IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #60

[mtnlites]

Thank you, kindly, mtnlites. My recollection of SMS reports is that the girls went to Monon High Bridge to "hang out". I've never seen it stated or spoken that the two girls went to photograph the area. If this is not accurate, a correction is appreciated.

This says they were “dropped off to go hiking.”
http://www.theindychannel.com/news/timeline-13-year-old-girls-go-missing-bodies-found

I believe the assumption that they were there to take pictures comes from the fact that, while they were hiking, they took pictures and uploaded them to social media.

ETA:Now I see that someone else provided the appropriate picture-taking link and that the words actually were spoken, making it a fact and not an assumption after all

 

[DeDee]

I would also think the person they called or texted would come forward and say something.

Why would that person go to the media only to be hounded by accusatory cruel groupies? If the family and LE knows, that is enough for me.

If they called someone to pick them up early because they saw a person who caused them concern, wouldn't the disappearance have been reported at 3:30 instead of 5:30?

I believe the family felt they could locate their two girls; even if, the girls did not send them a message. I cannot begin to guess why LE was not notified until 5:30 other than the families could not find their children so they were reported missing.

There is a good reason why we have not been told who was expected to meet the girls for the ride home.

 

[Steleheart]

Thanks Steleheart. Just curious, why do others think them taking photos could lead to wrong assumptions? It's a beautiful area, seems perfect for nature photos. I head into the mountains and lakes to take photos all the time. Just not sure what I'm missing! Thanks all

And just to credit the beautiful Libby with something she was good at and so passionate about - The evidence of which is shown by that very artful contemplative pose of lovely Abby as well as the B&W perspective toward the SE end of the bridge where the side rails converge toward infinity... Simplicity.
Just beautiful.

JMO

 

[LaneGirl]

Why would that person go to the media only to be hounded by accusatory cruel groupies? If the family and LE knows, that is enough for me.



I believe the family felt they could locate their two girls; even if, the girls did not send them a message. I cannot begin to guess why LE was not notified until 5:30 other than the families could not find their children so they were reported missing.

There is a good reason why we have not been told who was expected to meet the girls for the ride home.

I don't think they should go to media and didn't mean to even imply that, I think I just said "come forward and say something" implying parents or LE.

ETA - Correction in my statement.

 

[mtnlites]

Why would that person go to the media only to be hounded by accusatory cruel groupies? If the family and LE knows, that is enough for me.



I believe the family felt they could locate their two girls; even if, the girls did not send them a message. I cannot begin to guess why LE was not notified until 5:30 other than the families could not find their children so they were reported missing.

There is a good reason why we have not been told who was expected to meet the girls for the ride home.

A Delphi resident recently told me that she and the people she knows are staying off of social media because of all the talk and finger pointing-things mostly being said and done by non-residents. I was hoping to get some Delphi opinions but what she said made it totally more understandable. Some of the things being said and done are crazy.

I think it makes sense that they didn't call the police right away. These were not tiny girls. I mean, I think of them as babies, but these were girls that were old and independent enough to be out for a few hours without adult supervision. They might have waited around for the first half hour thinking that the girls were just running late. Caught up taking pictures, perhaps met up with a friend, got to talking, etc. But then, when 45 minutes to an hour rolled around, they might have gotten concerned and then started walking the trail themselves, worried that one of them got hurt. In this situation, my instinct would have been to assume that everything was okay in the beginning. As a parent of a child that age in that situation (out in the woods, hiking a place they knew, etc.) I wouldn't have started freaking out until they were an hour or more late and I couldn't find them on the trail. Heck, when my mom used to drop me off to go hiking and stuff, I always got a grace period of around 20 minutes. She'd bring a book.

Of course, this is all my opinion. I don't even know if the person/persons that were meant to pick them up even looked on the trail. I am just posting a hypothetical.

 

[DeDee]

A Delphi resident recently told me that she and the people she knows are staying off of social media because of all the talk and finger pointing-things mostly being said and done by non-residents. I was hoping to get some Delphi opinions but what she said made it totally more understandable. Some of the things being said and done are crazy.

