NH NH - Allenstown, Adult Female & 3 Children, found Nov'85 & May'00

[Springrain]

My first thought upon seeing the new recons was, wow, the middle girl looks *just* like the one in Carl's recon.

 

[Fireweed]

Everyone from these areas needs to think back on a man they knew who claimed his wife just took off with another man. I highly doubt a random killer did this. If that true then he had the world's greatest dumb luck in picking four people who would never be missed.

I see a woman who was a teenage mother from a working class background who spent her life on being on the edge of the underclass. She moved a lot and was unreliable when it came to keeping in touch with her family. Perhaps as a teenage mom she was ostracized from her family. Someone out there knows exactly who these people are.

 

[Springrain]

Everyone from these areas needs to think back on a man they knew who claimed his wife just took off with another man. I highly doubt a random killer did this. If that true then he had the world's greatest dumb luck in picking four people who would never be missed.

I see a woman who was a teenage mother from a working class background who spent her life on being on the edge of the underclass. She moved a lot and was unreliable when it came to keeping in touch with her family. Perhaps as a teenage mom she was ostracized from her family. Someone out there knows exactly who these people are.

I agreed. I picture him as being around 60, I believe that of the earth is most likely still around. I totally agree about her being unreliable about communicating, perhaps shunned from her family. She seems to be considered fairly young, socially, to have a kid around 11, but it's definitely not unheard of, by any means.

 

[Fireweed]

I agreed. I picture him as being around 60, I believe that of the earth is most likely still around. I totally agree about her being unreliable about communicating, perhaps shunned from her family. She seems to be considered fairly young, socially, to have a kid around 11, but it's definitely not unheard of, by any means.

Back in the late 70s/early 80s somebody's daughter/sister/cousin/friend took off with some guy and never came back. did they all four just randomly move to nh? I bet their killer has strong ties to that area. They don't though. I think he moved them there and is so often the case, the violence greatly escalated once he had isolated his victims. It took as little at two weeks but not more than three months.

 

[Springrain]

Back in the late 70s/early 80s somebody's daughter/sister/cousin/friend took off with some guy and never came back. did they all four just randomly move to nh? I bet their killer has strong ties to that area. They don't though. I think he moved them there and is so often the case, the violence greatly escalated once he had isolated his victims. It took as little at two weeks but not more than three months.

Since the adult and the oldest and youngest are from Northeast, I don't think they were too far from NH, but probably not from there. I wouldn't even be surprised if they were from VT. Anyway, I think he has a history of a violent temper most likely, and it was definitely not random. I think he didn't meet them with the intention of killing them, but did.

Also agree with lots of you folks about the middle and youngest girls having the same father, different mother. I would bet they both take after their mother--adult female resembles the youngest, and they are maternally related--but share some common traits because of same Dad.

 

[Fireweed]

I cannot help but think of the real lives these people had. Somewhere out there tonight is a woman in her early forties in the northeast who had a friend in the first, second or third grade. Perhaps that friend had new baby sister she talked about and maybe she moved suddenly. The woman has occasionally looked for her on MySpace or Facebook over the years but never finds her. Perhaps she just assumed she no longer uses the same name. I believe this people will finally get a name when friends of the oldest girl give police her name.

 

[Beamie]

I can't help to think about maybe they were all kidnapping victims. Like the mother being kidnapped at a young age, and forced to live with the kidnapper for years, giving birth to 2 of his kids, and him kidnapping another child

 

[Sherwood Park]

I cannot help but think of the real lives these people had. Somewhere out there tonight is a woman in her early forties in the northeast who had a friend in the first, second or third grade. Perhaps that friend had new baby sister she talked about and maybe she moved suddenly. The woman has occasionally looked for her on MySpace or Facebook over the years but never finds her. Perhaps she just assumed she no longer uses the same name. I believe this people will finally get a name when friends of the oldest girl give police her name.

I was thinking about your quote. The eldest (possibly the mother) had dental work, she likely would have had some type of insurance or medical assistance to cover the cost. I wonder if she was on social assistance at some point. If so, I hope former social workers or women's shelter workers will take a look at all the drawings of the 4 females and see if it jogs their memory.
One child showed signs of pneumonia and another child is suspected of having anemia. I'm wondering if any of the 3 children received regular health care.
Anemia in young children is most commonly caused by malnutrition.
The oldest female received dental care, but the other two obviously hadn't yet. I'm wondering if there was a change in their financial circumstances at some point.

 

[Tony1902]

My thoughts too. I pictured her father being Caucasian and mother NA. Then it would make sense if the youngest and middle girls shared the same father, different mother. If the middle girl took after her mother.

If they release the mtDNA clan grouping you'd know whether the child belonged to a Native American matrilineal clan. I wish they'd do that for all of the unidentified. It would probably be among haplogroups A, B, C, D & X with a sub-grouping. The most common Western European maternal line is Helena, H.

 

[cvaldez1975]

he could be, or he could have drank himself to death, OD'd, or been shanked in prison by now. I believe the killer was some travelling worker who was also "on the fringe" (carnie?) has been abusive to subsequent partners and known to LE.

I agreed. I picture him as being around 60, I believe that of the earth is most likely still around. I totally agree about her being unreliable about communicating, perhaps shunned from her family. She seems to be considered fairly young, socially, to have a kid around 11, but it's definitely not unheard of, by any means.

 

[catherine.]

I know the circumstances don't seem to match up (or if anyone suggested her before), but I find that the youngest child looks a lot like this girl:

http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/g/ginevicz_megan.html

 

[cvaldez1975]

bbm

yep, the bozo that killed them came into their life.

I was thinking about your quote. The eldest (possibly the mother) had dental work, she likely would have had some type of insurance or medical assistance to cover the cost. I wonder if she was on social assistance at some point. If so, I hope former social workers or women's shelter workers will take a look at all the drawings of the 4 females and see if it jogs their memory.
One child showed signs of pneumonia and another child is suspected of having anemia. I'm wondering if any of the 3 children received regular health care.
Anemia in young children is most commonly caused by malnutrition.
The oldest female received dental care, but the other two obviously hadn't yet. I'm wondering if there was a change in their financial circumstances at some point.

 

[leonhardt]

I was about to bring up the possibility of a husband doing it for insurance money, but then I realized that wouldn't work if his goal was to make it look like they just ran off. So that's probably out.

I must say, reading all these theories is giving me the chills. What a sinister case. A man killing his wife (and children) and simply claiming she ran off with someone else just reminds me of Night of the Hunter.

 

[Lilibet]

I'm so glad to see that there is movement on this case. Marking my spot while I catch up.

 

[Owutatangledweb]

Although this girl seems like she is too young to have been the parent of the older girl, she disappeared on the Ohio/PA line that falls within the isotope map and bears some resemblance to the new reconstruction. I haven't yet looked into the circumstances of her disappearance. However, even the name is throwing me for a loop because there is a boy missing from Oklahoma with the same last name that to me bears a resemblance to one of the children. Other than having the same last names and both having some resemblances to the reconstructions, I can't seem to make it fit. Any ideas anyone?

Evelyn Davis from Ohio:

http://www.missingkids.com/poster/NCMC/1167492/1

Lee Andrew Davis from Oklahoma:

http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/d/davis_lee.html

 

[Owutatangledweb]

Another from Ohio/PA (Lowellville) border within the isotope map who would have been about 20 when she disappeared and it appears that all of her relatives are now deceased. To me, she looks more like the original reconstructions.

http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/b/brewer_phyllis.html

FYI, I'm working through the States at the missingkids website for the range of missing in late 70s through 1985.

 

[apearn]

I agree with it seeming that there was: a young mom, who meets a man with a daughter, and they have a child, then he kills all of them.

One of the nasty things about that is that they could have 4 different last names and , depending on who is looking (family of adult female, father of oldest child, mother of middle child, maybe no one for the youngest) the dates they are reported to go missing could all be different. IF they are all reported and no one is assuming CPS took the kids.

This is a hunt.......:thinking:

I'm glad to see the isotope info though. That is wonderful stuff.

 

[Fireweed]

So today I was thinking a bit about the eldest girl. She had doubled pierced ears, and to me that is the best way LE has right now of solving this case. I sometimes think I am the only person who actually recalls the emotions that went with being a kid, not just the memories. I mean, this is huge.

No girl I ever went to elementary school with had double pierced ears.

I think LE is totally blowing their biggest lead here. Children, especially girl children, notice things like this. It is talked about. Something so edgy in the early 80's on a child that young would stand out to her peers.

There are women in their 40's today who went to school with a girl in the northeast who had double pierced ears and they remember her.

I am several years younger than the eldest girl and grew up in some rather liberal places and a young girl having double pierced ears was practically unheard of. Sure, in high school and jr high some of the edgier and more rebellious girls got a second piercing but no third grader did!

I am saddened to see this is just part of the basic description of this child when to me it should be the leading fact of the case.

 

[annemc2]

Wow, Fireweed. You're right. I'm in the age range of the elder child that was found and it would have been really memorable to have double pierced ears in elementary school. Definitely something very memorable!!

 

[Sleuthie_lu]

My first thought was the Yates family. The Belanger girl would have to be distantly related due to what DNA turned up, but are there any articles that mention family members missing. Speculation= The Yates went to NH to stay with relatives and were in the wrong place at the wrong time. But someone needs to make a connection between the Yates and someone else missing at the same time. You would think a newspaper article would mention a familial connection.