IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #55

[Nemellotus]

I understand how you feel, but the more details we know, however small, might just be the thing that makes someone realize something. Whether it's an item that was used or found, or a even something else the BG sad or made reference to on the video. It could just trigger some thing in someone's mind òr memory about a friend, coworker, neighbor, relative that could connect them to the crime.

Exactly!!! Why LE is holding onto any hints or clues that may help to solve this case is strange to me. Very strange. Seems they almost want this to die down almost.... sort of go away. I mean already dedicating ballparks now? Really? Already people? So soon giving up? Give us something to work with! Something! Release something instead of blocking everything! Why does LE want everything to seem as it never happened.. LE messed up! That is why! This entire case has been bungled from the moment they were called!


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[expatCanada]

Whom are you disagreeing with? Please use the reply with quote ... bottom right. Thanks

That is completely false.


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[gliving]

I agree 100%. Since they haven't made an arrest yet, they need to give the public more information. Revealing more details just may generate more tips and possibly lead to an arrest. And the fact that the reward money is so high and still no arrest is indicative that the public doesnt have enough information.

This is a thought provoking post DrOrchid. Could you please give an example of what info LE could release, in order to get more tips?

MOO only: I'm stuck thinking even if LE would come out and say there was SA, surely they've already checked out all SO within a certain radius. Or if COD is strangled with a rope, they've extracted evidence from the fibers.

I bet you've got some good ideas. Please share.

tia

 

[Lilowlet]

Lilowlet I love your praying icon...everytime I see it...I get hope! Thanks for the uplift!

Aww thanks kat! Me too that's why I chose it. Feel free to use it too! 😙

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[expatCanada]

Not me, since I've seen no evidence of that, but that's JMO. I'll bow out of this conversation.

For those of us who agree BG islikely a hunter/fisherman, how can we more productively explore this/ expand on this...?

 

[MistyWaters]

My theory is that the cause of death might be so unusual or bizarre that they are depending on the perp or others involved to slip and reveal the details forgetting which details have/have not been revealed to the public. Notice how all of us are confused about which information has been made public?That's an advantage to LE because the perp(s) are probably just as confused, thus more likely to screw up. This is just a theory, but it makes sense to me, and the same investigative strategy has been implemented in other murders. Again, just my opinion.

You could be right. And if the COD was vicious or gruesome, it also may be beneficial to withhold details in order to maximize tips. What I mean by that is none of us want to think people who we are associated with are murderers because it causes fear. But with particularly horrendous details, it's possible potential tipsters might shut the possibility out entirely, if too much info is known "no way would X be capable of ______" ie. rationalizing.


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[expatCanada]

BEST information we have, so far, IMO is this:
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...Delphi-13-Feb-2017-47&p=13298390#post13298390

I agree 100%. Since they haven't made an arrest yet, they need to give the public more information. Revealing more details just may generate more tips and possibly lead to an arrest. And the fact that the reward money is so high and still no arrest is indicative that the public doesnt have enough information.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

love that show too ..problem is though that the bad guys also have access to shows like this and i think they're becoming much more savvy re police procedure and how to eliminate evidence from crime scenes

bbm
My constantly thoughts when I'm looking Medical Detectives (your Forensic Files) in the middle of the night (sleep disorders).
Btw: Star forensic and one of the commentators is https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Benecke

 

[kat913]

BEST information we have, so far, IMO is this:
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...Delphi-13-Feb-2017-47&p=13298390#post13298390

Just to show a clip of what you were stressing, ExpatCanada


Petition to Seal Autopsy Reports filed

Filed By:
State of Indiana


File Stamp:
03/28/2017

Order Issued

On March 28, 2017, State of Indiana, by Prosecuting Attorney Robert T. Ives, filed a Petition to seal the autopsy reports concerning Abigail Williams and Liberty German. The Court, being duly advised, FINDS as follows: 1) On February 13, 2017 Abigail Williams and Liberty German were killed just outside of Delphi in Carroll County, Indiana. 2) An investigation into these killings is ongoing. 3) No charges have been filed with connection to the killings. 4) The details related to the manner and mechanism of the deaths of Ms. Williams and Ms. German, if they remain confidential, make it easier for investigators to recognize a false confession as it is improbable for an innocent person to accurately describe the details of the deaths without personal knowledge. 5) Investigators are able to maintain a tactical advantage when speaking with a suspect if the manner and mechanism of the deaths of Ms. Williams and Ms. German are not made public. The Court, being duly advised, ORDERS as follows: State of Indiana has demonstrated by a preponderance of the evidence that public access or dissemination of the information contained in Ind. Code 36-2-14-18(a) would create significant risks of harm to the criminal investigation of the deaths of Ms. Williams and Ms. German.

https://public.courts.in.gov/mycase/...1qY3lObU09In19

Link does not bring you directly to this document....so unsure of channels to do that but it is from ExPat's WS thread post (as seen above) by poster named Beer.

