Lowe's Pulls Ads From American Muslim Time Slot

[Fairy1]

Comments like that are acceptable but Lowes pulling their advertising dollars is not?

Ok, what's rational?

I'm not sure to which comment you're referring, but what's unacceptable is bigotry and stereotyping.

I'm too tired to look back right now, but someone earlier complained about being, basically, stereotyped as a Christian. To me, the hypocrisy is quite stunning but, truly, I fail to understand why anyone simply cannot recognize that. I really don't understand.

 

[Kimberlyd125]

I'm not sure to which comment you're referring, but what's unacceptable is bigotry and stereotyping.

I'm too tired to look back right now, but someone earlier complained about being, basically, stereotyped as a Christian. To me, the hypocrisy is quite stunning but, truly, I fail to understand why anyone simply cannot recognize that. I really don't understand.

Posts #175 and #179.

It's very offensive. It's meant to inflame. It's disgusting.

JMO

To say people are not rational for believing the Bible is just as bigoted and intolerant as anything else in this thread. To belittle someone's faith and downright call it fantasy goes to show how bigotry when pointed at Christians is accepted.

 

[legalmania]

That's ridiculous. I've watched this show and it appears to show normal American Muslims just living their everyday lives. Not everyone has an agenda.

I've never watched the show, but from what I picked up from the previews they are trying to teach others about the stereo-typing that goes on with the Muslim community. It's a process and it is going to take time. Corporations like Lowe's don't seem to help when they pull their ads because of negative responses. Almost every race has went through this, at one time or another. Right now the Muslim community is in the minority, but I'm sure that if they become the majority they will rethink their strategy.

 

[Fairy1]

Posts #175 and #179.

It's very offensive. It's meant to inflame. It's disgusting.

JMO

To say people are not rational for believing the Bible is just as bigoted and intolerant as anything else in this thread. To belittle someone's faith and downright call it fantasy goes to show how bigotry when pointed at Christians is accepted.

But can't you see that when people of one faith belittle others for their differing beliefs, it's the same thing?

I just don't understand why that is so impossible to grasp.

Whether someone's lifeline is the Bible, the Koran or the Book of Mormon, who is anyone else to JUDGE them? Every single religion is, theoretically, based on peace and, supposedly, love for others. Yet that sentiment rarely comes through in actual practice.

I still say, shame on the executive management of Lowe's for making such a public statement with this story. The fact that they did tells me everything I need to know about them.

 

[Kimberlyd125]

But can't you see that when people of one faith belittle others for their differing beliefs, it's the same thing?

I just don't understand why that is so impossible to grasp.

Whether someone's lifeline is the Bible, the Koran or the Book of Mormon, who is anyone else to JUDGE them? Every single religion is, theoretically, based on peace and, supposedly, love for others. Yet that sentiment rarely comes through in actual practice.

I still say, shame on the executive management of Lowe's for making such a public statement with this story. The fact that they did tells me everything I need to know about them.

I never said it wasn't and I never belittled Islam.

I questioned Mohammad's marriage and sexual relations with a 9 year old and I believe Lowes has a right to spend their money where they see fit.

I wouldn't expect a Muslim company to advertise on The 700 Club.

But, I've never belittled anyone's faith.

To say my Bible, or any other religious book, is fantasy and the believers are irrational is rude, bigoted, and intolerant. Yet those who say it are the ones calling Christians bigots.

I could care less what the cast of "All American Muslim" believe. That's their business.

What it boils down to is Lowes is a company. They depend on the customers. They advertise where they think they will get the most viewers. If they thought their advertising spots during the show were causing negative feelings against their company, they have a right to pull them.

 

[ziggy]

Look, we live in a majority Christian country, I think. White, straight Christians (including those who are Christian by default, or just nominal) are the priviledged majority. So of course they're the ones that are going to be on the receiving end of criticism and satire most often. Minorities who are discriminated against don't have as much power or influence, so there is no real cultural purpose in satirizing them or holding them to as much criticism. It's as simple as that. it serves no purpose to make a show that satirizes a minority group like Muslims, or gays, or Buddhists, because they're not the groups in our society that hold the cultural influence and power. But it does make sense to make a show that gives e majority a glimpse into a life and culture that they might otherwise know nothing about. Then we can see that although we may be different, we are also very much the same. It fosters unity and understanding.

