IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 #28

[Jacobite]

Actually, hitting your nose can cause black eyes. I know this because I'm gifted and talented that way, unfortunately.

Can't dispute a first hand account.

 

[ared684]

A concussion or a skull fracture can cause a black eye no matter which way you fall, if you fall hard enough. It's common if you hit your nose that both eyes will blacken but it can certainly only happen in one eye as well.

 

[Jacobite]

My question about the theory that LS never made it back to 5N is if she didn't then how does JR know about her facial injuries?

OK. Looks like you may have a point.

 

[Jacobite]

This story is told from another point of view. http://www.truecrimereport.com/2011/06/lauren_spierer_disappearance_d.php

 

[SeeingForThe1stTime]

OK. Looks like you may have a point.

Ok, just making sure there wasn't something i was missing. So, based on this then a few theories can be taken off the table and I guess it's also safe to assume that by making these statements that he saw physical changes to her face from her injuries in the alley that she didn't have earlier and he could not have known abiut otherwise that JR has proved that she was there, so we're back to trying to work out what happend next, correct? Did she leave? When? What time? With who? What direction? Alive or not?
Getting back to basics helps me sometimes. Is there a map with camera locations somewhere? Does anyone on WS that attended IU know how aware of the cameras the POI's would have likely been?

 

[Jacobite]

If Lauren takes 11th Street east, then turns south on College as told by JR? There were no cameras until she made it home that would have seen her. It is unlikely that JR would have been aware there were no cameras on the entire route.

 

[Todaysun]

I am a long time lurker, checking this thread daily but I have not joined/posted until today as I did not feel I had anything to contribute. Thank you to all of you. "regulars" who do post and keep this discussion alive!

However, I finally have something to say. I just can't shake the feeling that it is what is NOT being said that is most important. WHY did the JRNTT author feel threatened, and by whom? Who didn't want Lauren to be found?? What happened to Tony Gatto?? Both people were doing important work, I thought -- and both were passionate about their work so what (or WHO) made it end?

I can't shake that thought- and I don't understand why we are not exploring that subject more. Did both of them get too close to something?

Maybe they did, or maybe I am reaching ... I don't know.

And what happened to sweet_blush/Dorothea? She seemed to have a lot of information (some rumors, yes, but either way I found her insight refreshing at times). <modsnip>

Thanks for hearing me out. --- and it feels good to finally post something!!!!

 

[SeeingForThe1stTime]

Another question, since I don't know enough about how attorneys work and what would and wouldn't be likely for one to do but it seems like there are enough people posting here that seem to know so, my question is: given that the POI's retained counsel very early on, if one of them told their atty that not knowing about LS's medical issues that they panicked and thought she OD'd (i dont really think this is what happened but it could have) so they hid her body, how likely would it be that an Atty would convince (or try to) his client to reveal the location while it was still possible to find out if she died of "natural" causes, thereby lessening their responsibility in her death? Would an Atty attempt to do that? If so, doesn't it seem likely one of the 5N boys would go that route? If not for the sake of principle but to possibly save their own *advertiser censored*? I don't know, it just seems like one would?

 

[Skigirl]

Nobody said it was a good idea and it really doesn't matter overall.... If the story is true that is what happened and she walked out the door by herself.

Her condition at that point is a matter of conjecture.

If the story is not true then why it hasn't fallen apart and been impeached by this point is something I can't figure out.

My point was that the idea that he just said, "later," and let her walk alone in that condition seems suspect to me since it's not really a normal thing to do in most circles. It's possible that that's exactly what happened, but it seems unlikely to me.

 

[jobid]

as far as Lauren mistaking an ipod for a phone, I have tried to answer my television remote control when the phone was ringing... in a perfectly sober state...

I'm not sure why I felt the need to share that!

 

[bx2]

My point was that the idea that he just said, "later," and let her walk alone in that condition seems suspect to me since it's not really a normal thing to do in most circles. It's possible that that's exactly what happened, but it seems unlikely to me.

We have heard a lot about LS and CR's apparent mental and physical state after partying all night, but other than the comment about taking multiple shots of vodka, haven't heard too much about how JR was doing. I don't think I'm taking a huge leap in assuming he was not anywhere near sober. I'm really not trying to make excuses for him, but at the same time, there is a glaring reason for not making normal decisions if it was indeed the case.

And the same rationale on why I tend to give his logic at the time a pass, I find myself continually coming back up against his account of her walking down the street as being totally unreliable.

 

[SeeingForThe1stTime]

as far as Lauren mistaking an ipod for a phone, I have tried to answer my television remote control when the phone was ringing... in a perfectly sober state...

I'm not sure why I felt the need to share that!

No, I'm glad you did, I never thought that was a big deal, if you put an iPhone and an iPod touch next to each other it's not that hard to make that mistake. Well, for me it's not hard.

 

[Ros]

I am a long time lurker, checking this thread daily but I have not joined/posted until today as I did not feel I had anything to contribute. Thank you to all of you. "regulars" who do post and keep this discussion alive!

However, I finally have something to say. I just can't shake the feeling that it is what is NOT being said that is most important. WHY did the JRNTT author feel threatened, and by whom? Who didn't want Lauren to be found?? What happened to Tony Gatto?? Both people were doing important work, I thought -- and both were passionate about their work so what (or WHO) made it end?

I can't shake that thought- and I don't understand why we are not exploring that subject more. Did both of them get too close to something?

Maybe they did, or maybe I am reaching ... I don't know.

