IN - Grandfather charged in cruise ship death of toddler Chloe Wiegand #2

[SpanishInquisition]

IF he is color blind then one would think he might be more careful knowing this could be an issue - like lifting her up - and saying to yourself - hmmm I may not be able to see if this glass is missing - since i'm color blind - maybe I shouldn't lean the baby out of it? but he didn't. still negligent homicide. and he did refuse the breathalyzer so there's that.
JMO

It also defies credulity that for 30+ seconds (not the 5 seconds as originally reported) SA in all that time didn't know there was a window there, especially while Chloe was put on the windowsill that itself would automatically tell you that there's no window there.

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

On the subject of railings: I'm sure there are some "dance moms" here Are your daughters (or sons) allowed to sit, stand, hang from the barres in the studio? Probably not. The barres are there primarily for balance and also may be used for stretching or other types of movement. Dance students would likely be admonished for using the barres inappropriately.

 

[oviedo]

Toddler slips from grandfather’s arms, falls to her death from 11th floor of Royal Caribbean’s Freedom of the Seas

found the early reference to dangling that was NOT scrubbed yet-
The toddler’s maternal grandfather, identified as Salvatore Anello, was reportedly playfully dangling the child from one of the ship’s port-side windows when he lost his grasp, sending the girl plummeting into an awning before she landed on the concrete dock below. “It’s a very grave scene, very regrettable and tragic,” Elmer Román, an official with the Puerto Rican Department of Public Security, told Puerto Rico’s Primera Hora newspaper. “One of the grandfathers, whom it would appear was playing with the little girl, lifted her out of the open window and lost his grip
Toddler slips from grandfather's arms, falls to her death from 11th floor of cruise ship
The toddler's maternal grandfather, identified as Salvatore Anello, was reportedly playfully dangling the child from one of the ship's port-side windows when he lost his grasp, sending the girl plummeting into an awning before she landed on the concrete dock below.

"It's a very grave scene, very regrettable and tragic," Elmer Román, an official with the Puerto Rican Department of Public Security, told Puerto Rico's Primera Hora newspaper. "One of the grandfathers, whom it would appear was playing with the little girl, lifted her out of the open window and lost his grip."

The accompanying video has him dangling her out the window - and note - it was port side that this happened. I've been wondering about that.

 

[sl222]

He is really halting and choosing his wording carefully instead of being straight and saying exactly what he thinks happened. Since he is withholding info and trying to defend himself, why do the interview? It seems like a lot of the public relations is banking on the fact that people are sympathetic to his feeling terrible and the fact that this was a child that a family lost. But I don't think that is going to fly. And now it turns out that this incident was 30 seconds long. The prosecutors say they have a very solid case and I believe them. They've done a lengthy investigation. I certainly don't think it was intentional but there was so much negligence.

I wouldn't doubt he has depth perception issues but at 50 or 51 it's very early on to have this. He does have what appear to be thick bifocals. It's odd that his comments indicate he couldn't tell that the entire bank of windows is angled out and he's surprised he had to reach farther to "touch the glass." Colorblind has nothing to do with seeing the difference between light and dark. If he was that impaired, he wouldn't pass a drivers test, I would think.

I think the interviewer thinks there was negligence, but that other anchor keeps going with the sympathy angle. I guess that helps the network cover all their bases and appease all points of view here.

 

[MsBetsy]

This is my understanding of color blindness too. So seems he would have seen a difference in the clear versus colored, just not been able to tell if green or blue. JMO

Yes, you can definitely tell if something is clear, but it depends on the color behind it.
If the blue sky was in the background, it might be harder to tell.
My daughter tends to see shades of green as blue rather than the other way around. It depends on the shade, though. A true green she can recognize but if it is a blue green she has trouble differentiating.

Imo

 

[SaguaroSpirit]

IF he is color blind then one would think he might be more careful knowing this could be an issue - like lifting her up - and saying to yourself - hmmm I may not be able to see if this glass is missing - since i'm color blind - maybe I shouldn't lean the baby out of it? but he didn't. still negligent homicide. and he did refuse the breathalyzer so there's that.
JMO

BBM, this, right here.

 

[MaryG12]

What color are the cruise ship's windows on the inside?

And - per the grandfather's information from his eye doctor, what type of color blindness does he have?

MOO but this may be very important to the case.

 

[neesaki]

I’m even more angry after that CBS interview. For one, if he truthfully considers it inconsequential, he wouldn’t be blaming the cruise ship, but instead would acknowledge it was his fault, and his alone.
Man, I really need that :banghead: emoticon right now.

