IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 #31

[Jupiter812]

I'm inclined to disagree and agree partially.

Why would someone who doesn't attend the school come all the way from Michigan to visit the likes of JR?

a) One hell of a close friendship where yes you might do some serious favors for each other. For someone that has gutted a deer, disposing of a body for blood brother isn't that big of a stretch.

b) A bit more than a friendship, yes drug supplier relationship... in that case obvious motivation as partners in crime.

Any other plausible reason? Come down to party and get laid maybe? hmm...
I really don't think he drove all that way for some corned beef.

No need to excoriate every decision, every action they made. Lots of people including college kids like to visit Bloomington. When I was that age, friendship was reason enough to visit and it's reason enough in this case too IMO. Plus they were starting a business together, and JR had been in Spain for the semester. JR had already introduced CR and Lauren so if there were any promise of being laid, I doubt it was her.

 

[CoolJ]

Anybody have a good explanation for where this story about LS and CR ringing the doorbell of ZC and friends? ZC says she and roomates were asleep. LS is missing and CR has amnesia. So how does anybody know this even happened?

 

[Chuz Life]

Anybody have a good explanation for where this story about LS and CR ringing the doorbell of ZC and friends? ZC says she and roomates were asleep. LS is missing and CR has amnesia. So how does anybody know this even happened?

The accounting of those events apparently comes from Zoe Camp herself.

Shortly after 3 a.m. June 3, 2011, a drunken Spierer - who'd just fallen on her face and smacked her head on concrete - and her companion Corey Rossman rang the doorbell to Camp's apartment, where she and her three roommates were asleep.

Since no one answered, the two left, with Rossman slinging Spierer over his shoulders as he carried her down the steps. An hour later, she vanished. ...

In my opinion, Zoe Camp is the key person in solving the case of Lauren's disappearance.

 

[CoolJ]

So she wasn't really asleep. In fact she was awake enough to know exactly who was ringing her door. What is the motivation for the lie?

 

[Chuz Life]

So she wasn't really asleep. In fact she was awake enough to know exactly who was ringing her door. What is the motivation for the lie?

I can't say she was lying until I know what the facts actually were.

But if she was lying - her motivation is the same as everyone else's.

She would be motivated by the need to cover her tail.

 

[monkey222]

I am under the impression that DB was staying..at least..that night..at some place other than JRs.

 

[CoolJ]

Well to me whatever way you look at it she is not being truthful. Saying Lauren rang her doorbell but in the same breathe saying everyone in the apartment was asleep. Could be a few reasons for the lie, both good and bad. But something is missing with this part of the story and I agree that it could be very important to solving the mystery

 

[bx2]

In the loHud video detectives talk about CR carring LS down some steps. I am trying to picture where these steps are. I have been looking at the pictures from Btown. Can someone point out where these steps are? Thanks

I believe it is these (taken from Google street view) at the South West corner of the T&C bldg:

 

[bx2]

Anybody have a good explanation for where this story about LS and CR ringing the doorbell of ZC and friends? ZC says she and roomates were asleep. LS is missing and CR has amnesia. So how does anybody know this even happened?

This question was raised a few pages back too. As someone noted, it would make sense that the doorbell was heard and ignored and then later connected to the story when CR told her. ZC has already directly contradicted the amnesia story once, and I believe CR himself even mentioned it was only something his lawyer said.

Rossman's lawyer later would claim that he lost memory of that night from the punch. But Rossman's friend, Zoe Camp, told the paper, "He knows that he got in a fight with some of Jesse (Wolff's) friends in Smallwood."

 

[Ixchel13]

Yes, DR leaving almost as soon as arriving with LS was curious.
Also found it interesting when CS pointed that out about 12:16 being the last time LS used her phone. If someone snatched her phone, causing her to think DR had it, it could mesh with JR's account of the 4:15 call to DR. But JR may have also been aware of the possible phone charade. Say for example that CR took it and turned it off to prevent contact with JW. Later when they are at Kilroys he leaves it there. I don't recall details from Kilroys of exactly where the phone was found in proximity to the shoes. It would definitely seem odd that she would not have touched the phone at all if she had it at JR's and brought it to Kilroys, unless she was already severely incapacitated even before leaving JR's at 1:00ish. Which do you think it is? That someone snagged her phone or that she was so out of it before leaving JR's that she couldn't use it and then lost it at Kilroys?

as I have said before, I think she left it at SW and people started moving it around and then someone got scared and threw it over Kilroys fence.

