Michelle Young. Murdered Pregnant Mom, NC Part 11

[Samiya]

As we have no idea of what the crime scene looks like, it's impossible to tell how long the attack went for.

The perp may have been holding her down yelling at her for god knows how long. 'He' may have paused sometime during the attack then thought to give her more to make sure she was out of the picture. It is not unheard of where a perp has thought the victim to be dead, then the victim moves slightly (or goes into death throes, yes bodies do spasm) and they panic thinking they are still alive and begin attacking again....so 10 to 15 minutes is not impossible, unfortunately.

Someone who begins strangling a person will almost always finish 'the job' unless the victim is able to fully escape the situation or is extremely 'lucky'. And if a perp is unsuccessful at the strangulation, they then tend to bludgeon or knife their victims repeatedly. Once a person begins to murder someone by strangulation, it's not as though they can fail and think to themselves "oh well, that didn't work, I'll do it another time".

Sometimes that 'rage' is actually directed at themselves as they see themselves as a failure, not being able to complete a 'simple' task as strangling someone. That rage then turns outward at the victim and the result is often 'overkill'.

Sami

 

[raisincharlie]

As we have no idea of what the crime scene looks like, it's impossible to tell how long the attack went for.

The perp may have been holding her down yelling at her for god knows how long. 'He' may have paused sometime during the attack then thought to give her more to make sure she was out of the picture. It is not unheard of where a perp has thought the victim to be dead, then the victim moves slightly (or goes into death throes, yes bodies do spasm) and they panic thinking they are still alive and begin attacking again....so 10 to 15 minutes is not impossible, unfortunately.

Someone who begins strangling a person will almost always finish 'the job' unless the victim is able to fully escape the situation or is extremely 'lucky'. And if a perp is unsuccessful at the strangulation, they then tend to bludgeon or knife their victims repeatedly. Once a person begins to murder someone by strangulation, it's not as though they can fail and think to themselves "oh well, that didn't work, I'll do it another time".

Sometimes that 'rage' is actually directed at themselves as they see themselves as a failure, not being able to complete a 'simple' task as strangling someone. That rage then turns outward at the victim and the result is often 'overkill'.

Sami

Sami,

I think there is some length to this event as well. Sheriff Harrison's statement about it - abrupt as it was seems IMO to say this was not a short duration battle so to speak. "There was a struggle and I'll just stop at that."

Got me wondering again about those wedding photos as in being thrown or broken...

ETA -from WRAL:

"Despite the appearance of defensive wounds on her hands and the fact a hair was found in her hand, authorities haven't said what they have learned from the autopsy that might help their investigation.

"There was a struggle, and let me just stop at that," Harrison said."

 

[strach304]

After going over the posts of everyone else about the beating and the new info brought up about the hit to her mouth does anyone besides me get that *feeling* about who and why someone would punch a woman in the mouth like that? I can easily feel the whole thing from a certain perspective from having experienced severe domestic violence that goes from argument to extreme violence that did result in much trauma to the face and strangulation, etc. Something real odd but telling about punching a woman in the mouth or if it was even an object she was hit with in Scandi's scenario (I think) as that being the first blow. In my mind either Michele was screaming or yelling screaming type thing that whatever she was saying enraged that person (a man imo) enough to hit her in the mouth to shut her up and the start of the strangulation and probably hair pulling ensued. Maybe as RC suggested a vicious type strangle hold and then the object picked up or taken from her that the deadly blows immediately followed. Very telling imo to hit a woman in the face to begin with but the mouth as opposed to the nose or eye, etc. being purposeful. There was a recent case I saw where there was no previous domestic violence ever at all but that one and only time where the husband hit his wife then turned into a murder that he committed to cover up the crime of hitting her in the first place. It was an older couple and not high profile so mostly a headline thing I saw and just remembered but it was strange and certainly unexpected. At no time did my ex ever hit me in the mouth or start choking me unless he was trying to shut me up. First time for everything they say so I can envision from the feel of things and what we know so far in this case a marital argument over the affair discovery maybe and once that first but powerful hit made contact there was no turning back.

