IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 #28

[Jacobite]

I thought this site required verification of such claims.

Can you supply any sort of solid evidence that you've ever been to Bloomington, Indiana?

It would have been easier if you had stated that my event may have been unrelated to Lauren. I might agree with that. But, we did see a middle-eastern guy come running after a blonde in an alley in Bloomington. And, I said we because there were three witnesses. The guy fled with a white boy who had his little blue car parked in the north garage of 10th and College Village Apartments. I have plenty of proof that I can provide if it is connected to Lauren. And, yes, I did encounter a middle-eastern guy who would come charging after a blonde girl, he did not know in the area where Lauren went missing. This is not something we would make up. Is it connected is my question?

 

[Jacobite]

Then on 10 September, 2011, I was a Sports in Bloomington, drinking imports at the bar when a couple connected with this case showed up and sat down right next to me. I was surprised by this because the place was nearly empty. One of them I recognized from television, the other from Tony Gatto. They were on the cellphone with a guy they called Jay the whole time.

 

[TonyGatto]

Hi Tony. How long would you estimate it took the Bar manager to walk the half mile from the bar to the location at 10th and N. College where she said she saw LS being carried by Person X? I would estimate 3 minutes. Has there been any verification of when she left the bar? Do you think her time report of 3:38 is accurate?

Who do you think Person X is?

What do you think the discrepancy is with LE regarding her 3:38 time?

She drove.

 

[bx2]

She drove.

Meaning she was still in the car when witnessing the encounter or she drove home from work, parked, and witnessed it on foot?

If she was in the car driving, can you confirm if she drove past them on College or if it was on 10th? The reason I ask, is because if it was 10th then her car would be captured on camera by the same video cameras that captured the white truck and may be how LE can rationalize the timing.

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7189022&postcount=379"]There was a very similar account given here[/ame] where some of the details may be incorrect because of the third-handedness.

 

[Jacobite]

Meaning she was still in the car when witnessing the encounter or she drove home from work, parked, and witnessed it on foot?

If she was in the car driving, can you confirm if she drove past them on College or if it was on 10th? The reason I ask, is because if it was 10th then her car would be captured on camera by the same video cameras that captured the white truck and may be how LE can rationalize the timing.

There was a very similar account given here where some of the details may be incorrect because of the third-handedness.

Looks like Doubtingthomas did an excellent job in telling the story. The quotes attributed to the Mystery Man by his friends daughter are a close match to what the witness told the detective.

And, now I know Doubtingthomas had the scoop on the Mystery Man all along. Doubtingthomas is one of the nicest people I've come across here.

 

[VeryVeritas]

She drove.

Ok so 2 minutes? My point is that this would have been within a couple minutes of when she left the Bar, correct? Just seems the time she left should be backed up by something. I think her time is accurate, just am puzzled at why LE discounts it.

 

[VeryVeritas]

She drove.

Who do you think person X is?

Why do you think LE does not agree with her 3:38 time?
Do you know what time LE thinks she saw them?

 

[Jacobite]

It's now very obvious that the Mystery Man is Corey Rossman. The video evidence, statements by LE, and this post by Doubtingthomas prove it. [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7189022&postcount=379"]http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7189022&postcount=379[/ame] Simple logic! Thanks, Doubtingthomas!

 

[AnalyticalExaminer]

I think we should be focusing solely on the reported or otherwise-established facts, and not obfuscatory hearsay/speculation.

 

[AbbeyR]

Go back to the description. It doesn't sound like CR to me.

Hi Tony, welcome back!

There's a question I've wanted to ask you for ages -- The last time you were around, I believe you said that the 'mystery man' witness stopped talking to you, and that you suspected that someone 'got to her'.

Who did you mean? LE or the POI? She didn't know any of the POI or Lauren's friends, did she?

 

[AbbeyR]

Go back to the description. It doesn't sound like CR to me.

So is the witness account coming from the PI's in the Lohud video (at around 4:30) coming from the same source? They describe Lauren being carried over CR's shoulders.
http://www.lohud.com/VideoNetwork/1662569062001/Lauren-Spierer-interactive

Your blog posts say almost the exact same thing (same location, includes part about Lauren falling and banging her head), but it's clear that the witness does not think it is Corey.

http://tonygatto.com/2011/06/16/new...n-spierer-mystery-encounter-with-unknown-man/
http://tonygatto.com/2011/06/22/pol...-discount-mystery-man-in-lauren-spierer-case/

Are you suggesting that the Lohud version is wrong and this wasn't Corey - or that your witness was describing a similar event, different time, different person??

