NH NH - Allenstown, Adult Female & 3 Children, found Nov'85 & May'00 #2

[Alleykins]

Somewhat OT: DNA Doe Project made a detailed post explaining how they identified Buckskin Girl as Marcia King. In the comments someone asks if they would consider working on the Bear Book/Allenstown 4. Margaret Press replies they are on the list for consideration:
https://www.facebook.com/DNADoeProject/posts/2048512292074212

I'm hoping that DDP will pick up this case and solve it.

I saw a week or two ago that the A4 were on the DDP list of potential cases. Then I remembered how degraded their DNA profiles were and got discouraged. The adult female's was so bad off they couldn't even compare it to TR.
Then I saw the two ladies from DDP at the recent press conference and they said they could work with degraded samples, some they said were about 5% I think? This gave me hope again. If they can ID the adult female, the 2 related children should be able to fall in line with her.
The middle child may still remain a mystery if her mother was a runaway and her maternal family didn't know she was pregnant, don't know about her existence.

 

[Gardener1850]

I saw a week or two ago that the A4 were on the DDP list of potential cases. Then I remembered how degraded their DNA profiles were and got discouraged. The adult female's was so bad off they couldn't even compare it to TR.
Then I saw the two ladies from DDP at the recent press conference and they said they could work with degraded samples, some they said were about 5% I think? This gave me hope again. If they can ID the adult female, the 2 related children should be able to fall in line with her.
The middle child may still remain a mystery if her mother was a runaway and her maternal family didn't know she was pregnant, don't know about her existence.

I think there is hope, too! With 4 victims and 3 of them related DDP could choose to focus on whichever 1 victim out of the 4 had the best DNA sample for sequencing. Identifying one of the 3 related should ID the others. Identifying Terry's daughter may reveal the other 3 as well since it would be a huge piece of the puzzle about where TR was prior to murdering them all. JMO.

 

[Roselvr]

I think there is hope, too! With 4 victims and 3 of them related DDP could choose to focus on whichever 1 victim out of the 4 had the best DNA sample for sequencing. Identifying one of the 3 related should ID the others. Identifying Terry's daughter may reveal the other 3 as well since it would be a huge piece of the puzzle about where TR was prior to murdering them all. JMO.

I think if anything they'd do the mothers. They normally don't do children since parents are responsible for their deaths but the murderer has been found. Would be nice if they did the middle child too but I'd settle for the mother 1st to see what that brings.

 

[folieadeuxnola]

I think if anything they'd do the mothers. They normally don't do children since parents are responsible for their deaths but the murderer has been found. Would be nice if they did the middle child too but I'd settle for the mother 1st to see what that brings.

Recall early DDP stated they would not work on children's case's. Your right the oldest is above child/teenage years, in all how would that play into the others as that they are "children" and the case is connected. Read that they are on the list it may be their trying to decide the best way to handle with (3) children that are also involved.

I think one of the DDP founders is whom assisted in the search for D/L's family.

 

[taramarie]

I think this case would be an exception. They’ve stated in the past that they won’t generally take on child cases because finding the identity can reveal the killer, as most murdered children are victims of familial abuse. Since DNA is voluntarily uploaded into GED Match by individuals using it for ancestry purposes, they could be unwittingly implicating a family member in a murder which could jeopardize DNA Doe Project’s relationship with GEDMatch.

Long story short, we already know who killed these children, so I don’t think their policy would apply to this particular case.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Roselvr]

I think this case would be an exception. They’ve stated in the past that they won’t generally take on child cases because finding the identity can reveal the killer, as most murdered children are victims of familial abuse. Since DNA is voluntarily uploaded into GED Match by individuals using it for ancestry purposes, they could be unwittingly implicating a family member in a murder which could jeopardize DNA Doe Project’s relationship with GEDMatch.

Long story short, we already know who killed these children, so I don’t think their policy would apply to this particular case.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That's what I was saying, we know who killed them all so it shouldn't apply but they rely on funding. If LE could not fund all 4 I would think that just funding the adult and the middle child to see what answers that gave. We know that the oldest and youngest is maternally related to the adult so it shouldn't be hard to figure out if they're lucky to get a genetic match. With the middle child, we know her father, need to ID her mother's side.

It's also very possible that Id'ing the adult could lead to her family having an idea of where the middle child came from

We're talking about $1,500 per Doe. Could end up being more if there is degraded DNA. I'm also not sure if getting DNA from bone or teeth costs more then extracting from a vile of blood

I think if anything they'd do the mothers. They normally don't do children since parents are responsible for their deaths but the murderer has been found. Would be nice if they did the middle child too but I'd settle for the mother 1st to see what that brings.

 

[folieadeuxnola]

Authorities use N.H. method to help catch Golden State Killer

http://www.concordmonitor.com/Investigators-looked-to-NH-to-catch-Golden-State-killer-17298247

Officials here never revealed how, exactly, they solved a cold case that had baffled them for years. Investigators couldn’t figure out the true identity of the Allenstown killer or where he was.

Jeff Strelzin, the senior assistant attorney general and chief of the homicide unit, said Friday he knew nothing about a connection between the New Hampshire case and the search for the Golden State Killer, adding that he was not contacted by officials in Californi

Meanwhile, the baby who left the state in 1981 with Denise Beaudin was later identified as Dawn Beaudin, and she survived the ordeal after Rasmussen abandoned her in 1986 in a California trailer park. She lives in an undisclosed location in New Hampshire.

