Netflix to stream new documentary on Steven Avery - #4

[Jaiddie]

It actually was testified that there were heavy rains in some of those days and that could've been how the bones were moved around in the pit. The same person testified that pictures of the bones in the pit wouldn't have even been good. She explained it as due to the discoloration, pictures wouldn't have been clear. In fact some pieces that weren't even bones were brought into her. The fragments didn't look like bones.

Seems this entire post is an opinion because I haven't seen it said anywhere that the bones weren't important evidence. Who exactly is "they" in reference to why they didn't call the coroner, because they knew they had goofed when planting???
Are we now accusing all the investigators of being in on the planting as well?
This is getting absurd.

They were being sarcastic....means the bones were "unimportant" because they were the only "evidence" that were not photographed at the crime scene following proper protocol. If you remember, when the key was first "seen" by Lenk and Colburn, they made it a point that no one touch it because it was an "IMPORTANT" discovery. Yet they just treat the actual victim (her bones, anyway) with such obvious disregard that they don't bother to get the coroner or a forensic specialist ON SITE to examine and remove them, they just shovel and sift her into boxes with NO pics to corroborate their discovery of the bones. And we are just supposed to take their word for it?? Mmmkay.

*** The quotation's around key words here is because my opinion on all the prosecution's "evidence" is that it is not credible.

 

[krkrjx]

To me none of the evidence fits with what Dassey claimed occurred. I realize his confession was not used in the Avery trial but that does not mean it was not used by the state in making its case for trial. There is no way what Dassey said happened could have happened. The evidence does not fit, from where I sit.

Every single piece of evidence is such that it could have been planted. I really cannot figure out why most of Halbach's personal property was found in the burn barrel or the garage, and not the key. And for crying out loud why would a suspect wipe the key of prints but neglect to wipe off their own? And then bring the key into their home!?

There is so much glaring evidence that I find it difficult to believe any criminal could be so negligent in their cover up. To me, every piece of evidence that was found was meant to be found. I see no reason for Avery to be so careless. At the same time, I can think of 36 million reasons for one or more someones in authority to want to frame this man. I will not go as far as to say someone in LE committed the crime but I believe they were biding their time until this opportunity to frame SA fell into their laps. Someone committed murder and they decided to stick it to SA.

Had SA fingerprints been found in one or two specific places in the crime scene, I might be skeptical. But they were not and there is no good explanation for the lack of such evidence.

This possible frame up is, to me, almost as tragic as the murder.

 

[TheDuchess]

to me none of the evidence fits with what dassey claimed occurred. I realize his confession was not used in the avery trial but that does not mean it was not used by the state in making its case for trial. There is no way what dassey said happened could have happened. The evidence does not fit, from where i sit.

Every single piece of evidence is such that it could have been planted. I really cannot figure out why most of halbach's personal property was found in the burn barrel or the garage, and not the key. And for crying out loud why would a suspect wipe the key of prints but neglect to wipe off their own? And then bring the key into their home!?

There is so much glaring evidence that i find it difficult to believe any criminal could be so negligent in their cover up. To me, every piece of evidence that was found was meant to be found. I see no reason for avery to be so careless. At the same time, i can think of 36 million reasons for one or more someones in authority to want to frame this man. I will not go as far as to say someone in le committed the crime but i believe they were biding their time until this opportunity to frame sa fell into their laps. Someone committed murder and they decided to stick it to sa.

Had sa fingerprints been found in one or two specific places in the crime scene, i might be skeptical. But they were not and there is no good explanation for the lack of such evidence.

This possible frame up is, to me, almost as tragic as the murder.

bbm - excellent point!!!

 

[missy1974]

The coroner ~ They didn't let her in because it was a conflict, fine, we'll ignore the fact that Manitowoc's officers were still ACTIVE in the investigation.

Why didn't they call in the coroner from Calumut County? or from anywhere in Wisconsin? I could see deviating from protocol because of the conflict; however, it doesn't mean they skip that step all together.

http://www.co.calumet.wi.us/index.aspx?NID=166 They do have their own, at least today they do.

ETA: THEY = LE in charge of this investigation. I will not put who, because really.... I'm not sure at this point.

 

[BigCityAccountant]

Right, but didn't they leave for the cabin on the 3rd? So, they had from Nov3-Nov5th or 6th? Plenty of time to be on the property to search.

No, he left at 6:00am on November 4th with his mom according to what he told LE.

 

[BigCityAccountant]

Yes it is.. I am not going to get into the most cops are bad thing because it is not true. There are some bad apples but I am tired of people blaming Cops when they don't like the outcome..

The odds of a murder happening on his property that he has nothing to do with are astronomical. The fact that he knew her called her, His blood is in her car, which is found on his property and that her bones are found burned on his property is too much. Any other case people would know he was guilty.

He is playing the poor me I am innocent card and it makes me sick..

