Israel - Palestinian militants launch massive attack, 7 Oct 2023 #13

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Oh jeez...

MOO: I'm sure this means "Empty the prisons". They are convinced that Israel will empty the prisons in exchange for soldiers. MOO

I hope this doesn't happen.
Israel has already said that they will extend the ceasefire in order to return more hostages to Israel, but Israel has capped the number of criminals they will release from prison to 300.
 

A world away from Gaza, Palestinian Americans in this New Jersey community hold their breath​


“You haven’t checked your phone yet,” Mustafa’s sister said, “have you?”
“I spent the next three hours on my phone, crying uncontrollably,” Mustafa recalled to CNN. “Because I knew what was to come. And I just couldn’t – all I could think of was that, like, so many people are gonna get killed now. That’s all I could think. I’m like, this is gonna be horrible.” Noreen Rashid, a 21-year-old who like Mustafa grew up in New Jersey, had a similar reaction to news of the Hamas attack, she told CNN. She wondered what it would mean, in turn, for her parents’ families in Gaza. “I knew that, whatever the repercussions were going to be, were going to be hell,” she said.

Her family lives in that hell now. Six of her family members have been killed in Gaza, Rashid told CNN. Among them were her little cousins, 12-year-old Nouran Allouh and 10-year-old Razan Allouh — two of the more than 4,700 children killed in Gaza since October 7, per the Palestinian Health Ministry in Ramallah, which draws its figures from sources in Hamas-run Gaza.

It’s unclear how exactly the girls were killed, Rashid said, but they had stepped out to fill a bucket of water to use as a shower when the family heard a noise — a sniper, they believe — and looked out to see the sisters lying dead on the ground.

Their father Ahmad Allouh “lived for his daughters,” Rashid said, describing him as headstrong and firm, a protector – the kind of man who built his daughters’ bedroom furniture himself. Their killings cast him immediately into a state Rashid’s grandmother likened to a psychosis, the 21-year-old told CNN.

Despite his family’s pleas, Rashid’s uncle went outside to cover his daughters’ bodies, she said. And he lay down between them to say goodbye.

“And then they shot him,” Rashid told CNN. “They killed all three of them.”

View attachment 464170

Her reaction was so many people were going to be killed. This seems to relate to her seeing what Hamas did on October 7th right? Hamas should have known the same thing would happen and it did. Hamas is responsible for what happened following their attack IMHO. I am so sorry she has lost loved ones. I am not convinced Israel soldiers shot 2 young girls to death. Perhaps they were caught in crossfire or Hamas shot them. We don’t know.
 

A world away from Gaza, Palestinian Americans in this New Jersey community hold their breath​


“You haven’t checked your phone yet,” Mustafa’s sister said, “have you?”
“I spent the next three hours on my phone, crying uncontrollably,” Mustafa recalled to CNN. “Because I knew what was to come. And I just couldn’t – all I could think of was that, like, so many people are gonna get killed now. That’s all I could think. I’m like, this is gonna be horrible.” Noreen Rashid, a 21-year-old who like Mustafa grew up in New Jersey, had a similar reaction to news of the Hamas attack, she told CNN. She wondered what it would mean, in turn, for her parents’ families in Gaza. “I knew that, whatever the repercussions were going to be, were going to be hell,” she said.

Her family lives in that hell now. Six of her family members have been killed in Gaza, Rashid told CNN. Among them were her little cousins, 12-year-old Nouran Allouh and 10-year-old Razan Allouh — two of the more than 4,700 children killed in Gaza since October 7, per the Palestinian Health Ministry in Ramallah, which draws its figures from sources in Hamas-run Gaza.

It’s unclear how exactly the girls were killed, Rashid said, but they had stepped out to fill a bucket of water to use as a shower when the family heard a noise — a sniper, they believe — and looked out to see the sisters lying dead on the ground.

Their father Ahmad Allouh “lived for his daughters,” Rashid said, describing him as headstrong and firm, a protector – the kind of man who built his daughters’ bedroom furniture himself. Their killings cast him immediately into a state Rashid’s grandmother likened to a psychosis, the 21-year-old told CNN.

