NE NE - Jason Jolkowski, 19, Omaha, 13 June 2001 - #2

[MatthewTyler]

Many of Dahmer's victims were gay and had been lured to his house with the promise of money or sexual favours. I think we can rule this out, not because we know Jason's sexuality but because we know why Jason left the house that day - he was catching a ride to work.

Oh yeah no I didn't think that's what happened, I was just going off on the other point made about Jason's demographic (or somewhat since we don't know his sexuality) and saying that sexual assaults can happen. I don't believe Jason was sexually assaulted at all. I think he was pretty quickly killed and disposed of. Whether killed in a house or in a car, however, I'm not sure

ETA: He had to have been kept somewhere for awhile I assume, since I don't think whoever did it would be burying/dumping his body in the daytime. Assuming Jason was killed before noon that morning, whoever did this probably kept his body for at least 10-12 hours and buried it in the middle of the night

 

[MatthewTyler]

The problem with Omaha (and many other places in the midwest) is that if you look on the map, you can go in any direction and hit nothing but farmland and fields. A body could be buried literally ANYWHERE within even a short radius of the city

 

[dotr]

Then there is always the possibility that Jason started walking towards his intended meeting place and simply got mad or overwhelmed with his life.

Speculative thoughts, JJ may have had, imo.

"Why do i always have to take out the garbage? Accommodate a last minute work arrangement on my day off? When my stupid car is not working? It is embarrassing to have to meet some strange girl somewhere easy like the h.school, because i get directions mixed up.Did they tell her that? Maybe i will never feel confident around girls?
Starting that new job soon, maybe i do not feel up to it, maybe i will fail, will i be expected to move out, maybe i do not want to?

Everyone expects me to be this or that, doing this or that, maybe i will surprise them all and keep walking till i get somewhere different and start a whole new life.
Maybe i could call my new friend, he/she was talking about leaving town and leaving all the stress behind, or with the maybe 60 bucks in my pocket, just get on any bus going anywhere?
Yeah, i love my family but today i am going to step out on my own and for once be unpredictable".......

speculation.

 

[Jason_Pharae]

Honestly this is as likely as anything else anybody's come up with!

 

[Jason_Pharae]

However, it isn't difficult to imagine what happened next. Perhaps the abductor stopped at his house and asked Jason to come inside and help with something. Once Jason was indoors, the killer could take advantage of him, strike him while his back was turned, hold him up with a gun, whatever.

See, to me this is exactly where theories like this unravel. Remember, Jason had a very clear, specific purpose in walking to the high school at that moment, and looking at it from his perspective, his agenda didn't leave any margin for error. He was due to meet the co-worker at the school at 11:15 AM, and he left his house sometime after 10:45. So it's hard to understand why/how he would get distracted from this very definite course by getting into somebody else's car. He would have known he was pushing it, time-wise. To make this work at this point, I assume most people imagine that this unknown driver agreed that he himself would give Jason a ride to Fazzoli's (of course this doesn't resolve anything about why he would flake out on the ride from the original co-worker). But it just gets more bizarre when you try to add in some new detour—like the unknown driver getting Jason to go inside a house or whatever—because it's just adding more time onto the clock, and making Jason later and later for work. Wouldn't anybody in such a situation respond: "no, buddy, I can't go over to your house and help you mount the t.v. on the wall, because, like I told you, I'm running late for work." So this is the general reason I tend to assume that, within this hypothetical scenario, something happened to Jason more-or-less immediately after he got into the car.

I'd also like to register my respectful disagreement with the notion of a Fazzoli's-based conspiracy of some sort. By all means, the point here is to throw every possibility at the wall and see what sticks, so I appreciate and read any proposal. But does anybody honestly feel that one is defensible?

 

[Jason_Pharae]

However, it isn't difficult to imagine what happened next. Perhaps the abductor stopped at his house and asked Jason to come inside and help with something. Once Jason was indoors, the killer could take advantage of him, strike him while his back was turned, hold him up with a gun, whatever.

See, to me this is exactly where theories like this unravel. Remember, Jason had a very clear, specific purpose in walking to the high school at that moment, and looking at it from his perspective, his agenda didn't leave any margin for error. He was due to meet the co-worker at the school at 11:15 AM, and he left his house sometime after 10:45. So it's hard to understand why/how he would get distracted from this very definite course by getting into somebody else's car. He would have known he was pushing it, time-wise. To make this work at this point, I assume most people imagine that this unknown driver agreed that he himself would give Jason a ride to Fazzoli's (of course this doesn't resolve anything about why he would flake out on the ride from the original co-worker). But it just gets more bizarre when you try to add in some new detour—like the unknown driver getting Jason to go inside a house or whatever—because it's just adding more time onto the clock, and making Jason later and later for work. Wouldn't anybody in such a situation respond: "no, buddy, I can't go over to your house and help you mount the t.v. on the wall, because, like I told you, I'm running late for work." So this is the general reason I tend to assume that, within this hypothetical scenario, something happened to Jason more-or-less immediately after he got into the car.

