Lies point us to the truth

[Rain on my Parade]

FF was an intruder. IDI was inevitable conclusion to draw from RN.

JB did not have to be carried down the stairs in the dark. Someone could have held the flashlight in one hand, and led her down with the other? But, there is no need for me to elaborate foolishly any far-fetched scenario fabricated by the Rs, However, the flashlight is one of the few items of the staging that hint at IDI and a kidnapping.

At first, the Rs did not recognize the flashlight as belonging to them. If the batteries had their fingerprints, denying ownership should be impossible.

proust20,
The interesting thing about the basement being dark is that there is a light switch to be used. The parents wouldn’t have been about to see this light on even with the door open because it opens onto the butlers pantry entrance. The neighbor to the NW noticed lights flashing (flashlight) in the kitchen area of the house that night. So, it was used that night in the house for whatever reason.

At first JR denied ownership of the flashlight. PR recognized it as looking like one that JAR had given his dad (kept in a drawer @ the wet bar). She also stated that only JR used that flashlight. I suppose denying ownership didn’t last long as JR later admits to using it to take BR to bed that night.

 

[Rain on my Parade]

BBM: Burke does not admit to using the flashlight, he tells Dr. Phil:

UKGuy,
BR did initially admit to using the flashlight to go back downstairs to knock out his toy. Obviously this has been erased from the internet. I will continue to research this fact to see if I can find it.

No member of the Ramsey household needed a flashlight to go about their business.

John saying he used the flashlight to put Burke to bed is new information, he inserted it into the Ramsey's version of events.

Neither John nor Burke said anything about returning the flashlight back downstairs.

Unless we know the flashlight is the murder weapon speculation might mean we are dancing to Ramsey tune?

Exactly, we don’t know what the murder weapon is or was.

 

[proust20]

Even if true that JR used the flashlight to put BR to bed, it does not explain how it found its way into the kitchen area in the morning. Remembering where he left it before retiring would be important to his own cause. From where did he retrieve it initially - its usual drawer or elsewhere? Apparently, JAR thought of the flashlight as a appropriate present.

For the Rs' timeline to be credible, the house cannot be seen to be lit up past 11PM. The flashlight was used to find props for the staging? The size 12s were grabbed by mistake in the dark? The prevailing darkness of the house is at times unremarked. The over all flow and legibility of the RN indicates that it was unlikely to have been written in the dark.

 

[UKGuy]

UKGuy,
BR did initially admit to using the flashlight to go back downstairs to knock out his toy. Obviously this has been erased from the internet. I will continue to research this fact to see if I can find it.



Exactly, we don’t know what the murder weapon is or was.

Rain on my Parade,
No need for you to search. The following quote is Burke Ramsey's first and only public remarks on the flashlight:

Dr Phil Interview with Burke Ramsey, episode 2, excerpt

Dr Phil: I think your dad had said he used the flashlight that night to put you to bed, and then you snuck downstairs to play?

Burke: Yeah, I had some toy that I wanted to put together. I remember being downstairs after everyone was kinda in bed, and wanting to get this thing out.

Dr Phil: Did you use the flashlight, so you wouldn't be seen?

Burke: I don't remember. I just remember being downstairs, I remember this toy.

Dr Phil: Did you hit your sister over the head with a baseball bat of a flashlight?

Burke:Absolutely not.

But it's based on what JR is alleged to have told Dr Phil. Which is third party speech or hearsay, or gossip in common parlance.

Why would JR want to be linked with the alleged murder weapon, e.g. did he himself retire to bed with the flashlight on his bedside cabinet, did he use it to return back downstairs.

Was watching the George Floyd Trial and the pulmonary expert said an absence of bruising on George Floyd's neck at autopsy does not mean his neck was not compressed leading to oxygen deprivation. That's me paraphrasing.

This led me to think about JonBenet, other than the circumferential ligature furrow there were no obvious signs of compression.

Which must mean we cannot rule out manual strangulation, AKA Blood Choke.

the pulmonary expert also said it was lack of oxygen to George Floyd's brain which caused his heart to fail, thereby killing him, his leg throwing up, etc.

Just observing we do not have this with JonBenet, by some accounts she was still alive for a short period after sustaining her head injury.

.

 

[UKGuy]

Even if true that JR used the flashlight to put BR to bed, it does not explain how it found its way into the kitchen area in the morning. Remembering where he left it before retiring would be important to his own cause. From where did he retrieve it initially - its usual drawer or elsewhere? Apparently, JAR thought of the flashlight as a appropriate present.