Despite his family’s pleas, Rashid’s uncle went outside to cover his daughters’ bodies, she said. And he lay down between them to say goodbye.

“And then they shot him,” Rashid told CNN. “They killed all three of them.”

View attachment 464170

That's quite a big story. Two little girls, age 10 and 12, were told to walk into an active war zone with a bucket to get water so they could take a shower. Their father, who "lived for his daughters" remained safely in their house.

What aren't we being told? Was there a tunnel or a weapons stash under the children's beds? The children ventured out of their homes into an active shooting scenario because they wanted to take a shower? Didn't anyone in the family think that was a bad idea? Hamas snipers shoot Israeli and Gaza citizens. Have the bullets been collected and identified?
 
Israel did not invade Gaza until October 27th. (Couldn't access the original post)
Not sure how the damage occurred Oct 13th. Could it have been hamas? Moo

On the evening of 27 October 2023, the Israel Defense Forces (IDF) launched a large-scale invasion[16][17] inside the Gaza Strip, as part of the 2023 Israel–Hamas war, with the stated goal of destroying Hamas and overthrowing it.[18]
107313220-1696706613812-gettyimages-1712236302-AFP_33XQ74A.jpeg

What happened to the aerial bombardment that started on October 7th?

This image is from October 7th Israel retaliates after Hamas attacks, deaths pass 1,100

It declared war on Gaza on October 7th. It started bombing Gaza on October 7th. Do you know how much damage aerial bombardment can do? Israel ordered evacuations from North to South Gaza on October 12

However, it did not provide safe passages for evacuation from N-S until Nov 9th when it agreed to four hour pauses. (see wikipedia link below)

This is from October 7th: https://www.npr.org/2023/10/07/1204...-strikes-on-gaza-after-hamas-surprise-attacks

This is from October 9th


Israeli forces launched unrelenting airstrikes into the densely populated Gaza Strip on Monday with the aim of rooting out Hamas forces, Israel Defense Forces spokesman Jonathan Conricus said Monday night local time.

The airstrikes continued for 10 hours Monday, as Israeli forces react so "Hamas won't be able to strike Israeli civilians ever again," Conricus said his video update.

Timeline is edited to remove things about Hezbollah, West Bank, Syria, Houthi's, comments from United States, visits from the US, comments from the Pope etc

8 October​

  • Israel formally declared a state of war under Article 40A for the first time since the 1973 Yom Kippur War.[18] 300,000 reservists are called up, the most in the nation's history. Its declared aim is to eliminate Hamas's military capabilities and end its rule over the Gaza Strip.[19]

9 October​


  • Defense Minister Yoav Gallant announced a "total" blockade of the Gaza Strip that would cut electricity and block the entry of food and fuel, adding that "We are fighting human animals and we are acting accordingly."[27]
  • The IAF deployed C-130 and C-130J heavy transport planes across Europe to collect hundreds of off-duty IDF personnel to be deployed in the conflict.[28]

10 October​

11 October​

12 October​

  • The IAF attacked more than 200 targets in Gaza.

13 October​

  • Gazans began fleeing to the south of the enclave (de facto beyond Wadi Gaza)[48] after an IDF warning the day before of combat operations of 24 hours notice. The UN, warning of a humanitarian catastrophe, urged[49] Israel to rescind its evacuation order,[50] as did Amnesty International.[51]
  • An evacuation route on Salah al-Din street was bombed; the Gaza health ministry claimed 70 dead.[52]
  • The IDF launched localized raids on Hamas cells.[55]
 
Last edited:
107313220-1696706613812-gettyimages-1712236302-AFP_33XQ74A.jpeg

What happened to the aerial bombardment that started on October 7th?

This image is from October 7th Israel retaliates after Hamas attacks, deaths pass 1,100

It declared war on Gaza on October 7th. It started bombing Gaza on October 7th. Do you know how much damage aerial bombardment can do? Israel ordered evacuations from North to South Gaza on October 12

This is from October 7th: https://www.npr.org/2023/10/07/1204...-strikes-on-gaza-after-hamas-surprise-attacks

This is from October 9th


Israeli forces launched unrelenting airstrikes into the densely populated Gaza Strip on Monday with the aim of rooting out Hamas forces, Israel Defense Forces spokesman Jonathan Conricus said Monday night local time.

