IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #50

[CoreyRocks]

It would have been recent for Libby - within days.

Maybe someone overheard her talking about coming back there on Monday Feb 13th. Moo.

 

[Bird of Paradise]

and some of those you referenced are even older than RL.

True. But none killed two young teens and left them in the woods.

BessDrew that was a lot of work finding those links and I applaud you for doing so.

 

[Shiressleuth]

They are still going thru tips. So it is not cold and they have not run out of leads. I don't think they have anything pointing to a specific person yet but nor are they waiting for new info as they have yet to finish processing all the tips they have received. I believe they said as much a week ago.

And seriously, the image may have caused more harm than good, seeing how it looks like "everyman" i.e any age, size, etc...they probably won't get much more mileage out of pushing that on the public again. Sad, but it is one of the least useful images I have ever seen put forward by LE. You can tell this just by the hundreds of different things people "see" about this man.

LE have recently reported they are still receiving 100 tips a day IIRC so still not a cold case by any means.

 

[Aropizt]

I suppose, if we were to assume they could have been stalked on SM, it likely would have been via FB or Twitter.I thought someone said that one of the girls had her privacy settings set for public access on at least one SM site. I don't know if all were like that or not, but have heard several people mention pictures LG had posted on FB, so assume it was likely public accessible as well. It would be relatively easy for a predator to know where someone was going to be, simply by following their SM posts, if privacy features aren't utilized. This is a sad reality, but reality nonetheless.

Late reply but yes. Libby's other social media profiles- Facebook, Twitter, Instagram are all public. So if social media stalking happened it was no doubt on one of those. I just find the whole Snapchat aspect to be a lot less likely. It's not public the way those other SM accounts are and can be. And public is definitely the default on Instagram and Twitter (with Facebook who knows anymore. They're always fiddling with the default security settings it seems). Snapchat works very differently in that sense.


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[expatCanada]

Hopefully, someday we'll stop having to name laws after dead kids ... Amber Alert ... Amber Hagerman, Caylee's law, Jessica's law, Megan's law, Adam's law, etc. May they all RIP. :crying:

Dana Thompson mother of Summer Thompson was a fierce tragic soul to watch
Another was the father of Shania Davis.
Totally heartbreaking.

 

[Deleted member 155000]

True. But none killed two young teens and left them in the woods.

BessDrew that was a lot of work finding those links and I applaud you for doing so.

Ha. Thanks. It was no prob. I had seen a couple similar ones in my local paper this last year so it only took like a minute of Googling to find a bunch of examples.

There were a few exs of elderly men who shot teens in the search results too. One was bc they were hanging around his car in his driveway and he suspected they were going to steal it or break into it. Wish I would've grabbed those links given your comment. But maybe I will later if I have time.


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[Bird of Paradise]

Ha. Thanks. It was no prob. I had seen a couple similar ones in my local paper this last year so it only took like a minute of Googling to find a bunch of examples.

There were a few exs of elderly men who shot teens in the search results too. One was bc they were hanging around his car in his driveway and he suspected they were going to steal it or break into it. Wish I would've grabbed those links given your comment. But maybe I will later if I have time.


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I get cranky old people. But I don't get BG being an elderly man who suddenly had a conniption fit on a bridge and walked the victims to their demise. Could an elderly person be involved some other way? I suppose so. I'm only talking about the BG and the belief he is elderly.

 

[BarryManilow]

True. But none killed two young teens and left them in the woods.

BessDrew that was a lot of work finding those links and I applaud you for doing so.

Their own woods at that.

 

[expatCanada]

Oh ... might want to search a tad more.... JMO

Yeah, if not SA, I did have revenge among my ideas...that could align with the idea of a hit, too, I guess. Haven't even seen any rumors that the family would have enemies of that proportion though...



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[BarryManilow]

I get cranky old people. But I don't get BG being an elderly man who suddenly had a conniption fit on a bridge and walked the victims to their demise. Could an elderly person be involved some other way? I suppose so. I'm only talking about the BG and the belief he is elderly.

I don't believe the suspect description given by LE stated the person in the released photo as elderly. You'd think they would have pointed that out.

 

[Colton]

And seriously, the image may have caused more harm than good, seeing how it looks like "everyman" i.e any age, size, etc...they probably won't get much more mileage out of pushing that on the public again. Sad, but it is one of the least useful images I have ever seen put forward by LE. You can tell this just by the hundreds of different things people "see" about this man.

I agree that image will not identify anyone. And unfortunately I think it's impossible to say his gait was abnormal. He had to be overall in decent health to walk that terrain and take on 2 young people. IMO, they really only had two options, run in different directions and hope one of them can make it. Or stick together and face him, which was a very brave thing to do and I think it says a lot about their character.

 

[Deleted member 155000]

I get cranky old people. But I don't get BG being an elderly man who suddenly had a conniption fit on a bridge and walked the victims to their demise. Could an elderly person be involved some other way? I suppose so. I'm only talking about the BG and the belief he is elderly.

