JLM: Morgan Harrington/Fairfax Rape Victim - *Forensic Link* to MH #2

[ksj3]

OT but I am confused
Is there a search thread I am missing?
I see Search and Search 2 but both are locked

(OT - I know this doesn't belong here, but Bessie is probably moving appropriate posts from Search 1 to Search 2. There was a time lag on another one between closing one and opening a new one. What a job she has keeping up with all of this (and us, figuring out where posts get moved to)! Thanks, Bessie!)

 

[Moonchime]

How on earth can anyone know from viewing those remains, which are described as "skeletal" that MH did not live long after being abducted? The bones were all broken, but the body was found out in a field where tractors could have run over it with that tall grass hiding it. Damages could have been done AFTER Morgan was killed, not before. Also, he could have beaten her up terribly without killing her and left her in nearly dead, very bad condition. This article makes no sense at all. You can't tell from a skeleton lying out in field for months exactly when that person died, exact to even a week. Unless there was more there than just the skeleton, I don't even know where there could be DNA--maybe the hair, maybe nails left, maybe clothes left? No organs, flesh were left is what "skeletal" usually means.

How long is "long"?

My thoughts on this lean toward thinking that Morgan's clothes from that night were around her remains--except for the Pantera tee. Her hair was also there. (Morgan's Mom once mentioned that the nearby birds may have collected some strands of her hair for their nests) The spot at which her remains were located were so far out of the way that no tractors ever went up there. It was only after a huge storm that Anchorage Farm owner Mr. Bass went up there to check his fencing when he found Morgan's remains. He was in such shock that he walked more than a mile back to his farmhouse to call LE. He left the tractor up there.

LE said that the person who left MH's remains in that spot didn't expect for her to ever be found.

 

[Sin City]

Wondering how JM knew that farm area so well! Everyone with access to that farm was interviewed. Mr Bass allowed only a small number of people to hunt there. Just found this article regarding trespassing. http://www.newsplex.com/home/headlines/83076192.html

My thoughts on this lean toward thinking that Morgan's clothes from that night were around her remains--except for the Pantera tee. Her hair was also there. (Morgan's Mom once mentioned that the nearby birds may have collected some strands of her hair for their nests) The spot at which her remains were located were so far out of the way that no tractors ever went up there. It was only after a huge storm that Anchorage Farm owner Mr. Bass went up there to check his fencing when he found Morgan's remains. He was in such shock that he walked more than a mile back to his farmhouse to call LE. He left the tractor up there.

LE said that the person who left MH's remains in that spot didn't expect for her to ever be found.

 

[junksleuth]

I agree. Most of the time, DAs do not want to combine cases from what I have seen unless it's all the same episode, such as the Loud Music case, where the perp, MD, shot at a van with 4 young men it it and killed one of them. Instead of trying him for each count, against each of the men, the DA took it as an all in one. The case is being retried, as of now, by the way, a portion of it anyways.

It can get too confusing to try to mix both cases in one trial, especially when they are separated in time. Just like this forum did not like mixing the MH case with Hannah Grahams at first because it really did confuse things. Also, if there is a jury that just doesn't work, or the DA did not present the case in a way to get optimal result, the other cases are still available to put the perp away. Usually the strongest case is tried first and if the sentence is such that it would be redundant to try other cases, it often isn't done for financial reasons. IMO, the MH case will be tried regardless, given the parents' involvement in the case. I can't see the Harringtons letting it go, unless JM gets the chair. Even with guaranteed life, they would likely want their daughter's case be tried and justice done for her. That is often an issue with perps have multiple cases.

I don't know how much of "slam dunk" the 2005 rape case would be. So much time has passed. I believe the victim is out of country and it is possible she will not come to testify, and if she does, how much impact would her testimony have? The DNA evidence is what would convict JM if there is a direct match, but I believe the victim would still have to be here for the trial, or is that not the case?

I think the DA gets to choose how to go within constrains of state law.

Offenses can only be tried together if they were or could have been brought under the same indictment. In order for that to happen, they need to be based on the same underlying set of facts.

 

[lillygator]

I thought there was going to be a 2pm update?

 

[Carpooler]

I think the update is for the two young Lyon sisters. Live streaming now.

http://www.wdbj7.com/news/local/watch-livestreaming/22330138

 

[ksj3]

I thought there was going to be a 2pm update?

There was a search updated. Posted in the search thread.

 

[Hyrax]

Offenses can only be tried together if they were or could have been brought under the same indictment. In order for that to happen, they need to be based on the same underlying set of facts.

In Virginia, there does need to be some connection between the offenses, but it's not based on same underlying facts -- it's based on "same transaction" or "common scheme". (And some states are much more expansive in what they allow joined).

Virginia does have another wrinkle, though, in that if two different murders are committed within a three year period, they may be tried together, assuming the judge doesn't find it'd be too prejudicial. That wouldn't apply to Morgan and Hannah, but that doesn't necessarily rule out the possibility they could be tried together. If the cases are similar and "sufficiently idiosyncratic to permit an inference of pattern for purposes of proof, . . . thus tending to establish the probability of a common perpetrator," then they can be considered "common scheme" for purposes of consolidation. See Ferrell v. Commonwealth, 399 SE 2d 614 (VA 1990), which decided that

evidence of other crimes, to qualify for admission as proof of modus operandi, need not bear such an exact resemblance to the crime on trial as to constitute a "signature". Rather, it is sufficient if the other crimes bear "a singular strong resemblance to the pattern of the offense charged." 884 F.2d at 1021 (quoting United States v. Shackleford, 738 F.2d 776, 783 (7th Cir.1984)). That test is met where the other incidents are "sufficiently idiosyncratic to permit an inference of pattern for purposes of proof," id., thus tending to establish the probability of a common perpetrator.