For the Rs' timeline to be credible, the house cannot be seen to be lit up past 11PM. The flashlight was used to find props for the staging? The size 12s were grabbed by mistake in the dark? The prevailing darkness of the house is at times unremarked. The over all flow and legibility of the RN indicates that it was unlikely to have been written in the dark.

proust20,
The really big question regarding the flashlight is: Who returned it downstairs?

i.e. all JR needs to say is after putting Burke to bed I took it back downstairs and left it in the kitchen?

Why would any Ramsey need a flashlight to move about their own house, at any point in time.

Any signs of light at any point can be attributed to the intruder

JR never used a flashlight to put Burke to bed that is so bizarre it defies belief.

This is simply JR playing smoke and mirrors with an unaccountable reference to the flashlight.

If the case is JDI and he whacked JonBenet why is he admitting to using the flashlight?

Where is the percentage in that?

.

 

[Rain on my Parade]

Even if true that JR used the flashlight to put BR to bed, it does not explain how it found its way into the kitchen area in the morning. Remembering where he left it before retiring would be important to his own cause. From where did he retrieve it initially - its usual drawer or elsewhere? Apparently, JAR thought of the flashlight as a appropriate present.

proust20,
You so read my mind here. In so saying, BR did admit to Dr.Phil that he felt guilty for leaving the front door open.

Joe Barnhill stated he say JAR enter the house through the front door Christmas Day. A few days later he contacted ramnesia after one of the investigators told him to "be quiet- and never talk about what he saw the morning of the murder"...He said "they told me I was mistaken"... I found that to be very odd. It is possible that JAR knew where the maglite was because he lived there. Dropping his red and black scarf on the wet bar (a gift from PR) @ the party on the 23rd. It was never taken into evidence. Yet PR (off the rack) was turned over a year later. And bingo it’s fiber evidence time.

For the Rs' timeline to be credible, the house cannot be seen to be lit up past 11PM. The flashlight was used to find props for the staging? The size 12s were grabbed by mistake in the dark? The prevailing darkness of the house is at times unremarked. The over all flow and legibility of the RN indicates that it was unlikely to have been written in the dark.

The only place in that house (other than a closet) w/out being seen lit up past 11p.m. is the basement. There is a phone there in the laundry room, pictures of JB, and possibly the size 12 bloomies. In the basement were found: The blue suitcase with the duvet and a Dr. Seuss grooming book, the paintbrush shards, fiber evidence, wet carpet outside the wine cellar door, a knife, toys that shouldn’t be there, poon print of hi-tec boots, JB Barbie night gown with blood on it, her blanket and JB. And of course a set of golf clubs that we desperately needed during this time of loss.

 

[Rain on my Parade]

Rain on my Parade,
No need for you to search. The following quote is Burke Ramsey's first and only public remarks on the flashlight:

Dr Phil Interview with Burke Ramsey, episode 2, excerpt

I will still research because I know I have read this statement as coming from him (long ago). In the meantime we will take you for your word.

Just observing we do not have this with JonBenet, by some accounts she was still alive for a short period after sustaining her head injury.

Time period = 45 minutes to 2 hours

 

[proust20]

After 25 years of becoming increasingly entangled in differing versions of events, I sincerely wonder if JR in fact remembers what actually did occur. If you tell yourself the same lie repeatedly, it may become a personal truth. Pathological liars gain a feeling of control from their manipulative mistruths. They enjoy it. SA of a minor is similarly motivated by a need to feel powerful and in control.

The uncaptured killer of JB must have felt, or be feeling, a sense of power after having eluded LE successfully from the very beginning. As a result, this person may assume that they could get away with anything, e.g., blatantly associate themselves with the CS, continue to participate in mendacious interviews, or run for elected office.

Going with JR's line, the intruder(s) could not have possession of the flashlight any time before the Rs retired. If JR left it upstairs after BR was in bed, then the intruder(s) should have to have discovered it there while all were asleep, and took it and JB downstairs. If he or another R did return it someplace downstairs, then its usefulness to the 'kidnapper' is sketchier. This person didn't need a flashlight to get around the complicated layout of the huge house before; so, why need it suddenly? Then, JB winds up in the WC. So, either the intruder didn't need it to take her there; or, they went to the WC with her along with the flashlight, and came back up to the kitchen where they abandoned it before escaping. With so many missing items (duct tape, binding cord, Wednesday size 6s, pajama bottoms, notepad pages) involved, it seems IMO that if the flashlight were of significance, it would likewise have disappeared, the CBS doc notwithstanding. Once you start to write about this, you realize the scope of the absurdity once more.

Aside from a neighbor reportedly seeing dim lights moving about downstairs, there are no sightings of the house being lit up after 11PM. Whatever happened was in the dark. There may have been a pattern of secret nocturnal activities centered around JB?

