Local 6 - DP motion just DENIED

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lacey clementine said:
I don't see that. A 'fact' is a 'fact' by any other name. :twocents:
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I understand that, but the problem is that he can't [prove his facts. He can't prove that the duct tape was applied to kill her, it's just his theory of how it happened.

I have no doubt that the very last face Caylee saw before she died was of KC. I have no doubt that KC caused her death, either intentionally or by accident, and she panicked. I do have doubts that the duct tape was the murder weapon, I lean more towards something chemical, and then KC freaked out and didn't know what to do.

I just think that, by stating in the court record and therefore publicly that JA's recitation was of 'facts' he has said something he might not have intended to say.

I could be wrong :)
 
Themis said:
No chaos from me, 21Merc7. There are a lot of thoughtful, intelligent people who have given this topic a great deal of attention and study and have come to the same conclusion you just expressed. I respect that.

The truth is most of us have never had to come right down to seriously looking at the death penalty issue -- I mean seriously as in real life -- as opposed to an expression of our anger and frustration at a particular behavior or criminal but so far removed we don't have to make that decision. It is very sobering to actually have to make that decision. It is very sobering to have to decide whether or not more medical treatment is going to be given to a critically ill/injured patient. It is sobering to sit on a medical ethics board. It is sobering to decide to sew up a patient during surgery because there is nothing else that is realistic to do. It is sobering to decide how much intervention to give at the scene of a horrible accident. It is very sobering to actually have to decide other non-medical cases that involve life or death choices; like who will be on a roster to have to go into a military battle. Having to decide a death penalty in a particular case is no different. I have had some of these experiences and they will inevitably change the way you view the world.

I really think that there is evil in the world and that some people are evil. Maybe they were not born that way, but have become evil beyond redemption and have committed acts in accordance with that evil intent.

So, while I certainly understand why those who seek justice in this case are relieved and happy about Judge Strickland deciding to deny the motion and let the issue of death as a possible penalty go to the jury, I also understand that some may have come to that bridge where the issue is a present and solid reality from which there is no escaping the real life decision -- and a good many even on this website and even after celebrating the news today -- would choke.

So, I respect your effort and your stance.
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Themis;

Your eloquent words needed repeating. :blowkiss:
 
hroark2112 said:
Not to throw a monkey wrench into things...but something just struck me.

The Judge's comments have pretty much guaranteed that there is no way she can get a fair trial around Central Florida. His comment "The prosecution's brief recitation of facts" has, in my mind at least, stated that what the prosecutor said in his statement is how it happened, and has probably tainted the opinion of anyone who reads it.

Just my .02, and I'm not saying he's wrong. Just saying that he might have worded things a bit better.
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I think that it is one thing to say that the SA presentation was compelling to warrant the DP being on the table and, completely another for the SA to prove their case beyond a reasonable doubt.

I did not read JS' statement precluding that, as one of proven guilt per se -- he just said that the Jury should decide and the DP should be an option available to them -- if proven true.
 
justthinkin said:
I'm not against the death penalty in certain cases, this being one of them. A defenseless toddler has been murdered, and an adult is responsible. The state has the right adult behind bars. That adult, Casey Anthony is a total misfit, not only to society, but also to a general prison population. She fits in nowhere in this world nor can she be rehabilitated.
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I'm not sure if she can be rehabilitated or not, but she doesn't deserve the chance. She needed professional mental help long before she committed this crime and her parents ignored the truth staring them in the face.

I agree with you, in this case the death penalty fits.
 
True but don't forget that he'll add: "The state wants to kill my client." Isn't that the defense's new motto?
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What the state wanted and didn't get was cooperation and truth. Instead they got lied to and stonewalled.

My day has improved considerably, I must say!
 
azwriter said:
I hear you loud and clear SallyLu, but what else do they have - a mysterious Nanny? I do believe after the passionate plea from the defense about the DP, the only thing Casey's defense team will focus on is keeping her from receiving the death penalty.
A question for all - is there anyone among us who is not overjoyed by the decision to keep the DP for Casey? And why?
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BBM

I'm not overjoyed.
I don't believe in the dp. I struggle with it when I hear of extremely horrendous crimes but generally I think lwop is sufficient.

If she is found guilty I hope that she does spend the rest of her days in jail.

In the end I think the dp will be overturned by the judge. Just my opinion.

The only satisfaction I do get from this ruling is that it sends a very strong message to kc. Serious, deep deep doo doo she is in and if it isn't too late perhaps a deal should be sought right about now.
 
hroark2112 said:
I understand that, but the problem is that he can't [prove his facts. He can't prove that the duct tape was applied to kill her, it's just his theory of how it happened.

I have no doubt that the very last face Caylee saw before she died was of KC. I have no doubt that KC caused her death, either intentionally or by accident, and she panicked. I do have doubts that the duct tape was the murder weapon, I lean more towards something chemical, and then KC freaked out and didn't know what to do.

I just think that, by stating in the court record and therefore publicly that JA's recitation was of 'facts' he has said something he might not have intended to say.

I could be wrong :)
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Well I could be wrong too. It wouldn't be the first time :blushing: I am simply saying I don't see Strickland's statement as definitively as you did. And I seriously doubt a prospective juror would either.
 
confused...most people I've encountered think it would be more humane to put an animal to sleep than to cage it for 60 years and yet think it's somehow more humane to cage a person for 60 years instead of put them to sleep. I just don't get how one is more humane than the other. They are both equally bad imo, so I have no qualms about the DP. In fact, I think it is more humane and better for all.
 
cyberborg said:
For me the value of the DP 'threat' is that KC will get a DP-qualified Jury and given the shenanigans and spin of the Defense team --- I think this is a good thing. Important. This is serious and we need a conservative DP-qualified Jury to consider the evidence and cope with duelling experts, spin, etc.

Having said that, do I think KC will get the DP? -- no. I do think that she will get LIFE and in FL LIFE means LIFE. That works.
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Life works just as well as far as Im concerned. Just as long as she never get out again and has to think about what she did and why she will never get out.
 
Eidetic said:
"I'm pissed!"
CaseyDec112009.jpg
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That old saying a picture says a 1000 words. I guess there won't be anymore licorice sharing between Baez and KC anymore. The love affair must be over. :woohoo:
 
azwriter said:
I hear you loud and clear SallyLu, but what else do they have - a mysterious Nanny? I do believe after the passionate plea from the defense about the DP, the only thing Casey's defense team will focus on is keeping her from receiving the death penalty.
A question for all - is there anyone among us who is not overjoyed by the decision to keep the DP for Casey? And why?
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BBM. Hi Azwriter. I enjoy reading your posts. To answer your question, I am not 'overjoyed' by the decision to keep the DP for Casey. While it was the decision I was hoping for based on my desire for justice for Caylee, I can't take joy in the possible death of another human being, however horrid they may be. Some days I believe in the death penalty and other days I am not so sure. One thing I am sure of is wanting to see justice served. I don't envy anyone who will be called to sit on this jury. They have a daunting task ahead of them. Thanks for asking.
 
harleysnana said:
WOW.. that pic says it all IMO.
Neither of them look like they feel sorry for her.
They look pissed at her.
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I think JB originally went into this case believing every word KC said. It looks as if he might have taken off his rose colored glasses and realizes the mountain of evidence he is up against.
 
QB. said:
BBM

I'm not overjoyed.
I don't believe in the dp. I struggle with it when I hear of extremely horrendous crimes but generally I think lwop is sufficient.

If she is found guilty I hope that she does spend the rest of her days in jail.

In the end I think the dp will be overturned by the judge. Just my opinion.

The only satisfaction I do get from this ruling is that it sends a very strong message to kc. Serious, deep deep doo doo she is in and if it isn't too late perhaps a deal should be sought right about now.
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I am with you 99%

I am, however happy that she will be faced with the possibility for now, also, that she will have a DP qualified jury which makes a conviction almost a certainty. I do not think she will be given the DP, if the jury asks for it, Strickland will override it or it will be overturned on appeal. IMO of course. It just isnt likely that she will be executed so maybe that's why I can at least be happy about what this means for jury selection.
 
The seriousness of the crime won't be swept under the carpet. Thank You Judge.
 
hroark2112 said:
Not to throw a monkey wrench into things...but something just struck me.

The Judge's comments have pretty much guaranteed that there is no way she can get a fair trial around Central Florida. His comment "The prosecution's brief recitation of facts" has, in my mind at least, stated that what the prosecutor said in his statement is how it happened, and has probably tainted the opinion of anyone who reads it.

Just my .02, and I'm not saying he's wrong. Just saying that he might have worded things a bit better.
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I am not going to presume which 'facts' the Judge is referring to in his statement. JA references to the LAW may be the facts the Judge is referring to.

From the video referenced below (transcribed but not word by word)

JA: the facts that the defense argued their opinion and that the death penalty is available for 1st degree murder w/out special aggravating circumstances in FL. Why does prosecution waive it sometimes (to bring it before a jury) is more appropriate. Case law does say court is not permitted to make a pre-trial decision on special/aggravated circumstances - but that is what defense is arguing. Can if there is "bad-faith" for decision- case law is limited to where it can be shown if based on race, gender, religious beliefs or sexual orientation. Prosecutor is trying to punish defendant outside of the crime - defense has not presented anything that shows prosecutorial decision has done so. Defense goes on to allege that before Caylee's body was not found and no death penalty and once body was found and state's case became stronger then prosecutor needed 'advantage' of death penalty jury to win - why waive when case weaker and reinstate when stronger?

Then JA goes on with the innocence statement and the worst case scenario he gave which others are assuming are the 'facts' the Judge is referring to in his order.

15:32 (about where JA starts) http://www.wftv.com/video/21931707/index.html

MOO
 
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