Thanks!

ETA: Did you ever ask what your witness meant by "dark-skinned"? The description can obviously mean totally different things depending on whether it is a reference to skin tone or ethnicity.

 

[AbbeyR]

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Each of us has something we wish we could do over, start fresh or finish differently. Don’t you?...

We can all add a new page in the book of our lives – one which like the addition of a new page in any book, neither erases or undoes what came before it, but one which can transcend those earlier pages and the stories they contain. Each of us get a second chance – a chance to return to the person we most want to be and to living the life we most deeply desire. That’s the very human promise which lies at the heart of the Jewish New Year.

This Rosh Hashanah, give yourself the second chances to which you are entitled, and do the same for others also.

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012...2012-god-gives-second-chances-and-should-too/

Sometimes I think about the 'perplexing' silence of Laurens friends (as described by the Spierers). I wonder if some of the POI (or others) followed the advice of their lawyers or dads and then found themselves on a road that was hard to go back on. The Spierers have asked one thing of the POI -- to take FBI polygraphs. David Rohn is the only one to date who has done this.

Lauren has been missing now for 15 months and there are still so many unanswered questions. It's never too late to do the right thing...

What do you know about the disappearance of Lauren Spierer?
Anything Small Could Be Big. Speak Up.
Your call could make the difference.
www.findlauren.com
Bloomington Police Department 812.339.4477
helpfindlauren@gmail.com​

 

[bessie]

I thought this site required verification of such claims.

Members are free to relate personal experiences. Where similarities exist, members can also speculate that an incident might be related to the immediate case.

For example, in a hypothetical case, a 2009 silver Honda Accord is reported in MSM as the car driven by a suspect. A poster comments:

"I saw a 2009 silver Honda Accord driving in the vicinity a few days before the crime. I wonder if it was the perp."

No problem with the above. But, if poster comments:

"I saw a 2009 silver Honda Accord driving in the vicinity a few days before the crime. It had the exact same markings as the car reported in the news. I got a glimpse of the driver. It was the perp."

This kind of post is discouraged. Mods have the choice to remove it and/or request that the member become verified before repeating the claim. The poster should report the incident to LE, who will usually request that the witness keep the information to him/herself.

Speaking of the verification policy, here's a random reminder.

Verified / Professional Posters

We are lucky enough to have posters from all walks of life with a broad spectrum of expertise. Some may have special inside knowledge about a case or be directly related to a player in the case. This is all extremely valuable information for the forum. However, we like to make sure that anyone posting as a professional in a specific area (doctor, lawyer, search and rescue, etc.), or as someone with inside information, truly is what/who they claim to be. Verification is 100% optional. No posters are required to become verified unless they wish to post inside or professional information. If you wish to become verified, please contact [admin] at wsverify@xmission.com with your Websleuths name, your real name, the case, and your phone number and a good time to call. If you have any questions, contact a moderator.

[ame="http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=106653"]Professional Posters & Verified Locals/Insiders - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]

 

[monkey222]

Hi Bessie, Did this thread move somewhere?? Thanks.

 

[bessie]

No monkey, it's still right here under Hot Cases.

 

[imkeylime]

A message about second chances, brought to you by the Jewish New Year



http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012...2012-god-gives-second-chances-and-should-too/

Sometimes I think about the 'perplexing' silence of Laurens friends (as described by the Spierers). I wonder if some of the POI (or others) followed the advice of their lawyers or dads and then found themselves on a road that was hard to go back on. The Spierers have asked one thing of the POI -- to take FBI polygraphs. David Rohn is the only one to date who has done this.

Lauren has been missing now for 15 months and there are still so many unanswered questions. It's never too late to do the right thing...

​

The fact that only DR took an FBI-administered polygraph seems significant in that he wasn't with LS toward the end of the night, in contrast with the other POIs. So ... if there was a coverup of whatever, he probably wasn't involved in it, IMO.

The Lohud article mentions DR admitting to doing Klonopin with LS. I realize it's possible that another POI gave her something else, but I'd assume she told JR or CR what she'd taken, and hence he/they wouldn't feel as responsible for an OD.

So IMO 1) something happened later on that DR doesn't know about (or didn't at the time) and 2) the OD/disposal of body theory doesn't hold as much weight as it used to.

Unless whoever supplied the Klonopin provided her with something else later?