I'm a bit weary of the crying that Christians are some sort of persecuted group in this country. If you can't take criticism and satire, then honestly you're headed down the road of being just as knee jerk as those who get bent out of shape at cartoons of Muhammad.

I don't consider calling people bigots mere criticism and satire. Totally different. And BTW, once again, wrong is wrong. Just because a group is larger doesn't mean they should be a target any more than the smaller group. The logic of justifying unreasonable actions by saying the group is "privileged" due to their size is lost on me.

 

[ziggy]

Yes, how are people of these religions behaving NOW. In the USA.

I feel I'm being reasonable and, most importantly, TOLERANT.

I didn't say in the USA I said how are they behaving now regardless of what their "book" says. The Bible and Quaran are worldwide religions. The people who follow as a whole, and how they are manifesting their beliefs, are a better gauge than some passage you can quote. You are only being selectively tolerant, which isn't really tolerant.

 

[ziggy]

You disagree based on what, divine revelation? We have the one source with a quote from a Lowe's representative. On what basis do we assume Lowe's actually has some other motivation?

As for Muslims who oppose gay rights, carve Stars of David into perceived "traitors", commit so-called "honor" killings or blow themselves up in crowded malls, I have no problem calling them religious bigots. Who does?

Where I don't agree is with your post above that seems to imply that moderate Muslims have the burden of proof in showing they are not religious extremists. Since when do we shift that burden to individuals who, as far as we know, have done nothing wrong?

That's like demanding that Kimberly prove she doesn't shoot abortion providers: (a) not her job; and (b) how could she possibly prove such a thing? (For the record, I don't for a moment think Kimberly is a violent person; I'm specifically using her as an example because she is such an unlikely suspect.)

Although I am quite divine, I was trying to say SO WHAT? I never questioned that was perhaps the reason they pulled the ads, but my point is so what? They might believe the show is not a real portrayal and let's face it reality shows are not usually the real deal. Not unreasonable to question if it is an accurate portrayal.

Your analogy is flawed in that Kimberly is an individual and Muslims are a group, so how they are perceived makes a much larger impact on a society, especially due to their numbers. Groups are more powerful than individuals, with group think mindsets etc.

You Have no way of knowing if these Muslim people are moderate or not. You have no way of knowing if they secretly condone, but lie to fit in. AND especially not by a reality TV show. So if you can't prove it one way and I certainly can't the other, that means it's reasonable to consider each a possibility. And given that, Lowes acted within reason.

So Yes, I stand by the fact that if moderate Muslims want to be separated from the extremists they are going to have to stand up, denounce and be heard. (or either maybe they don't really have all that different views, or they are too afraid, either of which is pretty bad)

 

[ziggy]

1) Have you read the statement from the Florida Family Association they sent to Lowe's that the show "profiles only Muslims that appear to be ordinary folks while excluding many Islamic believers whose agenda poses a clear and present danger to the liberties and traditional values that the majority of Americans cherish."
Yes, shame on them for showing not all muslims are wanting to fly airplanes into buildings and kill Americans. Watching this show is a danger to Americans? How so? I'm not saying you agree with this statement. But try to explain how this is not bigotry?
Why would the show be considered sanitized? Because it doesn't show extreme Muslims? If they disagree with the Muslim faith that is okay. It is not okay to start a petition to get advertisers to pull out ads because you don't like their faith. Freedom of religon??

2)What does the gay minority have to do with Lowe's pulling ads?

3)She didn't say all Christians are bigots. Nova was very clear in his statements.

Definition of bigotry:stubborn and complete intolerance of any creed, belief, or opinion that differs from one's own

prejudice:unreasonable feelings, opinions, or attitudes, especially of a hostile nature, regarding a racial, religious or national group

discrimination:treatment or consideration of, or making a distinction in favor of or against, a person or thing based on the group, class, or category to which that person or thing belongs rather than on individual merit: racial and religious intolerance and discrimination

def. from dictionary.com

I was always told the difference between prejudice and discrimination is that the first is to believe in something wrong and the second is to act on it.
This group decided to act on it by starting that petition. All-American Muslim does not deserve to have ads pulled because the people on the show are not their idea of what a Muslim is.:banghead:
jmo

First, getting a petition to pull the ads is freedom of speech. The only thing it has to do with freedom of religion is that Lowes has the freedom to be true to their religion if they chose. NO fundamental rights of Musllims have been harmed here. Please don't blur the lines of Constitutionality.

The analogy to gay rights was that not all minority groups should be silenced because they are a minority. To dismiss a groups' opinion because they are "minority" is hypocritical. Nova called them "christian bigots" because their view is minority. He belongs to a minority with a view and probably does not approve of people calling people of his group derogatory terms. Funny how that works. It's OK for one group who claims tolerance to call others names and refuse to give it while at the same time demanding it.
If a group of Christians wanted to be heard and someone listened, as long as nobody's rights were infringed upon SO WHAT?

Definition of bigotry:stubborn and complete intolerance of any creed, belief, or opinion that differs from one's own.
In the definition of bigotry the standard is a complete intolerance...not liking someone's lifestyle or religion does not rise to that level. That is where christians get the definition misused on them. I actually do have a complete intolerance for the Sharia Law. I am a bigot. I frankly don't give a damn on that one. However, complete intolerance is a very high standard, so some little complaint about an ad airing during a show with a religious angle doesn't cut it. But thank you for the vocab. lesson.

And what are unreasonable feelings? Hmmm. Do I have unreasonable feelings by fearing pit bulls when I see them loose? They have the highest rate of attack and I can never be sure it the one I run into is a nice one or a mean one. Just because I don't KNOW for sure, doesn't make my fear unreasonable.

Discrimination is not hiring someone because of a race or religion, or other deprivations of liberties or fundamental rights. Voicing concern that people might want to think twice before supporting a show about a subject they either disagree with or think is being fraudulently portrayed is not discrimination. I'm sure certain advertisers don't like Sister Wives either.

The one and only reason you think this is discrimination and freak out is because it's about Muslims...oh no!!! We bend over backwards trying to convince the world we are not bigots!!!!

The truth is they live here like anyone else, and I do not want their rights infringed upon in any way, but I do not have to agree with their views or think they are just wonderful or that they are just as American because "I saw it on TV". Time will tell on that one. Not enough facts in evidence.

 

[ziggy]

You're wrong IMO. This group knows that not all Muslims are violent extremists. They petitioned because the show depicts only one side of the coin. "profiles only Muslims that appear to be ordinary folks while excluding many Islamic believers whose agenda poses a clear and present danger to the liberties and traditional values that the majority of Americans cherish."
Major Hasan, the Ft. Hood shooter, is an American. Colleen R. LaRose, aka Jihad Jane, Ramy Zamzam, Umar Farooq, Waqar Khan, Ahmad Mini, and Aman Hassan Yemer, are Americans.
Pakistani police showed the pictures and the U.S. passports of the five young college students from the Washington, D.C., suburbs, who authorities say had come to Pakistan to train for jihad.

http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/pakistan-americans-recruited-jihad-terror-deported-us/story?id=9306856

There are more. They exist. Let's not pretend they don't.

Yeah, yeah Timothy McVeigh... the big rebuttal to this fact that MAKES NO SENSE.

This is a good point trackerSam - and I would use the pit bull analogy. They are dangerous, we hear about them attacking people every day. We also hear people defend them every day as the most loving dogs and blaming the people who raise them. Yet, there have been pits raised in loving homes who have killed. Is a fear of them unreasonable? I don't think so.

The only reason people do not want to discuss this when it comes to Islam is the fear of being called a bigot, racist, ignorant. Well I'm done with that bully tactic used by the people who cast shame upon bullies yet act with the same intentions.

The problem is we don't know...we don't really know because one of the tactics terrorists are supposed to use is to fit in, lie to people, knowing they will turn around and kill them because IT IS FOR A GREATER CAUSE. One could ask if they are using a television show to further that goal. It would not be an unreasonable question to ask.

It's a very complicated situation. Of course it's not right to cast dispersions over people, but it would also not be prudent to ignore danger. I say use caution first. Having only a show on how great and sweet and nice pit bulls are is not the entire story. Therefore, when little Bobby sees one and decides to pet the nice doggy and is torn to shreds, was it really wise to have excluded the other side of the story?

The difference between other groups and religions and Muslims is that many (not all, but many and many who hide the fact) Muslims desire to wipe out Israel and the US and are out to KILL INNOCENTS. So when I see the being portrayed as just every day Americans, I might wonder if that is for real or not. We don't even know how many extreme Muslims are here living among us. The fact is we don't know.

Running around being paranoid isn't good but neither is running around claiming the danger doesn't exist.

 

[Gardenlady]

Maybe if we (the US) had, decades ago, stopped interfering in their nations and causing, directly or Indirectly, the deaths of Muslims, the radicals wouldn't feel so strongly about killing us in retaliation. :twocents:

 

[Gardenlady]

And so now, according to Ziggy, Muslims in America are like pitbulls, and should all be considered secret terrorist sympathizes until proven otherwise. WTH?!

 

[Gardenlady]

The bible is not a religion, nor is it a manual for living, or a science textbook. To follow it as such is indeed irrational. No less a person than St Augustine (not my favorite guy, but undoubtedly one of the foremost influences on Christian thought in the early centuries of the church) said much the same. Following the bible literally will bring you results like the witch trials, the KKK, apocalyptic cults, and 20,000+ denominations all claiming to be Christian because they have the "correct" interpretation of the bible.

Sort of similar to how hardline, literalist interpretations of the Quran will lead to fringe groups who are able to cite their scripture to justify their actions.

 

[Kimberlyd125]

Maybe if we (the US) had, decades ago, stopped interfering in their nations and causing, directly or Indirectly, the deaths of Muslims, the radicals wouldn't feel so strongly about killing us in retaliation. :twocents:

Sorry, but "death to infidels" is much older than our country.

There were radicals that wanted all non-Muslim people dead LONG before America was even known about.

 

[Kimberlyd125]

The bible is not a religion, nor is it a manual for living, or a science textbook. To follow it as such is indeed irrational. No less a person than St Augustine (not my favorite guy, but undoubtedly one of the foremost influences on Christian thought in the early centuries of the church) said much the same. Following the bible literally will bring you results like the witch trials, the KKK, apocalyptic cults, and 20,000+ denominations all claiming to be Christian because they have the "correct" interpretation of the bible.

Sort of similar to how hardline, literalist interpretations of the Quran will lead to fringe groups who are able to cite their scripture to justify their actions.

I absolutely follow the teachings of Christ found in the Bible. I find those teachings quite rational.

 

[jjw]

First, getting a petition to pull the ads is freedom of speech. The only thing it has to do with freedom of religion is that Lowes has the freedom to be true to their religion if they chose. NO fundamental rights of Musllims have been harmed here. Please don't blur the lines of Constitutionality.

The analogy to gay rights was that not all minority groups should be silenced because they are a minority. To dismiss a groups' opinion because they are "minority" is hypocritical. Nova called them "christian bigots" because their view is minority. He belongs to a minority with a view and probably does not approve of people calling people of his group derogatory terms. Funny how that works. It's OK for one group who claims tolerance to call others names and refuse to give it while at the same time demanding it.
If a group of Christians wanted to be heard and someone listened, as long as nobody's rights were infringed upon SO WHAT?

Definition of bigotry:stubborn and complete intolerance of any creed, belief, or opinion that differs from one's own.
In the definition of bigotry the standard is a complete intolerance...not liking someone's lifestyle or religion does not rise to that level. That is where christians get the definition misused on them. I actually do have a complete intolerance for the Sharia Law. I am a bigot. I frankly don't give a damn on that one. However, complete intolerance is a very high standard, so some little complaint about an ad airing during a show with a religious angle doesn't cut it. But thank you for the vocab. lesson.

And what are unreasonable feelings? Hmmm. Do I have unreasonable feelings by fearing pit bulls when I see them loose? They have the highest rate of attack and I can never be sure it the one I run into is a nice one or a mean one. Just because I don't KNOW for sure, doesn't make my fear unreasonable

.

Discrimination is not hiring someone because of a race or religion, or other deprivations of liberties or fundamental rights.

Voicing concern that people might want to think twice before supporting a show about a subject they either disagree with or think is being fraudulently portrayed is not discrimination.

I'm sure certain advertisers don't like Sister Wives either.

The one and only reason you think this is discrimination and freak out is because it's about Muslims...oh no!!!

We bend over backwards trying to convince the world we are not bigots!!!!

The truth is they live here like anyone else, and I do not want their rights infringed upon in any way,

but I do not have to agree with their views or think they are just wonderful or that they are just as American because "I saw it on TV". Time will tell on that one. Not enough facts in evidence.

1)Any show that portrays Muslim-Americans being good members of their community is suspect? Suspicions of fraudulence because it doesn't show members out on the street planning a jihad?

2)That is what happens when you're a world power. We are suppose to be better than countries who do so.

4) Muslims have to prove themselves to be true Americans. There are Muslims who were born in this country, fight in our armed forces, and give to this country and have for years. They don't have to prove anything to me. You shouldn't get your view of Muslims from t.v. and that includes the news. They are just like everyone else, I promise.

No one has said extremists don't exist. What we are saying is don't judge them all by a few wild cards.:twocents:

jmo

 

[jjw]

http://youtu.be/qQhls5PEmeQ

I found this on Twitter and wanted to share.:crazy:

 

[Gardenlady]

http://youtu.be/qQhls5PEmeQ

I found this on Twitter and wanted to share.:crazy:

Love it! Thanks for posting this. . I gotta say, if I were a Muslim living in the US, I don't think I'd be able to have such a sense of humor about this type of nonsense. In fact, knowing myself, I'd be pretty damn angry and in-your-face. So my hat is doubly off to them for being able to find the humor in it!

 

[not_my_kids]

Wow, we've gone from ad revenue to corporate decisions, to pit bulls, to Christianity, to Timothy McVeigh, and back again, all in one thread. That is either incredibly impressive or proof that Lowe's got what they wanted, because if everyone else is using their business move in as many different ways as the people on this thread, they've been trending worldwide for days.

We all believe what we believe. Those that have similar beliefs will always stand together, that's the way of the world, it's why we have wars, it's how we find the people we fall in love with or marry, it's how we choose career paths and religions. And I don't think that any of us would change religions because someone on a message board pointed out that they think we should. Similarly, those that do not understand or are completely hateful towards others will not change that because someone on a message board told them to.

The Qu'ran and the Bible both give wonderful suggestions for a righteous life and they give good rules to follow, interspersed with stories of war, questionable activity agaisnt people of other races and genders, and depictions of certain people as lesser beings due to gender, race, religion or lifestyle. Both of these books contradict themselves, and are inconsistent in places. As are any works, divine or not, that are edited and written by humans.

None of it matters, none of it. We are fighting about religion, something designed to bring people together. The true followers of any righteous religion follow the rules of their Lord and society: Be nice. Honor those that deserve it. Those of us that follow the positives of any religion have to fight daily against the extremist actions of a few people that also claim the same religion to justify their hatred and their own questionable actions. Followers of Islam have to fight against the stigma of a few people that decided that they hated people enough give their own lives to take them out to. And Christians have to fight against the stigma of idiots like the Westboro Baptists.

I think that if any of our Gods would speak to us today, the main message would be to just get over ourselves. We all want to fight because we think we're right, but in reality, we all sin, we all do wrong. None of us are perfect, and therefore, none of us can say that someone else is wrong.

 

[TrackerSam]

Maybe if we (the US) had, decades ago, stopped interfering in their nations and causing, directly or Indirectly, the deaths of Muslims, the radicals wouldn't feel so strongly about killing us in retaliation. :twocents:

Since 9/11, Islamists have committed 18,161 terrorist acts globally. The main cause of Muslim deaths are other Muslims.
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/Pages/TheList.htm

Are we to believe that all of these attacks are the result of interference in Muslim countries?

Islamic terrorism (Arabic: إرهاب إسلامي‎ ʾirhāb ʾislām&#299 refers to acts of terrorism committed by Muslims for the purpose of achieving varying political and/or religious ends. Islamic terrorism has been identified as taking place in the Middle East, Africa, Europe, Southeast Asia, and the United States since the 1970s.
Islamic terrorism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And here's a partial map.