Found Deceased NY - Jennifer Ramsaran, 36, Chenango County, 11 Dec 2012 - # 7

[LJKaust]

It's strange, because I can't find any record of Jen on any of the Camelot pages anywhere... I've tried everything. I wonder if maybe Pob has a link to a profile or anything.

How odd:waitasec:

Maybe 'someone' deleted her profile? If you do that, would any trace of you disappear completely? By completely I mean to the casual observer, not LE computer whiz's.

 

[OffRoadRunner]

Does each town where evidence was found have their own police department? Are they all in Chenango County?

Most towns do have their own local police.. however Plymouth and Pharsalia do not.. rely on the County Sheriff.

 

[CupCaked]

IMO, the fact that she played games is being played up like it's some sort of illicit behavior. I wonder how clicking a mouse to pass time is worse than cheating on your spouse?

Confession time: I have on multiple occasions played online games for more than 9 hours straight. I have created a facebook page and added about 300 people to that fake page to play my games, lol. Nothing sinister. You need to add people to give you energy, unlock tasks, etc. The point of these games is to create a successful farm, kingdom, happy avatar, not meet people or even talk to them.


IMO, the type of game she played (according to POB) is not to meet people, there are no pictures of people, just little avatars of pre-made characters. Often times players don't even select if they are male or female.

What's totally awesome about facebook games is the fact that every time they are played information is saved on the games server that includes what type of device was last connected, ip address, time, time played, etc. Even if messages were deleted, there should still be a way to retrieve them and of course they will have the date deleted.

Also, Facebook does keep track of sessions, so where ever you log in from it will be recorded and you can actually see this in your security settings. For example here is my info:

Last Accessed: Today at 6:46pm <---- This is the time I logged in with my tablet.
Device Name: chromebook
Location: Carmel, IN, US (Approximate) <--------- This is based on IP address.
Device Type: Chrome

I hope that LE has requested this information. My settings had a list of the last 9 different devices used to log in to my Facebook account.

So if she did log in when she "went to the mall" it would include her last log in location.

BBM
I was thinking the same thing. Being that it's been said she accessed the game through her Iphone, I have a few thoughts.

Who ever hosts the server for that game, may have her sessions information.

I have an Android phone and tablet. There are a lot of apps in order to download you have to give them permission to access information in order to work. Such as phone calls, texts, contacts, LOCATION etc. They seem very invasive to your privacy. I am wondering if she had apps on her phone where info could be obtained? I am not familiar with Iphone at all, but just a thought.

I wonder if GR had Jenn's devices like her phone or pc set to sync where he could see everything she was doing? I am not a pc newbie, but just found out I can see open tabs on my pc through my tablet. This is through my google acct with a few Chrome browsers. I am not sure what browsers Iphones use.


Just a few other thoughts:

Has GR worked since Jenn went missing? I am not asking about the last week, but the months she was missing?

GR said he was running the day when Jenn went missing. Maybe he should have been working. If that is the case, does he still have a job?

Regarding FB and Jenn's posts disappearing, I hope he did not delete all her stuff. Maybe he did not delete them, but hid them from public or allow certain people to see her page. My parents had some relatives visit for the holidays and I posted some pictures to FB. I had it restricted that only my cousins out of state and son could see them. I do have a second FB acct for the one game I play and double check to make sure I can't see any restricted stuff I post with my real acct. So far it has worked. I just pray that is what he did with her acct.

Also disgusted with the stuff LD posted about Jenn, with out even knowing her, and disparaging Jenn.

It seems like she was saying Jenn was a 'poser' in regards to running.For her to run and be 4 mins behind GR and ES, especially with the problem of her feet, does not seem to be a 'poser' to me. She actually ran, and I think under her circumstances, did a pretty darn good job at it.

We all know who LD got her info from, and it's sad to think he thought of her as a 'poser' if you know what I mean.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8827833&postcount=990


I feel that Jenn knew of the affair, and that she tried to compete with ES, not in running, but to keep her family together.

I am not sure IIRC, that Jenn mentioned a separation in one of the posts or maybe I read that in MSM? Has anyone else seen that?

My heart breaks for Jenn, her family and children.

ETA: Welcome to the new Members!!

 

[zwiebel]

BBM

I think there are a few motive "options" here- not sure how much of our past forums you have read, but the affair is only the tip of the iceberg unfortunately. Totallly with you on "Why not just get a divorce" seriously- why do people have to kill a spouse instead of separate?

