MO - Elizabeth Olten, 9, St Martin's, 21 Oct 2009 #8

[Imjen]

This is OT, but I just wanted to tell you how sorry I am that you lost your chihuahua. I buried one of mine this summer, and my big mixed breed died of heartworms last month also. I still have 4 other dogs, but still am grieving the two I lost.

ETA

I quoted the wrong post! I meant to address it to LadyRider.

My condolences to both you and LadyRider.
I know the pain of losing a beloved dog. I lost my 9 yr old beagle in April and I’m still comforting my very lonely 10 yr old spaniel.
:hug:

 

[Kimster]

My condolences to both you and LadyRider.
I know the pain of losing a beloved dog. I lost my 9 yr old beagle in April and I’m still comforting my very lonely 10 yr old spaniel.
:hug:

My condolences too! I still mourn my cat Cameo and she was run over years ago...

 

[Bibliophile]

Does it seem that everytime we mention something it is blocked/shutdown soon afterwards. RSomeILConeP is checking in and monitoring what we say and reacts accordingly.

Apparently, so are a lot of other people.

Perhaps we should start taking screen shots - not to post or violate TOS but to keep for our own reference.

 

[Kimster]

Apparently, so are a lot of other people.

Perhaps we should start taking screen shots - not to post or violate TOS but to keep for our own reference.

I've been doing that since I started out with Caylee's case and have so many saved that I can't ever find them. A big help I am, huh? :crazy:

 

[winterrose]

So you have that much to hide, eh?

Hoppy

That was great,cracked me up.

 

[Bibliophile]

I honestly think that the grave rumors are just that - rumors. Why couldn't she have tossed her in an old well or something like that?

I heard from a reliable source that a grave or concealment of the body was prearranged. Maybe that could have been a shallow, pre-dug grave; a small ravine like place in the woods that AB had found; branches and leaves she had collected to bury the body under ... lots of possibilities there that may not have been hours of work.

I did not hear about the second grave though I don't doubt its possible. It may have been her first attempt that didn't work out or it may have been her back-up plan if she was planning to lure EO there.

I'll try to find a photo to post to give you a better idea of the terrain.

 

[Prof]

quick thought about the "two graves" ..... (have been thinking about it tonight a lot)

is it possible that this knowledge came from the note? and that the note was possibly written by AB's sibbling? I know that thought/rumor had been tossed around before.. that a sibbling had written a letter to LE.

I was sitting around wondering how two pre dug graves would ever be floating around as a rumor and it hit me... what if a sibbling knew about the digging in the previous weeks. It made sense to me as a possible theory fwiw...

Hi Nurse, you do know that Tricia got the "two graves" from a source's source? I am not sure where the digging "week before" came from -- do you?

 

[winterrose]

I heard from a reliable source that a grave or concealment of the body was prearranged. Maybe that could have been a shallow, pre-dug grave; a small ravine like place in the woods that AB had found; branches and leaves she had collected to bury the body under ... lots of possibilities there that may not have been hours of work.

I did not hear about the second grave though I don't doubt its possible. It may have been her first attempt that didn't work out or it may have been her back-up plan if she was planning to lure EO there.

I'll try to find a photo to post to give you a better idea of the terrain.

That's exactly what I was thinking,maybe hit tree roots,and it wasn't deep enough.I still feel it's possible she had help and could be covering for someone.Maybe someone met her in the woods and this was prearranged since it was planned with a grave already dug.I'm still wondering about that house that was set on fire in the summer and a woman died,didn't someone say it was deliberately set and noone has been caught?They said it wasn't far from AB's house,I wonder how far away it was,actually.

 

[Bibliophile]

Here's some examples, not exact, but close. In the vicinity of the Missouri River, we often have what is called loess hills.

http://www.mrfs.net/trips/2003/Iowa/loess_hills.jpg

http://djringer.com/photos/d/6989-2/fort-hill-view.jpg

http://beetlesinthebush.wordpress.com/2008/08/09/the-hunt-for-cicindela-celeripes/

http://nebraska.sierraclub.org/movalley/outdoors/Hitchcock-Forest.jpg

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_9YLvgGMABM4/SJ05DeeekFI/AAAAAAAAA1o/d7z4CKsKgI0/s1600-h/P1010542.JPG

beetlesinthebush.wordpress.com/2008/08/09/the-hunt-for-cicindela-celeripes/

 

[Prof]

That's exactly what I was thinking,maybe hit tree roots,and it wasn't deep enough.I still feel it's possible she had help and could be covering for someone.Maybe someone met her in the woods and this was prearranged since it was planned with a grave already dug.I'm still wondering about that house that was set on fire in the summer and a woman died,didn't someone say it was deliberately set and noone has been caught?They said it wasn't far from AB's house,I wonder how far away it was,actually.

I do not know for sure, but one of the addresses I found for the woman was about 8 miles away -- not really a neighbor IMO
It was a "vapor explosion", (but no gas lines to the home) and authorities determined it was deliberately set, but no news after that news ----- weird, but I am still not clear on connection other than the possiblity that this was not a first kill (had a hard time typing that when speaking of a 15 year old)

Here is the link again http://www.connectmidmissouri.com/news/news_story.aspx?id=321009
Interesting solo comment made just yesterday --still not sure how this is related, hmmn

 

[cleo612]

There is a thread for WS Lingo that was started by SeriouslySearching. It lists almost every acronym that you could ever hope to see here at WS. I have it bookmarked for easy reference.

http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=84535&highlight=acronyms

 

[gliving]

A poster here was asking about the changing of reports as to Elizabeth calling home before leaving. I found an original copy of the report. If this has already been posted, my apologies.

http://www.topix.com/forum/city/st-martins-mo/TK880SFSBSKETJK2F
Body of Missing Missouri Girl, 9, Found in Woods

The body of a 9-year-old Missouri girl who vanished walking home from a friend's house was found in a heavily wooded area Friday.