 

[proust20]

To be thorough, I ought to add to my previous post that there is an outside possibility that the intruder(s) waited somewhere in the dark until one of the Rs brought the flashlight back downstairs, and they grabbed it and had it with them on their way up to get JB and returned with it, eventually depositing it on the bar.

Not that I believe any of this. Only playing along with JR's logic.

 

[Rain on my Parade]

To be thorough, I ought to add to my previous post that there is an outside possibility that the intruder(s) waited somewhere in the dark until one of the Rs brought the flashlight back downstairs, and they grabbed it and had it with them on their way up to get JB and returned with it, eventually depositing it on the bar.

Not that I believe any of this. Only playing along with JR's logic.

proust20,
There was no “intruder”. The maglite was in the drawer @ the wet bar. It was found on the kitchen counter/breakfast bar. I suspect the reasoning for the use of the maglite can be explained by 1 of 2 reasons. Either BR used it to sneak downstairs later on or it was used to hide activity within the home.Why was the Sunroom window turned out? Noticed by neighbors as it was always on. Makes me wonder what needed to be hidden in this part of the home? Could somebody have lured JB downstairs, waiting for her in the sunroom. Manually chocked her out. Then drug her down the basement stairs (very quietly), took out a knife for the ligature, and then hit her over the head. The wine cellar is located directly beneath the Sunroom. The room PR initially stayed in that morning before moving to the den. She probably moved there when she knew “game on” to find JB.

 

[proust20]

The flashlight stands out obviously in the CS photos. As a result, LE were interested enough in it to test the batteries for fingerprints. If it had been returned to its drawer, it should never been examined so closely. This leads me to conclude that the Rs wanted the flashlight to be part of their kidnap attempt narrative. There is no physical evidence that links the flashlight to the murder and the Rs knew that, or they'd have put it away. Several items directly connected to the crime are missing; so, the disposal of one more should not have presented a problem.

Could the RN have been written illuminated by flashlight? This would be quite awkward and the penmanship would be strained.

 

[anniejanet]

I saw a youtube by a retired homicide detective who worked in Colorado. He was a bit involved in the JB case but not totally. I don't think I can post a link to his vid but I'll sum up his theory. PR walked in on JR molesting JB and grabbed something heavy and swung at him. He moved and she hit JB instead. Makes sense right? If anyone would like a link shoot me a site mail.

 

[Veronica Lodge]

I saw a youtube by a retired homicide detective who worked in Colorado. He was a bit involved in the JB case but not totally. I don't think I can post a link to his vid but I'll sum up his theory. PR walked in on JR molesting JB and grabbed something heavy and swung at him. He moved and she hit JB instead. Makes sense right? If anyone would like a link shoot me a site mail.

Hi anniejanet, well yes that does make sense. That would explain why the ransom note is somewhat snarky towards JR, as well as PR calling her friends round etc. Also PR protection of Burke (from JR) afterwards. I just can't get my head around the fact that Burke was sent out of the house if he was the guilty party - no way would they take that risk that he wouldn't blurt something out. Do you have the name of the homicide detective please?

 

[Swirlz]

@anniejanet

Do you have the name of the homicide detective please?

Ditto

 

[anniejanet]

I know they frown on posting that kind of thing here so I will send you both a site message.

 

[proust20]

Unfortunately with this case, no one theory explains all of what has been established already. If we accept that PR accidently whacked her daughter during abuse by JR, it doesn't explain the gap in time between the blow to the head and the strangulation, which was the cause of death. Likewise, this theory does not tell us who applied the garotte.

 

[anniejanet]

Unfortunately with this case, no one theory explains all of what has been established already. If we accept that PR accidently whacked her daughter during abuse by JR, it doesn't explain the gap in time between the blow to the head and the strangulation, which was the cause of death. Likewise, this theory does not tell us who applied the garotte.

Hmm that's true. How much time was between the blow to the head and the strangulation?

For me this theory fits a lot together, that PR wrote the note, and the motivation of the parents if they were involved.

 

[proust20]

To the best of my knowledge, the approximate time between the head blow and the strangulation is anywhere between 45 minutes to 2 hours.

 

[Rain on my Parade]

I saw a youtube by a retired homicide detective who worked in Colorado. He was a bit involved in the JB case but not totally. I don't think I can post a link to his vid but I'll sum up his theory. PR walked in on JR molesting JB and grabbed something heavy and swung at him. He moved and she hit JB instead. Makes sense right? If anyone would like a link shoot me a site mail.

anniejanet,
Very interesting. I have thought this could be one scenario.

 

[Rain on my Parade]

I know they frown on posting that kind of thing here so I will send you both a site message.

Please send one my way as well. Thank you!