Is there any possibility of a Plea Deal on the Murder Charges?

[Leila]

The possibility of a plea seems so logical because of the "loss" of all her big deal lawyers (Lyon, Baden, Lee etc) plus the no reports from experts thing. I listened to an old youTube with Greta Van S today..it was from a long time ago. She indicated the Anthony case will be a "slow plea". I googled "slow plea" and I got various answers for what it meant. However, this interview with Greta was prior to the Death Penalty being put on the table, I believe. "Slow Plea" is a legitimate legal term and apparently has to do with pleading not guilty while knowing and acknowledging that a guilty verdict is likely. It also has to do with the Judge being in charge of the sentence instead of jurors(?). Well, it is clear that the "tone" in the courtroom yesterday seemed different than it has in the past. Everyone is thinking that something is afoot. The energy is just really different.
What is afoot?

I was immediately struck with how the overall tone in the courtroom Friday was so much different than in all previous hearings. JB had no snide remarks and both he and CM seemed overly gracious to the state attorneys. Something was very different.

 

[nyvictoria]

DA, you said,

"When I say that the press has nearly everyone convinced that KC is guilty, I am talking about the overall general public, and according to that same press, you will find very few who think KC is innocent. So I think the press has convinced nearly everyone that KC is guilty."

very few think KC is innocent because it is perfectly obvious that she is guilty. the press be damned, or whatever. this is one case where the suspect is screaming at the world " I did it"

by her actions and words.

the press has nothing to do with it.

ITA! It's not the press. It's the evidence.

 

[LambChop]

ITA-there is a world of difference between LWOP and DR. I don't think she has been told what DR is like.

A few facts about DR:

For the most part, she will be in solitary confinement for the rest of her life. She will live in a tiny, unairconditioned cell. She will eat, sleep, and spend almost every moment of the rest of her life a few feet away from a toilet. She will never be able to eat with a fork again or choose what she would like for breakfast, lunch, or dinner.

More from the prison web site:

"A Death Row cell is 6 x 9 x 9.5 feet high"

"Death Row inmates are counted at least once an hour. They are escorted in handcuffs and wear them everywhere except in their cells, the exercise yard and the shower. They are in their cells at all times except for medical reasons, exercise, social or legal visits or media interviews. When a death warrant is signed the inmate is put under Death Watch status and is allowed a legal and social phone call"

"Death Row inmates are served meals three times a day: at 5:00 am, from 10:30 am to 11:00 am and from 4:00 pm to 4:30 pm. Food is prepared by prison staff and transported in insulated carts to the cells. Inmates are allowed plates and spoons to eat their meals."

"The inmates may shower every other day."

"They do not have cable television or air-conditioning and they are not allowed to be with each other in a common room. They can watch church services on closed circuit television. "

http://www.dc.state.fl.us/oth/deathrow/index.html

Virtual tour of a DR cell:

http://www.dc.state.fl.us/oth/vtour/deathrow.html

IMO

Maybe JB should show her on his computer with a virtual tour EXACTLY what it will be like for her if she stays the course. I would think LWOP would be a more likely choice. jmo

 

[LambChop]

Why would a plea even be offered. The death penalty or at the very least LWOP is a slam dunk. There's just too much evidence for premeditated murder, plus the trial will be interesting and boost careers. It will go forward. Even jurors who never followed the circus will have no trouble seeing the premeditation and how the evidence all fits together. The only thing lacking is how she screwed up with ditching the vehicle.

I believe the only plea the state would offer is LWOP so she would only be avoiding the death penalty. For someone as social as KC LWOP is the better deal.

 

[2goldfish]

Maybe JB should show her on his computer with a virtual tour EXACTLY what it will be like for her if she stays the course. I would think LWOP would be a more likely choice. jmo

they're making a stupid mistake operating under the knowledge that death qualified juries do not like to sentence pretty*, young, white, middle class women to death. I also find it unlikely that she will be sentenced to death...but as her attorney, with her behaviour, I'd be very nervous indeed to trust any jury watching her stone cold face for 8 weeks of trial and pin my hopes on what juries typically do or dont do.

her demeanor has always been what will hang her. so to speak. this is not to say that alone makes her a murderer, it's the evidence that shows that...but she doesnt make a sympathetic figure at all.



*(I dont think she's particularly lovely, but compared to some dirty drug addicted monstrosities of parents I've seen convicted, she is)

 

[faefrost]

Well now I suppose, if she wanted, she could still say that the death was accidental and the only reason she used the duct tape was to make it look like a kidnapping. No one would believe it, except the Anthonys themselves, but she sure could claim it!

I don't think she can attempt to plead guilty to lesser charges without an agreement or deal from the state. She can only plea to the charges she is facing and not pick and choose herself.

 

[LiveLaughLuv]

Why would a plea even be offered. The death penalty or at the very least LWOP is a slam dunk. There's just too much evidence for premeditated murder, plus the trial will be interesting and boost careers. It will go forward. Even jurors who never followed the circus will have no trouble seeing the premeditation and how the evidence all fits together. The only thing lacking is how she screwed up with ditching the vehicle.

ITA..It wouldn't be a plea deal but a plea change with the SA's going along with it. She can then have a bench trial and leave the sentencing up to the judge. He's handed down a DP sentence before, so, she'd be treading on thin ice if she can't get the SA's to agree with LWOP. She did the same with the economic charges, at the last minute she changed her plea from NG to Guilty..JMHO

Justice for Caylee

 

[Marshmallow]

I am going to disagree with your statement, very respectfully though. I think KC has adapted very well to jail life. She has learned how to 'correspond' with the other inmates, manipulate a corrections officer or two to get 'special privileges, etc. She is a chameleon in that she takes on whatever persona she thinks will do her the most good.

I am probably in the minority here on WS but I do not think KC will get the DP, she may not even get LWOP. If a plea bargain is agreed to I think it will be something along the lines of 40 to life, time served and eligible for parole after serving a certain percentage of her sentence. If this happens, she will adapt just as well to prison life as she did to jail life. She may not be able to manipulate CO's as easily, but she will morph herself into whatever persona will do her the most good. She will get parole if it is allowed because she will be a model prisoner for the most part, taking classes, maybe even volunteering to help other inmates learn to read, etc. etc. She will become what she needs to be in order to 'enjoy' her enforced vacation. And as someone pointed out here on WS not too long ago - she will be away from CA.

I agree and wanted to add:
she will also be away from responsibility. No need to work, no need to live up to the pressures of equaling everyone else her age. She can spin her lies, become a new person according to who is in her cell block, she won't need to be a working, normail adult woman. She can pretend a life in her head without pressure to actually live. She will have her admirerers who send her notes and money, her "dates" with legal staff and even though it will seem as though she has no control over her life she will still be able to control the biggest part .. contact with her Mother.

 

[Macushla]

I don't think she can attempt to plead guilty to lesser charges without an agreement or deal from the state. She can only plea to the charges she is facing and not pick and choose herself.

What do you think of the possibility of pleading guilty to some of the charges, lying to LE, child abuse, in return for reducing the main charge to something like aggravated manslaughter? If the plea included maximum sentences for all the lesser charges to be served consecutively, do you think the State might be interested in something like that to save the poor debt ridden, bankrupt state of Florida some money?

 

[ZsaZsa]

What do you think of the possibility of pleading guilty to some of the charges, lying to LE, child abuse, in return for reducing the main charge to something like aggravated manslaughter? If the plea included maximum sentences for all the lesser charges to be served consecutively, do you think the State might be interested in something like that to save the poor debt ridden, bankrupt state of Florida some money?

Aaaagh! I sincerely hope not.

 

[ZsaZsa]

Well now I suppose, if she wanted, she could still say that the death was accidental and the only reason she used the duct tape was to make it look like a kidnapping. No one would believe it, except the Anthonys themselves, but she sure could claim it!

But, if that is what really happened then logic tells us she would have told someone (? Baez) before now, in order to avoid punishment. She knows it won't fly, or she would have tried it..
She put duct tape over Caylee's mouth and nose so tightly that 6 months and a hurricane later it was still in place.

 

[LolaMoon08]

I don't feel comfortable with Casey EVER getting out of prison. Just because she will be in her 70's doesn't mean that she would not be capable of murder. I've seen my share of cases where seemingly sweet, innocent, old ladies commit vicious murders. I don't think age has anything to do with the capabilities of murder... a murderer is a murderer and I believe Casey is very capable of murdering again... at any age.

Cindy Anthony is only 17-years-shy of being 70-years-old. This does not make me feel any more comfortable knowing that Casey may ever get out of prison. If Cindy can behave the way she has (sending DC out into those woods, obstructing justice, etc...), in her 50's... what is going to change in 17-years when she is 70? They are the way they are... they are not going to change for anyone.

Now, if Casey does get LWOP and she goes on to live a productive life behind those prison walls, barbed wire fences, etc... well good for her. Susan Smith did it... but it doesn't take away the fact that these two women are murderers and should never be set free.

MOO

 

[beach]

My feelings are so mixed on this, I don't even know where to begin.

I finally got a chance to watch the hearing last night. I agree the tone was different, however I am not ready to fully accept it is because a plea deal is in the works.

My thoughts about a possible plea deal: Considering it appears the defense experts have come up with pretty much nothing to refute the forensic reports of the SA experts, the defense would not be doing their job if they didn't at least consider approaching the SA to see if they could come to terms. However, there are a lot of bridges to cross between initiating talks about a plea deal and everyone coming to terms. For the State: Lawson Lamar, LDB, JA and Frank George. For the Defense: CM, JB, and Casey. (And though Cindy has no legal right, I'm not sure Casey would make such a pivotal decision w/o consulting her. "Mama's always covered for me before... one more shot at helping me figure out a way out of this big one".) Forget Cindy for now, all those attorneys would need to agree on terms and then they would have to convince Casey to agree. This isn't like the check fraud case. The stakes are MUCH, MUCH higher. What kind of terms would the defense be requesting? How much is the SA willing to bend? The SA has an extremely strong case, so IMO they hold the aces, iykwim. They could be miles apart or they could be close enough to maybe work things out. It is anybody's guess.

My thoughts about the tone of the hearing: It was definetly different. My impression was the main difference is that both CM and JB were far more professional. No smirking, more respectful toward the bench and no pot shots hurled toward opposing counsel. And yes, I saw the "friendliness" displayed between both sides. I realize how foreign that seems to us who have watched so many of these hearings, but frankly, what I saw is how most opposing sides behave toward each other in a "normal" courtroom setting. I fully realize it is a total 180° from what we are used to seeing from the defense.

I feel there could be a multitude of reasons the tone was different besides just assuming it could be a plea deal, which is a possibility. But it could be many other things, too, imo. First and foremost, I noticed that CM seems to be taking a more active role with JB riding shotgun, instead of the other way around. Maybe Judge Perry had a "come to meet Jesus" with them after the sanctions fiasco and made some strong "suggestions". The last thing you would want to do is ignore a judge's "strong suggestion" after you've already been hit with sanctions and you just filed a motion for reconsideration. I feel certain that CM stepping to the forefront would please Judge Perry (for obvious reasons) and probably make CM happy too.

There have been several sidebars between the SA sanctions/JJ motions hearing and the recent status hearing - all of which were "on the record", per HHJP's instruction. It's my hunch that one of the things Judge Perry did was make it abundantly clear...No, I'll use an even stronger word...I think he implored both sides to start working together in a more civil manner through whatever means necessary - be it working out a plea, exchanging specific discovery ordered by the deadlines, completing depos....WHATEVER - I think the message was "Get on with it and act like civil professionals while doing it." HHJP's job is to keep this train moving forward & running on schedule to meet a May trial date. Judge Perry is not about to let some attorneys dictate the schedule and cause unnecessary delays.

As to the hearing itself, I did not read as much "between the lines" as some have suggested. Not saying I am right and anyone is wrong, I just saw it differently. I saw Judge Perry advising the attorneys of how voir dire was going to be conducted, in a trial of this magnitude (media, out-of town selection, etc..). HHJP is prepping for trial. If they can work out a plea in the meantime, so be it. But he's gonna be ready for trial and wants both sides to know exactly what to expect and to prepare any objections.

Just my humble opinion.

 

[Pondering Mind]

ITA-there is a world of difference between LWOP and DR. I don't think she has been told what DR is like.

A few facts about DR:

For the most part, she will be in solitary confinement for the rest of her life. She will live in a tiny, unairconditioned cell. She will eat, sleep, and spend almost every moment of the rest of her life a few feet away from a toilet. She will never be able to eat with a fork again or choose what she would like for breakfast, lunch, or dinner.

More from the prison web site:

"A Death Row cell is 6 x 9 x 9.5 feet high"

"Death Row inmates are counted at least once an hour. They are escorted in handcuffs and wear them everywhere except in their cells, the exercise yard and the shower. They are in their cells at all times except for medical reasons, exercise, social or legal visits or media interviews. When a death warrant is signed the inmate is put under Death Watch status and is allowed a legal and social phone call"

"Death Row inmates are served meals three times a day: at 5:00 am, from 10:30 am to 11:00 am and from 4:00 pm to 4:30 pm. Food is prepared by prison staff and transported in insulated carts to the cells. Inmates are allowed plates and spoons to eat their meals."

"The inmates may shower every other day."

