Lowe's Pulls Ads From American Muslim Time Slot

[Trident]

No one forced Lowe's to choose to advertise on the show, but THEY DID. Lowe's pulled their ads because of pressure from bigoted groups and completely deserve the backlash they are getting.

It is never okay to show prejudice and bigotry against any group. The complaints by those opposing the show are extremely ignorant and small-minded. :banghead:

I respectfully disagree with the bolded part. I believe people should be allowed to feel the way they feel about any group. Following the politically correct herd makes no sense to me - I much prefer to be true to myself, and if I don't like, trust, believe in, or respect a certain group, I will be true to myself and my feelings no matter how many others think I'm bigotted, ignorant, small-minded, or anything else. The only thing I do feel is that all should have equal rights, and live free from violence.

 

[eileenhawkeye]

For a small company it comes down to $$$$$$ too. For medium sized companies as well. I doubt anyone would get bent out of shape if Lowes stopped advertising on the Duggars.

There would be a much bigger outrage if Lowe's stopped advertising on 19 Kids and Counting because of the Duggars' religious beliefs.

I respectfully disagree with the bolded part. I believe people should be allowed to feel the way they feel about any group. Following the politically correct herd makes no sense to me - I much prefer to be true to myself, and if I don't like, trust, believe in, or respect a certain group, I will be true to myself and my feelings no matter how many others think I'm bigotted, ignorant, small-minded, or anything else. The only thing I do feel is that all should have equal rights, and live free from violence.

Um....are you basically admitting that there are certain groups of people you don't like? :waitasec:

BBM It is sad and disturbing, you're right. On this and several other threads we see several of the same posters over and over being apologists for bigotry. We all know who they are, and they can protest till the end of time that their beliefs aren't rooted in fear and prejudice but noone is fooled. What I don't understand is why they just don't stand up and own it??? If there is nothing wrong with bigotry, discrimination, prejudice, don't hide behind religion, just come out and say it. Life is going to continue to be harder and harder for these people however. White, Christian, heterosexual (and yes, I am one myself) Americans do not own this country.

I agree with you 100%. I am glad I don't know what it's like to go through life hating anyone who is a different race, religion, or sexual orientation than me.

 

[gitana1]

When I was growing up I thought Catholicism was THE religion. Even our popular President was Catholic. I had no idea there was prejudice against Catholics because that was my world.
Of course ,my world broadened as I got older and I discovered some people had real issues with Catholicism. I had a dear friend who kept talking about her neighbor ,a non-Christian . The woman had health issues and my friend was rallying help for her ,even though she wasn't a "Christian". Then ,during yet another plea for help ,my friend mentioned this woman was Catholic!! My friend doesn't believe Catholic's are real Christians!
That was an eye opener for me . She didn't know much abut Catholicism ,but made assumptions by the few things she had been told.
Was I doing that about others?

I'm 53 now and believe many paths can lead to God. My chosen path is to (try) follow the teachings of Jesus. Above all else(IMO),he teaches love and acceptance of all.

I have 2 favorite songs .One is "Let There Be Peace on Earth"

"Let there be Peace on Earth and let it begin with me.
Let there be Peace on Earth ,the peace that was meant to be.With God as our Father,Brothers all are we.Let me walk with my brother in perfect harmony."

The entire song is wonderful and worth a listen.I was raised in my religion to believe all races,all religions,all ethnicities and socio-economic classes,were equal and my brothers,at least,that's what I took away from it.. I was taught by my Naval Officer father that this is what made the United States of America so special.

The second is based on The Prayer of St. Francis and was my only request at my child's funeral service.I carry it in my wallet and should pull it out more often. I don't care what your beliefs are,it's good stuff : )
Susan Boyle does a wonderful rendition on her Christmas album "The Gift"

"Lord,make me an instrument of your peace.
Where there is hatred ,let me sow love.
Where there is injury,pardon,
Where there is doubt,faith,
Where there is despair,hope,
Where there is darkness,light,
and where there is sadness,ever joy.

