MO - Lisa Irwin, 10 months, Kansas City, 4 Oct 2011 - #10

[wfgodot]

Having a verified local on the thread who answers questions with keen insight is a real plus, isn't it. Thanks, In da Middle.

 

[cluciano63]

FBI not posting a reward, not putting the baby on their site as "kidnapped." Why not? Are they that positive she wasn't kidnapped?

 

[In da Middle]

I saw that there was a default judgement regarding the paternity...is that what you are referring to? The motions and filings in both those cases are not publicly available so we have no way of knowing what happened.

But I think if this was as bad as her family states, there would be LOTS of docket entries. This one is short and sweet, that usually means not much contention or fight.

 

[wfgodot]

I could be wrong, but I thought the early reports stated that she put Lisa to bed at 7:30pm and checked on her at 10:30pm on her way to bed.

Congrats, KaylynnCouture, this one was your 5,000th post.

 

[Patty G]

I could be wrong, but I thought the early reports stated that she put Lisa to bed at 7:30pm and checked on her at 10:30pm on her way to bed.

You are probably accurate with the times more so then me as I didn't follow the timeline that closely in the beginning. I better fix my post ....

Thank you.

 

[KaylynnCouture]

FBI not posting a reward, not putting the baby on their site as "kidnapped." Why not? Are they that positive she wasn't kidnapped?

I find it really odd that the FBI isn't offering a reward..even if they don't believe she was kidnapped. In the recent case of Patrick Borally, for instance, they weren't sure if it was a kidnapping or not..yet they offered a $25,000 reward. Also, in the Celina Cass case, they offered a reward from the get-go before they were even sure she was kidnapped (back when they were still looking into reports that she ran away with someone she met online). So, the fact that they aren't offering a reward here is strange..whether or not they believe it's a kidnapping.

 

[sunflowerchick]

My question is why the metal detectors in the backyard? This seems a little weird to me as not much time has passed. LE would be able to determine if soil had been disturbed recently so why use metal detectors? The only thing I can think of is that they would be looking for something really small or something older than last week. But what and why?

 

[KaylynnCouture]

Congrats, KaylynnCouture, this one was your 5,000th post.

Oh, darnit!!! I wanted my 5,000th post to be "praying for Baby Lisa!". Lol. I had it all planned out, and then I forgot to pay attention to the post count.

 

[neesaki]

Baby Lisa's Parents Take Questions From Reporters - YouTube


At :45 JI says WE checked on Lisa and WE realized she was gone.

At 3:14, DB says it was only JI that went into the room to find Lisa missing.

At 2:00, DB looks to JI to answer the question about what the boys are saying and wondering. IMO, the boys may know the truth and she looked to JI to answer this difficult question.

At 2:55, JI says they took all the phones so he or DB could not call anybody. How does he know why the phones were taken? Why did he need to look for his personal cell phone to call 911 if he just arrived home with his work cell phone? Why was his personal cell phone on the kitchen counter next to hers? And of course the big point with the phones is why didn't they bring these missing phones up from the get-go in their interviews?

At 4:33, DB says we are trying to hold it together for our boys. Mentioning Lisa, staying strong for her, is a secondary thought. I think this could be an unintended subtle admission that it IS about the boys, custody of. And that Lisa is gone.

At 6:30, JI is quick to answer the question that the baby wouldn't cry if picked up by someone. It's as if he wants to defend the scenario they have staged, rather than contemplate the question. Also, I find it unlikely the baby wouldn't cry. MOO.

I keep trying to come up with a scenario of what could have happened where the mother, DB, appears to be completely devastated and grieving, and the father, JI, appears to be grieving but also overcome with guilt.

 

[KaylynnCouture]

My question is why the metal detectors in the backyard? This seems a little weird to me as not much time has passed. LE would be able to determine if soil had been disturbed recently so why use metal detectors? The only thing I can think of is that they would be looking for something really small or something older than last week. But what and why?

They're most likely looking for the missing cell phones. Cell phones can be detected with metal detectors.

 

[Elley Mae]

Has it been determined when Debbie went to bed? I know that she stated she put Baby Lisa to bed at 10:30, but I never heard when she actually went to bed.

iirc she put Lisa to bed at 7-7:30 she then went to bed at 10:30.

 

[Elley Mae]

Oh, darnit!!! I wanted my 5,000th post to be "praying for Baby Lisa!". Lol. I had it all planned out, and then I forgot to pay attention to the post count.

Go back and delete 3 j/k lol

 

[cluciano63]

If those phones are in the yard, you'd think they would have found them by now...unless they hadn't searched the entire yard before. I think they must have caught a ping on at least one of them that keeps them in that yard.

 

[In da Middle]

Go CARDS!!!

And while we are at it 'YEAH CHIEFS!'

 

[marycarney]

This stat is for all children and adolescents in the US that were held for at least one hour in 1999. I double checked before I posted it and found it here:

http://crime.about.com/od/stats/f/faqkids.htm

From the same document BBM: (2) an episode in
which a child younger than 15 or mentally incompetent,
and without lawful authority or parental permission,
is taken or detained or voluntarily accompanies
a nonfamily perpetrator who conceals thechild’s whereabouts, demands ransom, or expresses the intention to keep the child permanently.


I am not denying that there are indeed non-family abductions, my point is that the definition is SO BROAD as to make the figures quotes much less reliable to our discussion. Additionally, (from the same document) only in 21% of these cases are the police even called.

 

[MsDetective]

What neighbor? The teenage neighbor?

She never said an age. She said she was talking to the neighbor and the neighbors child and the boys were watching "some sort of fairy tale movie"(DB's words). She does say the other childs name that was there but i'm not gonna post that.

 

[panthera]

Well, if DB said she had the window open earlier, and someone was watching the house maybe they knew this so they thought it would be the easiest point of entry, never thinking she left the door unlocked. This of course, depending on if any of what she has said is true. I'm still on the fence on this case, go back and forth just don't know what to think.:crazy:

Even with the window unlocked or open, from seeing photos of the re-enactment today, it appears the perpetrator would have needed help getting through the window........either by standing on something or assistance from someone else to boost them up to get through. Therefore, my question would be if anything was found on the ground outside the window to indicate such?

 

[sunflowerchick]

They're most likely looking for the missing cell phones. Cell phones can be detected with metal detectors.

The problem I have with that is that if the cell phones were buried, LE would see the disturbed earth so no need for metal detectors. If they weren't buried, they are large enough to see. Do we know what the backyard looks like? Is it sod, dirt, grass, weeds, etc?

Congrats on your 5000th post by the way!

 

[greenpalm]

When I'm following a case, I will never say I disagree with a fellow poster even if I do. However, I will make an exception. Go Brewers!

Go CARDS!!! .

And while we are at it 'YEAH CHIEFS!'

<snipped>

Uh oh! Go Rangers!!!! :floorlaugh:

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

That is your take on it and I respect that

To me the only thing abundantly evident is that LE have named no POI or suspect and are still looking for a missing child.

If that's the case, why was the Amber Alert canceled so soon? I realize that the terms of an AA vary from state-to-state, but when I hear that this all-points-bulletin has been terminated, I assume that local authorities have determined that the child wasn't abducted or isn't "missing".
jmo