[Posted this once then deleted it to fix formatting, then re-posted]

 

[Vital Forces]

I'd also like to register my respectful disagreement with the notion of a Fazzoli's-based conspiracy of some sort. By all means, the point here is to throw every possibility at the wall and see what sticks, so I appreciate and read any proposal. But does anybody honestly feel that one is defensible?

A Fazzoli's-based conspiracy isn't impossible. It just isn't likely based on what we know. Someone who he worked with would need a motive (we don't have one) and a co-conspirator/accomplice/hit-man to actually meet Jason in his neighborhood. Plus they would have had to have timed it pretty well.

If we're going to rule out random abduction as statically implausible, we can also rule out 19-year old pizza baker is murdered in elaborate conspiracy as statistically implausible.

I think the most plausible explanation is a John Wayne Gacy-type predator who lived in the area in 2001. This person could also be behind the disappearance of Samuel Sherman.

 

[Jason_Pharae]

there is nothing to suggest that Jason could have been sexually assaulted before his presumed murder. For example, say that he was picked up by someone he knew/trusted from work (implying that some coworkers arranged this whole plot against him) -- once they got Jason into the car, why would they need to sexually attack him? The whole point of the scheme would assumably be to just get rid of Jason, so a simple kill and dump would do the trick.

The point isn't to propose that he actually was sexually assaulted; it's a point about motive. A sexually-motivated assault can be relatively spontaneous, so at least on that hypothesis you don't run into problems about planning or pre-meditation. Notice how, when you subtract the sexual-motivation component from the hypothetical scenario, you immediately resorted to something like a Fazzoli's-based conspiracy. That's because, without the spontaneous element (provided by the sex-motive hypothesis), you have to imagine something planned out in advance. But the point is that this is so fantastical—Why would his Fazzoli's co-workers need to assassinate him? How have the conspirators been so successful in totally hiding their activities?—it ends up pushing you back in the direction of something spontaneous like sex-motivation (which of course has a whole other set of problems)

 

[Jason_Pharae]

A Fazzoli's-based conspiracy isn't impossible
I think the most plausible explanation is a John Wayne Gacy-type predator who lived in the area in 2001. This person could also be behind the disappearance of Samuel Sherman.

Yeah—it's just that Gacy's MO, from my understanding, wasn't anything like 'spontaneous snatch-and-grab'. He used engaged in some manner of grooming behavior, came up with incentives and enticements to get the boys into his house (and I'm pretty sure he scheduled appointments with them, like "hey can you come over and paint my house on Sunday," or "if you don't tell your parents, you can come over Saturday and we'll drink a few beers").

Can you think of anything close to an opportunistic sexual predator, who chose adult male victims, and who engaged with them in a sudden, out-of-the-blue manner?

 

[MatthewTyler]

I'd also like to register my respectful disagreement with the notion of a Fazzoli's-based conspiracy of some sort. By all means, the point here is to throw every possibility at the wall and see what sticks, so I appreciate and read any proposal. But does anybody honestly feel that one is defensible?

The main reason I and many others believe it to be Fazoli's related his because they are the only ones that knew about his altered schedule that day. An opportunist abductor that just happened to catch him at the right time is much less likely so people tend to lean towards his coworkers. They called him in early (or in on a day off? Don't remember), knew he didn't have a car, and knew that they can lure him with a ride. With Jason leaving the job soon and starting another one, one has to wonder if he had problems with coworkers or if there was a reason someone at Fazolis might have wanted him gone.

And just to go on your other point, I agree that Jason going to someone's house is unlikely. I suspect that someone in a car lured him in by saying they'd drive him to the HS. If he was running late to meeting her, maybe he'd just need a quick lift to the school. Or maybe someone told him they were heading there anyway

 

[MatthewTyler]

I think the most plausible explanation is a John Wayne Gacy-type predator who lived in the area in 2001. This person could also be behind the disappearance of Samuel Sherman.

Has anyone ever looked up registered sex offenders in the area?