O Master grant that I may never seek so much to be consoled as to console,
To be understood ,as to understand ,
To be loved as to love with all my heart;
For it is giving that we receive--
It is in pardoning that we are pardoned;
And it is in dying that we are born to eternal life.



Merry Christmas,everyone!

The Prayer of St Francis is my absolute favorite too! It hung on my wall as a child. I read it over and over. It really impacted me.

 

[TrackerSam]

I respectfully disagree with the bolded part. I believe people should be allowed to feel the way they feel about any group. Following the politically correct herd makes no sense to me - I much prefer to be true to myself, and if I don't like, trust, believe in, or respect a certain group, I will be true to myself and my feelings no matter how many others think I'm bigotted, ignorant, small-minded, or anything else. The only thing I do feel is that all should have equal rights, and live free from violence.

I agree with you 100%. I'm glad I don't go through life hating free speech.

 

[gitana1]

They pulled their ads based on low viewership or do you have a video taped confession of religious discrimination? Most shows don't make it past the first 13 weeks causing many actors "monies to dry up" - happens every year. How is Lowes responsible for the income of the cast? They're not. Most people in reality shows have jobs and the TV revenue is a boon. And again - Lowes was not the only company advertising on the show nor the only company to pull ads from this show. I suspect the ad contract they had with this show specified a certain level of viewership and an escape clause if an adequate level isn't realized. Even if Lowes was the only advertiser, the cast is employed by the producers of the show, not Lowes. If the producers can't find ad revenue it's Lowes fault?
Citing circumstances from other cases that Lowes was involved in proves nothing.

Nope. They pulled their ads due to pressure from anti-Muslim groups. It had nothing to do with low viewership:

The retailer stopped advertising on TLC's "All-American Muslim" after a conservative group known as the Florida Family Assn. complained, saying the program was "propaganda that riskily hides the Islamic agenda's clear and present danger to American liberties and traditional values."

Lowe's issued a statement Sunday apologizing for having "managed to make some people very unhappy."

"Individuals and groups have strong political and societal views on this topic, and this program became a lightning rod for many of those views," the statement said. "As a result we did pull our advertising on this program. We believe it is best to respectfully defer to communities, individuals and groups to discuss and consider such issues of importance."

http://mobile.latimes.com/p.p?a=rp&m=b&postId=1321716&curAbsIndex=0&resultsUrl=DID%3D6%26DFCL%3D1000%26DSB%3Drank%23desc%26DBFQ%3DuserId%3A7%26DL.w%3D%26DL.d%3D10%26DQ%3DsectionId%3A6220%26DPS%3D0%26DPL%3D3

 

[ziggy]

Just to be controversial: what if those who complained to Lowes don't like the Muslims' view on gays and their seeming willingness to diminish women? It's OK to not like groups who are Christian who are anti-gay, but do we know how these American Muslims feel about that subject? Is that shown on the show? If so wouldn't they be very fringe?

I have a ginger cousin who converted to Islam. Go figure. I have issues with it because I just don't feel she's sincere and if she ever did try to go to Mecca she would probably be in danger. That's a whole 'nother story but the religion as a whole, is not very woman or gay friendly.

 

[animlzrule]

I agree with you 100%. I'm glad I don't go through life hating free speech.

Free speech is great conceptually. It's the ugly, hateful, ignorant, bigoted speech that, while free and legal, does not deserve to be championed. It panders to the lowest denominator of society. We should be encouraging thoughtful, intelligent and enlightened speech. Thankfully, as time marches on, the ignorant will continue to be marginalized.....

 

[gitana1]

From the original link:



BBM

You beat me to it, Nova!

So if the show fails and the network cancels it, will the network be boycotted too?
Will the network be considered a bunch of bigots?

No. But that's not why Lowe's pulled their ads.

The show is not getting good ratings. It's just a fact.

Networks depend on sponsors and sponsors watch the ratings. It's also a fact.

I watched the show one time. I wanted to see for myself if it was good or not. It bored me.
I got through about 20 minutes.

It had nothing to do with them being Muslim, it had to do with the crickets I was hearing.

Shows like Kate plus eight and 19 Kids and Counting are chalked full of busy children and that interests me.

I was sad to see the 8 go. I would be sad to see the 19 go.
If All American Muslims goes, it will not bother me at all because I don't watch it.

Apparently I'm not alone.

Even the current controversy is not helping the ratings.

I just don't think it's a good show.

Again, that's not why Lowe's pulled the ads. They admitted it was because of pressure from groups who are anti-Muslim.

I watched a portion of the show. I didn't think it was very interesting. So, it could fail due to low ratings. So be it.

But...nowhere did Lowe's state that was the reason. They stated the opposite. If they hadn't admitted to pulling ads because people complained to them about a show featuring Muslims, we simply would not be having this conversation.

In any event, it looks like there are enough advertisers to keep the show running through the season:

Ad time for next Sunday's "All-American Muslim" episode is apparently sold out, despite Lowe's decision to pull its commercials from the TLC reality series, a TLC network spokeswoman said.

http://articles.cnn.com/2011-12-13/...-simmons-unsold-commercial-time?_s=PM:SHOWBIZ

 

[rossva]

I wonder if there are any American Muslim families here on WS, and, if so, why are they not protesting about Lowe's pulling it's advertising dollars? It would seem to me they would be the only ones who have a horse in this current race.

 

[gitana1]

Just to be controversial: what if those who complained to Lowes don't like the Muslims' view on gays and their seeming willingness to diminish women? It's OK to not like groups who are Christian who are anti-gay, but do we know how these American Muslims feel about that subject? Is that shown on the show? If so wouldn't they be very fringe?

I have a ginger cousin who converted to Islam. Go figure. I have issues with it because I just don't feel she's sincere and if she ever did try to go to Mecca she would probably be in danger. That's a whole 'nother story but the religion as a whole, is not very woman or gay friendly.

Fundamentalist Christianity isn't very woman or gay friendly either. But these people are not fundamentalists. They are moderate Muslims. They are being protested not because some in their religion share certain values with those protesting them, but because they seem too normal and thus are propagandizing Islam.

I have no problem with protesting bigotry. Sadly, that's not what this is about.

 

[ziggy]

Looks like it's possible the attention the show has garnered by Lowes pulling their ads has made people want to watch it. I must admit I had not heard of it before then and am curious. And there you go...it may have saved the show from low ratings.

 

[gitana1]

I wonder if there are any American Muslim families here on WS, and, if so, why are they not protesting about Lowe's pulling it's advertising dollars? It would seem to me they would be the only ones who have a horse in this current race.

I think every proud American has a horse in the race when other Americans are stereotyped and discriminated against as a result of those negative stereotypes. Such behavior is un-American to me. It's not what we, as a nation, stand for.

Those who remain silent are as bad as those who attempt to marginalize and discriminate against an entire group of people for nothing more than their race or religion.

 

[Trident]

<snipped>

Um....are you basically admitting that there are certain groups of people you don't like? :waitasec:.

Yes, I am.

 

[Trident]

I think every proud American has a horse in the race when other Americans are stereotyped and discriminated against as a result of those negative stereotypes. Such behavior is un-American to me. It's not what we, as a nation, stand for.

Those who remain silent are as bad as those who attempt to marginalize and discriminate against an entire group of people for nothing more than their race or religion.

Most people on here have ancestors from foreign countries. Our likes and dislikes are as divurgent as the countries our ancestors came from and, I, for one am glad of it. It would be a terrible thing to be cut out of the same stamp as everyone else. Freedom of speech, religion, and thought are very precious to me. If everyone in this country had huddled together and obeyed old King George there never would have been an American Revolution in which brother did fight against brother, and whole families were torn apart - all for those freedoms which some don't feel everyone should have. Then there is the Civil War fought for vastly different rights and freedoms, and I'm proud to say my ancestors fought in almost every war in this country - they died so I could think the way I want to and say what I have on my mind, whether in correct politicaleeze or not.

