NV - 59 Dead, over 500 injured in Mandalay Bay shooting in Las Vegas, 1 Oct 2017 #7

[kittythehare]

Just as an incidental incident, I was in LV one time with my husband. I was just watching people as he checked in, and there was quite a long time, so I had quite a bit of time to people watch in the casino. I saw this very well dressed lady come into the casino, unusually well dressed, and appeared to be very expensive clothes (including high heels, even though I always wear high heels, you don't see them much, a very elegant hat, and an expensive looking fitted suit). She was carrying a large suitcase in her hand, and had no purse. I kind of kept my eye on her, and she was constantly looking around. I saw her walk over to a lady (not as elegant looking as her) sitting at the poker table. She said not one word to anyone, including that lady, and put the suitcase down by the poker table ladies feet. She very quickly exited the casino, no more looking around. I was very intrigued, but my husband basically told me to mind my own business. I don't know what it was, but nothing blew up, so thank God for that. I felt like it was money, but I will never know. Quite suspicious and intriguing was my thought. No one else seemed to notice, and so nothing was made of it. Just a note on weird stuff that happens if you pay attention and look around, like I always do. (My husband calls it nosey!!), Katt

This has me thinking..
My conclusions-(I've spent a while on it)- Ugly lady is a mafia boss, high heels is her secretary
??
?
Very interesting...Great story. Thanks.

 

[MistyWaters]

The P.R. group will certainly have to put a "spin" on the news that the MGM lawyer argued against the motion for a Court Order to preserve all evidence.

In my opinion, this was a "misstep" on the part of MGM to argue against this because this did not look good in a view to "transparency" as well as looking disrespectful towards the victims of the massacre.

From article (below):

" MGM's lawyers argued the order would be unnecessary, because the evidence was already being preserved for investigators"

http://www.krtv.com/story/36648257/mgm-ordered-to-preserve-evidence-connected-to-las-vegas-shooting
.

In other articles a more lenghty response is quoted. I think what that's saying is MB cannot possibly preserve all the evidence because it's either been turned over to investigators and investigators have disturbed the crime scene. The motion should to be more specific imo because I don't this attorney expects that the suite and festival grounds remain untouched and in the same state it was left at on Oct 1st prior to LE's arrival.

 

[kittythehare]

In other articles a more lenghty response is quoted. I think what that's saying is MB cannot possibly preserve all the evidence because it's either been turned over to investigators and investigators have disturbed the crime scene. The motion should to be more specific imo because I don't this attorney expects that the suite and festival grounds remain untouched and in the same state it was left at on Oct 1st prior to LE's arrival.

From what I remember it specified CCTV footage.. that it not be destroyed..

 

[kittythehare]

Regardless many like to be low key and not draw attention to themselves unless it’s a scheduled appearance. It’s not unusual to hear of them moving through fire escapes, back doors, non-public elevators...with bodyguards or assistants in tow and hotel staff with them. Bodyguards or not, a celeb sighting can set off a frenzy of ppl, media can get word of it....yeah not fun for some. Not sure why this is something that that people are getting hung up on.

I agree with you.
But, we're getting hung up on every single thing simply because we have NO information about the alleged killer.
It is not a legal case, will not be going to trial, nobody will be charged with it, therefore no good reason not to inform the GP.. unless they ARE actually still investigation whether or not SP worked alone or for on behalf of another entity..
That cOULD be a possibility here.

 

[katsrfun]

Hi - Kind of what I thought. I thought attractive well dressed lady was Mafia girlfriend/mistress and the lesser one was a carry person, not sure what they call them. She would be the one to deliver the money to whomever, and she was definitely less noticeable, and would not call any attention to herself, like the other one would. I make up in my mind all kinds of stories about what unusual people that I watch are doing. My husband thinks I'm "nuts"; what do you care, he always says to me. Katt

 

[Maroon10]

I used to really like going to Las Vegas, but unfortunately I think most of the stuff I enjoyed is gone now. So I don't have any strong interest in visiting anymore. But the main reason I don't go to casinos is that they are just so damn dirty. If they would clean them up, get rid of the smoking, and improve the food quality, I would go at least for the food. 20 or 30 years ago I was used to smelling tobacco smoke while eating, but not any more. Casinos, just don't seem to change with the times.

I agree that just walking along the Strip is the best part of Las Vegas. It's not really safe, but it's not much more dangerous than any other major city.

