Judge's Order re: OP's Mental Health Eval

[Trooper]

The reason that the size of Oscar’s home was brought forth was to discuss what the reasonable possibility was of Frankie not hearing anything that night, I merely stated the size of his home, it went in other directions from there, for reasons only known to those that took it in other directions.

The size of the home would be germane to the conversation about Frankie, the ill repair (or not) of the under construction home perhaps not so much.

I merely questioned as to whether 8000 sq feet was large.,.. it was then taken in a whole other direction as to the average size home in South Africa, although who could measure that is apparently to remain a mystery.. the thought of some poor civil servant measuring every home in South Africa, then calculating an average size, is an improbable venture.. hardly germane..


Franks job is houseman.. ergo.. the outside stuff. .. gardening, repair, maintenance, upkeep, stacking ladders left up against walls away, cleaning the little pool, hosing the driveway...... .. all germane to Franks appearance on stage..

 

[Trooper]

or.. more germane, indeed, Franks NON appearance on stage..

 

[Zim]

This post may seem out of step with the current topic, but I'm posting it for a WS who sighted an earlier post in Africaans translated into English - which I am now unable to find. The Africaans article described Frank Chiziweni as a 'caretaker and house boy'. However, this article has essentially the same content:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...s-at-Pistorius-home-on-night-of-shooting.html

Oscar Pistorius trial: Malawian housekeeper 'was at Pistorius home on night of shooting' By Aislinn Laing, Johannesburg.

The Malawian housekeeper, Frank Chiziweni, slept in the domestic quarters next to Pistorius's kitchen on the ground floor of his home... he was at home the night OP shot his girlfriend dead, but 'heard nothing'... despite neighbours living up to 170 metres away woken by sounds of an argument, shots and screams, then a man shouting for help...
A policeman confirmed Mr Chiziweni had been sleeping in a room off the kitchen and was awake when they arrived... Police said Frank Chizweni spoke good English, but upon request "What did you hear?” replied: “No, no, no, I didn't hear anything”... Police had been unconvinced by his response: “We were all asking ourselves how he could not have heard anything,” he said...

The relationship of servant and 'master' or 'madam' is complicated...say no more....
BTW I have to say Malawians are awesome !

 

[jay-jay]

It would be a palace to me :floorlaugh: although not my style :shakehead:

Does look quite poky and crappy compared with the neighbours though.

.. poor OP, couldn't even afford a roof :floorlaugh:

I'm actually really amazed by the size of his bedroom .. it's not that much bigger than mine and I live in a tiny little one bed property!

 

[luvmygarden]

I merely questioned as to whether 8000 sq feet was large.,.. it was then taken in a whole other direction as to the average size home in South Africa, although who could measure that is apparently to remain a mystery.. the thought of some poor civil servant measuring every home in South Africa, then calculating an average size, is an improbable venture.. hardly germane..


Franks job is houseman.. ergo.. the outside stuff. .. gardening, repair, maintenance, upkeep, stacking ladders left up against walls away, cleaning the little pool, hosing the driveway...... .. all germane to Franks appearance on stage..

Maybe I am overly suspicious but could OP'S TRIP downstairs to supposedly open the door also be to awake Frank to haul out the ladder to make his intruder story feasible? If he heard nothing what woke him and how was he present so fast on the scene? Something is amiss with this part of the night.

 

[Suthrnqt]

Adjourned till June 30th?
What will we do? sigh

 

[luvmygarden]

I would like to know if the first time Frank saw OP if he saw blood on him or not. That would tell if Op's story about retrieving Reeva right away or taking care of things first was true. Frank has a few things to offer as far as time line very close to the time OP shot and killed Reeva.

 

[Trooper]

Maybe I am overly suspicious but could OP'S TRIP downstairs to supposedly open the door also be to awake Frank to haul out the ladder to make his intruder story feasible? If he heard nothing what woke him and how was he present so fast on the scene? Something is amiss with this part of the night.

and its going to stay amiss, I regret to say.. Frank is gone. His heritage , the world of his parents , for example would have been solid Hastings Banda stuff for all their life..and a good portion of Franks life, possibly.. Its not surprising that Frank would evaporate ,.. probably he is running a fishing boat out on Lake Malawi, or being a bouncer in a nightclub in Lilongwe,... safe, I hope.

 

[wb180]

I would like to know if the first time Frank saw OP if he saw blood on him or not. That would tell if Op's story about retrieving Reeva right away or taking care of things first was true. Frank has a few things to offer as far as time line very close to the time OP shot and killed Reeva.

Frank is the best witness for OP because he said himself he didn't hear anything. He was not asleep as he was also the first one at the scene and knew where to go etc. All the other people at the scene were called by OP or heard noises.

Yet DT didn't call him as witness.

Just shows you how bad DT case is right now.

 

[Trooper]

Nel apparently can make his case without Frank.. Roux and Oscar don't seem that keen to produce Frank.. .. I want to know, but I don't think that carries much weight!!

 

[wb180]

Maybe I am overly suspicious but could OP'S TRIP downstairs to supposedly open the door also be to awake Frank to haul out the ladder to make his intruder story feasible? If he heard nothing what woke him and how was he present so fast on the scene? Something is amiss with this part of the night.

You are not overly suspicious. I agreed with u. Think about it. He was the ONLY guy at the scene who supposedly heard nothing. How weird is that?
All the other guys there, stander, stipps, baba were there because OP called them or they heard gunshots.

How can someone who heard nothing be the first one at the scene?!?

 

[Zinn]

The reason that the size of Oscar’s home was brought forth was to discuss what the reasonable possibility was of Frankie not hearing anything that night, I merely stated the size of his home, it went in other directions from there, for reasons only known to those that took it in other directions.