Not only does the deleted game information come across as disturbing but so does the FB info that was deleted & changed. I would think knowing your loved one was missing you wouldn't touch a thing, make sure to leave it as is so that LE could get the most of the information at any time should something come up later. Especially if something terrible should happen, then the family has somewhere to go that the loved one had been & had documented things they were a part of. I have seen people go to loved ones FB's that have passed on & "talk" to them about how much they are missed. JMO though....

Money often turns out to be a factor. Especially if children and issues of custody/child support are involved. Or were about to become issues.

 

[Portabella]

My mind keep going back to the fact that her wedding rings were in the jewelry box. I can only think of one good reason for that, otherwise I believe she would have had them on not stored away.
Can anyone tell me or guide me to that picture of her and the children right before she disappeared .... the one with the Christmas looking tree behind her outdoors? Can anyone see if she had her rings on in that photo? Thank you in advance....

 

[zwiebel]

Of course, I should have added to my money comment; That could hardly apply in this case though, could it? I get the impression from what GR has said that no woman in her right mind would dream of leaving him. And, before the interview with GR where he refused to discuss life insurance with the reporter, he did tell another reporter life insurance was taken out many, many years before, I think?

I'm glad GR has been able to clear the air on that point, so investigators don't need to worry themselves about money motives or anything like that, and can just concentrate on stranger abductions theories.

'A grant of probate or letters of administration can be obtained and the estate distributed. However, some insurance companies will not pay out in case the circumstances of the death makes the policies invalid.........If police are investigating a death in suspicious circumstances, this may also delay distribution of an estate, because a beneficiary will be disqualified if they are convicted of causing the death'

http://www.bereavementadvice.org/me...nations/the-coroner-and-inquests/inquests.php

So, as I was saying, I am so glad there will be no problems on that score here. With such a tragic, traumatic loss and the victim leaving behind children, I'm sure any insurance company will want to pay any claim for Jennifer, to her Trust beneficiary, the moment it can.

I can't wait to see when that will be.

 

[dansmom]

It doesn't matter how it happens - it will effect the children anyway, poor babies. It needs to happen asap.

I agree and without being clinical, there is no way these children will not be dealing with a.) loss of their mother in a violent manner b.) the time she was missing with no idea what would happen to them ( children are inherently self-centered and think they are the center of things, maybe blame themselves)c.) looking back at their father's statements and actions after their mother went missing and died ( presumable they would look at this as they got older). And this only scratches the surface of what they will have to deal with for their lifetime. No matter how much love and care given them , these factors will change their landscape for their lives.
Sadly, unless something unexpected develops they will also lose their father to a prison cell. No child can deal with all of this without major support and help.
I pray that the Renz family will be able to help and support their grandchildren,nieces ,nephew and cousins.

 

[Foxfire]

Awareness is the key - Over 350,000 views on the 7 Websleuth threads for: NY - Jennifer Ramsaran, 36, Chenango County, 11 Dec 2012 -

Morning.. Keep up the excellent sleuthing.. Salute to everyone raising awareness for Jennifer Ramsaran and giving her a voice and insuring swift justice...

 

[Jilllian]

'A grant of probate or letters of administration can be obtained and the estate distributed. However, some insurance companies will not pay out in case the circumstances of the death makes the policies invalid.........If police are investigating a death in suspicious circumstances, this may also delay distribution of an estate, because a beneficiary will be disqualified if they are convicted of causing the death'

RSBM, BBM

Understood that if/when GR is arrested/convicted of murder he himself won't see a dime. But, will the money be put into trust for the children?

 

[Caring4Many]

BBM



Money often turns out to be a factor. Especially if children and issues of custody/child support are involved. Or were about to become issues.

I think a lot of people took my question as a serious one. :blushing: It was rhetorical. I meant it in a why do people have to be so inhumane & selfish sorta way! 8)

 

[zwiebel]

RSBM, BBM

Understood that if/when GR is arrested/convicted of murder he himself won't see a dime. But, will the money be put into trust for the children?

That is what I have just been trying to find a reference link for. My opinion is that if the Trust is the type that passes to the children, and it DOES pass to the children for any reason....then a payout would be made to them. I don't know for certain though, so I'm searching.

Just my opinion, but I do think in this case, whatever the rules are, simple human compassion, as well as public goodwill, would ensure Jennifer's children are not deprived of anything.

 

[imamaze]

Its against TOS to discuss other members in a personal way. You can of course discuss what they have posted and disagree with it, but no personal feelings about any member here. Argue the post, not the poster.

Thanks!

Ima

 

[zwiebel]

I have found one of those lovely legalese documents about insurance and payouts. Like wading through mud. It has case studies there that are /could be very informative. Still wading through, then I have to type out quotes because this flipping tablet won't let me copy. I'll get there in the end though.

 

[Bettylou4you]

My mind keep going back to the fact that her wedding rings were in the jewelry box. I can only think of one good reason for that, otherwise I believe she would have had them on not stored away.
Can anyone tell me or guide me to that picture of her and the children right before she disappeared .... the one with the Christmas looking tree behind her outdoors? Can anyone see if she had her rings on in that photo? Thank you in advance....

Agian, we get this info from GR alone. If she had lost a lot of wieght the rings may not have fit. There are no pictures i have found that show her hands so there is no way of telling. I know i go without my ring when it bothers my hand, which is quite often. The fact that they were in her jewlery box suggests she was just storing them, if she was that unhappy she may have discarded them or not safely stored them.

 

[LivingJuicy]

I still log in daily and go to Missing - Missing Discussion and then I remember, she was located.

I still can't wrap my head around who would do something like this to someone as special as her.

Makes me so sad.

 

[zwiebel]

Warning, boring post coming up, and the link is even worse.

(ref 53)'The insured was found dead, but the medical examiner could not find the cause of death due to severe decomposition.....The estranged husband had been listed as beneficiary and the insured's *children challenged his right to receive the proceeds. Though no criminal charges resulted, a subsequent civil action determined that the husband had murdered the insured, barring him from recovering the insurance benefits.'

(ref 72)'The Court also noted that the contingent beneficiaries, who were entitled to take under the slayer statute if the primary beneficiary was barred, were not parties to the criminal prosecution. The court therefore concluded that due process standards preclude their being bound by the result of proceedings in which they did not participate'

I think point 72 is the one I was looking for. It is basically saying, I think, that beneficiaries who are next in line, cannot be deprived of a payout just because the original beneficiery lost his/her right to a payout. (Yay!!!)

http://www.thefederation.org/documents/schuman.htm

I am really glad I found that. Now am going to start dredging for all those boring legal obligations of those in control of family trusts. *To conserve any money properly, for example, and not go frittering it away on things like expensive cars, or clothes, or someone who has caught their fancy, or expensive criminal defence attorneys- sorry. Can't think what made me put that last one in.

 

[zwiebel]

Please ignore any stars that appear in my posts. They never mean anything. I don't know why it happens. Drives me mad.

 

[Hexe]

Long time lurker here. This is a race that Jennifer, Remy and ES all ran in this past summer with the results online. I assume all runners start at one start time - Remy and ES finish together at 38 minutes - Jennifer 4 minutes behind... How long was this affair really going on? So sad . I also couldn't believe the Mumford and Son song lyrics and that someone would actually post that to their Facebook with all that is happening!
http://stbartsnorwichny.com/FeastdayPoster.htm

I was away for two days and I'm just catching up, so sorry for pulling something from the middle of the thread.
As far as I remember Jennifer was supposed to be unable to run, because of the surgical pins in her toes. So how comes she run in the race past summer? :waitasec:

 

[thefox]

I was able to visit the site yesterday without a deputy sitting there.
The bank was 6 maybe 7' down and very steep. Semi wooded but fairly open.
It appears to be somewhat of a dumping site for those to cheap to pay tipping fees as we could see a large blue plastic tub all busted up just a few feet away.
A body could have been easily rolled off the road quickly here with minimal effort.
If no one paid any attention I suppose it could have gone unnoticed for a while.
It also appeared to be no heavy equipment activity at the site. There way a small pile of snow approximately 1cy in size neatly piled in the shape of a cone. Only about 600sf of the site had been disturbed by foot traffic.

 

[Bettylou4you]

Re: es posting mumford and sons, I Will Wait. Here are the lyrics. Wonder what the sentiment is?

Well I came home like a stone
And I fell heavy into your arms
These days of dust, which we've known
Will blow away with this new sun

And I'll kneel down, wait for now
And I'll kneel down know my ground

And I will wait, I will wait for you
And I will wait, I will wait for you

So break my step, and relent
Well you forgave, and I won't forget
Know what we've seen and him with less
Now in some way shake the excess

But I will wait, I will wait for you
And I will wait, I will wait for you
And I will wait, I will wait for you
And I will wait, I will wait for you

Now I'll be bold as well as strong
And use my head alongside my heart
So tame my flesh and fix my eyes
A tethered mind freed from the lies

But I'll kneel down, wait for now
I'll kneel down know my ground

Raise my hands, paint my spirit gold
Bow my head, keep my heart slow

'Cause I will wait, I will wait for you
And I will wait, I will wait for you
And I will wait, I will wait for you
And I will wait, I will wait for you