MN - Jacob Wetterling, 11, St. Joseph, 22 Oct 1989 - #3

[Trino]

concentric, Did I read this right?
This guy just decided to drive a truck full of boxes off his property the day after a neighbors child went missing?

No coincidence in my opinion.

Was it ever checked out where he took the boxes, were they burned, if so where and what was in them?...imo

The boxes were for a town festival/parade - something of the sort. They had been stored on the R property. I believe such boxes are still stored there. Still, if LE was on top of the case, they should have been checked.

 

[margaret_diane]

The boxes were for a town festival/parade - something of the sort. They had been stored on the R property. I believe such boxes are still stored there. Still, if LE was on top of the case, they should have been checked.

I agree they should have been checked.
-> WHY were the boxes being transported that day?
- > was there a festival or parade planned for the day after the abduction or in the days immediately following?? If not, where were they SUPPOSED to be taken to and WHY? (wishing I knew what was IN the boxes!).
-> How might history have changed if DR had just thought to SHOW investigators what was in the boxes as he left? Sure, it would have been foresight on his part, and might have caused MORE speculation (might have caused people to wonder why he might view himself as a potential suspect if no one had suggested the idea of him as a suspect)... but... still... its just another point that makes me go "hrmmmm"....

 

[human]

I know that there were items stored at the farm for a fair or something like that for this latest search, but I had never heard that's what the boxes were for that day at the time of Jacob's abduction.

 

[human]

Looking at the map, Lotus post #356, you can see what roads were there at the time, and it seems possible.

I don't think all of those roads were there.

I wish Lotus would come on and let us know.

Those are new housing developments and roads were put in.

As I said before, this is a long distance in the DARK with furrowed fields.

 

[margaret_diane]

What became of the flashlight that one of the boys was carrying? Could this have been used to illuminate the way through the woods for the perp? Just wondering. Perhaps he had a light source of his own hidden in his dark clothing??

NEW RUMOUR WHICH I HAD NOT HEARD BEFORE TODAY:
-> I have just found another site wherein a poster has provided the following information on the case:
- > Poster had a friend who was in a bar and saw an older guy playing a pulltabs game by himself at a table.
- > the friend bought a few of the games himself, and joined the guy at the table and struck up a conversation, which somehow turned to the topic of JW.
- > Apparently the older guy had his own theory of what happened to JW. Specifically, he thought that a road worker had taken JW, and noted his belief that IF there was a body to be disposed of, then a road being worked on would provide the perfect means to hide it, without a trace. Apparently the guy knew all about how roads were made, and indicated that there WAS some road work going on in the area at the time.
-> The friend told the poster this story a few times over the years, with consistency, and the friend noted his belief that he had played and talked with JW's killer. I do not know if the info was ever passed onto LE or not. Someone did ask the poster this question, but I didn't see a response.

Here is a link to the site in case anyone is interested.......the post in question is post #16, authored by someone sporting the username MN85.
http://forums.officer.com/forums/showthread.php?149193-Jacob-Wetterling&daysprune=-1#post2402588

 

[Mysterylover]

concentric, I think that we need someone to identify the distance across those fileds that are plowed with furrows.

A person would be walking at night carrying Jacob who weighed 75 pounds in the DARK.
This is not the city. There are not streetlights lighting up the night.

Balckness, walking across those fields? I can't see it.

The distance is huge.....

human, It seems clear to me, someone knew the lay of the land and the fields and knew where to walk that night, in the dark with no flashlight.

Interesting about Jacobs weight.
My daughter weighs 110 lbs., she is a marathon runner and has hiked over many mountains, the Olympic Nat. park, the Cascades and through Nepal as well as other places even in the snow. She tells me her back pack weighs around 75 lbs...

The point I'm trying to make is, seems most any man could carry a 75 lb. child across some fields, at least 500 yards.
I wonder what was done to J. to keep him from screaming?

Trino, I'd put my money on this simple theory as to some of the boxes being there BUT not all of the boxes being there...jmo

 

[human]

When road work is being done, it's with a crew.

Did a perp put the body in the road and then start the equipment up when now one was around?

Who has the keys to equipment?

No one would notice equipment running at odd hours?

The perp would have to park somewhere close to the roadwork by himself and hope no one noticed a car there?

Think how it looks when you see road work. See if it looks possible and how it could be done.

 

[human]

human, It seems clear to me, someone knew the lay of the land and the fields and knew where to walk that night, in the dark with no flashlight.

Interesting about Jacobs weight.
My daughter weighs 110 lbs., she is a marathon runner and has hiked over many mountains, the Olympic Nat. park, the Cascades and through Nepal as well as other places even in the snow. She tells me her back pack weighs around 75 lbs...

The point I'm trying to make is, seems most any man could carry a 75 lb. child across some fields, at least 500 yards.
I wonder what was done to J. to keep him from screaming?

Trino, I'd put my money on this simple theory as to some of the boxes being there BUT not all of the boxes being there...jmo

These would be plowed fields with furrows, so one would continually be tripping over them in the dark.

I feel carrying a back pack is a lot different than carrying a child.

I can carry a heavier back pack, but carrying a human is a lot different. They are not balanced properly like a backpack is with the proper pressure points on you back.

It isn't that I don't think that it can't be done, but there are much easier ways to get a kid than that.

 

[margaret_diane]

What year did pull tabs start?

When road work is being done, it's with a crew.

Did a perp put the body in the road and then start the equipment up when now one was around?

Who has the keys to equipment?

No one would notice equipment running at odd hours?

