GUILTY IN - Grandfather charged in cruise ship death of toddler Chloe Wiegand #9 *NO JAIL*

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Seattle1 said:
There will never be justice for baby Chloe. Every party failed this child. Charges filed against SA basically amounted to a misdemeanor so the same DA offering SA a plea deal was not so different than the penalty if tried in court.

Chloe would be alive today if not for SA raising her to the window AND breaching the security rail. She did not reach the open window by herself.

In the civil suit, RCCL is delaying discovery.

This child's life is nothing more than a footnote to everybody. :(
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Sadly, you are so right
 
Seattle1 said:
There will never be justice for baby Chloe. Every party failed this child. Charges filed against SA basically amounted to a misdemeanor so the same DA offering SA a plea deal was not so different than the penalty if tried in court.

Chloe would be alive today if not for SA raising her to the window AND breaching the security rail. She did not reach the open window by herself.

In the civil suit, RCCL is delaying discovery.

This child's life is nothing more than a footnote to everybody. :(
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Sadly, you are so right
 
ilovewings said:
I agree- I have felt it was an intentional act but it was a massive act of negligence for which he should spend some time in jail IMO. I see the family as greedy and hope the Cruise Company does not settle with these people, but, we know how that sometimes goes especially in light of a world wide pandemic- do they really want a protracted expensive trial?
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This is exactly why defendants sometimes settle even though they know the plaintiff's case is very weak - to avoid the expense, the time, trouble and stress of a trial. It's possible that RCLL will give the family something just to make them go away, but I would absolutely hate to see the family get even one cent. It would mean they succeeded in exploiting their child's tragic death at the hands of another family member for their own personal gain.
 
ilovewings said:
I agree- I have felt it was an intentional act but it was a massive act of negligence for which he should spend some time in jail IMO. I see the family as greedy and hope the Cruise Company does not settle with these people, but, we know how that sometimes goes especially in light of a world wide pandemic- do they really want a protracted expensive trial?
Click to expand...
This is exactly why defendants sometimes settle even though they know the plaintiff's case is very weak - to avoid the expense, the time, trouble and stress of a trial. It's possible that RCLL will give the family something just to make them go away, but I would absolutely hate to see the family get even one cent. It would mean they succeeded in exploiting their child's tragic death at the hands of another family member for their own personal gain.
 
mickey2942 said:
Sure. Whatever. Little girls lives don't matter. That is the message this sends.
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To any defendant, it’s numbers. Business decision. What are the chances that ... and they calculate every factor that they can think of to arrive at a decision. Not only to settle or not settle, but if settle, how much to pay. They run numbers, probably algorithms. Like bookies but way more complicated than yes or no and by how many touchdowns.
I wish they would bring him in as a third party defendant. Share the blame for the death. Then depending on the jurisdiction, whether a certain percentage at fault is attributed to each party. And damages are split along those lines. I presume the federal court in Florida has that option. Oviedo would probably know. As long as there is a question of fact, the judge should not dismiss the case.
 
Midwestmom2019 said:
To any defendant, it’s numbers. Business decision. What are the chances that ... and they calculate every factor that they can think of to arrive at a decision. Not only to settle or not settle, but if settle, how much to pay. They run numbers, probably algorithms. Like bookies but way more complicated than yes or no and by how many touchdowns.
I wish they would bring him in as a third party defendant. Share the blame for the death. Then depending on the jurisdiction, whether a certain percentage at fault is attributed to each party. And damages are split along those lines. I presume the federal court in Florida has that option. Oviedo would probably know. As long as there is a question of fact, the judge should not dismiss the case.
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There will be no human interest factored in this decision. RCCL is a publicly-traded company and the decision will be made by their insurer that is very experienced at assessing risk, and whose job it is to evaluate how best to proceed based on today's dollars and the future of RCCL. Dragging SA into the case serves only as a distraction, one that RCCL wants behind them. This will end as the majority of these cases do: a sealed settlement.

MOO
 
LietKynes said:
WTHR 13 News YT site :

Surveillance video shows moment Indiana toddler drops from cruise ship - YouTube
Surveillance video shows the moment Chloe Wiegand's grandfather dropped her from a window on a Royal Caribbean cruise ship.

A much sharper version.
SA threw her over and out that window.
He never sets her on the ledge of anything.
Very purposeful.
Imo.
Rest in peace, little Chloe !
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Wow! That was really something. He reaches down for her, and literally swoops her over the guardrail, and drops her. Swoop, drop. He didn't even hesitate. He knew that there was no glass there! Otherwise he would have banged her head into it.

Probation? Sure. Whatever. I hope that this family doesn't get a dime from RCCL.
 
The news media has been handling him and her family with kid gloves. Winkleman has earned his fees from a PR standpoint that is for sure.

However, This recent video makes it exceedingly clear that a) his whole upper body is outside that window and b) the amount of time that child was held precariously with seemingly not even 2 hands is not a second or two...it's long enough and he's close enough to know there's NO GLASS THERE! It's all such a bunch of self serving BS!