Yeah, my guess is BG isn't elderly, too. Although I do wish we had a clearer pic so I could feel 100% on that. RL moves around really well on the videos and has great skin for his age, so I am not totally sure how he or anyone else of that age could look blurred.

And I also wish we had a little more back story. We know RL had his property broken into once and that he also had reported a trespasser, iirc, but I don't know if him getting angry at someone on his land--as a hypothetical--would seem "sudden" to locals or if they would be like "oh yeah, he's been getting more cranky and paranoid about that for years."

Still, even with the possible connections, it is hard for me to imagine someone his age expending the energy to target and kill two young girls...so I am hoping other poi arise in time.

If they don't, I feel like we all are just waiting for LE to release the results of their sw at RL's or other houses or to reveal new info from the phone footage or something.


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[Aropizt]

So I know a few people have said, have older people ever committed crimes?

I'm not personally sold on the RL as suspect theory (tho don't rule it out), but I for one am not picturing an elderly serial killer (tho there are of course a few Granny Ripper and Dorthea Puente types out there, I suppose).

I believe something like half of murders are committed by people under 25...soooo yeah, elderly aren't the first on the list. But in all fairness, I DO see articles about angry and frustrated older people becoming angry and using a gun here and there...

https://www.dallasnews.com/news/cri...llegedly-shot-construction-site-noise-annoyed

http://kplr11.com/2017/01/19/elderly-man-kills-senior-housing-manager-over-missing-money/

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/breaking-news/os-ap-woman-killed-lost-dog-20170111-story.html

http://www.ibtimes.com/elderly-man-...-shot-nieces-nephews-their-california-2470514

http://www.nbcwashington.com/news/l...d-With-Murder-After-DC-Slaying-414203683.html

https://patch.com/rhode-island/tiverton/shootings-reported-tiverton

http://www.necn.com/news/new-englan...-Complex-in-Burlington-Vermont-373040981.html








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Thanks for this. I really don't get why some people thing age automatically makes someone incapable or nonviolent, you know? Makes me curious about the demographics of posters here (seems like we've got all ages but do we skew young?). I grew up with parents considerably older than the norm and one thing that was absolutely drilled into my head was the idea that age was "nothing but a number". And in my experiences that's pretty well true. There will always be exceptions any time you try to group people into any sort of large vague group (be it age, or whatever really). And I also have to laugh a bit when people say old men couldn't walk that bridge when hey I'm far from old but I can barely walk at all due to health issues. I'm regularly impressed by the energy I see in older folks and the things they achieve. My favorite band is Fleetwood Mac. The band members range from late 60s to late 70s and I've gone to a bunch of their shows in the last few years and it's incredible how much energy they have. A thirty-ish friend of mine who attended a few with me said they had more energy than the two of us put together.

Worth saying that with my band example I've heard that when the drummer (who is one of the oldest members of the band, late 70s) gets off stage they have to wrap him in ice packs and he can hardly move his arms. But he performs on stage non stop for 3 or more hours on world tours. I bring this up because most likely Abby and Libby's murders happened quickly. It's remarkable what people of any age or ability (talking about myself as well, being disabled in very familiar with this concept) can do for a short period of time if they really want to/ are motivated/ are filled with adrenaline/ etc. It will take a harder toll on elderly or less for people, no doubt. But I'm not even sure observing someone's general day to day function tells us much then because that's not accounting for those moments of extreme motivation.

I just think people can be incredibly surprising.


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[expatCanada]

JMO but RL will be forever linked to the deaths of the 2 girls since their bodies were found on his farm = involved.

No escaping that. Forever. Not the Logan Farm anymore ... the place where Abby/Libby were found.

He'll always be involved in prison and out (if he lives that long). He's involved. IMO

 

[Lilowlet]

Wasn't there two previous cases where separate individuals in unrelated incidents, were flashing people there? Wonder if at the time BG decided hey there not getting caught, they are caught now imo not the guys, but maybe BG had similar thoughts about flashing and maybe didn't like the girls response to it, teens laugh. And a grown man might take that as insulting. Just throwing out an idea, I know we have no way of knowing. But since one of the incidents was a few days prior they may have heard about it. Saw something, had the previous encounter we speculate about, and felt concerned by his reaction to their reaction. If that makes sense. All IMO. I'm not necessarily knocking out the idea of them seeing drug activity, but in my own experiences with drugs , dealers, etc. We were often seen by random kids, I was young, but the scary people I messed with, never gave them a second glance, and they usually had weapons on them. Yeah it I've seen some things, but I believe it helps me kinda understand other things. But I could be wrong. Just speculating and IMO always.