The perp would have to park somewhere close to the roadwork by himself and hope no one noticed a car there?

Think how it looks when you see road work. See if it looks possible and how it could be done.

I was just sitting here wondering about this, and about to begin a google search on road work! I'm not sure how plausible the theory is, and only posted it strictly because its one theory I hadn't yet heard. Interesting to note that at no point does the poster in the link say that the equipment was USED during, or in the days following the abduction. So unless the equipment were being used right at the time, how the heck could one get away with it (particularly with police and others scouring the area for one missing child?). Short of a tunnel under the road which might have been used as a possible escape route (?) I'm not sure I can see this as being legit. But -- its an interesting theory, and I'm willing to debate any theory regarding this case because the way I see it, the more we talk about every possibility, and dissect everything down to the basics and logistics -- the better the odds are that one day, somehow, we will collectively (with LE!) find the answers to what happened to Jacob!!

 

[human]

I don't think that the road work would have to be right there.

I think that it could have been anywhere.

Over the years, there have been so many people saying things.

The Wetterlings got prank calls right away from people pretending to be Jacob.

Everyone was on high alert and LE got thousands of tips that meant nothing. He was "seen" all over the US.

Maybe there were some good ones. I don't know.

 

[Mysterylover]

I actually was there on site the weekend after it happened.

Because of that, I know what the area looked like.

From the Tom thumb to the edge of the DR property, there were houses. Not real close together, but not very far apart. Just some more space than a typical suburban lot.

Then there was NOTHING but the DR property. Nothing.

There is no way someone could have run through the yards ahead of the boys.

There is no way a car could have passed them on the way there or on the way back without them noticing. This was a very narrow dirt road.

So where did this perp come from?

The perp had to be there .

So who is the perp? How did the perp know that the boys would be returning?

He may have not known for sure, but he was prepared in case they did....

Human, Did LE check if someone was visiting DR that weekend since his parents were out of town?
I have NO doubt a local was involved, very local...imo

Quote from Wikipedia:
In early 2009, Milwaukee police discovered child *advertiser censored* and an alleged video of Wetterling taken before the abduction in the home of Vernon Seitz, 62, of the St. Francis, Wisconsin area. Seitz had died in his home, but officers asked for additional assistance after the *advertiser censored* was discovered. Along with the child *advertiser censored*, articles involving missing children and maps of the cities those children were missing from were found in Seitz's home.[3]

On June 30, 2010 investigators with search warrants descended upon a farm near the abduction site. "Items of interest" were found when hauling away six truckloads of dirt from the site for evidence.....end of quote

I read that Seitz owned a barber shop for years, wonder who he met over the years?

Also, I understand it was October 22 when this precious child disappeared.
Would farmers in Minnesota have plowed fields that late in the season, or would the fields already be planted in winter rye?

 

[Trino]

It seem strange that J did not scream, but perhaps he was so terrified that he couldn't.

 

[human]

A hand over the mouth would take care of that.

I don't think they plant winter rye there, do they?

As far as Seitz, Milwaukee is a good 6 hour drive from St. Joe.

Not that I don't think he is some whack job.

Maybe he was visiting DR for all I know.

 

[Mysterylover]

A hand over the mouth would take care of that.

I don't think they plant winter rye there, do they?

As far as Seitz, Milwaukee is a good 6 hour drive from St. Joe.

Not that I don't think he is some whack job.

Maybe he was visiting DR for all I know.

human, You bring up another good point.
How far could a man go in the dark of night carrying a 11 yr. old boy under one arm and his other hand over the child's mouth?

I suspect not far, what's your opinion?

 

[Lotus]

I'm not from st. joseph but I'm pretty sure there were no streets behind DR's farm since they all look pretty new so I just don't see where a car could have been parked back then. Personally I think the abductor has some connection to the farm, whether it was DR or someone DR knew and I think LE knows that too hence all of the secrecy on their part. IMO there might be more evidence within the house itself (especially in the basement). I just don't understand why the abductor would go down the driveway, it makes no sense.

 

[human]

Lotus, I agree.

When you think of the fact that iit was a road that no one would need to go down, and no cars passed the kids either way, it is limiting.

 

[human]

mysterylover, that's why I wonder why those buildings on the farm burned down.

Now far to go at all.

 

[Jbrown324320]

does anyone know if the driveway had ditches on the side by the trees? If not, a car could drive down by the trees and park next to it. But the police said they were on the scene 5 mins after the call. It would have taken the boys about 10 or 15 mins to run to the Wetterling's house. That gave the perp about 20 mins to get away. But the kids turned around after a few mins of running and they were gone. I think a car near the woods or DR's place are the most plausible explanations. I still think DR had some involvement if he wasn't the exact person who took him.

 

[margaret_diane]

It seem strange that J did not scream, but perhaps he was so terrified that he couldn't.

How do you know that he didn't? He might have! He could have been silenced off the cuff with something (tape over mouth? A gag? A hand? A drug? A threat of death to himself, his brother or his friends or family?). How do you know that he never screamed?

 

[concentric]

Been reading all of your posts. Some very good groupthink here.

Since we're looking at all angles, I've been thinking about the sock found. Could the perp. have taken Jacob's shoes and socks off:

a) to impair Jacob from kicking him hard
b) use the sock as a gag, with some duct tape, for example? Maybe ether applied to knock him out. Then he has the shoes, but drops that one sock.

Earlier on, I thought perhaps ether could have been applied to a rag, and a container or rag was dropped in the process. Maybe there is a piece of cloth or something the investigators found.



Just thinking.