldn't drive several miles, whatever the distance is into Delphi, but I'd go a greater distance like Lafayette because I know I'm going to need an alibi that puts as many miles between me and the murders as I can get while still making it a plausible alibi. People cannot physically be in two places at once.

I expect that when LE tried to verify the timeline of the PO's day the times were off. Many businesses have security cameras and record front door, parking lot, etc.

IMO

 

[anthym29]

Occam's Razor - the most obvious solution, regardless of how improbably that may be, is usually the correct solution. The girls were abducted at the SE end of the bridge. They were told to go down the hill. Their bodies were found pretty much straight North across the river. A short walk North of the bodies is the cemetery. There was a huge police presence at the cemetery, meaning that location is significant.

I don't see any reason to introduce a theory that the girls were driven to some other location, murdered, driven back to the area where they were abducted (an area that would be swarming with searchers and police), and then dragged, one by one, to the river.

View attachment 114557

This exactly.

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