And what happened to sweet_blush/Dorothea? She seemed to have a lot of information (some rumors, yes, but either way I found her insight refreshing at times). Anyone know why she was banned?

Thanks for hearing me out. --- and it feels good to finally post something!!!!

And after a while, the posts on PT were repeatedly "modded," even though they were apparently within the rules, while other posts, that did violate the TOS, were allowed to remain. And JRNNT Uncensored was suddenly shut down too. And some, but not all, of the early stories have been deleted from the web. And Sweet_Blush/Dorothea reported receiving threats too.

 

[akh]

Another question, since I don't know enough about how attorneys work and what would and wouldn't be likely for one to do but it seems like there are enough people posting here that seem to know so, my question is: given that the POI's retained counsel very early on, if one of them told their atty that not knowing about LS's medical issues that they panicked and thought she OD'd (i dont really think this is what happened but it could have) so they hid her body, how likely would it be that an Atty would convince (or try to) his client to reveal the location while it was still possible to find out if she died of "natural" causes, thereby lessening their responsibility in her death? Would an Atty attempt to do that? If so, doesn't it seem likely one of the 5N boys would go that route? If not for the sake of principle but to possibly save their own *advertiser censored*? I don't know, it just seems like one would?

It's very possible the first thing an attorney would've said is "If you are guilty I don't want to know so don't tell me, and if you're innocent let's figure out what we can do"

If you confess your guilt to an attorney you limit the areas he can take your defense.

OTOH, he very well could still list possible scenarios and outcomes for his client and speak hypothetically and put the ball back in the client's court to do something like you have suggested. I would imagine the implications of that scenario would've been discussed so I would assume the clients that 'lawyered up' would've had that type of information to consider.

 

[Murakami]

WHY did the JRNTT author feel threatened, and by whom? Who didn't want Lauren to be found?? What happened to Tony Gatto?? Both people were doing important work, I thought -- and both were passionate about their work so what (or WHO) made it end?

To play devil's advocate (Even though I totally agree with you), it was true that both of those blogs, particularly JRNTT, were FRIGHTENINGLY detailed about every single possible facet of JR's life and family - his dad's family business, grandparent's health, childhood habits..EVERYTHING. What powerful, means-filled family (as JR's was), WOULDN'T do everything in their power to shut down the public flow of such detailed and private information, even if he was totally innocent? In all likelihood the family paid big bucks to a hacker to have it shut down, or had a lawyer/IT guy contact the blogger and find some clause that would rule it illegal and an infringement of privacy to post such things.

<modsnip>

 

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Bessie

:welcome5:
​

 

[Todaysun]

To play devil's advocate (Even though I totally agree with you), it was true that both of those blogs, particularly JRNTT, were FRIGHTENINGLY detailed about every single possible facet of JR's life and family - his dad's family business, grandparent's health, childhood habits..EVERYTHING. What powerful, means-filled family (as JR's was), WOULDN'T do everything in their power to shut down the public flow of such detailed and private information, even if he was totally innocent? In all likelihood the family paid big bucks to a hacker to have it shut down, or had a lawyer/IT guy contact the blogger and find some clause that would rule it illegal and an infringement of privacy to post such things.

<modsnip>

I didn't think about that - very good point.

 

[Ros]

To play devil's advocate (Even though I totally agree with you), it was true that both of those blogs, particularly JRNTT, were FRIGHTENINGLY detailed about every single possible facet of JR's life and family - his dad's family business, grandparent's health, childhood habits..EVERYTHING. What powerful, means-filled family (as JR's was), WOULDN'T do everything in their power to shut down the public flow of such detailed and private information, even if he was totally innocent? In all likelihood the family paid big bucks to a hacker to have it shut down, or had a lawyer/IT guy contact the blogger and find some clause that would rule it illegal and an infringement of privacy to post such things.

<modsnip>

I initially guessed that an attorney (or more than one attorney) had threatened to bring a suit against the bloggers, etc., but legit attorneys do not threaten to harm someone's child. As I recall, in the IM article, JL said that she and JV had nothing to do with the shutdown of the blog.

http://www.indianapolismonthly.com/features/story.aspx?ID=1712477

Just before JRNNT was shut down, it appeared to be hacked and vandalized in a strange way, so the idea that someone paid a hacker makes sense.

 

[friendsara]

As far as JRNTT and whether threats were made against her...it's totally possible, yes, but you might also want to read other blogs the author has written and consider how/if her mental state allows her to understand reality (just google JR Needs to Talk and you'll find another blog by her, her name, etc). I grew very fond of the author as I followed JRNTT but I think she may have some issues with paranoia. I don't say this to criticize her at all. I've read some other blogs by her that have since been deleted and her writing definitely made me question her state of mental health.

 

[Ros]

As far as JRNTT and whether threats were made against her...it's totally possible, yes, but you might also want to read other blogs the author has written and consider how/if her mental state allows her to understand reality (just google JR Needs to Talk and you'll find another blog by her, her name, etc). I grew very fond of the author as I followed JRNTT but I think she may have some issues with paranoia. I don't say this to criticize her at all. I've read some other blogs by her that have since been deleted and her writing definitely made me question her state of mental health.

I could find only one other blog, the one where she mentions the threat to her child in the "about me" section. I agree that paranoia is one possible explanation for that statement. There could also be more serious reasons. I am not a mental health professional, I do not know Mrs GS personally, and and I cannot know which is correct.

Mrs GS is not the same as CJ is she?