The size of the home would be germane to the conversation about Frankie, the ill repair (or not) of the under construction home perhaps not so much.

If Frank's room was off the kitchen, I would guess he wasn't too far from the crime scene. IIRC, Carice Stander stated she could hear OP's footsteps on the tile upstairs from where she was standing the in the hallway or kitchen area downstairs. Is there a map of the first floor of OP's house?

As always, all of the above is just my opinion.

 

[Suthrnqt]

Hippity skippity day.

 

[Estelle]

Ex-girlfriends, family and Oscar Pistorius’s coach could be interviewed by psychologists to establish the athlete’s mental stability.

Forensic psychologist Ivan de Klerk said the following:

1. Many people in Oscar’s life could be questioned to better understand his actions and behaviour.

2. He will be evaluated by a team of between four to six psychologists, psychiatrists and social workers

3. He will be observed for between four to eight hours by each of them

4. He has never heard of someone being ordered to undergo observation for GAD.

5. He will be evaluated by showing him different images, which he would need to interpret to give an idea of how he saw his basic surroundings.

6. Faking it would not be advised as he could end up a State patient and only released once they deem him cured.

Dr Giada del Fabbro, another forensic psychologist, said

1. The evaluation would also include psychometric tests and assessment tools, which would look at diagnosing anxiety and test for faking.

http://citizen.co.za/181186/tests-include-friends-family/#commects-section

 

[CriLondon]

Ex-girlfriends, family and Oscar Pistorius’s coach could be interviewed by psychologists to establish the athlete’s mental stability.

Forensic psychologist Ivan de Klerk said the following:

1. Many people in Oscar’s life could be questioned to better understand his actions and behaviour.

2. He will be evaluated by a team of between four to six psychologists, psychiatrists and social workers

3. He will be observed for between four to eight hours by each of them

4. He has never heard of someone being ordered to undergo observation for GAD.

5. He will be evaluated by showing him different images, which he would need to interpret to give an idea of how he saw his basic surroundings.

6. Faking it would not be advised as he could end up a State patient and only released once they deem him cured.

Dr Giada del Fabbro, another forensic psychologist, said

1. The evaluation would also include psychometric tests and assessment tools, which would look at diagnosing anxiety and test for faking.

http://citizen.co.za/181186/tests-include-friends-family/#commects-section

Thank you for this!

Point nr. 4 - I suspect that will have to do with Dr. V testimony that , if the court finds OP's version true( and the Dr. was clear , only IF the court finds) , then GAD would have played a role.

JMO

 

[luvmygarden]

Ex-girlfriends, family and Oscar Pistorius’s coach could be interviewed by psychologists to establish the athlete’s mental stability.

Forensic psychologist Ivan de Klerk said the following:

1. Many people in Oscar’s life could be questioned to better understand his actions and behaviour.

2. He will be evaluated by a team of between four to six psychologists, psychiatrists and social workers

3. He will be observed for between four to eight hours by each of them

4. He has never heard of someone being ordered to undergo observation for GAD.

5. He will be evaluated by showing him different images, which he would need to interpret to give an idea of how he saw his basic surroundings.

6. Faking it would not be advised as he could end up a State patient and only released once they deem him cured.

Dr Giada del Fabbro, another forensic psychologist, said

1. The evaluation would also include psychometric tests and assessment tools, which would look at diagnosing anxiety and test for faking.

http://citizen.co.za/181186/tests-include-friends-family/#commects-section

Are any of these interviews taken under oath? I would imagine if not anything can be said by the people being interviewed depending on what their agenda is.

 

[Lyra500]

Frank is the best witness for OP because he said himself he didn't hear anything. He was not asleep as he was also the first one at the scene and knew where to go etc. All the other people at the scene were called by OP or heard noises.

Yet DT didn't call him as witness.

Just shows you how bad DT case is right now.

He was in the house and he was awake, dressed and standing in the street when Carice Stander arrived just minutes after being summoned by OP.

If he truly did not hear anything, then there would have been no reason whatsoever for him not to say so and appear for the defence. The fact that he denied all knowledge but has not appeared for the defence speaks volumes - none of them pleasant reading either.

As other FMs have said, this fits more with someone afraid to testify, paid not to testify, or refusing to take the stand and lie.

It seems perfectly possible that given the choice of testifying and losing all hope of future employment and keeping schtum, he really ended up with no choice at all.

 

[Estelle]

http://www.nytimes.com/health/guides/disease/post-traumatic-stress-disorder/print.html

This state occurs on most days for more than 6 months despite the lack of an obvious or specific stressor. (It worsens with stress, however.)

 

[soozieqtips]

http://www.nytimes.com/health/guides/disease/post-traumatic-stress-disorder/print.html

Thanks Estelle.

From the link:

Given these conditions, a diagnosis of GAD is confirmed if three or more of the following symptoms are present (only one for children) on most days for 6 months:

Being on edge or very restless
Feeling tired
Having difficulty with concentration
Being irritable
Having muscle tension
Experiencing disturbed sleep

My question is how can anyone confirm whether OP had three or more of those symptoms on most days for six months?? Sure, he can say he has - but coming from a pathological liar, it would be hard to know if it was yet another lie.

 

[Estelle]

Thanks Estelle.

From the link:

Given these conditions, a diagnosis of GAD is confirmed if three or more of the following symptoms are present (only one for children) on most days for 6 months:

Being on edge or very restless
Feeling tired
Having difficulty with concentration
Being irritable
Having muscle tension
Experiencing disturbed sleep

My question is how can anyone confirm whether OP had three or more of those symptoms on most days for six months?? Sure, he can say he has - but coming from a pathological liar, it would be hard to know if it was yet another lie.

That's why as he lives alone, Samantha Taylor would probably have the best idea as they went on holidays together in October for a week or two.