And the interviewer stated the comments were mostly against him being prosecuted? Where are they reading, because everywhere I’ve read thought he was at fault.

 

[MaryG12]

Also - I am not sure that colorblindness will fly here - you're on the 11th floor of a cruise ship, if a window is open in front of you you can still feel the ocean breeze coming through. Sounds like the grandfather has some other issues going on.

For fun, a color blind test.

 

[Midwestmom2019]

Toddler slips from grandfather’s arms, falls to her death from 11th floor of Royal Caribbean’s Freedom of the Seas

found the early reference to dangling that was NOT scrubbed yet-
The toddler’s maternal grandfather, identified as Salvatore Anello, was reportedly playfully dangling the child from one of the ship’s port-side windows when he lost his grasp, sending the girl plummeting into an awning before she landed on the concrete dock below. “It’s a very grave scene, very regrettable and tragic,” Elmer Román, an official with the Puerto Rican Department of Public Security, told Puerto Rico’s Primera Hora newspaper. “One of the grandfathers, whom it would appear was playing with the little girl, lifted her out of the open window and lost his grip
Toddler slips from grandfather's arms, falls to her death from 11th floor of cruise ship
The toddler's maternal grandfather, identified as Salvatore Anello, was reportedly playfully dangling the child from one of the ship's port-side windows when he lost his grasp, sending the girl plummeting into an awning before she landed on the concrete dock below.

"It's a very grave scene, very regrettable and tragic," Elmer Román, an official with the Puerto Rican Department of Public Security, told Puerto Rico's Primera Hora newspaper. "One of the grandfathers, whom it would appear was playing with the little girl, lifted her out of the open window and lost his grip."

The accompanying video has him dangling her out the window - and note - it was port side that this happened. I've been wondering about that.

I wonder if the video of a man demonstrating how it happened was reenacting the game as SA holds her up, let’s go while she drops for a second or two then catches her.
OMG. Is that what you all mean by whoopsie?
SERIOUSLY?
I’ve never heard it called by that name.
If that’s what he did, that rises way higher than negligence IMHO.

 

[oviedo]

BBM! UGH this whole thing right here is prime evidence of how reckless his actions were, even if the window was closed. Did it ever occur to him that there was a reason for the rail, the distance, so that you couldn't easily reach the glass?!?!? DUH! I mean COME ON! I'm so annoyed I could scream. The whole banging on the glass excuse...so ridiculous. This man had NO REGARD whatsoever for his granddaughter's safety, I'm sorry! I'm sure of course he regrets it and feels terrible, in the same way that other people who do stupid reckless things thinking they are immune to the laws the rest of us abide by, including the laws of physics!!!

MAN, I AM FIRED UP!

me too. I think I would be less angry if the family just let the legal system work on it's own without these interviews - starting with the parents on the Today show back in July shortly after it happened. I sense a whole agenda here - now that the video has been seen the narrative needs to reflect that. So we have color blindness, the baby asking to be picked up - sitting her on the handrail (or ledge or dangling her depending on the version) together they lean forward to "bang on the glass" and she disappears. It seems to me this has all been contrived for his defense testimony. And the continuous threats to sue RCCL? but nothing filed yet? what's up with that?
IMO

 

[SpanishInquisition]

me too. I think I would be less angry if the family just let the legal system work on it's own without these interviews - starting with the parents on the Today show back in July shortly after it happened. I sense a whole agenda here - now that the video has been seen the narrative needs to reflect that. So we have color blindness, the baby asking to be picked up - sitting her on the handrail (or ledge or dangling her depending on the version) together they lean forward to "bang on the glass" and she disappears. It seems to me this has all been contrived for his defense testimony. And the continuous threats to sue RCCL? but nothing filed yet? what's up with that?
IMO

Actually thanks to this interview Chloe asking to be picked up has been reversed. Now by SA's own admission he unilaterally picked her up after for some mysterious reason he was unable to feel/touch the bottom window that Chloe was standing behind. If Chloe wanted to bang on the bottom window absolutely nothing was stopping her as there was no barrier stopping her.

 

[SaguaroSpirit]

I’m even more angry after that CBS interview. For one, if he truthfully considers it inconsequential, he wouldn’t be blaming the cruise ship, but instead would acknowledge it was his fault, and his alone.
Man, I really need that :banghead: emoticon right now.