Maybe he should play the lottery....LOL

 

[Sinsaint]

SA must not have any common sense as he :

1) Used *67 to hide his phone number twice when calling TH
2) Killed her on the family property knowing he could be seen/heard at anytime by other family members
3) Hid her vehicle in plain sight in the salvage yard knowing LE would be looking for her
4) Burned her body in a firepit/burn barrel right next to his house knowing that bones might be found
5) Shot her in his own garage knowing the shots might be heard and cleanup would be necessary
6) Hid TH's key in his tiny bedroom
7) Relied on an impressionable 16-year-old not to tell anyone

Is he possibly guilty ? If he is, he has to be one of the dumbest criminals on earth as he already spent 18 years in a maximum-security prison and knew what it was like.

As a side note, does anyone have a theory as to why SA or whomever removed the battery cables from the battery ?

If you think Avery is guilty there must be a purpose for disconnecting those cables but nothing comes to mind. Disconnecting the cables only ensures the vehicle can't move, even with a key.

On the other side I can see plenty of reasons for disconnecting the battery. One, it stays put unless you reconnect the battery, hotwire it or have the key to then turn it on. Otherwise you're going to be forced to tow it. Two, if the vehicle had an alarm the only way to shut it off without the key fob would be to disconnect the battery. If someone didn't have the fob and was trying to tow it in silently, the only way to do so would be to disconnect the battery.

 

[Madeleine74]

I find it sad and telling that people are up in arms by how TH's remains "were treated" by those recovering the charred little bits left of her, which had to be sifted from a pit of ashes and steel belts and whatever else was burned. I sure don't see anger and disgust at TH being burned to bits in the first place--that's who deserves the real vitriol, IMO. By the point LE found her (after a cadaver dog hit on the burn pit and barrels) the torture and murder of poor Teresa had already been a fait acompli.

 

[BigCityAccountant]

BBM...... Um Sgt AC could have seen his hand when he was at his trailer on Nov 3. You know right before he found the real crime scene. The other officer may have seen it on the 4th when he went there questioned him and even walked through his trailer. They could have noticed the burnt out seat in the back of his garage. They may have noticed burn barrels in front of his house and behind BJ's place. These are things they are seeing between the time she was reported missing and the time the car was planted.
The problem I have with the smear at the ignition is its going up. and looks like a drop that was smeared upward. I do believe it could go upward had he been turning the key back to the off position as his hand would come backwards. However there is also another drop that went side ways. How does that happen just turning the key in the ignition even with gloves on. I think they also goofed planting the blood. should have made one smear and going down might have been more believable to me. JMO

Is it possible the "smear" happened while trying to wipe down the car for prints, etc. He just didn't notice the blood there and it got smeared with a rag or towel or whatever he was using to wipe off the steering wheel?

 

[Sinsaint]

I actually don't know what thread is good for this. so I will just add it to this one. if they move it then I will know where it goes.

Why would there be stains on the passenger seat? I thought Dassey was sitting there.

 

[Sinsaint]

Some of Zellner's tweets mysteriously vanished. One of them being the Kratz letter sent to Avery about confessing to make a book.

Lol... The World Wide Web has it now.

 

[Madeleine74]

Is it possible TH's SUV was moved to its spot when it was dark outside by Avery? I would think it was certainly possible. What appears as obvious in hindsight, with light shined on the dark interior, is not so obvious. The people who came to the scene after Pam Sturm called, testified they didn't open the SUV, the SUV was locked.

 

[Sinsaint]

I asked this question here last night wondering if EDTA could now be found in blood. And usually forensic evidence covers blood or DNA or ballistics......I certainly don't know what new advances have been made since 2005-2007. Ten years is a long time.

Any more ideas at what she could be hinting?

I know over the last ten years ballistic testing has come under much scrutiny. Most scientists consider it one of the most fallible tests and lump it in with junk science.

 

[missy1974]

I find it sad and telling that people are up in arms by how TH's remains "were treated" by those recovering the charred little bits left of her, which had to be sifted from a pit of ashes and steel belts and whatever else was burned. I sure don't see anger and disgust at TH being burned to bits in the first place--that's who deserves the real vitriol, IMO. By the point LE found her (after a cadaver dog hit on the burn pit and barrels) the torture and murder of poor Teresa had already been a fait acompli.

Enlighten me.... what does this tell you?

No one said on here (since I have followed), or anywhere for that matter, that what happened to TH is not awful. But that doesn't mean if someone is in prison for not doing it, it isn't as equally terrible. And IMO what happened to BD is even worse than SA, at least SA can handle the situation better, he's was there for 18 years and survived. BD was 16 yrs old and they used and manipulated him.

 

[BigCityAccountant]

in 1996, the nurse drew the blood, it was put in the styrofoam and into a box. both were sealed with the first of the evidence tape. the Red tape. dated 1-2-96. Then the box went to the lab where it was sliced. and the blood was tested. then the lab tech put the vial back in that styrofoam taped it closed with clear evidence tape dated it 3-13-96. put it back in the box and taped and dated it the same 3-13-96. The vial it self said exp. Mar 96. Then the box was sent back to the Clerk and put back into evidence. In 2002 Lenk went into the evidence box that had the blood from both steven and PB. also had the fingernail clippings and hairs in that box. Per court order they opened the box and took the Fingernail clippings and hair. That evidence of blood should never have been touched again. Not until the defense team went to check on it in Dec 2006. However that is not the case. The Tape was cut on both sealed items. placed back into the box then sealed with scotch tape. This to me says since no one ever signed it out of the evidence since it was placed there in 96'. That second piece of clear evidence tape should never have been cut open.

So, my question is, if they only sent the hair and fingernail clippings--did they get re-merged into the old container when it came back from the lab in Mar-96? I mean was the hair and fingernail clippings in with the blood when it was found after TH was murdered? ...or was it maintained in 2 separate containers. Remember Lenk did not send the blood--only hair and fingernail clippings.

 

[missy1974]

So, my question is, if they only sent the hair and fingernail clippings--did they get re-merged into the old container when it came back from the lab in Mar-96? I mean was the hair and fingernail clippings in with the blood when it was found after TH was murdered? ...or was it maintained in 2 separate containers. Remember Lenk did not send the blood--only hair and fingernail clippings.

In the documentary, they showed the video of Buting with the prosecutors opening the box. I did not see the hair/fingernail clippings in the same box, and I don't think they were contained in the same box. Seems from everything I have read, the styrofoam and box is pretty standard for the blood vials.

 

[BigCityAccountant]

It could be as simple as testing area's of the RAV4 that were never tested, or retesting. I remember reading that there were fingerprints never matched up, maybe just running those now 8 years later might show someone in the system now that wasn't in 2005-2007.

Yes, I believe those were found on the hatchback window--although I read they were "palm prints" not fingerprints.

 

[Sinsaint]

I find it sad and telling that people are up in arms by how TH's remains "were treated" by those recovering the charred little bits left of her, which had to be sifted from a pit of ashes and steel belts and whatever else was burned. I sure don't see anger and disgust at TH being burned to bits in the first place--that's who deserves the real vitriol, IMO. By the point LE found her (after a cadaver dog hit on the burn pit and barrels) the torture and murder of poor Teresa had already been a fait acompli.

I'm sure those who think Avery and Dassey were wrongly convicted are still disgusted by the way she was murdered. They just want the right person to PAY for that atrocity.

 

[BigCityAccountant]

Great! Then they found the keychain with her house key, business key, other keys? No? Hmmm, wonder where those are considering they wouldn't just melt away.

Did he not leave his house between Oct 31 and Nov 8th when they found the other evidence? He could have put the keys in his pocket and then thrown them out the window when he went up to Crivitz with his mom. Just let you hand hang out the window and drop them.

 

[BigCityAccountant]

I'm not sure how or who deleted Zellner's tweets... but she is going on a bit of a rampage, seems she is posting articles she can find LOL


Kathleen Zellner ‏@ZellnerLaw 21m21 minutes ago
So If the truth hurts, just delete it. #MakingAMurderer http://wncy.com/news/articles/2016/...-prosecution-to-twitter/#.Vq1GrVXHxoI.twitter …

Kathleen Zellner ‏@ZellnerLaw 24m24 minutes ago
#MakingAMurderer Stephen Avery's new lawyer is destroying the case against him on Twitter http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...oys-prosecution-case-on-twitter-a6829741.html …

Kathleen Zellner ‏@ZellnerLaw 25m25 minutes ago
#MakingAMurderer Steven Avery’s New Lawyer Defends His Innocence on Twitter: He Was ‘Framed’ http://usm.ag/1nrJB7T via UsWeekly

Kathleen Zellner ‏@ZellnerLaw 25m25 minutes ago
#MakingAMurderer Steven Avery's New Lawyer Is Already Dismantling The Case Against Him On Twitter http://uproxx.it/1NnMwD3

Kathleen Zellner ‏@ZellnerLaw 26m26 minutes ago
#MakingAMurderer Steven Avery's lawyer has destroyed the prosecution's case on Twitter http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/making-murderer-steven-averys-lawyer-7236406#ICID=sharebar_twitter …

Kathleen Zellner Retweeted
Kent Riley ‏@Kentriley 2h2 hours ago
@ZellnerLaw I noticed they had disappeared (like all TH DNA from the crime SCENES ! Eg bedroom and garage ��loving your work ��������

We really don't know where she was killed. So, there maybe TH DNA somewhere on that property and not necessarily in the bedroom and garage, doesn't prove he didn't do it. But, the overwhelming amount of evidence points to someone on that property.