Jodi Arias Trial Discussion #8 *may contain graphic and adult content*

[Linda7NJ]

My heart sank after hearing that jurors today asked questions about roommates alibis etc. Really?!!

I hope that prosecutors aren't falling into the Casey Anthony trial trap of assuming that jurors will convict based on the defendant's pathological lies and absence of empathy/moral compass/soul, on and on.

Jodi's lies and lies and lies, the color of cars, the alleged staging of a robbery of a 25 gun, the calls after Travis's death, the dying of her hair, the travels to another man's bed after killing Travis.... none of that, IMO, is proof of her guilt or even core to the case.

If I were the prosecutor, what I would hammer over and over and over again is the timeline provided by photos, and the significance of that timeline. Bottom line, and the key fact in the case, IMO, is that the murder must have been premeditated (however long in advance) because there wasn't enough time for Jodi to run for a gun (AND knife, for g--'s sake) outside the bathroom, whatever Travis did or did not do to her/say to her in the shower after the last photo she took of him alive.

I agree. Keep it as simple as possible.

But I think this case is rather streamlined so far as compared to others I've followed. Prosecution is doing a good job of that. They lay the required foundation, enter evidence boom. Next witness.

They're doing fantastic with proving premeditation IMO.

Hopefully, the jurors will be capable of looking at the totality of evidence and connect the dots in a logical and reasonable way.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[FrayedKnot]

The only reason it matters which wound occurred first is because DP is on the table. The aggravating factor the prosecution is using to seek the death penalty is "murder committed in an especially heinous, cruel or depraved manner" so the State has to prove that Travis was subjected to extreme cruelty.

It behooves the defense to prove the shot came first and Travis likely lost consciousness quickly to circumvent this in my opinion.

Respectfully, I think this is PRECISELY why it matters and why I am loathe to see another "ball drop" like the computer forensics in the CA trial.

That is all I am saying here, is that I hope every single tiny variable is being considered because if not, JA might not get all she deserves.

 

[ftg]

Any theories as to what could have been on the floor matts, so that she had to destroy all 4?

Another thought...I wonder what was going on in the trunk of her rental car? Wouldn't that the trunk be the best place to put bloody evidence that she was going to get rid of? I wonder if JA put the floor matts down in the trunk, placing the evidence on top.

That would actually be one of her smarter moves if she did put the evidence in the trunk... However, I wonder what the koolaid stains are in the car? When the rental car first said he saw what appeared to be koolaid stains.. the first color I thought of was red. So, I wonder if the jury might have also.

Jodi could have only stained one of them for that matter and decided to get rid of all of them.. Who knows with her?? lol

 

[WhoaIsMe]

Just saw some of the jury's questions from today on the trails FB page. Should I feel this anxious about it? It really makes me nervous that they are asking about the roommates after what has been shown of Jodi already in trial. She confessed right? I don't get these questions.

 

[FrayedKnot]

I didn't mean to seem derisive, Frayed, so my apologies. To my mind I have a very clear picture of what occurred that day based in part on ME's testimony, blood analysis, fibers recovered, and even Jodi's accounts. The evidence fits what's in my head but I didn't/don't mean to be rude to those who believe otherwise.

I just can't see the otherwise myself.

I thank you for that. And I enjoy your smart, thoughtful posts.

I am still trying to see how the casing would be in any different condition had it been ejected directly from the gun and splashed onto the puddle, as opposed to it being kicked onto the puddle of blood from where it sat from a gunshot which occurred a minute or so before.

I guess I just cannot see any definitive proof as to sequence from the blood found on the casing. I would think it would cause a splash either way.

 

[Linda7NJ]

I just don't understand why you have to be so dismissive to those of us who are trying to piece together a sequence.

I think it is great that you are 100% in agreement with the ME.

I, however, still have some questions. And I don't think they are stupid or scary or inconsequential. And honestly, I think I haven't posed any alternative scenarios that are ridiculous.

I understand that you think this is "it, done, end of story, whole ball of wax." You keep saying that. That might be your take on it, and that's cool.

But I think it is still allowed that other posters like myself can pose questions and alternate sequences and offer different viewpoints. At least I was under that impression.

Mods, if this is not allowed, please delete. TIA.

Actually, I'm not in complete agreement with the ME.

I'm 97% with him because of the totality of evidence and the odds Travis was conscious, defending himself and crawling down the hallway after being shot in the head are slim to none.

I posted a fantastic link last night a neurologist or a neurosurgeon ( I forget which ) that studied live people that survived a shooting to the frontal lobe. It was long an detailed.

My point was it doesn't matter to the case. IMO







Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[BritsKate]

Respectfully, I think this is PRECISELY why it matters and why I am loathe to see another "ball drop" like the computer forensics in the CA trial.

That is all I am saying here, is that I hope every single tiny variable is being considered because if not, JA might not get all she deserves.

Everyone agrees that we don't want another acquittal. I think it is important to note though that the defense isn't trying, I don't think, to show Travis was conscious and ambulatory when Jodi inflicted the knife wounds and slit his throat. That would fly in the face of diminishing the State's aggravating factor (or so it seems to me).

But that premise is exactly what is being discussed. He was still conscious, still mobile. I do not believe the defense wants to leave that impression at all. (But again I am so not an attorney and it's nearly 4am so is just MOO)

 

[Katprint]

I just don't understand why you have to be so dismissive to those of us who are trying to piece together a sequence.

I think it is great that you are 100% in agreement with the ME.

I, however, still have some questions. And I don't think they are stupid or scary or inconsequential. And honestly, I think I haven't posed any alternative scenarios that are ridiculous.