 

[Bird of Paradise]

Yeah, my guess is BG isn't elderly, too. Although I do wish we had a clearer pic so I could feel 100% on that. RL moves around really well on the videos and has great skin for his age, so I am not totally sure how he or anyone else of that age could look blurred.

And I also wish we had a little more back story. We know RL had his property broken into once and that he also had reported a trespasser, iirc, but I don't know if him getting angry at someone on his land--as a hypothetical--would seem "sudden" to locals or if they would be like "oh yeah, he's been getting more cranky and paranoid about that for years."

Still, even with the possible connections, it is hard for me to imagine someone his age expending the energy to target and kill two young girls...so I am hoping other poi arise in time.

If they don't, I feel like we all are just waiting for LE to release the results of their sw at RL's or other houses or to reveal new info from the phone footage or something.


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You just triggered a thought. There were no reporters interviewing any of the neighbors of RL. Wonder why not. Granted there were only a couple but either they didn't want to talk or the reporters didn't attempt? Following the Danielle Stislicki case, when a house was searched the reporter had a couple of people on camera giving info/opinions on the person living in the house. RL has been a fixture there for 50+ years. No one around to interview?

 

[Deleted member 155000]

Thanks for this. I really don't get why some people thing age automatically makes someone incapable or nonviolent, you know? Makes me curious about the demographics of posters here (seems like we've got all ages but do we skew young?). I grew up with parents considerably older than the norm and one thing that was absolutely drilled into my head was the idea that age was "nothing but a number". And in my experiences that's pretty well true. There will always be exceptions any time you try to group people into any sort of large vague group (be it age, or whatever really). And I also have to laugh a bit when people say old men couldn't walk that bridge when hey I'm far from old but I can barely walk at all due to health issues. I'm regularly impressed by the energy I see in older folks and the things they achieve. My favorite band is Fleetwood Mac. The band members range from late 60s to late 70s and I've gone to a bunch of their shows in the last few years and it's incredible how much energy they have. A thirty-ish friend of mine who attended a few with me said they had more energy than the two of us put together.

Worth saying that with my band example I've heard that when the drummer (who is one of the oldest members of the band, late 70s) gets off stage they have to wrap him in ice packs and he can hardly move his arms. But he performs on stage non stop for 3 or more hours on world tours. I bring this up because most likely Abby and Libby's murders happened quickly. It's remarkable what people of any age or ability (talking about myself as well, being disabled in very familiar with this concept) can do for a short period of time if they really want to/ are motivated/ are filled with adrenaline/ etc. It will take a harder toll on elderly or less for people, no doubt. But I'm not even sure observing someone's general day to day function tells us much then because that's not accounting for those moments of extreme motivation.

I just think people can be incredibly surprising.


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I hear you.

I get that statistically it's not likely. So I appreciate people keeping the balance. But SKs aren't statistically as likely either yet they still do strike sometimes so we never know exactly what we might be dealing with, I guess.


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[Bird of Paradise]

JMO but RL will be forever linked to the deaths of the 2 girls since their bodies were found on his farm = involved.

No escaping that. Forever. Not the Logan Farm anymore ... the place where Abby/Libby were found.

He'll always be involved in prison and out (if he lives that long). He's involved. IMO

Agree. Just Google his name. It's there and there forever. Pictures, Youtube. You name it.

 

[cluciano63]

You just triggered a thought. There were no reporters interviewing any of the neighbors of RL. Wonder why not. Granted there were only a couple but either they didn't want to talk or the reporters didn't attempt? Following the Danielle Stislicki case, when a house was searched the reporter had a couple of people on camera giving info/opinions on the person living in the house. RL has been a fixture there for 50+ years. No one around to interview?

No links handy, but I did see some quotes from neighbors after he was sentenced. They seemed upset by the sentence, one lady said rides could have been arranged for him by neighbors, etc...so he does have support. The quotes were in an article a day after sentencing or so.

 

[expatCanada]

They were caught. FWIW the Monon trail extends for miles across Indiana. The flashers were Indianapolis.

http://fox59.com/2017/02/24/police-...eparate-flashing-incidents-along-monon-trail/

Wasn't there two previous cases where separate individuals in unrelated incidents, were flashing people there? Wonder if at the time BG decided hey there not getting caught, they are caught now imo not the guys, but maybe BG had similar thoughts about flashing and maybe didn't like the girls response to it, teens laugh. And a grown man might take that as insulting. Just throwing out an idea, I know we have no way of knowing. But since one of the incidents was a few days prior they may have heard about it. Saw something, had the previous encounter we speculate about, and felt concerned by his reaction to their reaction. If that makes sense. All IMO. I'm not necessarily knocking out the idea of them seeing drug activity, but in my own experiences with drugs , dealers, etc. We were often seen by random kids, I was young, but the scary people I messed with, never gave them a second glance, and they usually had weapons on them. Yeah it I've seen some things, but I believe it helps me kinda understand other things. But I could be wrong. Just speculating and IMO always.