 

[raisincharlie]

<snip> Very telling imo to hit a woman in the face to begin with but the mouth as opposed to the nose or eye, etc. being purposeful. There was a recent case I saw where there was no previous domestic violence ever at all but that one and only time where the husband hit his wife then turned into a murder that he committed to cover up the crime of hitting her in the first place. It was an older couple and not high profile so mostly a headline thing I saw and just remembered but it was strange and certainly unexpected. At no time did my ex ever hit me in the mouth or start choking me unless he was trying to shut me up. First time for everything they say so I can envision from the feel of things and what we know so far in this case a marital argument over the affair discovery maybe and once that first but powerful hit made contact there was no turning back.

Strach,

You've explained my thoughts better than I could actually. I do think he punched her in the mouth and this was the first actual "blow". I definitely do not think he liked what she was saying at all nor do I think it necessarily achieved in quieting her. I do believe there was a heated argument prior to the physical aspect and for some reason I don't think this was by any means the first heated argument. For some reason I do not think MY was unaware of things going on with JY. From watching the funeral videos I do not think either LF or MF were unaware either. JMO of course. Sorry about your first hand experience - glad you are away.

 

[panthera]

You've explained my thoughts better than I could actually. I do think he punched her in the mouth and this was the first actual "blow". I definitely do not think he liked what she was saying at all nor do I think it necessarily achieved in quieting her. I do believe there was a heated argument prior to the physical aspect and for some reason I don't think this was by any means the first heated argument.

Wouldn't that have then awakened Cassidy and she would've heard her daddy's voice yelling at Michelle? Might be why she said what she did to Meredith during the 911 call?

 

[scandi]

Hi Everyone ;}

I think you hit the nail on the head Strach with your assesment. I think so many women would attest to having experiences like this. I did too. As an artist my eyes mean everything to my work, and I was kicked so hard in the eye it knocked my retina loose and they had to sew it back in place. Then he hit me in the same eye 2 weeks later and the sack holing my lens broke and had to have another operation to remove the lens.

I am over that and he has long been out of my life {thanks to a lot of help from my WS friends here} but it is a case in point.

I also agree with you Charlie that Michelle probably said something that brought him to a boiling point.

 

[raisincharlie]

Wouldn't that have then awakened Cassidy and she would've heard her daddy's voice yelling at Michelle? Might be why she said what she did to Meredith during the 911 call?

Panthera

I want to live in this little world that says Cassidy saw nothing, no voices or dog barking heard to awaken her, but I have serious doubts that it is anything other than my own fairy tale. JMO

 

[raisincharlie]

Hi Everyone ;}

I think you hit the nail on the head Strach with your assesment. I think so many wqomen would attest to having experiences like this. I did too. As an artist my eyes mean everything to my work, and I was kicked so hard in the eye it knocked my retina loose and they had to sew it back in place. Then he hit me in the same eye 2 weeks later and the sack holing my lens broke and had to have another operation to remove the lens.

I am over that and he has long been out of my life {thanks to a lot of help from my WS friends here} but it is a case in point.

I also agree with you Charlie that Michelle probably said something that brought him to a boiling point.

Scandi,

If you ever need a hitman -call me. No charge, will take him for a nice horse ride.

 

[Bee Charmer]

Hi Everyone ;}

I think you hit the nail on the head Strach with your assesment. I think so many wqomen would attest to having experiences like this. I did too. As an artist my eyes mean everything to my work, and I was kicked so hard in the eye it knocked my retina loose and they had to sew it back in place. Then he hit me in the same eye 2 weeks later and the sack holing my lens broke and had to have another operation to remove the lens.

I am over that and he has long been out of my life {thanks to a lot of help from my WS friends here} but it is a case in point.

I also agree with you Charlie that Michelle probably said something that brought him to a boiling point.

I am so sorry you had
to experience such terrible things in your life Scandi and am very glad
you are safe and sound now.

Mr. RC, you are a true gentleman.

 

[scandi]

Yes, He is so cafvalier. I love it!

You know Bee, I couldn't see what was really happening to me as I always thought he'd change and then he felt so awful. It is a hard syndrome to break out of. Now that I have learned so much about it I wish other gals in similiar situations could learn before they get hurt.