 

[MatthewTyler]

So I went on the Nebraska state sex offender registry site and found this. These red marks are all the sex offenders within ONLY A 3 MILE RADIUS of Benson High School. I put in the address of the school as a reference point. That is completely insane. This is as of 2017, so I don't know who was living there in 2001 but Omaha apparently is a breeding ground for a lot of sex offenders

 

[Jason_Pharae]

So I went on the Nebraska state sex offender registry site and found this. These red marks are all the sex offenders within ONLY A 3 MILE RADIUS of Benson High School. I put in the address of the school as a reference point. That is completely insane. This is as of 2017, so I don't know who was living there in 2001 but Omaha apparently is a breeding ground for a lot of sex offenders

Yeah but I've heard so many stories about people getting put on the list for things like public urination or sexting—though now that I think about it, maybe I shouldn't trust those stories. Seriously, though, they often seem a little too eager to put people on the sex offender registry.

 

[MatthewTyler]

Yeah but I've heard so many stories about people getting put on the list for things like public urination or sexting—though now that I think about it, maybe I shouldn't trust those stories. Seriously, though, they often seem a little too eager to put people on the sex offender registry.

True. But the people I looked at on there (I looked at the ones between Jason's home and the school) were mostly on there for like aggravated assault on children/minors. Most of them are too young around Jason's disappearance date, but there are a couple of guys on there I'd suspect. Though I don't know how long they've lived in Omaha

 

[Vital Forces]

Can you think of anything close to an opportunistic sexual predator, who chose adult male victims, and who engaged with them in a sudden, out-of-the-blue manner?

One that comes to mind is Rickey Enochs. He got into a car with a stranger and was never seen again. He may have been one of Gacy's victims.

 

[neesaki]

Does anyone know who the co-worker was that was meeting Jason to pick him up and give him a ride to work? Wasn't it a female? Could possibly Jason have been infatuated with this girl, and possibly she had been flirtatious with him? What if something was starting to develop? And what if she had a psycho crazy jealous boyfriend, I mean in the manner of Jodi Arias, yes that bad. :scared: Just a thought, it does happen. Could he have intercepted Jason before the girl got to the parking lot ? Just one more theory, no tomato throwing please.

 

[dotr]

Does anyone know who the co-worker was that was meeting Jason to pick him up and give him a ride to work? Wasn't it a female? Could possibly Jason have been infatuated with this girl, and possibly she had been flirtatious with him? What if something was starting to develop? And what if she had a psycho crazy jealous boyfriend, I mean in the manner of Jodi Arias, yes that bad. :scared: Just a thought, it does happen. Could he have intercepted Jason before the girl got to the parking lot ? Just one more theory, no tomato throwing please.

http://www.pickyourtrail.com/blog/paint-spain-red-la-tomatina

 

[Alleykins]

We have so little information as to what happened, virtually no clues. At this point, short of an alien abduction or a rift in the time space continuum appearing on his street as he was walking to the school, anything could be possible.

 

[MatthewTyler]

https://www.podomatic.com/podcasts/unfoundpodcast/episodes/2016-09-24T09_48_05-07_00

Here's a link to a podcast about Jason's case that features an interview with Kelly. In the interview they mention sex offenders in the area (around the 27:00 mark) and Kelly mentions that there was an adult male at Jason's previous place of works (Fazolis? Not sure if he worked anywhere before that) that would befriend and invite young males over to this house. She says he was questioned and cleared, but again, I don't think that means much.

She also mentions that the real investigation and media didn't begin on the case until 10 days after his disappearance. This would give anyone who did it plenty of time to dispose of evidence.

 

[neesaki]

https://www.podomatic.com/podcasts/unfoundpodcast/episodes/2016-09-24T09_48_05-07_00

Here's a link to a podcast about Jason's case that features an interview with Kelly. In the interview they mention sex offenders in the area (around the 27:00 mark) and Kelly mentions that there was an adult male at Jason's previous place of works (Fazolis? Not sure if he worked anywhere before that) that would befriend and invite young males over to this house. She says he was questioned and cleared, but again, I don't think that means much.

She also mentions that the real investigation and media didn't begin on the case until 10 days after his disappearance. This would give anyone who did it plenty of time to dispose of evidence.

She does say at his previous place of work which sounds like it was the one before Fazoli's. I do remember he had been employed before Fazoli's but don't know where. What gets me is she said there has never been even a POI in Jason's case. She also said there was a veteran police officer, a detective, that had been on the force for 30 years who told her he had never had a case as baffling as Jason's.

We have so little information as to what happened, virtually no clues. At this point, short of an alien abduction or a rift in the time space continuum appearing on his street as he was walking to the school, anything could be possible.

I'm beginning to think that's it, the parallel universe theory. :scared: