IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #77

[TeaTime]

Does anyone know if the man whos property where the girl's bodies were found was questioned? If maybe he had a strong alibi and was ruled out? I'm just hoping they didn't overlook this man.

Megg - he was. His name is Ron Logan, he is elderly, and he was questioned - a lot. His answers eventually revealed that he had driven on that day, a violation of his probation/parole for a second DWI. He was jailed as a result. He had nothing to do with these murders, he just happened to be the owner of the land where BG left the bodies.

 

[foxbluff]

It is up to us how much weight we give the letter. I do believe what he says about his attorney yes. What felony was he convicted of in Indiana that required him to provide his DNA? I agree regarding the new legislation but, that is not yet in effect, nor has he yet been arrested in Indiana for them to take his DNA. So his attorney correctly denied them the DNA. How could they have possibly legally obtained it therefore?

I, too, find it credible that DN's attorney may have been able to prevent Indy LE from taking a cheek swab directly from DN.

Even if that's the case, however, I see no reason why Colo wouldn't/couldn't share with Indy the DNA Results they obtained. Imho

 

[Shiressleuth]

I am with you on RL and i am still shocked how he was allowed to be torn apart with absolutely no proof.

That’s why when people say they can see DN in that image I laugh as it’s funny how people could also see RL in it as well.

That picture could be one of a million men at the end of the day and unfortunately I feel like LE have no idea on who is responsible and I just hope they can catch a break and get the person.

It wasn't the image but the sketch that made me see DN. Have never seen RL in the image on the bridge and never believed it was him. The witness saying "not blue eyes" appears to exonerate RL. Once the DN case similarities broke I could see the likeness to BG as well as the sketch. I am not aware of anyone who thought BG was RL now believes it to be DN.
:cow:

 

[asyousay]

It wasn't the image but the sketch that made me see DN. Have never seen RL in the image on the bridge and never believed it was him. The witness saying "not blue eyes" appears to exonerate RL. Once the DN case similarities broke I could see the likeness to BG as well as the sketch. I am not aware of anyone who thought BG was RL now believes it to be DN.
:cow:

Thank you for the reply

I don’t see DN in the sketch, I was actually looking at his arrest photos last night and the sketch and I still don’t see what other posters do.

I think BG is a good 10 years older and also a lot heavier and from looking at the image from the bridge I would say that BG walks like a older man.

IMO

 

[Jax49]

I, too, find it credible that DN's attorney may have been able to prevent Indy LE from taking a cheek swab directly from DN.

Even if that's the case, however, I see no reason why Colo wouldn't/couldn't share with Indy the DNA Results they obtained. Imho

Agree. And, IF as some have suggested Indiana obtained DNA in some illegal manner, they still have DN's DNA.

I don't think it was illegal, but if it was AND a match, logically they would then return to Colorado with a subpoena to obtain another sample.

Instead, they went on Dr. Phil.

moo, of course

 

[mtnlites]

Could one of the girl's have said something like "isn't that a friend of so and so?"
What else could "there are some others we think could help us" and "certain people" mean?

"There are some others" meaning that, unless BG is a hermit who lives off the grid and never sees anyone, SOMEONE knows him:a neighbor, a spouse, a sibling, a co-worker, etc. Then again,scratch that. Even the unabomber had connections in the community who knew him.

I don't think those are statements with hidden meanings or references. People rarely commit crimes without someone, somewhere, having an inkling of them. A spouse saw their husband come home with wet pants and muddy shoes, a boss realizes that their weirdest employee didn't show up for work on the day of the murders and has been acting stranger even since. Over Thanksgiving dinner, a sibling notices that her brother is showing an unnatural interest in the case and appears to have details that weren't released to the press...etc.

Those are the people that LE is appealing to.

 

[Boxer]

I am hopeful as the detectives go over all the investigated ground a second time.