I think Laci was abused by Scott. Just a feeling, and I think a lot of that was verbal. I read on a blog that JY and Michelle did a lot of verbal fighting, and this form of verbal abuse is just a predacessor to physical violence I think.

 

[jilly]

Strach I agree with you. I think it's very possible how that went down - Michelle was a better match for words and I'm guessing she had a pretty big mouthful for him. Out of frustration - like many men - he hit her in the mouth to shut her up. That must have made him feel like he then had some control because he then went on to choke her.

I agree also - at this point he knew he was 'done' anyways so thought he had nothing to lose by killing her. Angry now at her for what she has made him do, he goes berserk to make sure there will be no divorce or him losing Cassidy.

 

[jilly]

Scandi I am so very sorry to learn of your horrible experience. Thank God you got out of that alive! :blowkiss:

 

[otto]

Hi Everyone ;}

I think you hit the nail on the head Strach with your assesment. I think so many women would attest to having experiences like this. I did too. As an artist my eyes mean everything to my work, and I was kicked so hard in the eye it knocked my retina loose and they had to sew it back in place. Then he hit me in the same eye 2 weeks later and the sack holing my lens broke and had to have another operation to remove the lens.

I am over that and he has long been out of my life {thanks to a lot of help from my WS friends here} but it is a case in point.

I also agree with you Charlie that Michelle probably said something that brought him to a boiling point.

I'm just wondering about something ... if a woman knows that a man is prone to anger and violence, wouldn't she be more careful about she says - sort of like walking on eggshells to avoid triggering an episode?

 

[strach304]

I'm glad I got some constructive conversation going on this board based on so many good thoughts from our posters experiences and intuition and opinion. Panthera, the voice is a very good thought indeed. I've said previously that both of my daughters at age 2 1/2 could clearly tell anyone anything that they witnessed at that age so it is probable that she heard rather than saw. Was maybe put back to sleep and then the murder occured? Next thing she new was finding her mother that morning and remembered daddy there yelling?

RC, just by being male you are able to bring much value to the table and seem to get exactly what I mean even without being on the receiving end of many of my proposed scenarios including the strangling.

Scandi, I know the force behind involved dislodging a retina from a disease a very dear one has. I don't wanna be too specific since my anonymity is crucial. The original diagnosis was that a very severe injury from extreme trauma was the cause of the retina being seperated but it turned out to be Coates disease unfortunately and caused total blindness. Many surgeries saved the eye from having to be removed but she will never see with it.

I hope something breaks in this case soon as it's very frustrating and needs resolution. The kidnapping cases were a huge distraction and then we got the autopsy info. I've been reading the ctv boards and even got re- registered to post because of that sickening fan fiction one but by the time I could I was over it and CW locked it and deleted that crap exactly like I wanted. Love to know who that poster was as CW indicated the two nics being used. Might not be anything other than a trouble maker anyway since they were very uninformed on pertinent known facts of the case anyway. Check back later.

 

[raisincharlie]

I'm glad I got some constructive conversation going on this board based on so many good thoughts from our posters experiences and intuition and opinion. Panthera, the voice is a very good thought indeed. I've said previously that both of my daughters at age 2 1/2 could clearly tell anyone anything that they witnessed at that age so it is probable that she heard rather than saw. Was maybe put back to sleep and then the murder occured? Next thing she new was finding her mother that morning and remembered daddy there yelling?

RC, just by being male you are able to bring much value to the table and seem to get exactly what I mean even without being on the receiving end of many of my proposed scenarios including the strangling.

Scandi, I know the force behind involved dislodging a retina from a disease a very dear one has. I don't wanna be too specific since my anonymity is crucial. The original diagnosis was that a very severe injury from extreme trauma was the cause of the retina being seperated but it turned out to be Coates disease unfortunately and caused total blindness. Many surgeries saved the eye from having to be removed but she will never see with it.

