IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #73

[RIP Meagan + Johnny]

Well the option is extraordinarily sloppy journalism. I find it hard to believe that LE would have leaked this information unless CO LE leaked it to media prior to Indiana placing a gag order on CO discussing similarities between the cases, but I guess it's possible. I think in MOO that COD as shooting explains the DNA issues with this case that we have discussed here ad nauseam. If BG (whomever he may be) shot the girls first and then further violated them after they were dead it would explain how DNA was not found on their bodies in places like under fingernails etc....

I agree.

And COD does not necessarily mean there were no other non-life threatening injuries nor any other weapons used that did not cause the life threatening injury nor an injury which occurred after death.

JMO.

 

[Boxer]

I wouldn’t want to see that either. But don’t you think it’s odd she didn’t turn around to check on her children? Make sure they weren’t hurt. Comfort them when they’re frightened? I would be doing my best to not watch the activity with the hatchet and not look out the rear window, but any decent mother would be concerned about her children before anything else.

I’m not judging her parenting skills here. I’m doubting her story that she didn’t even turn around once.

If she didn’t know whether or not he had the hatchet, why wouldn’t she turn around to check on the children? Why wouldn’t she turn around to make sure the other driver wasn’t trying to run over Daniel with his/her vehicle?

Still not buying it.
JMO.

Since her experience with the justice system is that DN always gets out - I would say whatever she is doing - she is doing to save herself and the children.

 

[Shiressleuth]

I wouldn’t want to see that either. But don’t you think it’s odd she didn’t turn around to check on her children? Make sure they weren’t hurt. Comfort them when they’re frightened? I would be doing my best to not watch the activity with the hatchet and not look out the rear window, but any decent mother would be concerned about her children before anything else.

I’m not judging her parenting skills here. I’m doubting her story that she didn’t even turn around once.

If she didn’t know whether or not he had the hatchet, why wouldn’t she turn around to check on the children? Why wouldn’t she turn around to make sure the other driver wasn’t trying to run over Daniel with his/her vehicle?

Still not buying it.
JMO.

Of course you would look. Maybe even get out of car and get in driver's seat to get ready to drive. He had no chance of catching a speeding truck anyway unless he threw the hatchet at it. MOO.

 

[WestieMom]

Interesting.


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[Shiressleuth]

Well the option is extraordinarily sloppy journalism. I find it hard to believe that LE would have leaked this information unless CO LE leaked it to media prior to Indiana placing a gag order on CO discussing similarities between the cases, but I guess it's possible. I think in MOO that COD as shooting explains the DNA issues with this case that we have discussed here ad nauseam. If BG (whomever he may be) shot the girls first and then further violated them after they were dead it would explain how DNA was not found on their bodies in places like under fingernails etc....

Or if he forces them at gunpoint down the hill, they make a break across creek and he shoots them from a distance. No assault, no DNA, he covers them with leaves and twigs and departs the scene. The similarity to TW death. MOO.

 

[gregjrichards]

Some of you really can't see the hatchet in BG's left pocket in his jeans? Look at the shadows that are created. The handle is pointed down and blade is up. You can see a definite outline of it. Also, both the sketch AND the BG photos look EXACTLY like DN to me. Zoom in on HIS left pocket on the 2nd photo where his left leg is raised.

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I see what you see too.

https://m.gazette.com/suspect-in-mount-herman-hatchet-threats-charged-with-menacing/article/1613915
"Nor did prosecutors mention the unsolved fatal shootings of two teenage girls who went missing Feb. 13 on a trail in Delphi, Ind., a crime for which Indiana State Police identified Nations as a person of interest. Nations hasn't been charged in either case."

Interesting considering COD has never been released to the public!

Wow if this is true then it’s my worst fear as it likely makes the case harder to solve. I still wonder how Elizabeth and a Lyric were killed too. I hope the girls families knew before reading this. Law enforcement won’t be happy if this has been leaked by a media outlet.

 

[tokyorose]

Or if he forces them at gunpoint down the hill, they make a break across creek and he shoots them from a distance. No assault, no DNA, he covers them with leaves and twigs and departs the scene. The similarity to TW death. MOO.

Yes and also explains the tight time-line in this case, that does not leave a lot of time for more than that.

 

[Boxer]

Or if he forces them at gunpoint down the hill, they make a break across creek and he shoots them from a distance. No assault, no DNA, he covers them with leaves and twigs and departs the scene. The similarity to TW death. MOO.

If true, that’s dying with your boots on.
America is missing two amazing young women.