 

[Moonchime]

I think that some things other than just her skeleton were found. I am pretty sure her bracelet was found at the same site. There may have been some remnants of her clothing--although obviously not her shirt.

Yes, this is the bracelet that Morgan was wearing when she was murdered. Look at all of the nooks and crannies for DNA to be. I even wondered if LE had truly given Gil Morgan's bracelet and not kept it in evidence. Gil had said that they both had identical bracelets.

 

[Justice101]

Thanks. I hope that is the case. A match that way would be definitive. I thought the DNA under the fingernails came from that rape vicitm that was linked to MH. I never did read anything that gave the source of where MH's DNA evidence was acquired other than possibly that shirt, but yes, mention was made that in addition to the shirt, somethig was found with the body, but I don't know what.

I am surprised that the DNA from that rape case has not been linked, as a much better sample was gotten. LE was there right away, and the victim was immediately taken care with evidence collected very quickly.

I thought in the MH case that it was determined that there was 2 sets of DNA samples... one from Morgan's nails or body cavity AND one from skin cells left on the Pantera T-shirt that was planted a week later. (PS Morgan DNA was in the T shirt too, of course)

 

[Gypsy Road]

I don't see much of a similarity, other than that it is a big black guy.

Those sketches are not too useful IMO, they utility is limited to a generic look. Part of the problem with them is that memory is plastic, and the process of generating the sketch can alter the memory of the witness through suggestion, so you can never be sure that what comes out in the end is really what the witness remembered at the start.

True in some aspects. However, when I was a victim of a crime I was able to remember many details of what the man looked like. I was asked questions and also shown sketches from books of just noses, lips, hair, eyes, etc... alone. When the sketch was complete - it wasn't completely accurate, but it was a close description. I don't recall anyone suggesting anything to me - other than to look through the drawings of features and choose what I thought was the closest resemblance.

 

[Gypsy Road]

Jm's. Check his Facebook , see if there is anything around the dates of the Metallica concerts etc...

I tried looking last night and I couldn't see anything. His page is locked-down isn't it?

 

[junksleuth]

In Virginia, there does need to be some connection between the offenses, but it's not based on same underlying facts -- it's based on "same transaction" or "common scheme". (And some states are much more expansive in what they allow joined).

Virginia does have another wrinkle, though, in that if two different murders are committed within a three year period, they may be tried together, assuming the judge doesn't find it'd be too prejudicial. That wouldn't apply to Morgan and Hannah, but that doesn't necessarily rule out the possibility they could be tried together. If the cases are similar and "sufficiently idiosyncratic to permit an inference of pattern for purposes of proof, . . . thus tending to establish the probability of a common perpetrator," then they can be considered "common scheme" for purposes of consolidation. See Ferrell v. Commonwealth, 399 SE 2d 614 (VA 1990), where the standard is found to be whether

Thanks for the helpful info. I am a lawyer, but not barred in VA. VA's "common scheme" rule is interesting

 

[J1981]

Was looking for articles re: DNA on MH and came across this terrifying premonition:

"As of right now, the case is unsolved, but Gil Harrington believes that they will find the DNA of their daughter’s killer from his next victim, which is a terrifying thought. That is why she and her husband continue to keep the case alive in the media as best they can — to prevent another murder and another victim."

http://noisecreep.com/morgan-harrington-metallica-interview/?trackback=tsmclip

 

[JohnTate90210]

I suspect the forensic match will be JM's DNA on Morgan's t-shirt. I doubt her body was in good enough shape to provide DNA since they couldn't even really give a cause of death. Another possibility would be finding a trophy he took from her and kept in his apartment that might hold her DNA.

 

[cluciano63]

I tried looking last night and I couldn't see anything. His page is locked-down isn't it?

No but he only has two entries from Oct 2009 that are viewable, both just "adding a friend".

 

[R.U.Kidding!]

I suspect the forensic match will be JM's DNA on Morgan's t-shirt. I doubt her body was in good enough shape to provide DNA since they couldn't even really give a cause of death. Another possibility would be finding a trophy he took from her and kept in his apartment that might hold her DNA.

Hi John,

I think the finger nails do not deteriorate, there could be DNA under her nails or they could have found a hair from him on her body or hair. I think there is more than the T Shirt. I do not think that would be definitive proof of his involvement, it had to be also on her remains to tie him to the crime.

What was actually very lucky for LE was his effort to flee to Texas. That enabled them to get a search warrant and his DNA. That will also keep him from being able to get out on bond.

 

[blefuscu]

I suspect the forensic match will be JM's DNA on Morgan's t-shirt. I doubt her body was in good enough shape to provide DNA since they couldn't even really give a cause of death. Another possibility would be finding a trophy he took from her and kept in his apartment that might hold her DNA.

No they got DNA when they found her body. There was some tissue left when they found it although it was almost completely skeletonised

 

[libby5264]

No they got DNA when they found her body. There was some tissue left when they found it although it was almost completely skeletonised

And they found his DNA on that tissue?

 

[MomHoo]

I'm not ready to assume the link is DNA. Since LE has stated there is a forensic link between JM & MH, but they have not stated that there is a forensic link between JM and MH and the Fairfax victim, (although MH & the Fairfax victim are linked via perp DNA) it leads me to believe the forensic link is likely something else i.e. something unique to MH. Probably many parallel investigations going on behind the scenes. JMO.