This time when statements are taken, LE has so many more details.
IMO finding inconsistencies in first statements or in second statements will be easier.
They have a lot of evidence. A short video, a voice recording, a sketch, dna (I believe they do now), timeline, path to and from the CS and several witnesses.


IMHO, the reason DNA took so long is that they were testing so much material. The forest floor was covered in big dry leaves, forensices swept all that up for testing.
Then they needed to work their elimination process for DNA and touch DNA, everything and everybody the girls recently came into contact with left trace evidence.
As possible examples of what kind of things mightleave touch DNA: If Grandma folded the laundry, Mom gave a hug, a sister lifted the sweater out of the trunk, Grandpa gave a hug, then the professionals and volunteers also need to be eliminated. Searchers, police, coroner, detectives -- thats a lot of DNA. And its on on a lot of surface area, clothes, skin, and all the relavant forest floor and tree trunks.
In July the detective said they were not yet done with DNA processing. But the last statements in October are much more confident about the DNA, and they said they could discover if DN was positively involved within a week. But no POI can be eliminated even if not a match due to that persistent suspicion LE expresses that there was possibly a second person involved.

 

[sumzero]

Agree. And, IF as some have suggested Indiana obtained DNA in some illegal manner, they still have DN's DNA.

I don't think it was illegal, but if it was AND a match logically they would then return to Colorado to with subpoena to obtain another sample.

Instead, they went on Dr. Phil.

moo, of course

Until LE releases more info about the case, we have to draw inferences from their actions. So, yes, I agree. They still seem to be looking for someone who is still at large.

 

[Shiressleuth]

I, too, find it credible that DN's attorney may have been able to prevent Indy LE from taking a cheek swab directly from DN.

Even if that's the case, however, I see no reason why Colo wouldn't/couldn't share with Indy the DNA Results they obtained. Imho

The Indiana law at present allows DNA to be taken if arrested for a felony committed in Indiana. DN has not been arrested for a felony committed in Indiana as yet so I can't see it. If Co shares their sample, that would be illegal IMO. If DN's DNA is already in CODIS that would be different, I think. I think his attorney knew the law and was protecting his clients rights.

 

[mtnlites]

Does anyone know if the man whos property where the girl's bodies were found was questioned? If maybe he had a strong alibi and was ruled out? I'm just hoping they didn't overlook this man.

Questioned many, MANY times. If you go back to the beginning, you'll find quite literally hundreds of posts of us discussing the property owner's actions and words in relation to this case. In the media thread, you'll also find links to his MSM interviews and videos.

 

[Boxer]

The Indiana law at present allows DNA to be taken if arrested for a felony committed in Indiana. DN has not been arrested for a felony committed in Indiana as yet so I can't see it. If Co shares their sample, that would be illegal IMO. If DN's DNA is already in CODIS that would be different, I think. I think his attorney knew the law and was protecting his clients rights.

DNs DNA would be taken by lawful procedure and put into the state database, available to all CODIS users as federal and state databases combined are CODIS. Kudos the lady Jayann Sepich whose daughter was murdered in New Mexico. She was out campaigning for country wide DNA collection on felony arrest.

https://www.vaildaily.com/news/new-colorado-law-requires-dna-tests-in-felony-arrests/

 

[Jax49]

DNs DNA would be taken by lawful procedure and put into the state database, available to all CODIS users as federal and state databases combined are CODIS. Kudos the lady Jayann Sepich whose daughter was murdered in New Mexico. She was out campaigning for country wide DNA collection on felony arrest.

https://www.vaildaily.com/news/new-colorado-law-requires-dna-tests-in-felony-arrests/

Thanks for linking. I noticed they have tried to address privacy concerns.

[FONT=&quot]Under Colorado’s new law, DNA will be taken from those arrested for felonies through a cheek swab, by reasonable force if necessary, and then sent to the Colorado Bureau of Investigation for testing and entrance to the state database. Those not charged within 90 days can ask for their DNA records to be removed for the database.[/FONT][FONT=&quot]As an added protection, Republicans and some Democratic lawmakers added a requirement that the state pay $25,000 to anyone whose DNA record was not expunged upon request. A $2.50 charge will be added to all felony and misdemeanor convictions and traffic tickets to pay for the testing.[/FONT]

bbm

moo

 

[RIP Meagan + Johnny]

DNs DNA would be taken by lawful procedure and put into the state database, available to all CODIS users as federal and state databases combined are CODIS. Kudos the lady Jayann Sepich whose daughter was murdered in New Mexico. She was out campaigning for country wide DNA collection on felony arrest.

https://www.vaildaily.com/news/new-colorado-law-requires-dna-tests-in-felony-arrests/

Hi, Boxer!

Starting from your post, but my questions are for anyone...

Wouldn’t DN’s DNA already be in CODIS from his SC arrests?

Would DN have needed to provide DNA to IN when he moved there because of his RSO status?

TIA

 

[Shiressleuth]

So we can be expecting some mighty interesting posts from you today! Can't wait!

Hoping you've already had some. Where's all the newbies tonite?
:wave: sign up and give us your thoughts. :thinking:

 

[Jax49]

It really is disheartening, the lynching that happens on-line. So many people were convinced Marcus Harper murdered Tara Grinstead; Clint Bobo his sister; Davy Blackburn his wife; Ron Logan the Delphi girls. The list goes on and on. I’m sure LE is more cautious than ever about releasing info to the public precisely because they don’t want to expose innocent people to self-proclaimed Internet detectives.

bbm

Unbelievable (to me, at least) there are still people blaming RL or the grandfather or the sheriff or the policeman, etc., etc., etc.

smh

moo

 

[Shiressleuth]

Hi, Boxer!

Starting from your post, but my questions are for anyone...

Wouldn’t DN’s DNA already be in CODIS from his SC arrests?

Would DN have needed to provide DNA to IN when he moved there because of his RSO status?

TIA

It's my understanding IN will start 1/1/18 taking DNA on felony arrest. ATM it is only on felony conviction. DN has no felony conviction in IN only the SC conviction. His DNA maybe in CODIS from that SC conviction depending when exactly the date of the offence was IMO. The Columbus IN exposure offence is one that he ran away from so he has escaped conviction on that so far. Is exposure a felony? Sorry more questions than answers.

 

[foxbluff]

The Indiana law at present allows DNA to be taken if arrested for a felony committed in Indiana. DN has not been arrested for a felony committed in Indiana as yet so I can't see it. If Co shares their sample, that would be illegal IMO. If DN's DNA is already in CODIS that would be different, I think. I think his attorney knew the law and was protecting his clients rights.

Ty. You're probably right.

Now, just jumping off your post: My apologies to Colo LE...I certainly didn't mean to accuse them of doing something illegal.

Hmm...since the FBI is involved in the Delphi case...I'm wondering if they would be exempt from the restrictions that might hinder Colo and Indy in obtaining and/or sharing DNA results?

 

[Shiressleuth]

No one was arguing about snark. I rely on official mods, not members to decide what is snark.

It's really sweet of you to comment on every post made here Shires but mine truly did not need further elaboration.

YVW. Is it really every post??

 

[Jax49]

Indiana LE said they have DN's DNA. Period.

Unless they are being called liars...

moo

 

[Shiressleuth]

Ty. You're probably right.

Now, just jumping off your post: My apologies to Colo LE...I certainly didn't mean to accuse them of doing something illegal.

Hmm...since the FBI is involved in the Delphi case...I'm wondering if they would be exempt from the restrictions that might hinder Colo and Indy in obtaining and/or sharing DNA results?

I'm just presupposing here. The Feds probably could take his DNA but it wasn't them but ISP I think. I certainly don't know either but am just trying to think of the reason his attorney would do what DN said in his letter. :moo: of course.