 

[Ixchel13]

Well to me whatever way you look at it she is not being truthful. Saying Lauren rang her doorbell but in the same breathe saying everyone in the apartment was asleep. Could be a few reasons for the lie, both good and bad. But something is missing with this part of the story and I agree that it could be very important to solving the mystery

IMO Zoe Camp is def lying about something, if not actually involved.

 

[Ixchel13]

I credit the Marine Corps with the dedication and the attention to detail thing... I can't take credit for that.

As for my enthusiasm? I'm tired and I don't feel enthusiastic.

I think there is enough evidence in this case for a grand jury to indict some people and I'm more driven by a need to get answers to my questions than anything else.

I do appreciate your comments though.

Thanks for all that you do too.

semper fi fellow ex-marine!

 

[Ixchel13]

I will have to provide the links later because I need to run some errands.... but I've found more than one news report that says Zoe claimed they knocked or rang the door bell just after 3:00 am.

Given the slowing pace and the time the walk would have taken...

It would have been plausible for Lauren and Corey or ??? to be seen at the steps at 3:38 am (by the Bar Manager.)

However, I can't find anything any-WHERE that substantiates Zoe Camp's claims.

WHO were her other (three) room-mates and what were their recollections of that night?

Inquiring minds want to know.

Here's the article VV: LINK: http://webcache.googleusercontent.c...531/NEWS/305310113/+&cd=7&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us

IMO, ZC knew the bar manager. Also, IMO, someone came out when Lauren rang the doorbell, and told them Zoe was asleep,(bar mgr?) and that's why ZC told the police this, because she knew someone else knew, and for some reason, they are all lying about something at the 10th and College interlude--
probably drug$.

Said it before, saying it again--they are all lying because of drug$, they may have all contributed to Lauren's demise in some way, and are responsible for
her demise, and yet, in the end, left her to be abducted by a (probably) local
predator. IOW, it's definitely all of their faults, but they didn't commit the act.
jmoo

BTW, almost any of these cameras can be misdirected with a pole, or hit with a pole and very easily broken. I can see these "kids" who live in these places doing these things on a regular basis. As for the people who own the cameras, I can see them possibly only caring about this and repairing the cameras when LE is sniffing around, or on a Monday after the weekend, etc. After checking with someone who was actually repairing cameras, I can say with confidence that these cameras could have been misdirected or broken on a continual basis, anytime, and it is not weird that Lauren didn't show up on any other camera.

 

[Snapfade]

Is there any chanxe that ZC and JW were together in the apartment?

 

[Ixchel13]

I believe it is these (taken from Google street view) at the South West corner of the T&C bldg:

keep walking north just about 60 feet and you come to another set of stairs that lead to a walkway between two businesses and then opens into a large,
inner courtyard, I mean large, the entire building encompasses it's square and it has a fountain in the middle. There are inner entrances to the building from this courtyard.

I'm going to make a wild assumption and opinionate that probably most of the cameras at 10th and College were faulty that evening.

On a ne'er- do- well, rich- spoiled- god- knows- what's- going on scale of ten, 10th and College gets a 9.5. There was a video, maybe u tube, posted on PT that someone got off AB's (ZO roommate) FB. It was a party at an apt that looked like 10th and C. The crowd was a mix of older locals, and by older I don't mean late 20s, I mean late 30s and 40s. Older compared to the
19-21 yr old other guests. They all looked like druggies, when I use that term I don't mean pot. A probably 32-37 yr. woman (looks older from coke?) goes up to AB and starts teasing and then kissing him, and the filmer was panning, getting crowd reactions. The older people were really getting a kick out of this woman coming on to AB, at first he wasn't into it but as he gauged the crowds reactions, it's like oh well, might as well be a sport.

This video being connected by someone to this tragedy and the other one of Kilroys from the top of the opposite parking garage seem like obvious clues but obvious why?