I think it makes sense that they didn't call the police right away. These were not tiny girls. I mean, I think of them as babies, but these were girls that were old and independent enough to be out for a few hours without adult supervision. They might have waited around for the first half hour thinking that the girls were just running late. Caught up taking pictures, perhaps met up with a friend, got to talking, etc. But then, when 45 minutes to an hour rolled around, they might have gotten concerned and then started walking the trail themselves, worried that one of them got hurt. In this situation, my instinct would have been to assume that everything was okay in the beginning. As a parent of a child that age in that situation (out in the woods, hiking a place they knew, etc.) I wouldn't have started freaking out until they were an hour or more late and I couldn't find them on the trail. Heck, when my mom used to drop me off to go hiking and stuff, I always got a grace period of around 20 minutes. She'd bring a book.

Of course, this is all my opinion. I don't even know if the person/persons that were meant to pick them up even looked on the trail. I am just posting a hypothetical.

IMO, the locals in your reference have made sound judgement by staying away from SM. The harmful accusations are the very reason that I do not join any FB crime groups. MP stated texts to the girls were sent but no indication they were read. That proves to me the parents were actively attempting to reach their children when they did not arrive to catch their ride.

 

[whiskers]

I totally agree. Small town girl here, also not naive. Yes, we know almost everyone in town but we're not sheltered and we DO occasionally leave. I have lived in the same 3,000-people town almost all my life but I have also been a post-war photographer, traveled extensively throughout the United States and abroad, and even lived overseas to receive my graduate degree. While I think it might have been true in the past that small town people might have had a different view of the world, I don't believe it's necessarily that way anymore. With the advent and popularity of the internet, the world isn't the same place anymore. You're no longer forced to only communicate with those that you see on a daily basis. Teens these days have friends with and communicate with people from all over the world. Even in my small, mountain town high school students and middle school students frequently take extended trips to Washington DC, NYC, and Chicago. I hesitate to refer to Abby and Libby, or anyone in a small town, as "naive" or to imply that they were somehow less "worldly" just because Delphi wasn't Indianapolis. It comes down to an individual thing and not something you can throw a blanket statement over anymore.

Very true. We live in a global world now even if you live in a smaller area. Geography does not dictate intellect or naiveté.

I went from a small midwest town to boarding school on the east coast in 9th grade. I met other students from similar small towns. I know a lot of people like to think everything intellectual or inspiring happens around cities, but it's not true. Social media we have to thank for that also. You can be an incredible photographer in a small town in Iowa and have an Instagram following of over 100 thousand. It's now a connected world.

 

[DeDee]

And to not credit the beautiful Libby with something she was good at and so passionate about - The evidence of which is shown by that very artful contemplative pose of lovely Abby as well as the B&W perspective toward the SE end of the bridge where the side rails converge toward infinity... Simplicity.
Just beautiful.

JMO

There was no discredit to Liberty's many talents, including her photography skills.

 

[Deleted member 172065]

MONON BRIDGE: Should never have been open to public. Looks way too dangerous imo. Off topic a little...


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[Steleheart]

There was no discredit to Liberty's many talents, including her photography skills.

Thank you. I edited my post closer to what I meant. It wasn't in reference to your post but in response to another about beauty and photography. Sorry for the confusion .

 

[Bird of Paradise]

Anyone recognize this?

Skibaboo has the most awesome map that has clickable links which show locations as well as links to the media article where the information came from.

If you haven't viewed it, here's the link. This and the media timeline is available on page one of EVERY thread. It will answer so many of the questions often brought up here that were answered way back at the beginning.

https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewe...M&ll=40.40062626780704,-86.40000880000002&z=9

 

[margarita25]

I think I've found some good potential matches for the possible rope. Some I have in my possession, reminder to elaborate.

Secondly, Cold Case Files, Episode "The Tournequit: Burning Desire, 2002. 0:17.