An "older juvenile" suspect led authorities to Elizabeth Olten's body, deep in the woods near where an exhaustive search for the child was under way for much of the day.

Elizabeth disappeared just after she started walking home from a friend's house Wednesday night.

"There's been no contact with her since then," Cole County Sheriff Greg White told Fox News earlier Friday, before Elizabeth was found dead.

White said Elizabeth spoke with her parents on the phone before she left her friend's house.

"Her parents said she should leave and get home," he told Fox.

About 70 investigators worked on leads Friday and another 70 people spent the day scouring woody, uneven terrain west of Jefferson City, Mo.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,569338,00...

However if you click on the foxnews link, the story has been changed. I guess we will get the answers when the phone records come out at the trial.

"Get home" seems strong language to me. And fox news quotes this as a direct statement from the Sheriff.

 

[danni]

ABSOLUTELY!!!!!!!!!!

When I found his Xanga I also found his LiveJournal - which was under a different username, but mentioned the username from Xanga. Also mentioned many "familiar" people so that I am sure its him. He was writing until this summer (2009).

However, it was very personal and very sad, so I didn't mention anything. I read all of it, and I really feel bad for him. But that's GONE too now- says deleted. He is 100% reading, he wouldn't know we found this stuff just based on google- I never wrote the username here.

[I really, really, really hope he was ILC because if not I feel like I know way too much about a random stranger.]

But lesson to ALL: make sure all of your online diaries are friends-only or somehow private!! I google my real name and email address constantly to make sure nothing I wouldn't want the world to know comes up!

BBM
Better yet if you don't want people to know something, just don't post it online! ANYWHERE!
My little sister found this out the hard way when she started going through her divorce. She had ALL her stuff to private, and some how her husband got into all her stuff and well it was bad! He didn't have her passwords she changed them all to some crazy stuff that he didn't know but he hacked her stuff and got in anyways! It's not hard to do if you know how to and it would only take one person to know how to do it!

JAT

 

[MDATCA]

CC - A map was shown on Nancy Grace Oct 27. Here's a link to the video on You Tube:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v__BuXJRPLs&feature=related"]YouTube- Nancy 10/27/09 Elizabeth Olten Part 4

Start watching around 1:30 and be ready to pause at 1:38 - it does not show the location "directly behind" AB's house like someone posted here, more like 1/2 way between the two homes. Who knows though...

The Nancy Grace Diagram is labeling the old house as AB's house. The new house is just about in front of the spot labels. The new house was not built when the pic was taken. If you zoom to street level yo wil see it behind the triange shaped pond that is at the street. If you zoom back out you will see another triangle pond and a triangle clearing meeting tip to tip. From the NG map it shows the body being found in the thick of trees behind the triangles.

 

[nursebeeme]

Hi Nurse, you do know that Tricia got the "two graves" from a source's source? I am not sure where the digging "week before" came from -- do you?

Hi Prof, yes I did (Tricia's info) and not sure where digging before came from.. I was just wondering how this 'knowledge' came to be and wondered if it at all could tie into the writings... as another poster has rumored inside information that there was more writing than just the diary. I was thinking that the predug graves could have come from a note from perhaps a sibbling who could have witnessed her digging around in the woods... it was just a thought.

 

[human]

Although I do not live in Missouri, I do have woods on my property. Digging in woods! Tree roots, rocks, roots of other vegetation! It is nearly impossible. I am not exaggerating on that account. It's not like a pile of dirt. When you hit a rock, you don't know how big it is. You have to dig it out. You just can't push a shovel into that kind of terrain. Tree roots go for a long ways and are tough. That was one determined girl.

 

[crimecurious]

Terrain Sample:

 

[crimecurious]

Although I do not live in Missouri, I do have woods on my property. Digging in woods! Tree roots, rocks, roots of other vegetation! It is nearly impossible. I am not exaggerating on that account. It's not like a pile of dirt. When you hit a rock, you don't know how big it is. You have to dig it out. You just can't push a shovel into that kind of terrain. Tree roots go for a long ways and are tough. That was one determined girl.

You got that right!!!

 

[akashana]

Too bad she chose to channel all her determination and energy into evil! She could have accomplished so much good instead . . .

 

[danni]

I was just looking at the property layout. Most if not all of you know where the NEW house sets. After looking at this map you can see that there is a utility line easement, from the map it apears that the clearing is about 50 foot wide. After seeing this my mind went right to this post that I wrote a while ago!

"The body was found near the wooden area of Elizabeth's home." http://www.connectmidmissouri.com/ne...aspx?id=367027
"AT&T triangulated the location as deep in the woods behind Elizabeth's home. Family members say Elizabeth would not have gone into the woods."
http://www.connectmidmissouri.com/ne...6949&id=366728

BBM
Then I THOUGHT they said the phone was found with/near Elizabeth. right?

the theory of being next to the path would make sense if she was found NEAR the woods, but still DEEP in the woods. You can be back in the woods but still NEXT to the woods if you are on a path IN the woods.

Since then we have heard that the body was found behind AB's house not EO's house.
I wonder...could the NEAR yet DEEP that they are talking about be in the easement behind AB's house?
It would be easy to get to, and it would be easier to dig than in the woods. If the utility comp. had been doing any tree trimming, or general work back there lately it would be a great cover up too.

JAT