IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #51

[Bemused]

I think a condom may slip or leak, I know that is gross and I hear you, but for me to even entertain SA here, given the length of time it's taking, I'm thinking foreign object and the DNA was from another source but from the killer. Hairs on his clothing either human or maybe pet? I'm no scientist but I'd guess no semen, IMO.

Judging by LE reaction and emotion, I'm thinking maybe mutilation or something like foreign penetration and maybe posing or leaving exposed in a very revealing manner, IMO, even if covered. Bound? Maybe gagged, IDK.

I hate to think about SA; but if it was a premeditated attack, BG may have had condoms. Would the use of condoms eliminate semen DNA? Is this something that rapists know to use to try to lessen the chance of being caught? (I'm disgusted just asking the question.)


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[jillycat]

If anyone cares to watch and listen to the press conferences with LE it's beyond me how they would ever conclude LE would not be asking for help if they needed it.

Is anyone reading a scientist and can address possible scenarios as to evidence and its types of testing? Read the scanner thread for a few clues as to evidence collected from a wider area, but the actual site where Abby and Libby were found appears the communication was taken to more secure channels. Maybe they needed to do more testing, more specialized testing, on test results that came back inconclusive.

Mr. Patty and his wife have confidence LE will solve it and so do I. I think LE has already solved it and are tying up all the loose ends. They only get one chance so please tell me why they would make errors in haste? I don't think they would. IMO

Superintendent Carter says they have scientific evidence, not speculation or circumstantial, but including DNA. I choose to believe him because he's Indiana's highest-ranking law enforcement officer.

https://www.facebook.com/AlexisMcAdamsTV/videos/1609577225723145/

Who knows what "scientific evidence" means here, but DNA or other physical evidence that can be tested using scientific tools is still circumstantial. It might be highly compelling and connect more dots or identify who had contact with the girls or was at the crime scene, but whatever they found is considered circumstantial.

There was also an early claim about DNA and then a clarification by LE that they had not/would not confirm that, so I'm not sure if the reference here is before or after all that. I've not seen LE say anything about any physical evidence that they found. I also notice that any confirmation of the one item in particular referenced by the reporter was either edited out of the video or that it wasn't confirmed at all by LE.

High-ranking or not, I don't think this 3/10 report and conversation with LE told us much more than LE is using every tool it has in this investigation and that DNA, if it was present, was/is being analyzed. It could be the DNA of the victims to see what else is there. It could be analysis of all kinds of physical items to determine IF a DNA profile for someone besides the girls is present.

JMO

 

[ImnoSherlock]

Hello!

I am new to WS, but have been lurking here to follow this case since it happened. I haven't had any particular insights, but I know some have asked about similar crimes. Well, this just happened on Monday (4/17/17). Dunlap, IL is a small town in the Peoria, IL area, about 150 miles straight west of Delphi. (I'm not sure I'm pasting the link in here correctly):

http://www.week.com/story/35187671/...nd-trail?utm_medium=social&utm_source=25_News

Am I missing something in the link here?Happened 2 days ago and supposedly she saw him twice,and nobody puts out a description?

 

[kat913]

Hello!

I am new to WS, but have been lurking here to follow this case since it happened. I haven't had any particular insights, but I know some have asked about similar crimes. Well, this just happened on Monday (4/17/17). Dunlap, IL is a small town in the Peoria, IL area, about 150 miles straight west of Delphi. (I'm not sure I'm pasting the link in here correctly):

http://www.week.com/story/35187671/...nd-trail?utm_medium=social&utm_source=25_News

Thanks Alix...I just looked a bit about it and saw this train trestle...yikes! Also noticed that back in 2007 a woman was rammed from behind on her bike (on what may have been different trail or same?) and a "cloth with chemical" was attempted on her. She did break free but jeez he came prepared!!

Welcome and thanks for your insight!!

https://www.traillink.com/trail/rock-island-trail-(il)/#trail-detail-photos
http://peoriachronicle.com/2007/05/30/woman-attacked-on-biking-trail/

 

[Bemused]

I hate to think about SA; but if it was a premeditated attack, BG may have had condoms. Would the use of condoms eliminate semen DNA? Is this something that rapists know to use to try to lessen the chance of being caught? (I'm disgusted just asking the question.)


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http://www.forensicmag.com/news/201...ooks-condom-lubricants-forensic-evidence-rape

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/255176034_Condom_use_during_sexual_assault

Doug Carter said they have scientific evidence that includes DNA but not what the source of the DNA is.

 

[sumzero]

I feel so sorry for the ppl that have had to prove their innocence because they happen to own property or helped in the search, have SW served, having their phone put under microscopes. LE would not get anything from me with out a fight. Jmo

Like i said before shovel, shutup & don't volunteer to help. Jmo

Unfortunately, you're right. Think about what has happened to innocent people whose names have gotten associated with a crime. The on-line sleuthing is merciless, dissecting someone's life and, as I've seen repeatedly, turning the person, no matter how innocent, into a suspect. It's a real shame.

 

[Dawning3]

Can't imagine any search warrants were issued based only on someone helping in the search. If I lived near Delphi, looked like BG, had a relevant criminal record, or all three, I'd expect to be contacted. If I were innocent, I'd view the inconvenience as a small price to pay to help find one or more monsters. To his credit, that's the attitude JL seemed to have in the two or more interviews he gave regarding being contacted by LE.

I agree that I would feel the same about being questioned by LE. It's the public opinion and suspicion that I would fear as a volunteer. SM can crucify anyone who has ever been recorded saying the word "down" or who has two legs and wears jeans.


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[AlixVR]

Am I missing something in the link here?Happened 2 days ago and supposedly she saw him twice,and nobody puts out a description?

To confuse things a bit, another news outlet posted this. I'm not sure now whether there were two separate incidents (one in March and one on Monday, 4/17), or whether the girl didn't report the March incident until Monday, though that would seem odd to me. As in Delphi, the Dunlap schools were off on Monday for Easter.

At any rate, the WMBD article states the alleged perpetrator was a white male.

http://www.centralillinoisproud.com...p/694405581?utm_medium=social&utm_source=WMBD

 

[thorpedo]

Hello!

I am new to WS, but have been lurking here to follow this case since it happened. I haven't had any particular insights, but I know some have asked about similar crimes. Well, this just happened on Monday (4/17/17). Dunlap, IL is a small town in the Peoria, IL area, about 150 miles straight west of Delphi. (I'm not sure I'm pasting the link in here correctly):

http://www.week.com/story/35187671/...nd-trail?utm_medium=social&utm_source=25_News

It's a rail-trail, too. Good find!
https://www.traillink.com/trail/rock-island-trail-(il)/#trail-detail-photos

 

[asyousay]

RL is a perfect example of what SM can do. His life has been ripped apart and yet LE don't consider him a suspect.

 

[Casey73]

Been a lurker on here a long time and have been following this case with interest, simply as there's no coverage of it here in the UK.

I have to ask though, who does LE and RL refer too?

Cass xx

 

[eastcoasterinco]

Been a lurker on here a long time and have been following this case with interest, simply as there's no coverage of it here in the UK.

I have to ask though, who does LE and RL refer too?

Cass xx

Welcome! No problem asking, sometimes the acronyms can be confusing.

LE refers to law enforcement, and RL refers to <modsnip> the property owner where the girls were found in this case.


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[Jax49]

RL refers to the owner of the property where the bodies were found. We are not allowed to use his name, only initials.

 

[Casey73]

Welcome! No problem asking, sometimes the acronyms can be confusing.

LE refers to law enforcement, and RL refers to <modsnip> the property owner where the girls were found in this case.


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I was never figuring that one out. Cheers

Cass xx

 

[Peace777]

RL is a perfect example of what SM can do. His life has been ripped apart and yet LE don't consider him a suspect.

But it was LE who went on media and talked about the search on RL's property. They put his name out there and charged him for past crimes DUI etc. (bad timing?). I agree RL was publicly attacked and people wondered if he did it or was covering up for someone.

 

[cluciano63]

That latest interview sure does not make me believe they have a suspect, just waiting for him to "slip up".

 

[Elley Mae]

Been a lurker on here a long time and have been following this case with interest, simply as there's no coverage of it here in the UK.

I have to ask though, who does LE and RL refer too?

Cass xx

Welcome to Websleuths!

LE- Law Enforcement
RL- <modsnip> the owner of the property the girls were found on.

 

[Burnt Toast]

RL is a perfect example of what SM can do. His life has been ripped apart and yet LE don't consider him a suspect.

do you think they would tell us if he was a suspect prior to an arrest?? they certainly have not cleared him. He is still involved in their criminal investigation.

 

[BarryManilow]

Been a lurker on here a long time and have been following this case with interest, simply as there's no coverage of it here in the UK.

I have to ask though, who does LE and RL refer too?

Cass xx

LE=Law Enforcement RL=the owner of the property the bodies were found

 

[BarryManilow]

That latest interview sure does not make me believe they have a suspect, just waiting for him to "slip up".

LE are not noted for their open and forthcoming nature.