 

[mtnlites]

MONON BRIDGE: Should never have been open to public. Looks way too dangerous imo. Off topic a little...


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As an urban explorer, I can say that closing it would not have kept people off it. It's a beautiful bridge, though. I would love to walk across it. I hope they're able to restore it a little and reopen it. Going to places like that and taking photos is kind of my jam, which I why I think I feel a kindred spirit with Abby and Libby. At their ages I would've been doing the exact same thing.

 

[passepartout]

If they called someone to pick them up early because they saw a person who caused them concern, wouldn't the disappearance have been reported at 3:30 instead of 5:30?

And if so, the non-appearance of the girls would have met the criteria for an Amber Alert.

LE has said that, in this case, no Amber Alert was issued because the situation didn't meet the criteria.

http://fox59.com/2017/02/14/heres-why-an-amber-alert-wasnt-issued-for-missing-carroll-county-teens/

 

[Shiressleuth]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=HH3twaMV9Fg

Watched Gray Hughes' video #2 again tonight. It shows very well the parking area where the girls were likely let out of the car to begin their day's adventure, as well as the cemetery on the other side of the creek.

It makes me wonder if there is a simple explanation for why so many of the police cars involving investigators are parked at the cemetery. It may be because from there, they don't have to cross the creek.

To me, and IMO, that would indicate there isn't necessarily evidentiary value in the cemetery itself, but an easier way for the investigators to reach the crime scene.

If it's an easier way for them wouldn't it also be so for the perp (s) too?

 

[Shiressleuth]

Respectfully - It cannot be tracked with your phone off. There is no energy in the phone to transmit anything. There has to be power.

Also that information is found in both your links. The second link references a hack software from China that mimics turning your phone off so you think its off.

You're second BBM statement I agree with and even mentioned several posts back so I agree.

I believe it can be traced when turned off. But not if battery dies or is removed. That is my understanding from another case where phone is key evidence. The phone was tracked moving from one town to another, approximately 12 miles. MOO

 

[Shiressleuth]

In an interview, LE was asked how they knew it was a homicide. Their reply was: The way the bodies were found.

I thought they asked how they knew it was foul play and that was the answer. I understand LE makes a decision but it is not confirmed until autopsy. LE did not even confirm the bodies were the girls till the autopsy confirmed it. My suitcase example clearly showed foul play but not COD.

 

[Shiressleuth]

Why would that person go to the media only to be hounded by accusatory cruel groupies? If the family and LE knows, that is enough for me.



I believe the family felt they could locate their two girls; even if, the girls did not send them a message. I cannot begin to guess why LE was not notified until 5:30 other than the families could not find their children so they were reported missing.

There is a good reason why we have not been told who was expected to meet the girls for the ride home.

What's the good reason IYO? Can u say?

 

[LaneGirl]

I believe it can be traced when turned off. But not if battery dies or is removed. That is my understanding from another case where phone is key evidence. The phone was tracked moving from one town to another, approximately 12 miles. MOO

Turned off means cutting the power source off. I have not yet found a source that states something can transmit data when the energy has been shut off. I will acknowledge it fully if you can show me a creditable source.

Power off means nothing is there to send/receive and I've searched the internet to find otherwise since this has come up in another thread I'm participating in.

Batter dieting or removing isn't any different than cutting the power source off. Its off. Unless you can show me different. I have been wrong in the past.

ETA - hahaha I mean battery dying.

 

[Shiressleuth]

Turned off means cutting the power source off. I have not yet found a source that states something can transmit data when the energy has been shut off. I will acknowledge it fully if you can show me a creditable source.

Power off means nothing is there to send/receive and I've searched the internet to find otherwise since this has come up in another thread I'm participating in.

Batter dieting or removing isn't any different than cutting the power source off. Its off. Unless you can show me different. I have been wrong in the past.

ETA - hahaha I mean battery dying.

Luckily as it was MOO I don't have to provide a source. But I may call it batter dieting from now on. : :-D :