MN - Philando Castile, 32, shot by police officer, 6 July 2016 #1

[animlzrule]

Officers in Europe do not carry guns.

By contrast, national standards in most European countries conform to the European Convention on Human Rights, which impels its 47 signatories to permit only deadly force that is “absolutely necessary” to achieve a lawful purpose. Killings excused under America’s “reasonable belief” standards often violate Europe’s “absolute necessity” standards.

For example, the unfounded fear of Darren Wilson – the former Ferguson cop who fatally shot Michael Brown – that Brown was armed would not have likely absolved him in Europe. Nor would officers’ fears of the screwdriver that a mentally ill Dallas man Jason Harrison refused to drop.

"In Europe, killing is considered unnecessary if alternatives exist. For example, national guidelines in Spain would have prescribed that Wilson incrementally pursue verbal warnings, warning shots, and shots at nonvital parts of the body before resorting to deadly force. Six shots would likely be deemed disproportionate to the threat that Brown, unarmed and wounded, allegedly posed."

In some areas, local police don't carry. But there are PLENTY of armed officers aside from local police in Europe. The article addresses this.

 

[Ray_of_hope]

Philando Castile was not resisting or running and he reported to LE that he had a concealed weapons permit and was carrying. Why not order him out of the car and frisk him? Why ask for ID and registration only to shoot him when he complies. I am so stunned.

 

[human]

I am a full blooded native American and have never felt "vulnerable to police violence". In my opinion huffington post should not be considered mainstream media.

You may wish to research about Native deaths. In MN, we call it "Driving while Native". http://thefreethoughtproject.com/police-killing-native-americans-higher-rate-race-talking/

 

[LonghornSpeakEasy]

http://http://fox43.com/2016/07/07/multiple-officers-shot-at-black-lives-matter-protest-in-dallas/

Report of at least 2 officers shot during BLM protest in Dallas

 

[animlzrule]

Breaking news - Two police officers were just shot during a protest in Dallas over recent police shootings.

Yep. This is just going to escalate until the police get control of their own practices. I will never advocate for people unlawfully attacking a police officer. But I can certainly understand the frustration, hopelessness, distrust and anger of minority communities when it comes to law enforcement in this country. We reap what we sow.

 

[bluesneakers]

Yep. This is just going to escalate until the police get control of their own practices. I will never advocate for people unlawfully attacking a police officer. But I can certainly understand the frustration, hopelessness, distrust and anger of minority communities when it comes to law enforcement in this country. We reap what we sow.

It's going to escalate because it keeps happening and nothing changes. So we've tried protests and marches and writing to our senators and staging sit-ins... nothing is working. Where else can it go but up?

 

[jjenny]

Disagree. A cop can't tell the risk by the movement or lack thereof. Sometimes the most dangerous guy is the one who sits quietly and doesn't move a muscle.

Cops are going to approach the vehicle warily with hand on gun butt, regardless. Once they get up to the window, which do you think they would prefer:

1. A guy who has no info ready and, when asked for papers, reaches behind himself and/or into glovebox, both of which are blind spots to the cop; or

2. A guy who has both hands firmly on the wheel in plain sight, and his paperwork sitting in his lap?


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This paperwork isn't going to magically appear in his lap. Cop approaching the car would see him reaching and moving to get this paperwork. So thank you very much, I am not going to be reaching for things unless police tells me to.

 

[jjenny]

Philando Castile was not resisting or running and he reported to LE that he had a concealed weapons permit and was carrying. Why not order him out of the car and frisk him? Why ask for ID and registration only to shoot him when he complies. I am so stunned.

As he was reaching for his ID, he told the cop he had a gun. So the cop presumably assumed he was reaching for that gun.

 

[Cannonball3804]

This paperwork isn't going to magically appear in his lap. Cop approaching the car would see him reaching and moving to get this paperwork. So thank you very much, I am not going to be reaching for things unless police tells me to.

The cop doesn't jump out of his car immediately when it comes to a stop. You have plenty of time to at least grab your wallet and have it in your lap.

But if you think you're "safer" with him standing one foot away from you, with you reaching and digging into areas he can't see, then be my guest!


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[jjenny]

The cop doesn't jump out of his car immediately when it comes to a stop. You have plenty of time to at least grab your wallet and have it in your lap.