"They do not have cable television or air-conditioning and they are not allowed to be with each other in a common room. They can watch church services on closed circuit television. "

http://www.dc.state.fl.us/oth/deathrow/index.html

Virtual tour of a DR cell:

http://www.dc.state.fl.us/oth/vtour/deathrow.html

IMO

I must say I believe that Baez is a fool if he doesn't at least try to get ICA some kind of deal..

That said..What you posted above sounds perfect for ICA, it's much more than what she gave poor Caylee, imo..

 

[chefmom]

ITA-there is a world of difference between LWOP and DR. I don't think she has been told what DR is like.

A few facts about DR:

For the most part, she will be in solitary confinement for the rest of her life. She will live in a tiny, unairconditioned cell. She will eat, sleep, and spend almost every moment of the rest of her life a few feet away from a toilet. She will never be able to eat with a fork again or choose what she would like for breakfast, lunch, or dinner.

More from the prison web site:

"A Death Row cell is 6 x 9 x 9.5 feet high"

"Death Row inmates are counted at least once an hour. They are escorted in handcuffs and wear them everywhere except in their cells, the exercise yard and the shower. They are in their cells at all times except for medical reasons, exercise, social or legal visits or media interviews. When a death warrant is signed the inmate is put under Death Watch status and is allowed a legal and social phone call"

"Death Row inmates are served meals three times a day: at 5:00 am, from 10:30 am to 11:00 am and from 4:00 pm to 4:30 pm. Food is prepared by prison staff and transported in insulated carts to the cells. Inmates are allowed plates and spoons to eat their meals."

"The inmates may shower every other day."

"They do not have cable television or air-conditioning and they are not allowed to be with each other in a common room. They can watch church services on closed circuit television. "

http://www.dc.state.fl.us/oth/deathrow/index.html

Virtual tour of a DR cell:

http://www.dc.state.fl.us/oth/vtour/deathrow.html

IMO

Thank you for this, Jon! See, this is exactly what I want for KC. If she was capable of murdering her 2 yo daughter, duct taping her mouth and nose, shoving her lifeless body into 1,2,3 bags, and then dumping her body off of the side of the road into a swampy, wooded area down the road from her home, and then proceed to her current squeezes apartment where she hooked up with him and headed off to Blockbusters for an evening of murder/kidnapping movies and some carefree "bella vida", then she deserves nothing but this until she receives the needle. JMO.

 

[Sooner Fan#1]

It is my firm belief that KC will make a last minute Plea and this will never go to trial, unfortunately. I hope I am wrong, as I want to see KC squirm when she hears some of the testimony. I truly hope JB has told her the truth about how bad this is going to get. I especially want to see her reaction when TL testifies. That has been my belief from the beginning. :sick:

 

[krisskross]

I dont think Casey Anthony will ever plea or admit what she did. I say this because I believe she is a text book narcisistic sociopath. History shows these types rarely confess if the system gives them the slightest hope of beating the charges. moo

 

[Sooner Fan#1]

I dont think Casey Anthony will ever plea or admit what she did. I say this because I believe she is a text book narcisistic sociopath. History shows these types rarely confess if the system gives them the slightest hope of beating the charges. moo

:blowkiss: I SO hope you are right!....I will be really upset if we don't get to see this trial!!

 

[LinasK]

Why would a plea even be offered. The death penalty or at the very least LWOP is a slam dunk. There's just too much evidence for premeditated murder, plus the trial will be interesting and boost careers. It will go forward. Even jurors who never followed the circus will have no trouble seeing the premeditation and how the evidence all fits together. The only thing lacking is how she screwed up with ditching the vehicle.

I totally agree- there seems to be this mass hysteria on this forum concerned with what Casey would do or should do- but the bottom line is, is it's NOT up to her- there is absolutely NO reason for the prosecution to offer her a plea deal nor agree to one, and her pleading guilty will not get her off the hook, she can still get sentenced to death, so all it does it spare a trial, which I can't see Casey turning down the publicity, nor admitting guilt!!!
People are forgetting about Scott Peterson, he took it all the way to trial in the face of obvious guilt, and when he was led away to Death Row, claimed he was "jazzed to be going to a historic building site" or words to that effect. His family is still pleading his innocence!

 

[Sooner Fan#1]

In an Alford Plea, the criminal defendant does not admit the act, but admits that the prosecution could likely prove the charge. The court will pronounce the defendant guilty. The defendant may plead guilty yet not admit all the facts that comprise the crime. An Alford plea allows defendant to plead guilty even while unable or unwilling to admit guilt. One example is a situation where the defendant has no recollection of the pertinent events due to intoxication or amnesia. A defendant making an Alford plea maintains his innocence of the offense charged. One reason for making such a plea may be to avoid being convicted on a more serious charge.