I understand that you think this is "it, done, end of story, whole ball of wax." You keep saying that. That might be your take on it, and that's cool.

But I think it is still allowed that other posters like myself can pose questions and alternate sequences and offer different viewpoints. At least I was under that impression.

Mods, if this is not allowed, please delete. TIA.

I think the sequence of attacks is relevant because I think that the alternative scenario suggested by the defense, i.e. gunshot in the head prior to stabbing 28 times then slashing his throat, makes any self defense claim even less likely to be successful. It was only ever a "Hail Mary" last ditch effort anyway, after her prior unsuccessful stories of 1) not being there at all then 2) a ski mask-wearing ninja couple did it.

IMO it would be better to spin the Medical Examiner's testimony into a scenario of JA using the knife to try to fend off an attack by TA who was so enraged that he chased after her out of the shower, past the sink, onto the carpeted area and down the hall despite his being naked and bleeding, until JA finally reached her purse then got her gun and shot him. I don't think she could succeed completely with asserting self defense with regard to slashing his throat, but asserting Battered Women's Syndrome (due to extreme fear of him attacking her again in the future) or extreme provocation might be good enough to bring First Degree Murder down to Voluntary Manslaughter or Second Degree Murder, or at least evade the death penalty.

Katprint
Always only my own opinions

 

[ftg]

Here is a copy of the actual court doc and it shows what her charges are.

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/document-preview.aspx?doc_id=109828551

 

[Vhead]

Just saw some of the jury's questions from today on the trails FB page. Should I feel this anxious about it? It really makes me nervous that they are asking about the roommates after what has been shown of Jodi already in trial. She confessed right? I don't get these questions.

I agree! I'm hoping we don't get another Casey Anthony jury. What a nightmare. I'm hoping they just want to be thorough .. She confessed during opening statement .. Right?????


Sent from my iPhone

 

[Linda7NJ]

I just don't understand why you have to be so dismissive to those of us who are trying to piece together a sequence.

I think it is great that you are 100% in agreement with the ME.

I, however, still have some questions. And I don't think they are stupid or scary or inconsequential. And honestly, I think I haven't posed any alternative scenarios that are ridiculous.

I understand that you think this is "it, done, end of story, whole ball of wax." You keep saying that. That might be your take on it, and that's cool.

But I think it is still allowed that other posters like myself can pose questions and alternate sequences and offer different viewpoints. At least I was under that impression.

Mods, if this is not allowed, please delete. TIA.

I think it's scary if that's what the jury is doing. In my post I was speaking of jurors. I've seen it happen time and time again.

Here is irrelevant. Posters can post any theory they want. I really don't care. I sometimes ask what they are basing their opinion on, because I'm honestly curious. Nothing wrong with that either.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[ladonna]

Here is a copy of the actual court doc and it shows what her charges are.

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/document-preview.aspx?doc_id=109828551

The link isn't working...

 

[AZNanaPeg]

After following this case so closely and listening to all the CA references, I purchased an eBook today - "Presumed Guilty" because I didn't follow the CA case at all. So far, 49 pages into the book, I'm already learning things that I didn't know about the case. It's an interesting way to learn information that wasn't presented to the general public during the trial, or as the book says it wasn't. Have any of you read this book before?

 

[FrayedKnot]

I will respond to the post here and not the poster. I am not responsible for the way someone takes my posts. I am actually a very nice person and if my posts seem "mean", perhaps that is something that you are perceiving. Every person posts in a different way. While I realize that I am not one to mince words and sugar coat things, I have been on this site for over 2 years and have not had any problems in the past. We do not "call out" other posters here on the site. We are not to attack posters. So, I ask you to please drop the obvious vendetta against my posts. They are not meant to be to anyone specific unless I post someone. In addition, my signature makes it clear that what I say is my opinion. We are all entitled to our opinion here. I do not say things to people to upset them. That said, I am not responsible for how they are taken by a reader the same way other posts are from other readers

As the MODS have said, if someone has a problem with a post, please alert them or walk away for a while and take a break. That's what I do.

I am sorry that you feel the way that you do, but if you do not like my posts, please...please...put me on ignore. Thank you.

ITA! Thank you!

We are ALL entitled to our own opinions here.

Thanks for saying that! I will feel more comfortable asking questions now that I know they won't get picked on!

Justice for Travis!

 

[AZNanaPeg]

On the facebook page "The State vs. Jodi Arias" someone posted a side by side picture of Andrea Yates and Jodi Arias... the similarities are incredible!!

 

[kscornfed]

So first degree is the only charge and that won't change? Don't they ask for other charges before deliberations sometimes?

I believe this case is charged properly, but if they get one person who can't go that high, it could cost us the ball game.

 

[Linda7NJ]

ITA! Thank you!

We are ALL entitled to our own opinions here.

Thanks for saying that! I will feel more comfortable asking questions now that I know they won't get picked on!

Justice for Travis!

Opinions are for picking, people aren't


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[ftg]

www.docstoc.com/docs/document-preview.aspx?doc_id=109828551

Here you go.. this one does.. Sorry about that.

 

[ftg]

The link isn't working...

Here you go: www.docstoc.com/docs/document-preview.aspx?doc_id=109828551

 

[BritsKate]

So first degree is the only charge and that won't change? Don't they ask for other charges before deliberations sometimes?

I believe this case is charged properly, but if they get one person who can't go that high, it could cost us the ball game.

Bear in mind jurors do not have to agree on premeditation. They just need to agree on 1st degree premeditated OR felony murder. (Essentially they have to discount self defense.)
11 could vote yea on felony with only 1 for premeditated murder and we still have a guilty verdict.