NV - 59 Dead, over 500 injured in Mandalay Bay shooting in Las Vegas, 1 Oct 2017 #5

[komodo]

Well witness reports and multiple shooters - this rings a bell. Daley plaza and grassy knoll.. Acoustics is a tricky business as one can see from Jfk case, where we have decades of bickering and CTs. I remember watching a documentary with US soldiers in Iraq and how difficult it was to locate the shooters/insurgents in the city with echoes of gunshots.

I wouldn’t say there were multiple shooters in this event but the LV PD really isn’t making this easy for itself with all the conflicting and unclear information it is releasing.

 

[m00c0w]

The receipt says he was in room 32135 on the 27th. With one other guest.

True. Good catch. The Sheriff has not done any favors with his explanation of the room thing.

 

[fred&edna]

The older generation just may not want to speak to reporters about it. Our generation is all about SM and being in constant communication with our peers. My parents generation is not like that. Just because people aren’t talking to the media about their experience, doesn’t mean they weren’t there. There were people of all ages there. Strollers were found on site.


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This is part of the reason I found it quite odd that the (mid-20 yr old IIRC*) security guard opted to leave minutes before being interviewed by reporters.

jmo

 

[CARIIS]

Given it was TPM, I was wondering if maybe they had just miquoted... But several other sources say the same thing:

Las Vegas coroner John Fudenberg said an autopsy was completed on the 64-year-old, but a finding on a cause and manner of his death is not expected for several months.​

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...brain-study-stanford-university-a8000221.html

It was apparently an AP release, so I guess that's what the coroner really meant. Which makes it all the more strange, considering I would think cause and manner of death would be apparent... self-inflicted GSW. :moo:

Pure speculation -- I kinda feel like they are gonna go with something organic --that is why from the get go they got "tumor" in the story instantly.

It they can come out with a lesion associated with impulse control was found ......

moo and speculation only - but in the media tumor was bought into the narrative within what 18 hours??

 

[CoolJ]

Well witness reports and multiple shooters - this rings a bell. Daley plaza and grassy knoll.. Acoustics is a tricky business as one can see from Jfk case, where we have decades of bickering and CTs. I remember watching a documentary with US soldiers in Iraq and how difficult it was to locate the shooters/insurgents in the city with echoes of gunshots.

I wouldn’t say there were multiple shooters in this event but the LV PD really isn’t making this easy for itself with all the conflicting and unclear information it is releasing.

The difference in this case is that we have the immediate reaction from witnesses caught on tape. And they are reporting multiple shooters and shootings at other hotels.

The US soldiers you speak of may not have known where the shots were coming from, but they knew if there was more than one shooter, you can bet on that!

 

[canadiangirl]

guess he didn't learn much from his Masters in CRISIS MANAGEMENT.

From the document, it's interesting how its reported that his father was employed for only several months with Greyhound as a driver, then moved to AZ and was able to purchase 2 gas stations. Apparently his son had the same knack for making big investments with money that comes out of nowhere. :thinking:

But only one of his sons because the other was being supported by his brother according to his animated interview. At least that's what I took from it.

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[MistyWaters]

His name is on the receipt.

Can you post a pic please?

 

[m00c0w]

Can you post a pic please?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4948584/Vegas-gunman-ate-burger-bagel-days-massacre.html

 

[CoolJ]

True. Good catch. The Sheriff has not done any favors with his explanation of the room thing.

IMO, the sheriff is just saying what he is told to say. Hard to go off script when you have that Fed goon looking over your shoulder everytime you speak. The FBI has been leading this investigation from day 1. JMO

 

[canadiangirl]

I'm also going to point out that I have heard LEO address CT before. Specifically, they addressed it via Facebook during the Crystal Rogers disappearance in Kentucky. So it's not unheard of. LEO thought it was impeding the investigation.

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I haven't heard them address it for any mass murders. And there were a ton surrounding 9/11, Sandy Hook etc

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[kittythehare]

imo

all behavior has meaning!!

It is the biggest mass murder in the nation

That big story

The world is watching -- and they call a presser in an hour -- come on now

I have seen video of a cop outside the presser before it starting being really nasty kicking people out .