 

[expatCanada]

Bold by me Both girls died on Feb. 13th per petition to seal the records.

Says a lot to ME which goes against blogs, SM, etc. They didn't die on separate days! God rest their souls. Prayers.

Just to show a clip of what you were stressing, ExpatCanada


Petition to Seal Autopsy Reports filed

Filed By:
State of Indiana


File Stamp:
03/28/2017

Order Issued

On March 28, 2017, State of Indiana, by Prosecuting Attorney Robert T. Ives, filed a Petition to seal the autopsy reports concerning Abigail Williams and Liberty German.

2) An investigation into these killings is ongoing. 3) No charges have been filed with connection to the killings. 4) The details related to the manner and mechanism of the deaths of Ms. Williams and Ms. German, if they remain confidential, make it easier for investigators to recognize a false confession as it is improbable for an innocent person to accurately describe the details of the deaths without personal knowledge. 5) Investigators are able to maintain a tactical advantage when speaking with a suspect if the manner and mechanism of the deaths of Ms. Williams and Ms. German are not made public. The Court, being duly advised, ORDERS as follows: State of Indiana has demonstrated by a preponderance of the evidence that public access or dissemination of the information contained in Ind. Code 36-2-14-18(a) would create significant risks of harm to the criminal investigation of the deaths of Ms. Williams and Ms. German.

https://public.courts.in.gov/mycase/...1qY3lObU09In19

Link does not bring you directly to this document....so unsure of channels to do that but it is from ExPat's WS thread post (as seen above) by poster named Beer.

 

[Eclipse]

I, for one, do not want to know the horrendous deaths that happened upon two innocent, beautiful little girls. I want justice - if we knew the COD would that change our sleuthing?
All I think I know, that these murders were horrific. IMO
RIP Abby & Libby.

Well, it might be helpful in comparing these murders to others. Weapons used could be familiar to someone who may have looked at the picture, heard the voice, but are still in denial. They may be familiar with a certain gun, knife, fetish, weird talk about certain forms of violence that connects with someone they know.

 

[DeDee]

Obviously, I am a very frank person, by nature. I do not sugar coat life. I have spent countless hours studying the Carroll County area. Indy is ranked 13th in the nation for murders. Indy has long been known as the sex trafficking capital of the US. Myself, and others, pray incessantly for the residents in the Great State of Indiana.

The number of arrests in IN beats anything I've seen in this lifetime. Satan has apparently captured a strong foothold in the Heartland of America. Carroll Co has an astonishing number of RSOs. They have a horrendous meth drug problem with abusers and dealers ranging in ages within the sector. There is a notorious gang problem within the area. Once allowed in, one cannot leave quietly. <modsnip> I have to ask myself why was LE able to arrest 72 people for outstanding violations for one legal reason or another. Were these criminals not being actively pursued before the tragic murders? These are facts, my friends, that I find very concerning. You can use google, just as I have, to obtain, or challenge, this data.

There are no links included. Therefore, please consider this my own opinion. Thank you for being here.

 

[Lilowlet]

Just to show a clip of what you were stressing, ExpatCanada


Petition to Seal Autopsy Reports filed

Filed By:
State of Indiana


File Stamp:
03/28/2017

Order Issued

On March 28, 2017, State of Indiana, by Prosecuting Attorney Robert T. Ives, filed a Petition to seal the autopsy reports concerning Abigail Williams and Liberty German. The Court, being duly advised, FINDS as follows: 1) On February 13, 2017 Abigail Williams and Liberty German were killed just outside of Delphi in Carroll County, Indiana. 2) An investigation into these killings is ongoing. 3) No charges have been filed with connection to the killings. 4) The details related to the manner and mechanism of the deaths of Ms. Williams and Ms. German, if they remain confidential, make it easier for investigators to recognize a false confession as it is improbable for an innocent person to accurately describe the details of the deaths without personal knowledge. 5) Investigators are able to maintain a tactical advantage when speaking with a suspect if the manner and mechanism of the deaths of Ms. Williams and Ms. German are not made public. The Court, being duly advised, ORDERS as follows: State of Indiana has demonstrated by a preponderance of the evidence that public access or dissemination of the information contained in Ind. Code 36-2-14-18(a) would create significant risks of harm to the criminal investigation of the deaths of Ms. Williams and Ms. German.

https://public.courts.in.gov/mycase/...1qY3lObU09In19

Link does not bring you directly to this document....so unsure of channels to do that but it is from ExPat's WS thread post (as seen above) by poster named Beer.

I thought there was a parts that said,

2) The address where the dead body was found, or if there is no address the location where the dead body was found and, if different, the address where the death occurred, or if there is no address the location where the death occurred.

Is this saying.. these are possibilities or something else. I do not understand legal procedure as far as clauses go.

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[bluesneakers]

Bold by me Both girls died on Feb. 13th per petition to seal the records.

Says a lot to ME which goes against blogs, SM, etc. They didn't die on separate days! God rest their souls. Prayers.

I caught that too. I hope it puts the rumour to rest.

 

[expatCanada]

NO...

Both girls died on the same day... Feb 13th which goes against those that think one lived longer than the other.
Per ... document ^^^

Where did you get your BBM quote?

I thought there was a parts that said,

2) The address where the dead body was found, or if there is no address the location where the dead body was found and, if different, the address where the death occurred, or if there is no address the location where the death occurred.

Is this saying.. these are possibilities or something else. I do not understand legal procedure as far as clauses go.

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[MistyWaters]

Well, it might be helpful in comparing these murders to others. Weapons used could be familiar to someone who may have looked at the picture, heard the voice, but are still in denial. They may be familiar with a certain gun, knife, fetish, weird talk about certain forms of violence that connects with someone they know.

The reward of over $200k hopefully should be a good incentive for people to call in their suspicions regardless. But I wonder, might too much information risk not only false confessions but malicious tips as well?

"4) The details related to the manner and mechanism of the deaths of Ms. Williams and Ms. German, if they remain confidential, make it easier for investigators to recognize a false confession as it is improbable for an innocent person to accurately describe the details of the deaths without personal knowledge."

 

[kat913]

Obviously, I am a very frank person, by nature. I do not sugar coat life. I have spent countless hours studying the Carroll County area. Indy is ranked 13th in the nation for murders. Indy has long been known as the sex trafficking capital of the US. Myself, and others, pray incessantly for the residents in the Great State of Indiana.

The number of arrests in IN beats anything I've seen in this lifetime. Satan has apparently captured a strong foothold in the Heartland of America. Carroll Co has an astonishing number of RSOs. They have a horrendous meth drug problem with abusers and dealers ranging in ages within the sector. There is a notorious gang problem within the area. Once allowed in, one cannot leave quietly. <modsnip> I have to ask myself why was LE able to arrest 72 people for outstanding violations for one legal reason or another. Were these criminals not being actively pursued before the tragic murders? These are facts, my friends, that I find very concerning. You can use google, just as I have, to obtain, or challenge, this data.

There are no links included. Therefore, please consider this my own opinion. Thank you for being here.

The same might be said for Ohio lately (murders)...my town used to have about 5 RSO in 5mile area (about 3 years ago) which may be concerning....I get briefed every now and again about one moving close (and none are that close so I haven't paid close attention). I could not believe that jumped to 179 offenders in that same 5 mile radius. What the heck happened? How come the public is not asked if we "mind" becoming a haven? I was furious and also concerned that at every corner or store there would be one. It sure is hard to memorize 179 faces....

 

[expatCanada]

It won't but I'll keep it up and I just wish those that continue to rely on SM would post the record? I can dream!

I caught that too. I hope it puts the rumour to rest.

 

[Lilowlet]

NO...

Both girls died on the same day... Feb 13th which goes against those that think one lived longer than the other.
Per ... document ^^^

Where did you get your BBM quote?

Last night's thread maybe let me see if I can find

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[DrOrchid]

NO...

Both girls died on the same day... Feb 13th which goes against those that think one lived longer than the other.
Per ... document ^^^

Where did you get your BBM quote?

I read somewhere that in the obituaries the dates of death were one day apart.