Virtually every hotel on the strip is non-smoking now

 

[Maroon10]

Just as an incidental incident, I was in LV one time with my husband. I was just watching people as he checked in, and there was quite a long time, so I had quite a bit of time to people watch in the casino. I saw this very well dressed lady come into the casino, unusually well dressed, and appeared to be very expensive clothes (including high heels, even though I always wear high heels, you don't see them much, a very elegant hat, and an expensive looking fitted suit). She was carrying a large suitcase in her hand, and had no purse. I kind of kept my eye on her, and she was constantly looking around. I saw her walk over to a lady (not as elegant looking as her) sitting at the poker table. She said not one word to anyone, including that lady, and put the suitcase down by the poker table ladies feet. She very quickly exited the casino, no more looking around. I was very intrigued, but my husband basically told me to mind my own business. I don't know what it was, but nothing blew up, so thank God for that. I felt like it was money, but I will never know. Quite suspicious and intriguing was my thought. No one else seemed to notice, and so nothing was made of it. Just a note on weird stuff that happens if you pay attention and look around, like I always do. (My husband calls it nosey!!), Katt

Im thinking sexy RP for a couple.

 

[KaaBoom]

Virtually every hotel on the strip is non-smoking now

Some of them are banning smoking in the hotel rooms, because it wrecks the rooms. That's to protect their property. Everywhere else it's allowed. Of course you can walk into a non-smoking area, but that doesn't accomplish anything. Even here in Oregon where smoking is banned outdoors in most areas, the casinos are still filled with smoke. But that's OK with me. If they want to cater to the minority who smoke instead of the majority who don't, I'll stay away.

 

[Footwarrior]

From the New York Times: 10 Minutes. 12 Gunfire Bursts. 30 Videos. Mapping the Las Vegas Massacre..

The shots began at 10:05. Twelve bursts of gunfire later, the police broke down Stephen Paddock’s door at the Mandalay Bay. The Times mapped 30 videos to draw perhaps the most complete picture to date of what happened.

 

[MistyWaters]

From what I remember it specified CCTV footage.. that it not be destroyed..

But surely that'd be turned over to investigators too?

 

[kittythehare]

But surely that'd be turned over to investigators too?

For sure..

It is possible that for civil cases additional footage may be requested, deemed to be necessary.
Separately, I think the confusion re the PR firm is because they are known to be extremely adversarial.. and they were originally discussed (poss LV Review) in the context of hotel lawyers indicating some kind of resistance to the request.
A judge ruled in favor of the litigators (I THINK thats how it went.. and I think thats possibly when the PR firm were also discussed (I remember posting a link about it somewhere in this thread recently along with a diatribe against MGM)

 

[MistyWaters]

For sure..

It is possible that for civil cases additional footage may be requested, deemed to be necessary.
Separately, I think the confusion re the PR firm is because they are known to be extremely adversarial.. and they were originally discussed (poss LV Review) in the context of hotel lawyers indicating some kind of resistance to the request.
A judge ruled in favor of the litigators (I THINK thats how it went.. and I think thats possibly when the PR firm were also discussed (I remember posting a link about it somewhere in this thread recently along with a diatribe against MGM)

I could be wrong but I have a strong hunch these early legal wranglings by litigation attorneys are mainly for the sake of seeking headlines and attracting additional claimants. Nothing wrong with that. Meanwhile LE and the FBI or MB is not going to disclose evidence in advance of the official investigation being concluded, just because civil suits have been filed. And until the investigation is concluded, the law firms cannot know what MB has already turned over to authorities.

The Sandy Hook lawsuit filed against the town and school district still hasn't seen its day in court even though the shootings occured in 2012.

JMO

 

[kittythehare]

I could be wrong but I have a strong hunch these early legal wranglings by litigation attorneys are mainly for the sake of seeking headlines and attracting additional claimants. Nothing wrong with that. Meanwhile LE and the FBI or MB is not going to disclose evidence in advance of the official investigation being concluded, just because civil suits have been filed. And until the investigation is concluded, the law firms cannot know what MB has already turned over to authorities.

The Sandy Hook lawsuit filed against the town and school district still hasn't seen its day in court even though the shootings occured in 2012.