And the interviewer stated the comments were mostly against him being prosecuted? Where are they reading, because everywhere I’ve read thought he was at fault.

[URL=https://imageshack.com/i/pne1JrCJg][/URL]

 

[SaguaroSpirit]

IN-Grandfather charged cruise ship death of Chloe Wiegand MEDIA TIMELINE NO DISCUSSION

I've been updating the media thread - interesting how the story SA is telling has changed significantly from the July MSM reports... IMO

It's a big fat flapping red flag when stories change...

 

[oviedo]

I wonder if the video of a man demonstrating how it happened was reenacting the game as SA holds her up, let’s go while she drops for a second or two then catches her.
OMG. Is that what you all mean by whoopsie?
SERIOUSLY?
I’ve never heard it called by that name.
If that’s what he did, that rises way higher than negligence IMHO.

Yes, that is what I mean - I can't speak for others on the board but I do believe he held her outside of the window ledge and was playing a game of "whoopsie" - "catch" whatever you want to call it - and she slipped from his grip. However, none of the reporters who viewed the video have said this outright. But I think that is because there is a criminal case pending. If that video shows his hands even crossing the plane of the window ledge - his claims of colorblindness, bifocals, whatever, just will not fly IMO. And again, because of my many cruises on RCCL - it is windy as heck when those windows are open. There is no mistaking the breeze you feel.
JMO

 

[Montrealaise]

Something is up, like it sounds like he was on drugs or something even taking what he's saying at face value. "I remember trying to find her on the floor and then I saw her fall, I saw her fall all the way down..." So first he started looking for her on the floor and then he saw her fall all the way down. By his own account him starting to look for her even though she was right in front of him caused her to fall out the window, which would at best mean he was impaired at the time.

Did he tell his lawyer that he was going to give this interview? Any criminal defense attorney worth his or her salt is going to advise a client, especially one charged with homicide, to NOT give any media interviews. Or did SA decide on his own that he should give an interview to make himself look better, the way Prince Andrew did (and we know how that worked out for the prince)?

 

[MsMarple]

Yeah, Winkleman is now trying to set a narrative that goes with that upcoming trial video IMO. First time we hear SA was holding her with one hand, she did not ask to be lifted up, he’s got a medical condition (colorblind) , she” slipped “ and he thought she was on the floor as he was “reaching for glass “ with his other hand.
Wow. He never takes any responsibility that he decided to do this act. He never says it’s his fault she is dead.
Does he and his attorney think the public is stupid?

MOO

And IMO that's the #1 reason he should not have done the interview. I suspect it was an attempt to garner sympathy and "set the record straight" but it seems to have had the opposite effect. Problem is that SA couldn't admit any kind of guilt on video shown to a National audience because it would impair both his criminal case and the civil suit.

So now he's added another excuse - color blindness - that he's been *told* he has. Huh? By whom, his doctor? Why not just say so? Was his statement passive because it was his lawyer who advised him to bring it up?

IMO nothing he says will take away the fact that Chloe is the victim and it's SA's fault that she's dead. MOO.

 

[oviedo]

Attorney: Girl Fell to Death From Open Window on Cruise Ship
snipped - note the hand position of the man in the picture - the video showed him with his hands outside the window and motioning up and down.
Girl Fell to Death From Open Window on Cruise Ship: Lawyer

An 18-month-old Indiana girl who fell to her death from the 11th story of a cruise ship in Puerto Rico plunged from a window inexplicably left open in a children's play area, the family's attorney said Tuesday. Police in Puerto Rico had said Monday that Chloe Wiegand apparently slipped from her grandfather's hands Sunday as he was holding her out ........

 

[Midwestmom2019]

Yes, that is what I mean - I can't speak for others on the board but I do believe he held her outside of the window ledge and was playing a game of "whoopsie" - "catch" whatever you want to call it - and she slipped from his grip. However, none of the reporters who viewed the video have said this outright. But I think that is because there is a criminal case pending. If that video shows his hands even crossing the plane of the window ledge - his claims of colorblindness, bifocals, whatever, just will not fly IMO. And again, because of my many cruises on RCCL - it is windy as heck when those windows are open. There is no mistaking the breeze you feel.
JMO

Next we’ll hear the wind caught her and and and

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

What color are the cruise ship's windows on the inside?...

I don't know about Freedom of the Seas specifically, but the tinted windows on the upper decks of the many ships on which I've sailed are a bluish-grey tint. The tinted windows diminish glare and keep the covered areas of open decks cooler than the external temperature.