Well the shot from the parking garage shows people at the door and a bouncer. Does it say that someone could watch people leaving Kilroys
from up there, using a walkie talkie to a partner on the ground?

Let's don't talk about the guy with guns, too scary, I live here. But "ordinary"
citizens could also use that vantage point. Could drug dealers use that vantage point? Sure. You can see every approach to Kilroys from that spot.
Now, I'm not saying this would have anything to do with the actual owners of Kilroys. This would be lowlives taking advantage of a public spot.
Could young people doing/dealing drugs use that spot? again, sure.

Someone's daughter I know jumped from that spot to her death. Someone else got married up there.
Then someone else used it for the start of a video song for Lauren called Dear Lauren. Weird vantage point.

The kissing video just straight out identifies an older crowd of druggies that these kids were hanging out with.

 

[bx2]

keep walking north just about 60 feet and you come to another set of stairs that lead to a walkway between two businesses and then opens into a large,
inner courtyard, I mean large, the entire building encompasses it's square and it has a fountain in the middle. There are inner entrances to the building from this courtyard.

One camera on the left captures the entry to the courtyard (on the right hand side), another looks to be visible in the far corner.

I'm going to make a wild assumption and opinionate that probably most of the cameras at 10th and College were faulty that evening.

It was several years ago now, and certainly a lot fewer then there is now, but the owner of these complexes was diligent to the point of demanding same day repair on cameras in my experience.

 

[Chuz Life]

One camera on the left captures the entry to the courtyard (on the right hand side), another looks to be visible in the far corner.

A camera in that type housing and at that height and angle - even set to it's widest field of view - would only cover the fountain there and about a 25 ft. area around it.

I'm not sure if those are more cameras back there in the corner... if they are they look to be in a different housing and of a different type. If they are the more modern type wide angle cameras, they could cover the entire area but not likely with much detail.

It was several years ago now, and certainly a lot fewer then there is now, but the owner of these complexes was diligent to the point of demanding same day repair on cameras in my experience.

For them to do that (for them to demand same day repair)... that means the cameras would have been checked on -on a daily basis by someone too. We know they were not being watched by any 24 hr. security or anything like that... they would have reacted to some of the things reported.

 

[AbbeyR]

The accounting of those events apparently comes from Zoe Camp herself.



In my opinion, Zoe Camp is the key person in solving the case of Lauren's disappearance.

Bx2 already posted that the 'after 3 am' was a typo that was corrected. LE has confirmed the last time Lauren was seen on video. They have also confirmed that she didn't appear at that location later.

So, I don't really understand how ZC could be meaningful here. I think they probably caught Lauren and Corey buzzing her apt. on surveillance. She didn't answer, so infers she was sleeping. Even if she wasn't, it doesn't make a difference since they did not answer the door...

I thought the timeline posted in the LoHud video made sense.

 

[Ixchel13]

One camera on the left captures the entry to the courtyard (on the right hand side), another looks to be visible in the far corner.



It was several years ago now, and certainly a lot fewer then there is now, but the owner of these complexes was diligent to the point of demanding same day repair on cameras in my experience.

yes Elliot is a good landlord but how about a nightly repair?

 

[Ixchel13]

Bx2 already posted that the 'after 3 am' was a typo that was corrected. LE has confirmed the last time Lauren was seen on video. They have also confirmed that she didn't appear at that location later.

So, I don't really understand how ZC could be meaningful here. I think they probably caught Lauren and Corey buzzing her apt. on surveillance. She didn't answer, so infers she was sleeping. Even if she wasn't, it doesn't make a difference since they did not answer the door...

I thought the timeline posted in the LoHud video made sense.

yeah but I wondered right away at the beginning of these threads who the girls who didn't answer were. But, nothing was forthcoming, til almost 2 years later, Zoe Camp gives an interview, reinserting herself into the situation. Could it be the guilt of knowing JR wasn't the one who hurt Lauren (besides letting her go--unforgivable)? Like we have been saying, someone was bound to crack and IMO, she was the first one to crack. But not all the way. Maybe we can help her with that.:fence: