NO BAIL! Australia - Allison Baden-Clay, Brisbane QLD, 19 April 2012 -#27

[itsthevibe]

So, looking at the timeline posted recently, what time do you all think this murder took place? I think a 10 y.o. child is still awake at 8:45 pm and possibly not sound asleep until 9:30-10:00 pm. Allow 30 minutes of discussion/argument after that. If he contacted NBC at 12:20, and if she was killed at home, IMO it could have been after 10:30 pm (Footy Show had been on and GBC remembers it) but before 12:00 midnight. He then needed some time to think before making a call to NBC. All my speculation and IMO.

Sounds plausible. Now that we have more information it's great to get back onto some more serious sleuthing about what happened and when.

How do your times above fit in with the reported time of the screams followed by one muffled scream? ... and with the report of the loud arguing coming from the house?

I was also wondering what relevance there is about the sighting of the cars at Anstead near the Kholo Bridge. I thought that was supposed to have been at 3.30am? But then I noted that the defence said in his remarks at the bail hearing "there is nothing to place GBC at the Kholo Creek site". I wondered about that - was that because that information wasn't placed in the prosecutions case against bail - because they only made the case on some of the information they had? Or because they still had not verified it completely yet? (maybe still wading through phone calls to rule out other drivers of cars fitting similar descriptions). Or could that statement mean that the sighting of the vehicles doesn't prove anything because the number plates weren't sighted?

I know it's only a rumour, but can anyone recall the time NBC was supposed to have been seen at the roundabout?

Maybe we could do our own timeline, with all the facts we know, and then see if any of the more believable rumours fit into that?

 

[itsthevibe]

Yep I stabilized the cross and place 3 bunches of bigger sunflowers on it. Thanks for checking Possum.

I went past it today - it looks gorgeous. You are both such dears

 

[summer_breeze]

ABC and GBC house was rented. (Again, seems odd for a realtor, by profession. This could be just me.....)

From whom was the house rented?

Who "owned" the property???

Looking for additional reasons to motive, or clarification it WAS NOT part of motive.

 

[itsthevibe]

?? I know the above has been discussed several times before in earlier threads. But my question was in regard to when QPS did the clock-timing of one vehicle going around the roundabout several times (it was done during daylight), but I can't remember the time they did this testing.

As I recall it was done in the evening, because people here remarked that the time it was done could have been significant as well. I think it might have been around 10.30pm. Or was it early evening just after 6? It was done on Friday 4 May. But the link below doesnt have a time, I'm not certain about the time I've suggested because I might have mixed it up with the questioning during the night the following week. If you went back on past threads you might be able to find it, because as i recall the first we knew of it was when someone drove past the roundabout and saw the testing going on, and they came and informed us asap.

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...cus-on-road-clue/story-e6freon6-1226347683137


The following Friday 11 May they had a police post at the roundabout and were stopping people and questioning them - police were there between 11.15pm and 4am

http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/que...pares-to-farewell-allison-20120510-1yf7w.html

 

[itsthevibe]

Unfortunately, such a trauma can not be erased. It may be possible to somewhat numb powerful emotions for a limited time, but just as vodka does not freeze, trauma also stays molten, ready to bleed back, no matter how deeply one buries it.

Absolutel agree. There will be scars and damage, and life will have to be lived trying to work around the impact. For some, it might be a daily battle. But one may be lucky enough to be especially blessed and emerge as a model of wisdom and serenity.

 

[Dlady]

First time poster. English is not my first language, so I'm sorry for the mistakes. And also sorry if this has been covered before. I have been trying to read as much as I can, but it's a bit difficult as I live in a completely different time zone.

I have a personal interest in this case, because a long time ago I met Gerard and Allison. I didn't know them well, so i can't comment on their personalities. Still, I was horrified to hear that Allison had went missing because she seemed such a nice lady. I have followed this case ever since, and obviously this should't happen to anybody and ecpecially not to such a nice person.

I have looked at GBC:s facebook guite a few times. We have a lot of facebook-friends in common and not a single one of them has un-friended him. I think it's strange that somebody want's to be friends with an alleged murderer, ecpecially when the prosecution has a fairly strong case. (I'm not and I haven't been fb-friends with G)

In the process I noticed that the number of his friends is going smaller, very slowly. But the night he was arrested, the number of his facebook-friends suddenly went up by about 10. How is that possible? Does he have internet-acces in jail? Where I live, that's not possible, ecpecially right after you have been arrested. Or is there somebody else facebooking for him? That would also be strange, I don't think anyone would accept friend invitations on behalf of an alleged murderer right after he's been arrested. I don't get this.