The airstrikes continued for 10 hours Monday, as Israeli forces react so "Hamas won't be able to strike Israeli civilians ever again," Conricus said his video update.

8 October​

  • Israel formally declared a state of war under Article 40A for the first time since the 1973 Yom Kippur War.[18] 300,000 reservists are called up, the most in the nation's history. Its declared aim is to eliminate Hamas's military capabilities and end its rule over the Gaza Strip.[19]

9 October​


  • Defense Minister Yoav Gallant announced a "total" blockade of the Gaza Strip that would cut electricity and block the entry of food and fuel, adding that "We are fighting human animals and we are acting accordingly."[27]
  • The IAF deployed C-130 and C-130J heavy transport planes across Europe to collect hundreds of off-duty IDF personnel to be deployed in the conflict.[28]

10 October​

11 October​

12 October​

  • The IAF attacked more than 200 targets in Gaza.

13 October​

  • Gazans began fleeing to the south of the enclave (de facto beyond Wadi Gaza)[48] after an IDF warning the day before of combat operations of 24 hours notice. The UN, warning of a humanitarian catastrophe, urged[49] Israel to rescind its evacuation order,[50] as did Amnesty International.[51]
  • An evacuation route on Salah al-Din street was bombed; the Gaza health ministry claimed 70 dead.[52]
  • The IDF launched localized raids on Hamas cells.[55]
That demonstrates that Gaza started telling tall tales about running of fuel early on! What else were they fibbing about?
 
Here is another article that explains how not everyone was able to evacuate:

Wounded patients left at Gaza’s al-Shifa Hospital face dire conditions​


View attachment 464177
From your article
The Israeli army ordered an evacuation of Gaza’s largest medical facility on November 18, but it was not possible to evacuate all the patients, as for some, an evacuation would have presented high health risks.

Why would any medical professional believe it a good idea to place high-risk patients, in what appears to be a parking lot, with no overhead shelter? This is less dangerous that evacuating?

No, hamas will not allow this facility to be fully evaluated. Moo

IDF, RC, IRC evacuated all the patients except the high risk, sitting in the open.
(per article)
 
107313220-1696706613812-gettyimages-1712236302-AFP_33XQ74A.jpeg

What happened to the aerial bombardment that started on October 7th?

This image is from October 7th Israel retaliates after Hamas attacks, deaths pass 1,100

It declared war on Gaza on October 7th. It started bombing Gaza on October 7th. Do you know how much damage aerial bombardment can do? Israel ordered evacuations from North to South Gaza on October 12

This is from October 7th: https://www.npr.org/2023/10/07/1204...-strikes-on-gaza-after-hamas-surprise-attacks

This is from October 9th


Israeli forces launched unrelenting airstrikes into the densely populated Gaza Strip on Monday with the aim of rooting out Hamas forces, Israel Defense Forces spokesman Jonathan Conricus said Monday night local time.

The airstrikes continued for 10 hours Monday, as Israeli forces react so "Hamas won't be able to strike Israeli civilians ever again," Conricus said his video update.

timeline is edited to remove things about Hezbollah, West Bank, visits from United States etc.

8 October​

  • Israel formally declared a state of war under Article 40A for the first time since the 1973 Yom Kippur War.[18] 300,000 reservists are called up, the most in the nation's history. Its declared aim is to eliminate Hamas's military capabilities and end its rule over the Gaza Strip.[19]

9 October​


  • Defense Minister Yoav Gallant announced a "total" blockade of the Gaza Strip that would cut electricity and block the entry of food and fuel, adding that "We are fighting human animals and we are acting accordingly."[27]
  • The IAF deployed C-130 and C-130J heavy transport planes across Europe to collect hundreds of off-duty IDF personnel to be deployed in the conflict.[28]

10 October​

11 October​

12 October​

  • The IAF attacked more than 200 targets in Gaza.

13 October​

  • Gazans began fleeing to the south of the enclave (de facto beyond Wadi Gaza)[48] after an IDF warning the day before of combat operations of 24 hours notice. The UN, warning of a humanitarian catastrophe, urged[49] Israel to rescind its evacuation order,[50] as did Amnesty International.[51]
  • An evacuation route on Salah al-Din street was bombed; the Gaza health ministry claimed 70 dead.[52]
  • The IDF launched localized raids on Hamas cells.[55]
The entire time all of this was going on, HAMAS was firing rockets at Israel. Does Israel just not respond at all? Not try to take out the rocket launchers? Not try to hit military targets were they know rockets are coming from?

I really would love to know how else Israel could have handled this?

Were they supposed to continue to allow rockets to be fired at their country and just do nothing? If I recall correctly (I'll look to verify this number) 12 hours Israel endured HAMAS carrying out it's attack before they ran back to their hiding spots in Gaza and they still were firing rockets into Israel.

Do we just think a country attacked like that should do nothing? Not fire back? Not try to stop the rockets from being fired into their country at innocent civilians? Not try to take out the weapons before they can be fired? Not try to take out the terrorists before they can fire the weapons?
 
"Piers, stop asking her to condemn October 7th when she is borderline a terrorist herself."Emily Austin cuts in as Piers Morgan asks Nerdeen Kiswani about the Hamas attacks.

'nov 27, 2023 #piersmorgan #palestine #israel
Piers Morgan Uncensored is joined by journalist and author Emily Austin as well as founder of Palestinian-led organisation Within Our Lifetime Nerdeen Kiswani for a heated debate over the Israel-Palestine conflict, the condemnation of both Israel and Hamas and the possibility of a pathway to peace.Nerdeen suggests she cannot believe Emily is sympathising and defending an organisation that has killed over 6,000 Palestinian children in their fight against Hamas.Piers asks Nerdeen a few times if she condemns Hamas, before Emily jumps in to suggest that of course Nerdeen wouldn't condemn a terrorist organisation when "she is a borderline terrorist herself".
 
The entire time all of this was going on, HAMAS was firing rockets at Israel. Does Israel just not respond at all? Not try to take out the rocket launchers? Not try to hit military targets were they know rockets are coming from?

I really would love to know how else Israel could have handled this?

Were they supposed to continue to allow rockets to be fired at their country and just do nothing? If I recall correctly (I'll look to verify this number) 12 hours Israel endured HAMAS carrying out it's attack before they ran back to their hiding spots in Gaza and they still were firing rockets into Israel.

Do we just think a country attacked like that should do nothing? Not fire back? Not try to stop the rockets from being fired into their country at innocent civilians? Not try to take out the weapons before they can be fired? Not try to take out the terrorists before they can fire the weapons?
I was countering something else. I was countering a claim that all injured could just go to Egypt instead of Gaza's hospitals. I'm trying to show that plenty were injured before the ground war began and before they could go to Egypt starting on Oct 31st. Blaming full hospitals and injured on people who would not go to Egypt or evacuate isn't accurate.
 
107313220-1696706613812-gettyimages-1712236302-AFP_33XQ74A.jpeg

What happened to the aerial bombardment that started on October 7th?

This image is from October 7th Israel retaliates after Hamas attacks, deaths pass 1,100

It declared war on Gaza on October 7th. It started bombing Gaza on October 7th. Do you know how much damage aerial bombardment can do? Israel ordered evacuations from North to South Gaza on October 12

However, it did not provide safe passages for evacuation from N-S until Nov 9th. (see wikipedia link below)

This is from October 7th: https://www.npr.org/2023/10/07/1204...-strikes-on-gaza-after-hamas-surprise-attacks

This is from October 9th


Israeli forces launched unrelenting airstrikes into the densely populated Gaza Strip on Monday with the aim of rooting out Hamas forces, Israel Defense Forces spokesman Jonathan Conricus said Monday night local time.

The airstrikes continued for 10 hours Monday, as Israeli forces react so "Hamas won't be able to strike Israeli civilians ever again," Conricus said his video update.

Timeline is edited to remove things about Hezbollah, West Bank, Syria, Houthi's, comments from United States, visits from the US, comments from the Pope etc

8 October​

  • Israel formally declared a state of war under Article 40A for the first time since the 1973 Yom Kippur War.[18] 300,000 reservists are called up, the most in the nation's history. Its declared aim is to eliminate Hamas's military capabilities and end its rule over the Gaza Strip.[19]

9 October​


  • Defense Minister Yoav Gallant announced a "total" blockade of the Gaza Strip that would cut electricity and block the entry of food and fuel, adding that "We are fighting human animals and we are acting accordingly."[27]
  • The IAF deployed C-130 and C-130J heavy transport planes across Europe to collect hundreds of off-duty IDF personnel to be deployed in the conflict.[28]

10 October​

11 October​

12 October​

  • The IAF attacked more than 200 targets in Gaza.

13 October​

  • Gazans began fleeing to the south of the enclave (de facto beyond Wadi Gaza)[48] after an IDF warning the day before of combat operations of 24 hours notice. The UN, warning of a humanitarian catastrophe, urged[49] Israel to rescind its evacuation order,[50] as did Amnesty International.[51]
  • An evacuation route on Salah al-Din street was bombed; the Gaza health ministry claimed 70 dead.[52]
  • The IDF launched localized raids on Hamas cells.[55]
Well, I certainly didn't read far enough. Apologies, the 27th must be the
107313220-1696706613812-gettyimages-1712236302-AFP_33XQ74A.jpeg

What happened to the aerial bombardment that started on October 7th?

This image is from October 7th Israel retaliates after Hamas attacks, deaths pass 1,100

It declared war on Gaza on October 7th. It started bombing Gaza on October 7th. Do you know how much damage aerial bombardment can do? Israel ordered evacuations from North to South Gaza on October 12

However, it did not provide safe passages for evacuation from N-S until Nov 9th when it agreed to four hour pauses. (see wikipedia link below)

This is from October 7th: https://www.npr.org/2023/10/07/1204...-strikes-on-gaza-after-hamas-surprise-attacks

This is from October 9th


Israeli forces launched unrelenting airstrikes into the densely populated Gaza Strip on Monday with the aim of rooting out Hamas forces, Israel Defense Forces spokesman Jonathan Conricus said Monday night local time.

The airstrikes continued for 10 hours Monday, as Israeli forces react so "Hamas won't be able to strike Israeli civilians ever again," Conricus said his video update.

Timeline is edited to remove things about Hezbollah, West Bank, Syria, Houthi's, comments from United States, visits from the US, comments from the Pope etc

8 October​

  • Israel formally declared a state of war under Article 40A for the first time since the 1973 Yom Kippur War.[18] 300,000 reservists are called up, the most in the nation's history. Its declared aim is to eliminate Hamas's military capabilities and end its rule over the Gaza Strip.[19]

9 October​


  • Defense Minister Yoav Gallant announced a "total" blockade of the Gaza Strip that would cut electricity and block the entry of food and fuel, adding that "We are fighting human animals and we are acting accordingly."[27]
  • The IAF deployed C-130 and C-130J heavy transport planes across Europe to collect hundreds of off-duty IDF personnel to be deployed in the conflict.[28]

10 October​

11 October​

12 October​

  • The IAF attacked more than 200 targets in Gaza.

13 October​

  • Gazans began fleeing to the south of the enclave (de facto beyond Wadi Gaza)[48] after an IDF warning the day before of combat operations of 24 hours notice. The UN, warning of a humanitarian catastrophe, urged[49] Israel to rescind its evacuation order,[50] as did Amnesty International.[51]
  • An evacuation route on Salah al-Din street was bombed; the Gaza health ministry claimed 70 dead.[52]
  • The IDF launched localized raids on Hamas cells.[55]
You are correct. I should have looked at the timeline. I just keep seeing the 27th day, which was the invasion.
My apologies
 
I was countering something else. I was countering a claim that all injured could just go to Egypt instead of Gaza's hospitals. I'm trying to show that plenty were injured before the ground war began and before they could go to Egypt starting on Oct 31st. Blaming full hospitals and injured on people who would not go to Egypt or evacuate isn't accurate.
Do you have a number for the injured non-combatants from IDF aerial attacks in Northern Gaza from Oct 7th to Oct 12th?
 
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