 

[Meadowllark]

If that COD is true, it’d make more sense why one, of not both, didn’t run away when he began to lead them off the trail : /

 

[carbuff]

I wouldn’t want to see that either. But don’t you think it’s odd she didn’t turn around to check on her children? Make sure they weren’t hurt. Comfort them when they’re frightened? I would be doing my best to not watch the activity with the hatchet and not look out the rear window, but any decent mother would be concerned about her children before anything else.

I’m not judging her parenting skills here. I’m doubting her story that she didn’t even turn around once.

If she didn’t know whether or not he had the hatchet, why wouldn’t she turn around to check on the children? Why wouldn’t she turn around to make sure the other driver wasn’t trying to run over Daniel with his/her vehicle?

Still not buying it.
JMO.

Well, yes, I'm not either. But if she's lying about looking back, there's no reason to assume that she didn't turn around to check on the kids.

 

[cluciano63]

If they were shot, they should have some bullets to check against the cycling victim. Which really should have been completed by now, imo.

 

[cluciano63]

Well, yes, I'm not either. But if she's lying about looking back, there's no reason to assume that she didn't turn around to check on the kids.

How do you do one without the other? And honestly...your husband gets out of the car to presumably go after someone and you choose not to look? To see if he is okay, or what the hell is going on? Not buying it. I might if she simply floored it and fled.

 

[Shiressleuth]

From the Gazette: Drifter suspected in Mount Herman hatchet threats charged with menacing

Second to last paragraph is interesting...

Also Nations attorneys plan to ask for a bond reduction and a gag order? How would that affect things? Could he get out on bail and no reporting be allowed on the case?

 

[tokyorose]

If true, that’s dying with your boots on.
America is missing two amazing young women.

Yes, and this also explains, perhaps, why LE won't release the rest of the audio from the phone. If gun shots are heard, that would reveal COD. MOO, but I have also felt that Libby's phone was recovered from the water, and if it fell into the creek while she was running, it would explain why BG didn't feel like he needed to or really could retrieve it for that matter. If he had stayed around fishing through the creek for a phone, he would have been caught. Being shot and killed before violated in another manner could be the "twist" that LE refers too, and given that the bodies were discovered 21 or so hours after the crime, autopsy would have been required before knowing which injuries caused death. MOO but it was at that point that LE realized they didn't have DNA and returned to secure the crime scene to try to find it. To further complicate matters the DNA BG left at the scene might not have even been his own... if he had a hair on clothing etc, that belonged to someone else that he inadvertently dropped at the crime scene, that would further complicate matters.

 

[carbuff]

Wow if this is true then it’s my worst fear as it likely makes the case harder to solve. I still wonder how Elizabeth and a Lyric were killed too. I hope the girls families knew before reading this. Law enforcement won’t be happy if this has been leaked by a media outlet.

Yeah, when I saw the diagram of where Lyric and Lizzie's bodies were relative to each other, not close, I had (and still have) some really ugly thoughts of what a guy with a gun might have done. And Libby and Abby weren't next to each other, either.

 

[carbuff]

If they were shot, they should have some bullets to check against the cycling victim. Which really should have been completed by now, imo.

Being shot doesn't necessarily mean that a slug was recovered.

 

[her]

Some of you really can't see the hatchet in BG's left pocket in his jeans? Look at the shadows that are created. The handle is pointed down and blade is up. You can see a definite outline of it. Also, both the sketch AND the BG photos look EXACTLY like DN to me. Zoom in on HIS left pocket on the 2nd photo where his left leg is raised.

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No
surprised anyone can

 

[carbuff]

How do you do one without the other? And honestly...your husband gets out of the car to presumably go after someone and you choose not to look? To see if he is okay, or what the hell is going on? Not buying it. I might if she simply floored it and fled.

I'm clearly not saying what I mean.

I think she really might have turned around to check on the kids, but lying about the hatchet means she had to lie about that too.

 

[her]

I wouldn’t want to see that either. But don’t you think it’s odd she didn’t turn around to check on her children? Make sure they weren’t hurt. Comfort them when they’re frightened? I would be doing my best to not watch the activity with the hatchet and not look out the rear window, but any decent mother would be concerned about her children before anything else.

I’m not judging her parenting skills here. I’m doubting her story that she didn’t even turn around once.

If she didn’t know whether or not he had the hatchet, why wouldn’t she turn around to check on the children? Why wouldn’t she turn around to make sure the other driver wasn’t trying to run over Daniel with his/her vehicle?

Still not buying it.
JMO.

How do you know she wasn't?
Not watching DN does not equal Not watching her kids

 

[Elle*Bee]

I’m watching the reporter’s and The Gazette’s Twitter accounts to see whether anyone questions the potential leaking of COD/misreporting (whichever) and what the response might be. I’m also watching the article for edits. I should probably check the Gazette’s official FB page.