Diversity of speech and thought is what made America great, not UNAmerican. Cookie cutter people will finish off this once great country quicker than opposing thoughts and ideas. In fact, I see signs of it already.

 

[Nova]

Good for Lowe's. Whatever, if it hurts "Islam," it's pretty much fine with me. Personally, I'd rather see a program featuring artists drawing Muhammad, or examining the jesus myth.

IMO religion deserves nothing but discourteousy, contempt, ridicule, and derision. The "holy" books of both islam and christianity are little more than regurgitated primitive tribal superstitions of ancient peoples (who happened to be tirelessly obsessed with blood, violence, and both animal and human sacrifices).

Well, that was a bit harsher than I would put it, but I do see marauder's point.

Myself, I don't mind a thoughtful discussion of religion, but that seems to displease almost everyone, as so many true believers don't really want their beliefs questioned.

While reading the posts on this thread, I've been wondering how many of the posters who are applauding Lowe's and its decision would feel the same if Lowe's had withdrawn advertising from a Christian-themed program because of protests by atheists. I'm sure everyone will claim they are defending freedom of speech (even though nobody here has called for government intervention), but I wonder...

 

[Trident]

Well, that was a bit harsher than I would put it, but I do see marauder's point.

Myself, I don't mind a thoughtful discussion of religion, but that seems to displease almost everyone, as so many true believers don't really want their beliefs questioned.

While reading the posts on this thread, I've been wondering how many of the posters who are applauding Lowe's and its decision would feel the same if Lowe's had withdrawn advertising from a Christian-themed program because of protests by atheists. I'm sure everyone will claim they are defending freedom of speech (even though nobody here has called for government intervention), but I wonder...

Ummm :waitasec: I believe that's already happened when nativity scenes were banned from public places. After all, Jesus IS the reason for the season, like in CHRIST mas.

 

[Nova]

I respectfully disagree with the bolded part. I believe people should be allowed to feel the way they feel about any group. Following the politically correct herd makes no sense to me - I much prefer to be true to myself, and if I don't like, trust, believe in, or respect a certain group, I will be true to myself and my feelings no matter how many others think I'm bigotted, ignorant, small-minded, or anything else. The only thing I do feel is that all should have equal rights, and live free from violence.

Being bigoted and small-minded has nothing to do with being true, to yourself or anyone else.

That isn't to say some groups don't earn our disapproval through their actions. But that has nothing to do with clinging to our prejudices just to avoid the dreaded "PC" label.

 

[Nova]

Ummm :waitasec: I believe that's already happened when nativity scenes were banned from public places. After all, Jesus IS the reason for the season, like in CHRIST mas.

Utter nonsense! Winter festivals were celebrated almost everywhere long before the time of Jesus. And Jesus wasn't born on December 25 anyway. It was Christians who "stole" the winter festival, not pagans who "stole" Christmas.

Surely everyone knows this by now!

That many people choose to celebrate Jesus as part of their winter festival is their business, but the whining about the lack of nativity scenes on public property has really gotten old.

 

[gitana1]

Most people on here have ancestors from foreign countries. Our likes and dislikes are as divurgent as the countries our ancestors came from and, I, for one am glad of it. It would be a terrible thing to be cut out of the same stamp as everyone else. Freedom of speech, religion, and thought are very precious to me. If everyone in this country had huddled together and obeyed old King George there never would have been an American Revolution in which brother did fight against brother, and whole families were torn apart - all for those freedoms which some don't feel everyone should have. Then there is the Civil War fought for vastly different rights and freedoms, and I'm proud to say my ancestors fought in almost every war in this country - they died so I could think the way I want to and say what I have on my mind, whether in correct politicaleeze or not.

Diversity of speech and thought is what made America great, not UNAmerican. Cookie cutter people will finish off this once great country quicker than opposing thoughts and ideas. In fact, I see signs of it already.

Diversity of speech is one thing. Bigotry is another. We can try to drape hatred, ugliness and ignorance in as many fancy words as exist, "free speech" "un PC", try to equate hate with our forefathers liberating themselves from the British, etc., but bigotry has nothing to do with "diversity".

Diversity has to do with intelligent, opposing viewpoints, not blanket disgust or dislike of a person, their race, religion or sexuality, due to uneducated stereotypes or generalizations. Our principle of protecting speech should not be confused with accepting speech that is hateful, oppressive or ugly. Just because it is legal does not mean it is right, nor that the principles of our nation condone it.

Utter nonsense! Winter festivals were celebrated almost everywhere long before the time of Jesus. And Jesus wasn't born on December 25 anyway. It was Christians who "stole" the winter festival, not pagans who "stole" Christmas.

Surely everyone knows this by now!

That many people choose to celebrate Jesus as part of their winter festival is their business, but the whining about the lack of nativity scenes on public property has really gotten old.

Hey, I see nativity scenes in different cities all around Orange County on public property. Got a beautiful one in the circle in old Orange. And while it's true that pagan winter solstice festivals were adapted into Christmas, (same as spring solstice became Easter and fall equinox became Halloween), and many of the pagan traditions, like giving gifts, pretty lights, using greenery as decoration, donating to charity, all predate Christmas as part of yule celebrations, a Christ-centered Christmas is part of our American culture.

Of course, I love Christmas so I guess it's harder for me to be critical, but as long as people aren't being forced to participate or discriminated against if they don't, and other religions are given equal time if they want it, it seems fair to me.

And our laws appear to agree. They allow nativity scenes on public lands as long as equal time is afforded to others who may want menorahs or crescent moons or whatever.

 

[Nova]

...Hey, I see nativity scenes in different cities all around Orange County on public property. Got a beautiful one in the circle in old Orange. And while it's true that pagan winter solstice festivals were adapted into Christmas, (same as spring solstice became Easter and fall equinox became Halloween), and many of the pagan traditions, like giving gifts, pretty lights, using greenery as decoration, donating to charity, all predate Christmas as part of yule celebrations, a Christ-centered Christmas is part of our American culture.

Of course, I love Christmas so I guess it's harder for me to be critical, but as long as people aren't being forced to participate or discriminated against if they don't, and other religions are given equal time if they want it, it seems fair to me.

And our laws appear to agree. They allow nativity scenes on public lands as long as equal time is afforded to others who may want menorahs or crescent moons or whatever.

Thank you for the clarification on the law, gitana1. I shouldn't have used the phrase "public lands"; that is really much too broad. (Though it's still narrower than "public places", which was how the ban was originally defined here. That's obviously not true.)

Personally, I'd prefer we have no religious symbols on places that represent civil authority: including courthouses and city halls. (Yes, I know, too late: every courtroom in the nation has "In God We Trust" engraved above the bench. And I admit I'd make exceptions for military installations, which are certainly places that represent authority.)

I just don't see why we need a nativity scene at City Hall. It's all very well to say other religions may put up their own displays, but (a) why should they have to engage in a competition, and (b) what sort of display will atheists be allowed? My guess is anything the latter do will only lead to more conflict and complaints.

We already publicly subsidize churches, temples and mosques by exempting them from taxes. Why can't religious displays go there?

***

That a Christ-centered Christmas is an American tradition carries no weight with me. I'm sure we both can list some truly heinous things that are also American traditions. (I'm not saying nativity scenes are heinous, just that tradition isn't much of a defense in my book.)

***

But mostly I'm just tired of the whining that pops up every year about a so-called "War on Christmas." The darn holiday now starts the day after Labor Day, how much more Christmas do we need?

There. Now you all have me whining about whining. I blame religion.