 

[VeryVeritas]

The fact that only DR took an FBI-administered polygraph seems significant in that he wasn't with LS toward the end of the night, in contrast with the other POIs. So ... if there was a coverup of whatever, he probably wasn't involved in it, IMO.

The Lohud article mentions DR admitting to doing Klonopin with LS. I realize it's possible that another POI gave her something else, but I'd assume she told JR or CR what she'd taken, and hence he/they wouldn't feel as responsible for an OD.

So IMO 1) something happened later on that DR doesn't know about (or didn't at the time) and 2) the OD/disposal of body theory doesn't hold as much weight as it used to.

Unless whoever supplied the Klonopin provided her with something else later?

I'd never seen proof that DR admitted doing Klonopin with LS. I do recall secondhand statements to that effect. If he is directly quoted please post or at least the date of this article. At the time, I researched Klonopin and there is no question that it could cause her to fall and / or drop dead, all by itself. In conjunction with other substances and / or her falls and possibly her health it could have killed her. And from the time they supposedly ingested it, the effects would have been peaking around 4am, making it pretty much impossible for her to walk just a few minutes later. Look up the metabolic characteristics of this stuff. It does make sense that JR calls DR at 4:15 because of her condition. It also makes sense that DR did not answer because at 4:15 DR should have been unconscious as well.

Why would this in any way change the OD / Body disposal theories?
If she's dead from Klonopin, that doesn't mean those with her knew that.
The most plausible thing that happened in my mind is that one way or another 1,2 or 3 of them wound up with a dead LS and didn't want to face LE at 3:30 - 4:15 am The 3 main POI's did not necessarily know about the cameras. If LE arrived at CR/MB's or JR's and saw LS's injuries and questioned any of these 3 at the time can you see a different outcome here? It's very reasonable to assume that they were scared of what might happen if they were caught with a 4'11" 98lb dead 20 year old girl who looked beat to death. LE would not be very friendly. At the same time, CR was messed up, JR had been drinking heavily. That would look real good to LE too. Any average person even just sitting there watching, who was drunk and tired might be scared to face LE under those circumstances. The idea that maybe one would be serving 20 years in prison for murder could easily pass through their mind. They had no way of knowing that LS's falls were witnessed and recorded. They would have no way of knowing what killed her and that DR would admit Klonopin was used. As the saying goes "Hindsight is always 20/20". Even as I'm willing to accept other theories, nothing seems to fit the circumstances and facts better than this. If it were disproven, that would be fine with me. But as more facts have come in, it's only solidified this theory for me, and weakened others.

I do hope that they will make a deal and admit what happened and give the Spierers the truth AND LS's location. If she died from Klonopin + whatever, that's something they need to know. The reasons why this was covered up, might be less sinister than imagined. If it is what happened, keeping quiet at this stage is horrible, and the longer it goes on, then it's as though they did kill her (to me). Torturing LS's family by not coming forward with the truth is evil. It's my view that if they aren't forthcoming soon, and then later it's proven they covered it up, they should get 20+ years. They may think they can bargain their sentence down later, or that they can just skate on through life as though nothing happened. How guilty would they feel if they figured she OD'd by her own actions? I'm sure they could all go on with their lives, finish school, start businesses, etc... oh wait... that is what they are doing.

 

[Ros]

According to the Lohud article, DR or LS told JR about the Klonopin and he told "investigators."


http://www.lohud.com/article/201206...ered-away-after-night-heavy-drinking-drug-use

So DR did no necessarily admit to using Klonopin. JR could have heard about it from LS instead. But JR would have know about the Klonopin when LS arrived at 5N

 

[Jacobite]

There is no proof, only assumptions here that any of the 5 North boys were into anything besides drinking and some pot smoking.
Had the police caught them with something like coke, they would have been charged and pressured for more information.
Maybe, the hard drug use was back at Smallwood? Would the 5 N boys lawyer up and cover up for that? I doubt it. Something else must have happened.
How about, someone thought they'd take sexual advantage of a girl he thought was too wasted to say no. Then she appears to die while this is going on. And, what if she wasn't really dead? The LE cadaver dogs don't seem to have found a dead scent anywhere.

 

[Jacobite]

I thought this site required verification of such claims.

Can you supply any sort of solid evidence that you've ever been to Bloomington, Indiana?

I would prefer that I knew everyone who posted here. It does matter who is saying what. But, I will not be the only one who is not wearing a mask. That is not a level playing field. I came here to see if I could get info. I did not come here to make computer friends. Guess I'm not disappointed.

But one thing for certain, I am very connected with this place called Bloomington.