This case sickens me. News media wake up!
 
According to the defense reenaction , this man holding the doll would have his head out the window if he bent all the way forward like SA was doing. The way SA reaches forward with his hands / arms, it looks to me like he is grabbing hold of the window frame in order to pull himself over even further. It's bone chilling to watch this !
The defense claims that he couldn't have put his head out the window is total hogwash, as are the claims that he thought there was glass. Outrageous.
Another twist as investigators say toddler couldn’t have been dangled from ship’s window
 
neesaki said:
According to the defense reenaction , this man holding the doll would have his head out the window if he bent all the way forward like SA was doing. The way SA reaches forward with his hands / arms, it looks to me like he is grabbing hold of the window frame in order to pull himself over even further. It's bone chilling to watch this !
The defense claims that he couldn't have put his head out the window is total hogwash, as are the claims that he thought there was glass. Outrageous.
Another twist as investigators say toddler couldn’t have been dangled from ship’s window
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From the article:

"The Wiegand’s legal team boarded the Royal Caribbean ship on January 10th and found 13 cameras trained on the area where the incident had happened.".

Interesting. We have only seen footage from two cameras. I wonder if the rest of the video will be released?
 
neesaki said:
According to the defense reenaction , this man holding the doll would have his head out the window if he bent all the way forward like SA was doing. The way SA reaches forward with his hands / arms, it looks to me like he is grabbing hold of the window frame in order to pull himself over even further. It's bone chilling to watch this !
The defense claims that he couldn't have put his head out the window is total hogwash, as are the claims that he thought there was glass. Outrageous.
Another twist as investigators say toddler couldn’t have been dangled from ship’s window
Click to expand...

I remembering scratching my head over that picture of team W guy holding the doll on the window ledge after claiming SA did no such thing. Regardless of what they were trying to convey it looks like they believe SA did in fact put Chloe past the wooden railing and onto the actual window ledge, as alleged by RCCL. Sheesh, way to go guys!

mickey2942 said:
From the article:

"The Wiegand’s legal team boarded the Royal Caribbean ship on January 10th and found 13 cameras trained on the area where the incident had happened.".

Interesting. We have only seen footage from two cameras. I wonder if the rest of the video will be released?
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I'd have to dig way back to find the references - I believe they're in the lawsuit docs - but IIRC several of the so-called cameras were in fact not cameras and the rest didn't show Chloe and SA. Only the two that we've seen the video from are relevant to the case.
 
I saw a few photos from his recent appearance. No, I don’t have the link. But he sure looks spiffed up in his double breasted jacket and 40 pound lighter physique. I don’t think it’s because he’s so distraught over Chloe's death. I’m thinking his bad health habits finally caught up with him. Or someone told him you ARE going to straighten your act up or there will be consequences.
Don’t diabetics have peripheral nerve damage in their extremities? That would have been a much better excuse than color blindness. I slipped because my toes...and I could not hold on to her because I, I, I have loss of feelings in my fingers. That’s it. Loss of strength in my fingers.
If only that had been the truth.
ETA: can’t find the pics. They were at the courthouse. Two different angles. With a woman next to him, not his wife, who had white hair and was much shorter than him. She looked like court personnel.
 
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Kakidoll said:
Sure doesn't look like an accident... never did to me. I just don't get his end game.
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The wheels of justice grind slowly.
Accepted GUILTY plea.
Now, RCCL can dig up everything it needs. I won’t repeat the prior comments but there were so many hinky things that came out in the very first few days before things started to spin.
If anyone wants a new thread for facts that went poof, we can start a new PM. There are other cases I can add. Just ask.
 
Midwestmom2019 said:
The wheels of justice grind slowly.
Accepted GUILTY plea.
Now, RCCL can dig up everything it needs. I won’t repeat the prior comments but there were so many hinky things that came out in the very first few days before things started to spin.
If anyone wants a new thread for facts that went poof.
There are other cases I can add. Just ask.
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Snipped by me
Agreed and done.

Just so you all know-- this is based on hinky acts of the parents and SA, and not that SA is innocent and just set her down and was not told by the ship's staff that there was no glass.
 
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Kakidoll said:
Sure doesn't look like an accident... never did to me. I just don't get his end game.
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bbm
$$$$$$$$$$$$$
For not just S.A. but the parents as well.
The lawyer had said the parents could sue for an (paraphrased) 'unlimited amount'.

From the swiftness of the lawsuit -- it appeared that the child's parents and grandparent (SA) were very focused on reaping the rewards of a successful lawsuit.
Who knows why the other set of grands have been silent, but it's possible they were threatened to have money withheld if the lawsuit was successful -- if they spoke against SA or the parents.
Chloe was their grandchild as well. :(

It's surprising that the local LE in Chloe's father's (Alan Wiegand) police jurisdiction were so supportive of this lawsuit.
LE are by the nature of their job a nosy bunch of people.
They must know by now that this did not happen the way Kimberly Wiegand and S.A. said it did ?
Imo.
 
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