But if you think you're "safer" with him standing one foot away from you, with you reaching and digging into areas he can't see, then be my guest!


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If cop is so afraid of me reaching for my license, he shouldn't be asking for it.
And not reaching for documents before asked is the right thing to do.

"Do not reach for documentation: officers are trained to spot driver's reaching for hidden items, or stashing items, and it is likely an officer may misinterpret your actions. You might be reaching for your registration, but for all the officer knows, you're reaching for a gun."

http://traffic.findlaw.com/traffic-stops/what-to-do-during-traffic-stops.html

 

[bluesneakers]

As he was reaching for his ID, he told the cop he had a gun. So the cop presumably assumed he was reaching for that gun.

What would make the officer think he would say "I'm licensed to carry" as a preamble to shooting him? Do people usually announce themselves before firing?

 

[anonypotomous]

Breaking news - Two police officers were just shot during a protest in Dallas over recent police shootings.

Totally makes sense to me. Mad about someone getting shot? Be a hypocrite and shoot others.

/sarcasm.


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[Tillicum]

As he was reaching for his ID, he told the cop he had a gun. So the cop presumably assumed he was reaching for that gun.

Then, Reynolds said, the officer asked them to put their hands in the air, and they complied. The officer then asked Castile, who was driving, for his identification.
Reynolds said he kept it in a thick wallet in a right-back pants pocket.

"As he's reaching, he lets the officer know, 'I have a firearm on me,'" Reynolds said. "I begin to yell, 'But he's licensed to carry.' After that, he began to take off shots — bup bup bup."

Reynolds said that "nothing in (Castile's) body said intimidation," but the officer ordered him, "Don't move, don't move."

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news...pts-minnesota-governor-call-doj-probe-n605301

 

[Cannonball3804]

If cop is so afraid of me reaching for my license, he shouldn't be asking for it.

There is a dead man in Minnesota who would agree with you on that. Except he's dead.


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[bluesneakers]

If cop is so afraid of me reaching for my license, he shouldn't be asking for it.

:goodpost:

 

[anonypotomous]

Doubtful. The story would have just changed to "I saw him moving in his car. I thought he might have been hiding drugs or weapons. That made me fear for my life so my shoot is justified."

It would have? I doubt it.



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[Ray_of_hope]

As he was reaching for his ID, he told the cop he had a gun. So the cop presumably assumed he was reaching for that gun.

Is that what happened? Is that on video? Why would you tell someone you have a concealed weapons permit and are carrying if you intend to shoot them first? It doesn't make sense. Sorry, but I am in shock. How are Philando's fiance and her child ever going to feel safe again?

 

[reedus23]

It's going to escalate because it keeps happening and nothing changes. So we've tried protests and marches and writing to our senators and staging sit-ins... nothing is working. Where else can it go but up?

I said at the time of the Michael Brown ordeal that all of this was simply going to get worse. And it will continue to do so. You have 2 sides that are diametrically opposed and at times at very extremes of responses. You have LE supporters who justify every shoot (or at least come off that way) and you have the opposite side that thinks that every shoot is unjustified and should be met with anarchy.

 

[jjenny]

There is a dead man in Minnesota who would agree with you on that. Except he's dead.


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You should not be reaching for anything if police stops you until asked.

"Always be polite during traffic stops, even if the officer is aggressive. You have little to lose by being polite and a lot to lose by being belligerent. Roll down your window, turn off the engine and place your hands on the steering wheel. If it is night time, turn on your interior light. Do not reach for documentation: officers are trained to spot driver's reaching for hidden items, or stashing items, and it is likely an officer may misinterpret your actions. You might be reaching for your registration, but for all the officer knows, you're reaching for a gun."

http://traffic.findlaw.com/traffic-stops/what-to-do-during-traffic-stops.html

 

[jjenny]

Is that what happened? Is that on video? Why would you tell someone you have a concealed weapons permit and are carrying if you intend to shoot them first? It doesn't make sense. Sorry, but I am in shock. How are Philando's fiance and her child ever going to feel safe again?

I never said he intended to shoot anyone. Per the girlfriend, which I saw talking, he told the cop he had a gun. I don't know how his fiance is going to feel safe again, and I would be the wrong person to ask about that.