JMO

Just In re Sandy Hook.. http://thehill.com/homenews/news/356930-fbi-releases-files-on-sandy-hook-massacre

 

[bears10]

Just In re Sandy Hook.. http://thehill.com/homenews/news/356930-fbi-releases-files-on-sandy-hook-massacre

The article was interesting, thanks for posting. Idk if the info in the article is brand new to us or if I just don’t remember since it’s been so long. I do remember that I was living in Hoboken at the time and so was Adam Lanzas bro, and LE came to arrest him bc at first they thought it was him. That’s pretty much the extent of details I remember at this point, and it’s only bc his bro lived a few blocks away from me. Otherwise what would stand out most in my mind is the awful CT who claim sandy hook was a false flag and the parents were crisis actors. Anyway, there’s over 1000 pages on the FBI website but they appear to be so heavily redacted that I def don’t feel like scrolling thru all of them on my phone right now.

That being said, it will prob be a very long time before the official details and docs in this case become available to the public. I think the fact that sandy hook documents are being (somewhat) released after 5 years predicts that the public will not be privy to the details of this investigation any time soon. And when documents are finally made public, they will likely be disappointingly redacted to holy hell.

Sadly, by the time the investigation docs are made public, we will probably have moved on to a different tragedy.. the Las Vegas massacre being a distant memory of details we forget by that point. LE has to do their thing and it’s going to take time. Getting annoyed that they aren’t releasing info to the public isn’t productive or realistic at this point JMO

 

[kittythehare]

The article was interesting, thanks for posting. Idk if the info in the article is brand new to us or if I just don’t remember since it’s been so long. I do remember that I was living in Hoboken at the time and so was Adam Lanzas bro, and LE came to arrest him bc at first they thought it was him. That’s pretty much the extent of details I remember at this point, and it’s only bc his bro lived a few blocks away from me. Otherwise what would stand out most in my mind is the awful CT who claim sandy hook was a false flag and the parents were crisis actors. Anyway, there’s over 1000 pages on the FBI website but they appear to be so heavily redacted that I def don’t feel like scrolling thru all of them on my phone right now.

That being said, it will prob be a very long time before the official details and docs in this case become available to the public. I think the fact that sandy hook documents are being (somewhat) released after 5 years predicts that the public will not be privy to the details of this investigation any time soon. And when documents are finally made public, they will likely be disappointingly redacted to holy hell.

Sadly, by the time the investigation docs are made public, we will probably have moved on to a different tragedy.. the Las Vegas massacre being a distant memory of details we forget by that point. LE has to do their thing and it’s going to take time. Getting annoyed that they aren’t releasing info to the public isn’t productive or realistic at this point JMO

Great points Bear.
I cannot help but feel very annoyed, however..
They could have handled it a whole lot better than going on the defensive.
They are , after all paid employees with the (expensive) skill and training to impart reassurance and coherent and prompt information to a devastated public.
I had not actually realised until I read Misty's post that no trials had come to pass yet. I actually jumped!
when I coincidentally saw it on Twitter almost immediately afterwards I realised that the investigation seemed pretty thorough and I thought of this one..

I find myself in 'waiting' mode still in this case.. Is that a delusion?
It will take years to be complete, but if a revelation occurs in the meantime, it will be made public immediately, or not?
Not necessarily by the LE people, but perhaps by an intrepid REPUTABLE source of journalism.

I dont have the slightest evidence that an event of that nature is anywhere on the horizon, but still I wait...
Part of the process, perhaps.

 

[bears10]

Great points Bear.
I cannot help but feel very annoyed, however..
They could have handled it a whole lot better than going on the defensive.
They are , after all paid employees with the (expensive) skill and training to impart reassurance and coherent and prompt information to a devastated public.
I had not actually realised until I read Misty's post that no trials had come to pass yet. I actually jumped!
when I coincidentally saw it on Twitter almost immediately afterwards I realised that the investigation seemed pretty thorough and I thought of this one..

I find myself in 'waiting' mode still in this case.. Is that a delusion?
It will take years to be complete, but if a revelation occurs in the meantime, it will be made public immediately, or not?
Not necessarily by the LE people, but perhaps by an intrepid REPUTABLE source of journalism.

I dont have the slightest evidence that an event of that nature is anywhere on the horizon, but still I wait...
Part of the process, perhaps.

I understand the way you feel and wish I had answers for you kitty. Of course we all hope nothing happens that will be so big it will turn our attention from this tragedy to another tragedy. But unfortunately it’s likely. Media reports have died down a lot already, probably due to the secrecy of the investigation. I hope not, but it could be years before we get more info. It could be days, or weeks, but we have to brace ourselves for it to be years, like this sandy hook info release. In both this case and sandy hook, the murderers are dead, so there isn’t mass panic about a psycho being on the loose. Speaking of, there is a potential serial killer on the loose in Florida. Tragedies can happen in the blink of an eye. Especially for people like us who are so emotionally invested in the case, it’s hard to believe that anything could ever happen to change our focus and make us brush this case aside. But if it takes years for LE to release docs like the sandy hook case (which I understand and am not criticizing), we all will move on to the next case that catches our eye. We won’t forget about Vegas, but with no new leads or information, we are going to hit a dead end soon in terms of the forum convo.