But is was like someone filming it from there tv so I could not tell what outlet it was being aired on. The crawl on the bottom was hard to make out .

I will link it if I can find a way to find out which outlet it was on. It did look like a local tv outlet

As a taxpayer I feel ripped off.

According to officials there are 100's involved in trying to find the "truth"

72 hours had passed since they suddenly yelled presser in 60............no questions

and then they say nothing new

no from employer view ! We pay them.

In private sector of we had 100's of people on our payroll and in 72 hours they do nothing -- I might consider ...............


then we have to ask ourselves what is the purpose a press conference.

My sense is its to answer the medias questions about an event.

Yesterday was like saying your having a BBQ but you bring nothing to eat

kinda effed up IMO- they pulled it on a Friday - so it airs on the east coast late on a Friday afternoon .

They then get 48 hours further away from the story . Its a game. And typically it works ..........

there letting it fade out -- it will go down in history as this lone shooter

Any pressers for next week announced?

I did not think so ..........................

No further clues to any future pressers given.

The only way we will get information is by investigating ourselves
the hotel
the shooter
the reasons.

I dont think there was a second shooter.
BUT they seemed to proclaim it too soon
( I study and follow avidly terrorism and all big events and this appeared to be an act of terrorism when the news first broke.)

Was Paddock the shooter?
Or a stooge, in the wrong place at the wrong time?

You see whats not fitting here is his lack of a mandate.. a story to explain to the world what it is he wanted them to know regarding why he killed so many human beings?

The lack of clarity on the timeline is crazy making.
Are we still being told that in 9 seconds he accomplished the breaking of the 2 windows, the shooting towards the maintenance man, the first shots on the tanks and then the shooting of the people?

aND if thats not the case and he had already broken the windows, why did every alarm in that hotel hop off the wall?

Are you sure the vid you saw was not one made after the end of the presser.. they guy saying he had to change a flight for 12, 000$ to get there but was not allowed in because he was late? He was challenging the PI cop and asking questions? LL and co were also hanging around at that point..

 

[CARIIS]

But only one of his sons because the other was being supported by his brother according to his animated interview. At least that's what I took from it.

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and the two others don't exist!

Media has no interest in the other two brothers -- or so it seems moo

 

[CoolJ]

I haven't heard them address it for any mass murders. And there were a ton surrounding 9/11, Sandy Hook etc

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If people are going to continue to speak about "conspiracy theories" we really do need a working definition of what that means. The Sheriff did not address "Conspiracy Theories". Neither him nor the FBI dude said that term. They said " There is no conspiracy"

 

[canadiangirl]

No, MGM was "helping" him. Union guys were sent out of the room and MGM took him away. They're the ones who made him vanish.

Do you have a link? I don't recall hearing that?


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[CoolJ]

No further clues to any future pressers given.

The only way we will get information is by investigating ourselves
the hotel
the shooter
the reasons.

I dont think there was a second shooter.
BUT they seemed to proclaim it too soon
( I study and follow avidly terrorism and all big events and this appeared to be an act of terrorism when the news first broke.)

Was Paddock the shooter?
Or a stooge, in the wrong place at the wrong time?

You see whats not fitting here is his lack of a mandate.. a story to explain to the world what it is he wanted them to know regarding why he killed so many human beings?

The lack of clarity on the timeline is crazy making.
Are we still being told that in 9 seconds he accomplished the breaking of the 2 windows, the shooting towards the maintenance man, the first shots on the tanks and then the shooting of the people?

aND if thats not the case and he had already broken the windows, why did every alarm in that hotel hop off the wall?

Are you sure the vid you saw was not one made after the end of the presser.. they guy saying he had to change a flight for 12, 000$ to get there but was not allowed in because he was late? He was challenging the PI cop and asking questions? LL and co were also hanging around at that point..

And don't forget those tanks were 600m away. Can an untrained civilian make that shot? I have no idea but my friends in LE say no way.

 

[CARIIS]

No further clues to any future pressers given.

The only way we will get information is by investigating ourselves
the hotel
the shooter
the reasons.

I dont think there was a second shooter.
BUT they seemed to proclaim it too soon
( I study and follow avidly terrorism and all big events and this appeared to be an act of terrorism when the news first broke.)

Was Paddock the shooter?
Or a stooge, in the wrong place at the wrong time?

You see whats not fitting here is his lack of a mandate.. a story to explain to the world what it is he wanted them to know regarding why he killed so many human beings?

The lack of clarity on the timeline is crazy making.
Are we still being told that in 9 seconds he accomplished the breaking of the 2 windows, the shooting towards the maintenance man, the first shots on the tanks and then the shooting of the people?

aND if thats not the case and he had already broken the windows, why did every alarm in that hotel hop off the wall?

Are you sure the vid you saw was not one made after the end of the presser.. they guy saying he had to change a flight for 12, 000$ to get there but was not allowed in because he was late? He was challenging the PI cop and asking questions? LL and co were also hanging around at that point..

good question here is what it was

super short hair cop nasty and controlling and rude imo and was being asked if any gun shot residue was done -- is that the one you saw , and if so then that was at the end?? tia

 

[Betty P]

No Betty.. this is specifically cause and method of death.
I did a google search on how long it normally takes for forensic autopsy specifically
heres the link
http://pathlabs.ufl.edu/services/autopsy/faq-autopsy

• Forensic Autopsy: Forensic autopsies differ from hospital autopsies in their objectives and relationships. In addition to determining a person's cause of death, if possible, forensic pathologists must establish the manner of death (e.g., natural, accident, suicide or homicide) and identity of the decedent (if not known), as well as the decedent's time of death and/or injury. Evidence collected from the body may prove or disprove a person's guilt or innocence. The autopsy also involves evaluating the scene, clothing and toxicology.

On time frame, I found this bit

When are final autopsy reports ready for review?
Preliminary autopsy reports are usually available on the next working day. Final autopsy reports are ready between 30 and 45 days later. Complex cases may take up to 90 days before a final report is complete.

So Coroner does not expect to have things finalised for months..
What was so complicated in his case, I wonder?

Sorry if I wasn't clear in my post, but we're in agreement on all this. Having followed enough cases here, most of us are pretty familiar with the procedure and timelines. Preliminary AR, final AR and all the analysis that goes into the final report. Following an infamous case now where final AR information has still not been released over 1 yr later and news media has taken the AG to court to review the information.

There's been a recent trend among some LE and prosecutors to resist making that info public when related to criminal cases. That has been and should be questioned by the news media and others.

ETA: But the act of ordering further analysis on the perp's brain seems like a good idea.

Thanks!

 

[kittythehare]

Pure speculation -- I kinda feel like they are gonna go with something organic --that is why from the get go they got "tumor" in the story instantly.

It they can come out with a lesion associated with impulse control was found ......

moo and speculation only - but in the media tumor was bought into the narrative within what 18 hours??

NO Cariis. This statement from Coroner oNLY refers to the means and manner of his death. How he died and the circumstances surrounding his death. The only other specific is the examination of the neurological pathway, possibly found some erosion there or its possible he died of a heart attack, brain haemorrhage or something not to do with his alleged shooting of himself or a cocaine, for example , overdose.

A clot, for example would not be always visible and brains are really fragile gelly like things, its really easy to damage them.. They are extremely delicate.

i

 

[kittythehare]

good question here is what it was

super short hair cop nasty and controlling and rude imo and was being asked if any gun shot residue was done -- is that the one you saw , and if so then that was at the end?? tia

He was nasty.
That was aFTER the presser.
The journalists filmed themselves , yet again..desperately seeking a story... and pushing Campos under the bus again... despicable thing to do..

 

[CARIIS]

And don't forget those tanks were 600m away. Can an untrained civilian make that shot? I have no idea but my friends in LE say no way.

hey you !!

Since this I have watched videos shootings these horrid things.

Let me put it this way -- my shoulder was sore from just watching !1

The notion that an old out of shape man physically could hold one of those things for that long with his arms

well pretty ludicrous imo

and we dont even know how along the pic we have seen was -- he did not look
like a star athlete to me .

On a tripod those things still make quite a mess I would think !!

It was minute after minute I would think
physically it took something