I hope something breaks in this case soon as it's very frustrating and needs resolution. The kidnapping cases were a huge distraction and then we got the autopsy info. I've been reading the ctv boards and even got re- registered to post because of that sickening fan fiction one but by the time I could I was over it and CW locked it and deleted that crap exactly like I wanted. Love to know who that poster was as CW indicated the two nics being used. Might not be anything other than a trouble maker anyway since they were very uninformed on pertinent known facts of the case anyway. Check back later.

Strach,

You need to try Sami's exercise - it puts some of the autopsy right into perspective - pretty awakening exercise. Of course my wife thinks I'm nuts but Sami is brilliant... go figure!!:crazy:

 

[jilly]

I'm just wondering about something ... if a woman knows that a man is prone to anger and violence, wouldn't she be more careful about she says - sort of like walking on eggshells to avoid triggering an episode?

I don't think the eggshell part sets in until after the first beating. I don't think there was physical abuse in this relationship - maybe a lot of arguing but nothing physical. I would guess that MY like many women make it clear from the beginning that they wouldn't put up with physical abuse.

This had to be an argument related to MM or other women, imo & I think MY might have been calling it quits.

 

[otto]

I don't think the eggshell part sets in until after the first beating. I don't think there was physical abuse in this relationship - maybe a lot of arguing but nothing physical. I would guess that MY like many women make it clear from the beginning that they wouldn't put up with physical abuse.

This had to be an argument related to MM or other women, imo & I think MY might have been calling it quits.

I guess I'm having a problem with the theory that Jason was in the house, an argument ensued, Michelle said something that made Jason really mad and Michelle was murdered.

We know that he left the house for a business meeting in the early evening when Michelle had company. He was gone for a couple of hours. Why would he return to the house? It would surprise me that he would talk on the phone and then drive a couple of hours home in the middle of the night to continue the discussion, only to become really mad and commit the almost perfect murder complete with alibi. I guess I'm wondering what he was doing at the house prior to being provoked by Michelle.

 

[jilly]

I guess I'm having a problem with the theory that Jason was in the house, an argument ensued, Michelle said something that made Jason really mad and Michelle was murdered.

We know that he left the house for a business meeting in the early evening when Michelle had company. He was gone for a couple of hours. Why would he return to the house? It would surprise me that he would talk on the phone and then drive a couple of hours home in the middle of the night to continue the discussion, only to become really mad and commit the almost perfect murder complete with alibi. I guess I'm wondering what he was doing at the house prior to being provoked by Michelle.

I don't really know either - unless maybe it was her that called him at 11pm. If she had found out about him and her best friend - she must have been livid. Just thinking....if that was me I wouldn't have waited until the next day or two to confront him either.

I really don't know Otto. Here's another guy who was living a double life. He had a lot to lose.



I think this friend that was over watching GA just might have some answers.

 

[otto]

I don't really know either - unless maybe it was her that called him at 11pm. If she had found out about him and her best friend - she must have been livid. Just thinking....if that was me I wouldn't have waited until the next day or two to confront him either.

I really don't know Otto. Here's another guy who was living a double life. He had a lot to lose.

I think this friend that was over watching GA just might have some answers.

I'm just going on what I know about professional guys that want to keep their jobs, or at least give the right impression at work. Even if there is a family problem, like their wife just found out about an affair, I think they're more likely to follow through on the meeting or work commitments. I think the guy will hope that when he goes home ... with flowers and humble apologies ... his wife will have calmed down a bit.

I don't think that Jason would just blow off his work commitments and race home to talk about his affair ... after all, there wasn't much he could do about it at midnight and all he would do is end up with a bigger problem, and no sleep for the meeting the next day. It doesn't make sense to me that he would be at the house because Michelle found out about the affair. In fact, I don't see any reasonable explanation for him being at the house except to murder her and then she wouldn't have to say anything to provoke him because he'd already made up his mind.

 

[happy2bn10ec]

What exercise??? My inquiring mind wants to know!

Awww - I bet you are you talking about the experiments you did when you were in FL? Why else would your wife think you're nuts???

Strach,

You need to try Sami's exercise - it puts some of the autopsy right into perspective - pretty awakening exercise. Of course my wife thinks I'm nuts but Sami is brilliant... go figure!!:crazy: