Missouri - The Springfield Three--missing since June 1992 - #15

[Nixaeagle]

He’s been dead over two years now .

 

[Talullah]

So what's everyone think of the coke can? Do you think it came from Janelle's or perhaps they stopped somewhere on the way home?

When I go to Springfield I want to explore a few different places. I was going to go on June 6, but with Covid-19 I'm not sure it's the best time to travel. I was going to attend the memorial if they have one. There are also a few other people I'd like to speak with in person. I'm not sure when I'm going now, perhaps towards the fall. I will make videos though so that anyone who wishes can view what I do when I'm there. I've been trying to see who now owns the Old Robb Farm and If they would let me explore it. Of Course I want everything the right way with everyone's permission. I'd be interested in meeting Kathee Baird just to see what she thinks. I'd take it with a grain of salt of course. As with everyone, including myself. I also don't plan on going alone.

Larry Hall lives in my State of North Carolina. I am trying to write to him to see if he's allowed to have visitors and if he'd be willing to speak with me in prison. I know where he is, just unsure if he'd speak with me. I'm also writing to Robert Cox as well, and would also speak with him in person if he'd allow me. Do I think these men will spill their secrets to me? No. That would be idiotic. But I would like to hear what they think while also looking into their eyes. I'm pretty good at telling when someone's lying to me.

I also plan on contacting Gary Hall as well to see if he'd be willing to speak with me in person or on the phone.

I've also been in contact with someone who lived in Springfield at the time and is going to show me around. Again, I'm taking someone else with me so I don't think safety will be an issue. I know this may be a little extreme but the only question I can ask myself is why not? Why not do all of this? I'm sure not all of these men would be willing to speak with me, but I have been in contact with a few people already known to this case, and want to hear as many perspectives as possible.

I haven’t thought much about the Coke can but it wouldn’t surprise me if there was a 12 pack in the refrigerator. I read the people at Delmar the next day helped themselves to chips and dip so it’s not much of a stretch to think Sherrill kept snack soft drinks on hand. People are different but few things settle my stomach like a cold Coke-though a warm Coke works better for some.
It’s awesome that you’re taking the initiative and are able to go to Springfield to look for answers to your questions. I think taking someone is a wise move. I’m interested in what you learn about the Halls. With so much focus on Garrison and his “prime” info I haven’t given them much thought.

 

[Jdgreene]

Could you provide some context for this passage? Where and when was this found?

It’s on one of the sticky threads. Either in the images or media only thread. One of the last posts I believe.

 

[Woofbark]

I haven’t thought much about the Coke can but it wouldn’t surprise me if there was a 12 pack in the refrigerator. I read the people at Delmar the next day helped themselves to chips and dip so it’s not much of a stretch to think Sherrill kept snack soft drinks on hand. People are different but few things settle my stomach like a cold Coke-though a warm Coke works better for some.
It’s awesome that you’re taking the initiative and are able to go to Springfield to look for answers to your questions. I think taking someone is a wise move. I’m interested in what you learn about the Halls. With so much focus on Garrison and his “prime” info I haven’t given them much thought.

I would be quick and covert in your investigation. If you wake a sleeping dog, he may bite you.

 

[Seeker994]

I would be quick and covert in your investigation. If you wake a sleeping dog, he may bite you.

I'll take my chances! A murder or rapist doesn't deserve to live freely without consequence. Honestly, had they never had the nerve to do such a thing it wouldn't even be an issue. Plus I'm 26. Whoever did this is most likely 50+. I'll take my chances.

 

[Betty P]

I'll take my chances! A murder or rapist doesn't deserve to live freely without consequence. Honestly, had they never had the nerve to do such a thing it wouldn't even be an issue. Plus I'm 26. Whoever did this is most likely 50+. I'll take my chances.

Hi, if you're planning for an autumn trip, let me know. I'm planning my regular trip to the family home town area that's near Springfield. I stayed in and visited Springfield for work for several years back in the 70's and 80's, so am a little familiar with the area.

 

[Woofbark]

I'll take my chances! A murder or rapist doesn't deserve to live freely without consequence. Honestly, had they never had the nerve to do such a thing it wouldn't even be an issue. Plus I'm 26. Whoever did this is most likely 50+. I'll take my chances.

That's exactly the answer I was hoping for. Will you be taking metal detectors or other special equipment? I'm glad there are people like you who are willing to help solve these cases. Keep us posted on your progress.

 

[Seeker994]

I've talked to a few, and plan on trying to talk to a few others known to this case. @cherrymeg and I just watched the Horror movie of this case that came out last year. It was definitely a B movie. Lol. It also spins a certain narrative.

I would also like to add that Logically I know that I will not be the person to solve this case. But I can do my best to help inform others that a majority of this case is rumor and speculation, and perhaps someday, that will help someone else solve this crime.

 

[Woofbark]

I hope you all know how much I appreciate all of you for thinking about the women. This Rabbit Hole of a case can be frustrating. I can't imagine how the family feels. It's driven me crazy in a short amount of time. I can't imagine 28 years.

There are two things I "know" about this case.

1) The Women Didn't Disappear on their own.
2) After all this time, whoever did this has no conscience.

As far as finding them, could this be a possibility? Keep in mind age is only estimated and could be off either way.

 

[Missouri Mule]

I touched on this earlier but there hasn’t been much discussion.

I have been operating on the assumption that the third member of the crypt vandals was not in Springfield at the time the women went missing but was in Illinois. That does not appear to be correct.

If that is the case, why was all the emphasis on Dustin Recla and Michael Clay? If Riedel was in town obviously he would have had the opportunity, one of the three pillars of all crime; means, motive and opportunity. This is not to say he was involved but why was he not investigated as thoroughly as were Recla and Clay?

I had ruled all three out but in view of this have revised my suspect list. We seem to have had all the emphasis on Garrison, Cox and Carnahan. I just don’t see Garrison or his two friends as capable of this crime. I do believe either Cox or Carnahan was with Cox the more likely. And contrary to what many believe, Cox is no dummy. Carnahan got by for so long due to strong arming those who could put him away.

 

[Missouri Mule]

I'll take my chances! A murder or rapist doesn't deserve to live freely without consequence. Honestly, had they never had the nerve to do such a thing it wouldn't even be an issue. Plus I'm 26. Whoever did this is most likely 50+. I'll take my chances.

I agree, But if a classmate was involved he or she would only be in their mid to late 40’s.

We have to remember that whoever this was was let in because one of the three women must have recognized the perp as trustworthy.

 

[Seratonin]

 

[Alexsea]

I agree, But if a classmate was involved he or she would only be in their mid to late 40’s.

We have to remember that whoever this was was let in because one of the three women must have recognized the perp as trustworthy.

I havebeen tracking since I joined from thread one and rarely chime in because I don’t really know what I think. But I do think we need to account for an anomaly in behavior. What if just this one night guards were down and a perp not usually accepted was let in by someone. It was a weird night with lots happening and many interactions with graduating folks and friends and families who the girls didnt necessarily Usually see. Someone odd in the driveway THAT night might be less unusual than some other night.

 

[KickapooGrad04]

I touched on this earlier but there hasn’t been much discussion.

I have been operating on the assumption that the third member of the crypt vandals was not in Springfield at the time the women went missing but was in Illinois. That does not appear to be correct.

If that is the case, why was all the emphasis on Dustin Recla and Michael Clay? If Riedel was in town obviously he would have had the opportunity, one of the three pillars of all crime; means, motive and opportunity. This is not to say he was involved but why was he not investigated as thoroughly as were Recla and Clay?

I had ruled all three out but in view of this have revised my suspect list. We seem to have had all the emphasis on Garrison, Cox and Carnahan. I just don’t see Garrison or his two friends as capable of this crime. I do believe either Cox or Carnahan was with Cox the more likely. And contrary to what many believe, Cox is no dummy. Carnahan got by for so long due to strong arming those who could put him away.

Riedel certainly has motive. As does Recla and Clay. And they could have had help from criminals. Any reasons to not think he could have done it? I do not agree that someone just "had to be trusted"...it's possible one of the women saw someone they didn't necessarily trust, but knew enough that no matter what they should comply.

 

[pittsburghgirl]

I agree, But if a classmate was involved he or she would only be in their mid to late 40’s.

We have to remember that whoever this was was let in because one of the three women must have recognized the perp as trustworthy.

I'm not ready to assume that the women let in the perpetrator--It's possible that the perp knocked on the door and the girls answered, thinking it was a classmate or friend but found it was someone unexpected. Or they forgot to lock the door.

 

[Missouri Mule]

I’ve been doing some further study of Joe Riedel’s whereabouts on June 7, 1992. What seems to be true is that he was NOT in Springfield that night.

I apologize for bringing this up again but everything else seems to lead to dead ends.

I keep coming back to one male perpetrator who likely either was a cop or had police training or had studied on how to stage a crime scene. It is the only scenario that works for me.

How would the police have concluded this was a sexual assault? We are never told. Many other things are never explained. We are left to guess.

At this point this is one less suspect. Plus, the police have said none of the vandals were involved.

The most important unknown is the motive. Perhaps we have no choice but to accept what the police have said. Sexual assault by one perpetrator whose whereabouts were unknown from 9 PM until 6 AM and exhibited no previously unknown sexual deviancy tendencies.

 

[KickapooGrad04]

I’ve been doing some further study of Joe Riedel’s whereabouts on June 7, 1992. What seems to be true is that he was NOT in Springfield that night.

I apologize for bringing this up again but everything else seems to lead to dead ends.

I keep coming back to one male perpetrator who likely either was a cop or had police training or had studied on how to stage a crime scene. It is the only scenario that works for me.

How would the police have concluded this was a sexual assault? We are never told. Many other things are never explained. We are left to guess.

At this point this is one less suspect. Plus, the police have said none of the vandals were involved.

The most important unknown is the motive. Perhaps we have no choice but to accept what the police have said. Sexual assault by one perpetrator whose whereabouts were unknown from 9 PM until 6 AM and exhibited no previously unknown sexual deviancy tendencies.

What's your source on this? He was reported to be in town, and the paper came well after the vandal case itself and initial questioning of Riedel so that means they had enough time to coroborate. "Riedel left town shortly after the disappearance" it says it right there. Plus the Day 24 article backs it up.

Also Who is your source that they were cleared? Only one cop cleared them. Many cops say they aren't cleared. Moore says this in the upload. I also uploaded where it says Riedel was in town. Since he's one of the grave robbers, he's not cleared yet according to Moore (and the cops he's referencing). (3:55 mark of

)

Let me know your source Mule! Thanks!

 

[cherrymeg]

I touched on this earlier but there hasn’t been much discussion.

I have been operating on the assumption that the third member of the crypt vandals was not in Springfield at the time the women went missing but was in Illinois. That does not appear to be correct.

If that is the case, why was all the emphasis on Dustin Recla and Michael Clay? If Riedel was in town obviously he would have had the opportunity, one of the three pillars of all crime; means, motive and opportunity. This is not to say he was involved but why was he not investigated as thoroughly as were Recla and Clay?

I had ruled all three out but in view of this have revised my suspect list. We seem to have had all the emphasis on Garrison, Cox and Carnahan. I just don’t see Garrison or his two friends as capable of this crime. I do believe either Cox or Carnahan was with Cox the more likely. And contrary to what many believe, Cox is no dummy. Carnahan got by for so long due to strong arming those who could put him away.

Did Cox and Carnahan know each other? Garrison is a semi capable liar. He tried to pretend he knew where the women and possibly others were buried then walked away and kidnapped and raped a college student. His also is annoying in letters.

I have some questions about Carnahan and his actual guilt. I know it isn’t popular but I read the book ‘Murder on a Lonely Road...’ it seemed like the DNA was questionable. I’m obviously not an expert or anything but it also seemed like they were pushing for degraded DNA to match Carnahan. I always thought DNA is supposed to narrow down suspects because while its science it’s not always 100% . I did get that off a John Oliver video lol. If Carnahan was responsible for Jackie Johns he is likely responsible for two other murders if he isn’t than someone else is. It’s scary how many murderers can be in one town.

 

[Nixaeagle]

Cox didn’t associate with anyone . Per his estranged wife , he only even saw his son on holiday or a 10 second phone call . Several of his own family believe he is responsible for the 3MW . Doesn’t make it so , but pretty damming .

 

[KickapooGrad04]

Cox didn’t associate with anyone . Per his estranged wife , he only even saw his son on holiday or a 10 second phone call . Several of his own family believe he is responsible for the 3MW . Doesn’t make it so , but pretty damming .

Cox didn't do it if you look at the FBI statement in 1992 and Springfield Police Department's media release at the 20-year mark in 2012. They both say the suspect(s) are likely not people with a history of violent crimes. That rules out Cox. Keyword: Violent.

FBI Statement: FBI expert discusses abductions
SPD 2012 Statement: https://www.springfieldmo.gov/ArchiveCenter/ViewFile/Item/2003

That rules out all serial killers types too.