 

[Moonchime]

https://www.warc.com/NewsAndOpinion/news/How_MGM_Resorts_delivers_memorable_experiences/83590c56-262c-4245-b527-7348847dd7d7

I've read that MGM has retired this slogan now.

I'm always appalled to see the other slogan "What Happens in Vegas Stays in Vegas" printed across small pink toddler tee shirts. They sell these inappropriate shirts at every casino gift shop as well as at the airport.

My husband and I recently went to the 58 Cross Memorial for the victims located at the "Welcome to Las Vegas" sign. There was a sense of profound sadness as the crowd moved slowly to look at each name and photo on the crosses. Everyone was solemn and respectful. I didn't think I'd cry since I didn't know any of the victims.

That didn't seem to matter though. The loss of so many people was overwhelming. 58 crosses all lined up represents a lot of innocent people. People just like you and me.

People who were only doing what most all of us have done at one time or another in our lives. They were enjoying themselves as they listened and danced to some of their favorite musicians during a live performance.

I hadn't realized just how close to the Welcome sign that the Mandalay Bay is. There it was looming above the 58 Cross Memorial. The only saving grace was that the shooters lair wasn't in view, since it is located on the other side of the hotel.

It truly was sad to see just how young every victim was. As my husband and I looked at one young victim's photo that was attached to her cross, we had mentioned how young she had been. We then heard another person in the procession voice the same thing.

Whenever my eyes met with another's who had also come to pay their respects in some small way, tears were already falling, or they were about to spill over.

I understand that our city is wanting to make certain that the world knows that Vegas is Strong. The people in attendance at the Route 91 Harvest Festival showed great courage and strength as they helped one another get to safety. It's not just Vegas that is strong. It is the people of this city and the people who visit this city who are the ones who are strong.

If I was in charge of any sort of campaign to reach out to the world, I'd ask for this; Pray For Vegas. Please. Say a prayer for Vegas and for all of the victims who came here to enjoy themselves for a while. They've all left behind loved ones who must now live their lives without their loved ones in it. This horrific tragedy of profound loss has sent ripples throughout the lives of those lost. It's not just a loss in Las Vegas. It's a loss that touches countless communities. For a majority of the victim's came here from other cities in the United States as well as from other countries. #PrayForVegas #PrayForOneAnother

 

[Baciagalupo]

From the New York Times: 10 Minutes. 12 Gunfire Bursts. 30 Videos. Mapping the Las Vegas Massacre..

Incredible. I have no doubt he was acting alone. After watching this it's clear he could have killed so many more if not for the big 1-minute break that allowed so many to flee.

 

[Gooddeeds]

For sure..

It is possible that for civil cases additional footage may be requested, deemed to be necessary.
Separately, I think the confusion re the PR firm is because they are known to be extremely adversarial.. and they were originally discussed (poss LV Review) in the context of hotel lawyers indicating some kind of resistance to the request.
A judge ruled in favor of the litigators (I THINK thats how it went.. and I think thats possibly when the PR firm were also discussed (I remember posting a link about it somewhere in this thread recently along with a diatribe against MGM)

-Kitty i did see that post, thank you. That is precisely what most of the talk on the PR firm is about “high profile, adversarial, costly”, etc. They have won large controversial cases with RESCUE being the achieved mission. They got my attention when I read that under them, the MGM employees were not free to speak. That was enforced prior to the JC and SS interview so I guess there was an exception made for it...I don’t know, didn’t hear anything on it.

-I imagine MGM considered who within their go-to resource pool would be the best fit for this.

 

[bears10]

-Kitty i did see that post, thank you. That is precisely what most of the talk on the PR firm is about “high profile, adversarial, costly”, etc. They have won large controversial cases with RESCUE being the achieved mission. They got my attention when I read that under them, the MGM employees were not free to speak. That was enforced prior to the JC and SS interview so I guess there was an exception made for it...I don’t know, didn’t hear anything on it.

-I imagine MGM considered who within their go-to resource pool would be the best fit for this.

Since you’ve stated it as fact a few times, please post the source where the PR firm forbid MGM employees from speaking. TIA