Finally, DNA confirmed in 2016 that Rasmussen was the biological father of one of the little girls found in Allenstown, but not the other two.

All of which leaves ongoing mysteries that remain on law enforcement radar.

Who are the four females found in those two barrels 15 years apart?

And where and who is the mother of Rasmussen’s child, one of the little girls found in 2000?

And where and who is the father of the other two little girls found in those two barrels (the woman was related to the two girls, but DNA testing could not confirm she was their mother)?

And, finally, what happened to Denise Beaudin, the Goffstown teen who left the state with her baby and Rasmussen in 1981? State investigators have said they believe she’s dead.

Maybe a free website will have the answers.

“Those are all victims or potential victims who we are well aware of,” Strelzin told me. “And given the history of Rasmussen, there could be more.”

 

[carbuff]

That's what I was saying, we know who killed them all so it shouldn't apply but they rely on funding. If LE could not fund all 4 I would think that just funding the adult and the middle child to see what answers that gave. We know that the oldest and youngest is maternally related to the adult so it shouldn't be hard to figure out if they're lucky to get a genetic match. With the middle child, we know her father, need to ID her mother's side.

It's also very possible that Id'ing the adult could lead to her family having an idea of where the middle child came from

We're talking about $1,500 per Doe. Could end up being more if there is degraded DNA. I'm also not sure if getting DNA from bone or teeth costs more then extracting from a vile of blood

Back when they were doing the initial DNA testing, the adult's DNA was so degraded they could only get mtDNA. They did more testing later when better techniques came along, but I don't know whether they were able to improve hers. They might have better luck with one of the children. Since they're all related, it shouldn't matter which one they work with.

 

[Springrain]

Tomorrow will be the 18th anniversary since the youngest and middle child were found, RIP angels :rose:

It would be great if DNA Doe Project took on the adult female and middle child. I believe the adult female's identity would quickly lead to the identity of the oldest and youngest child, since they were maternally related and seemingly mother and daughters. The middle child would probably have to be done separately to get her identity, I'm assuming, unless someone from the adult female's life remembers her.

 

[Alleykins]

Back when they were doing the initial DNA testing, the adult's DNA was so degraded they could only get mtDNA. They did more testing later when better techniques came along, but I don't know whether they were able to improve hers. They might have better luck with one of the children. Since they're all related, it shouldn't matter which one they work with.

You are correct about the adult female's DNA being very degraded. AG Agati mentioned this in the November 2015 (or was it 2016?) pc as a reason why they didn't compare all the victims' DNA to the criminal DNA db (the child victms DNA was only slightly less degraded, he said). After they ID'd TR and discovered the middle child was his, I read in an article that the adult female's DNA was so degraded, they couldn't compare it to TR's and are only assuming they're not related (paraphrased).

 

[rats]

So if DDP did this case they would probably have to do the two oldest children... But they don't want to do child cases. Will an exception be made because they already know the killer?

 

[Alleykins]

So if DDP did this case they would probably have to do the two oldest children... But they don't want to do child cases. Will an exception be made because they already know the killer?

I know they said they didn't want to do children cases, but where they know who the killer is and he's deceased, I'm hoping they will make an exception.

 

[carbuff]

I presume the investigators will continue to go through whatever labs they used for the previous DNA work. That lab would already be up to speed on the case.

 

[folieadeuxnola]

How a mummified body helped unravel the Allenstown murders

https://www.fox25boston.com/news/ne...lped-unravel-the-allenstown-murders/747980623

New England's Unsolved's Bob Ward traveled to an undisclosed location out of state, to talk to the retired investigator who finally caught Terry Rasmussen: the serial killer behind the Allenstown, New Hampshire murders. A woman and three children who were found in those barrels.

They're identities are still unknown.

But a mummified body, found in cat litter in a California crawl space helped unravel the mystery.

 

[folieadeuxnola]

Criminologist: 'Allenstown killer is unlike any serial killer I have ever studied'

https://www.fox25boston.com/news/cr...serial-killer-i-have-ever-studied-2/747800653

"What distinguishes Rasmussen from most serial killers, is that he targeted people with whom he had a relationship," Levin told Ward. "Most serial killers would never do that; it's the last thing they would do. Instead, they focus on complete strangers."

 

[Gardener1850]

How a mummified body helped unravel the Allenstown murders

https://www.fox25boston.com/news/ne...lped-unravel-the-allenstown-murders/747980623

Eunsoon Jun's thread: https://www.websleuths.com/forums/s...on-Jun-Murdered-by-Suspected-SK-Richmond-2002

 

[Springrain]

I'm wondering if the middle child's mother had a young daughter before she even met Terry that may have been murdered by him before the Bear Brook murders.

 

[Two for the road]

Sorry if this has been posted before, but have Doris and Caren Wurst been ruled out? They are not on the Namus list.

http://charleyproject.org/case/doris-helen-wurst

https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/34631/0/

Missing since 1974, would be enough time for Doris to have another kid and Caren looks a lot like the recon of the oldest child. Forgive me if it's already been suggested.

 

[KaylaraOwl]

I submitted them back when Ronda and I helped get their cases added to Namus. No word back on them.

 

[carbuff]

I presume the investigators will continue to go through whatever labs they used for the previous DNA work. That lab would already be up to speed on the case.

According to this article, Parabon is going into this area in a big way:

https://www.theatlantic.com/science...g-wave-of-murders-solved-by-genealogy/560750/