I hope this is not off-topic. It also puzzles me that so many nice and normal people want to be friends with him. I have un-friended people for racist comments etc, and I think that's common thing to do. So I just don't get this.

Thank you for all the links and info! Without this forum it would have been a lot more difficult to follow this horrible case.

 

[Lurker on Websleuths]

But I wasn't suggesting the police had even investigated whether the kids had been given a sedative.

It was a simple suggestion.That's all.

RE the suggestion of sedatives , they may not have been necessary on the night in question , after all , wasn't it the night following the cross country . Most schools make children walk the track if they don't run it and I'm sure these kids were more than likely to have had a run. The point I am trying to make is THEY WOULD HAVE SLEPT LIKE ROCKS THAT NIGHT....food for thought there , why do it that night hey ?

 

[Lurker on Websleuths]

ABC and GBC house was rented. (Again, seems odd for a realtor, by profession. This could be just me.....)

From whom was the house rented?

Who "owned" the property???

Looking for additional reasons to motive, or clarification it WAS NOT part of motive.

Summer Breeze , under the Australian taxation system there can be advantages to owning a home and not living in it yourself , ie , have it as an investment property and rent it to somebody else and then rent another house to live in yourself. I had looked at a property ownership database just after I joined this website re the Brookfield house in which GBC lived, but I didn't think that there was any purpose to 'out ' the owners of the property as they are more than likely themselves wishing they had chosen other tenants than this real estate agent.

 

[summer_breeze]

First time poster. English is not my first language, so I'm sorry for the mistakes. And also sorry if this has been covered before. I have been trying to read as much as I can, but it's a bit difficult as I live in a completely different time zone.

I have a personal interest in this case, because a long time ago I met Gerard and Allison. I didn't know them well, so i can't comment on their personalities. Still, I was horrified to hear that Allison had went missing because she seemed such a nice lady. I have followed this case ever since, and obviously this should't happen to anybody and ecpecially not to such a nice person.

I have looked at GBC:s facebook guite a few times. We have a lot of facebook-friends in common and not a single one of them has un-friended him. I think it's strange that somebody want's to be friends with an alleged murderer, ecpecially when the prosecution has a fairly strong case. (I'm not and I haven't been fb-friends with G)

In the process I noticed that the number of his friends is going smaller, very slowly. But the night he was arrested, the number of his facebook-friends suddenly went up by about 10. How is that possible? Does he have internet-acces in jail? Where I live, that's not possible, ecpecially right after you have been arrested. Or is there somebody else facebooking for him? That would also be strange, I don't think anyone would accept friend invitations on behalf of an alleged murderer right after he's been arrested. I don't get this.

I hope this is not off-topic. It also puzzles me that so many nice and normal people want to be friends with him. I have un-friended people for racist comments etc, and I think that's common thing to do. So I just don't get this.

Thank you for all the links and info! Without this forum it would have been a lot more difficult to follow this horrible case.

Welcome to WebSleuths Dlady! We are happy to have you here!

Sometimes people are strange. And want to be part of the fray, so they support what they perceive to be the "wronged" or "underdog" in any given situation. Happens even with proven (court/trial/etc.) serial killers.....unfortunately.

MY OPINION.... but my welcome message is genuine.

 

[summer_breeze]

Summer Breeze , under the Australian taxation system there can be advantages to owning a home and not living in it yourself , ie , have it as an investment property and rent it to somebody else and then rent another house to live in yourself. I had looked at a property ownership database just after I joined this website re the Brookfield house in which GBC lived, but I didn't think that there was any purpose to 'out ' the owners of the property as they are more than likely themselves wishing they had chosen other tenants than this real estate agent.

Thank you for your discretion Lurker. It is refreshing. I was looking for a tie-in for another known (outed) suspect in other cases. If that is not the situation, well then letting it go is perfect!!!!!!!

 

[Strangeworld]

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/.../story-e6freon6-1226406390099?from=public_rss

THIS is where accused wife-murderer Gerard Baden-Clay will live, possibly for up to three years, as the high-profile case goes through the legal process.

A toilet connected to a sink, a single bed, a mirror, TV, shelf and desk make up a 3m x 4m cell where prisoners spend 12 hours a day inside the Arthur Gorrie Correctional Centre.

A small window overlooks the nondescript, high-security, prison grounds. Locked prison blocks remain under constant surveillance; thick, secure, doors slam loudly; guards walk freely through long, caged walkways; inmates workout with whatever they can find, pumping chairs like dumbbells.

 

[ozazure]

Welcome to WebSleuths Dlady! We are happy to have you here!

Sometimes people are strange. And want to be part of the fray, so they support what they perceive to be the "wronged" or "underdog" in any given situation. Happens even with proven (court/trial/etc.) serial killers.....unfortunately.

MY OPINION.... but my welcome message is genuine.

If I was his friend on facebook, I imagine I'd not unfriend, I'd be hanging in there to see if anything was ever posted.

 

[Curiousasacat]

I don't think they will be there, but this is just my feeling on the matter. I am assumng the girls are staying with the Dickies, who live on the Gold Coast. Not sure what will be happening in the near future with residence, school etc, but I've been past the house in Brookfield at night a couple of times, and it has been in darkness. It's a rented property anyway, so it will be interesting to see what happens to it.

Very sad situation, from all accounts the girls loved their school but I can't see how they can continue going there, or return to live in that area. It is a 50/50 situation to my mind, on the one hand good for them because they are supported at school, it's familiar, they have their friends etc, and it's one thing that hasn't changed and been ruined or taken away from them (if they were somehow able to still go there). On the other hand, maybe there are too many bad memories associated with the district now, and they are better to be in a new environment with no physical reminders of all that has occurred. How could they stay living in the house where the murder took place?

Although it's an initial wrench maybe starting afresh at a local school, in the new location with their grandparents, lots of visits from Allisons sister and brother, and maybe their favourite friends from Brookfield now and then would be best. I guess these are some of the many decisions that the various child support services and professionals the Dickies may have access to can help them with.

I am going to the cricket day, and I'll be wearing a sunflower, contriuting to funds raised, and sending up prayers for Allison and girls! Hope it's a beautiful sunny day and they raise more than $20,000

Agreed and written so much better than I had tried.
I wish I could be there also but I am so pleased that some from here will be there. I bet the sunshine's down beautifully today and how nice they chose yellow. I hope you have an enjoyable day Vibie x

 

[Curiousasacat]

About chargers. At home or in a car, iPhones are charged via USB ports, so device identification numbers used for connection are recorded. It is pretty much straight forward to identify where the phone has been charged.

Grannie you don't have to use a USB port you can plug it into a charger on the wall or a dock,like an alarm etc.

 

[SapphireSteel]

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/watched-prisoner-not-able-to-cope/story-e6freon6-1226406495736

As already posted, but the whole article.

Baden-Clay to be protected prisoner

by: Alison Sandy From: The Sunday Mail (Qld) June 24, 2012 12:00AM


GERARD Baden-Clay is expected to be a protected prisoner at Arthur Gorrie Correctional Centre, requiring 24-hour observation, seven days a week.

Corrective Services confirmed the 41-year-old would most probably be kept separate from other prisoners and remain in the medical unit until later this week.

Then another assessment of his mental health could be undertaken following his failed bail bid.

It's understood a follow-up examination is necessary because of the knowledge he could potentially remain on remand for years.

A protected prisoner is someone who has been assessed "as not being able to cope with mainstream prison", a QCS spokesman said.

Baden-Clay's day will comprise waking by 6.30am to be ready for a head count at 6.45am to 7am via closed-circuit television cameras before receiving breakfast.

Visiting times are between 9am and 11.15am or 1.15pm and 3.30pm, lunch is at 11.30am and dinner at 4.30pm before washdown at 6pm and lockdown at 6.30pm.

Baden-Clay will be subjected to several musters and head counts each day, but all of them will be via CCTV.

He is due to reappear in Brisbane Magistrates Court on July 9, but the charges must proceed through committal to be dealt with in the Supreme Court.

"At the committal mention, the matter must proceed as a committal hearing unless the defence lawyers advise the court that application will be made to cross examine witnesses," the court documents state.


Geez, he's still getting special treatment! bold bit is my opinion.


*

Not for much longer IMO.

Princess is going down, hard. :woohoo:

People say "how could he have been so stupid?" as more and more allegations are coming out about his behaviour.

I agree, so much of what he allegedly did seems idiotic beyond belief...but if you add in ego, ie his belief that he is smarter than everyone and will not be suspected in the first place (DUH) then it explains a lot of the stupider seeming behaviour. He had help also IMO, and was possibly following some ****** advice.

At the heart of this tragedy is beautiful Allison and her innocent girls. I hope they will find peace and justice. So sad...utterly devastating.


:moo:

 

[Curiousasacat]

I don't understand this line of thinking. How would he have got her in the car, and to keep her there? He couldn't have restrained her manually whilst she died, as he would have been exposed to the exhaust as well. If he had restrained her in the car by other means, there would have been visible signs on the body from restraints. If he drugged her, it would appear in her blood. If he knocked her out, there would be outward signs of injury.

I guess nothing can be ruled out, given we don't have full access to the evidence, but I just can't see this been a possibility. Sorry!

Edit: also, if he had just locked the door and held it shut (or something along these lines - i.e. she was conscious but locked in car), there would likely be damage to her nails/hands or other body parts like deep bruising from pushing shoulder against door, in an attempt to exit the vehicle.

What would an autopsy show if she was silenced/suffocated via a pillow over the face? Anyone???

 

[Curiousasacat]

Yep I stabilized the cross and place 3 bunches of bigger sunflowers on it. Thanks for checking Possum.

Thank you Keen for taking the time to do this, a long drive and all for you.
What a lovely thing to do and to you all who have checked for her and indro would if she could too I am sure. xx

 

[Strangeworld]

What would an autopsy show if she was silenced/suffocated via a pillow over the face? Anyone???

There's probably others who could answer this with more certainty but I'd guess there could be fibres found in airways, change in skin colouration (though don't know how relevant this would be given her exposure outdoors for so long). Maybe even some bruising. Would also love to hear what others have to say.

 

[SapphireSteel]

First time poster. English is not my first language, so I'm sorry for the mistakes. And also sorry if this has been covered before. I have been trying to read as much as I can, but it's a bit difficult as I live in a completely different time zone.

I have a personal interest in this case, because a long time ago I met Gerard and Allison. I didn't know them well, so i can't comment on their personalities. Still, I was horrified to hear that Allison had went missing because she seemed such a nice lady. I have followed this case ever since, and obviously this should't happen to anybody and ecpecially not to such a nice person.

I have looked at GBC:s facebook guite a few times. We have a lot of facebook-friends in common and not a single one of them has un-friended him. I think it's strange that somebody want's to be friends with an alleged murderer, ecpecially when the prosecution has a fairly strong case. (I'm not and I haven't been fb-friends with G)

In the process I noticed that the number of his friends is going smaller, very slowly. But the night he was arrested, the number of his facebook-friends suddenly went up by about 10. How is that possible? Does he have internet-acces in jail? Where I live, that's not possible, ecpecially right after you have been arrested. Or is there somebody else facebooking for him? That would also be strange, I don't think anyone would accept friend invitations on behalf of an alleged murderer right after he's been arrested. I don't get this.

I hope this is not off-topic. It also puzzles me that so many nice and normal people want to be friends with him. I have un-friended people for racist comments etc, and I think that's common thing to do. So I just don't get this.

Thank you for all the links and info! Without this forum it would have been a lot more difficult to follow this horrible case.

I suspect that someone has his password, possibly his lover or sister.

IMO, it's not so strange those people would remain "friends" with him. A lot will probably be family or business acquaintances, who would choose to remain unbiased in public until he is convicted. He is still innocent until proven guilty in a court of law in Australia.

Mateship is very strong in Australia and most of those "friends" will be choosing to remain so until his conviction, at least in the public eye. Whether they have personally reached out to him is another question - I bet he's already found out who his fakebook "friends" are in actuality...no one.

Btw, your English is perfect, and all sleuths speak the same language no matter what part of the world we're from...you have found a home here! Welcome x

 

[Opinionsgalore]

Well Lordy Geez, what I had to go through just to get here, *(re-activating an email account I NEVER use that WS 'liked'... Good to know that WS takes security seriously ) so I'm obviously a newbie and you've probably sleuthed I've been a lurker.
I'll just dive straight in.
With regards to blood in back of car: death by suffocation can and usually does cause retinal hemorrhaging (sorry for the gross descriptions), if her body was placed in the back of the car for transport there may have been some jarring or knocking of her head (also possibly causing broken tooth) which could have caused a vessel in an eye to burst (sorry again), and leave a small amount of blood in the car.
With regards to the bomb threat, it could have been one of the 'gentleman' taking revenge for the fact 'he' won't be paid, therefore waste as much of GBC 's legal fund as possible.
At this stage I can imagine that GBC's legal team is suggesting he re-think what happened. I wouldn't be at all surprised to see him plead guilty with a 'TM was in on it' added for good measure. GBC knows she talked to QPS and helped to 'stitch him up' - she's now quite likely enemy no.1.
All MOO.