NY-LI-4 bodies on Beach-Possible SK-12/10-All id'd,4 more found 3/11 #3

[carbuff]

can man...there is a ton of info if u read back trhu some of the threads.

yes, there may be because of groupings of 4...some have ventured that it may be ocd.

it would have signifigance to the killer. to us I think it's a vague half clue.

Looking at the detailed map, it looks like it might not be a pattern after all.

 

[SuziQ]

I'm bumping up the body discovery locations for those who may not have seen it.

Long Island body location map
http://www.newsday.com/long-island/suffolk/location-of-bodies-in-gilgo-beach-1.2541830


Atlantic City body Location pic
http://www.nytimes.com/imagepages/2006/11/23/nyregion/23slay.2.ready.html

The police placed four white dots on the picture to show where the bodies were found, in a ditch behind the Golden Key Motel on the Black Horse Pike.

Goes with this article. You might have to register to read.

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/11/23/nyregion/23slay.html?_r=1[/quote]

 

[carbuff]

Ok I know it is A baby but more specific it was a fetus ,an unborn child. Which is different in this case.

One woman was four or five months preganant in that case.

This case it is a childs body.

We don't know that yet. The source said it could have been an infant and I suspect all that person is going by is having seen what appeared to be very small remains being removed from the area. The information is not official and is probably very inaccurate, if it's not completely made up.

At least one of the people on that list I compiled was thought to be pregnant.

 

[nursebeeme]

this is an older article but has a lot of good info on the phone calls/taunts that were reported on today

Taunting calls to the sister of a craigslist serial killer victim - calling the missing hooker "a *advertiser censored*" - were made from the heart of Manhattan, sources said Tuesday.

Melissa Barthelemy, 24, was last seen alive July 12, 2009, but her sister in Buffalo got calls from her cellphone on July 16, 19 and 23, sources said.

"Do you know what your sister is doing? She's a *advertiser censored*," a man menacingly said.

It's unclear whether the caller was the psycho who murdered Barthelemy and three other hookers, including Amber Lynn Costello of Long Island, and dumped them on a beach.

The NYPD, which had opened a missing persons case on the Bronx-based prostitute, was able to trace the last two calls to the Madison Square Garden and Times Square area.

"But he shuts off right away so we can never figure out where he was exactly," one law enforcement source said.



Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/ny_...okers_phone_used_in_july_i.html#ixzz1JE8zEiJF

 

[Wondergirl]

This is horrible and just getting worse and worse. I disagree with the writer of the article that it may not be the same perp since it doesn't fit the pattern. Is this beach just a general dumping ground for murderers?? I don't think so. It is in my opinion the same person. This poor child could be the child of one of the victims or the perp is also a child sex offender. So sickening.

BBM: I agree, and this information may help LE identify the victims, if both young child and mother are missing.

I would think this would be a focus of identifying the remains, to see if the DNA from the child matches any of the other remains.

 

[CanManEh]

Just my oppinion I am not putting anything in to the number 4 . i mean if he is dropping off a dead group of girls there is 4 seats in a car too but thats a little risky riding around with well dead people in the car i think since they were all skelletonized i think he just thought he had found a great dumping spot and lets not forget if it wasnt for that missing girl right along there who would ever know its a high way your prolly going by it at like 120 kms an hour your not gonna notice anything . Im not even buying the hes a cop senario is there really anything you can not learn on tv or the internet now adays and from where iam from and near the london border in to the states maybe the wrong way all together not great at directions those sacs are potato sacs and london ont..which is the border right in to the states is potato country those berlap sacs are a dime a dozen....something a truck driver would haul constantly... just a thought.

 

[Soulmagent]

We don't know that yet. The source said it could have been an infant and I suspect all that person is going by is having seen what appeared to be very small remains being removed from the area. The information is not official and is probably very inaccurate, if it's not completely made up.

At least one of the people on that list I compiled was thought to be pregnant.

"One doesn't match the others. It's a young person, possibly as young as an infant, or a child," said the source, who is familiar with the investigation.

"If that's the case, then that wouldn't fit the pattern," the source added, suggesting that the victim may not be related to the other murders, believed to be the work of a serial killer.

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/child_slay_shock_F6ppvCWkouPkcrlTS608JL

BBM as young as an infant implies not a fetus.

But it is the Yellow link so who knows. Really the post was to correct the Baby fetus from the other case and not this one since as you said we dont know so I should have been specific but my opinoin was based on the wording of the yellow article.

The media makes it hard to be correct anymore.

 

[svpernin]

Bumping up this map of the locations of the bodies that wondergirl posted last night.

http://www.newsday.com/long-island/suffolk/location-of-bodies-in-gilgo-beach-1.2541830


Also bumping the link to the case archives compiled on crankycrankerson's photobucket.

http://s296.photobucket.com/albums/mm166/crankycrankerson/Ocean Parkway Murders -NY-/

wm

Thanks for linking to this map!! Why are we stuck on the sets of four thing? The map from Newsday shows that the LI victims were NOT dumped in sets of four. Yes, LE discovered them in sets of four, more or less (In Dec and within days in March/April) but the bodies were not placed in sets of four.

 

[waltzingmatilda]

Thanks for linking to this map!! Why are we stuck on the sets of four thing? The map from Newsday shows that the LI victims were NOT dumped in sets of four. Yes, LE discovered them in sets of four, more or less (In Dec and within days in March/April) but the bodies were not placed in sets of four.

I agree svpernin! I don't understand how in the world LE missed the 5th body (denoted in blue) which was so close to the 4 bodies they found in Dec. But there was snow on the ground at that time and it looks like it was placed further off the road than the others so maybe it was just hidden.

I am not so stuck on the groups of fours now that I have seen the maps of the LI and AC dumpsites. Ugh I hate that word...dumpsite.

MOO

wm

eta...I am no longer stuck on the bodies being evenly spaced even....

 

[minazoe]

Thanks for linking to this map!! Why are we stuck on the sets of four thing? The map from Newsday shows that the LI victims were NOT dumped in sets of four. Yes, LE discovered them in sets of four, more or less (In Dec and within days in March/April) but the bodies were not placed in sets of four.

if it is not the positioning of the bodies, and not groups of four, then what is the nexxus between the AC murders , other than prostitution?:waitasec:

 

[svpernin]

if it is not the positioning of the bodies, and not groups of four, then what is the nexxus between the AC murders , other than prostitution?:waitasec:

Very good question, minazoe! We desperately need more official info. So much is being left out and likely misreported.

 

[MrsG728]

Hi Everyone
I was away all weekend but I wanted to address certain topics as best I can, piece by piece. I will try to cite as much as I can!

This is to address the possibility of public transportation to the area.

In my opinion, public transportation was not taken.
Someone was discussing busing vs. taking cars to the beach area. Buses do not serve Oak/Gilgo beach. During the summer, the MTA/LIRR services Jones Beach from one bus line running from the Railroads. At the Jones Beach "needle"/"pencil", the buses turn around and cannot run on the Ocean Parkway.
On the Suffolk side, Suffolk County buses run to Robert Moses beaches only from a rail station (Babylon, mainland) and go across the causeway to the ocean beaches and back. A complicated system- set up purposely by the land developer, Robert Moses. In addition, since buses are serving a state parks system (which closes by 8pm) buses do not run after sundown.

"In the period from 1920 to 1970 the architect Robert Moses built overpasses across the parkways on Long Island by New York. Moses designed the overpasses to be so low that only cars could reach the recreational area of Jones Beach. That prevented African Americans and other low-income groups, who relied on buses for transportation, from going to Jones Beach"
http://www.dcdr.dk/uk/Menu/Update/Webzine/Articles/Designing+Means+Executing+Power

 

[nursebeeme]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/42534686/ns/us_news-crime_and_courts/

6 min video on latest search of jones beach

 

[minazoe]

Hi Everyone
I was away all weekend but I wanted to address certain topics as best I can, piece by piece. I will try to cite as much as I can!

This is to address the possibility of public transportation to the area.

In my opinion, public transportation was not taken.
Someone was discussing busing vs. taking cars to the beach area. Buses do not serve Oak/Gilgo beach. During the summer, the MTA/LIRR services Jones Beach from one bus line running from the Railroads. At the Jones Beach "needle"/"pencil", the buses turn around and cannot run on the Ocean Parkway.
On the Suffolk side, Suffolk County buses run to Robert Moses beaches only from a rail station (Babylon, mainland) and go across the causeway to the ocean beaches and back. A complicated system- set up purposely by the land developer, Robert Moses. In addition, since buses are serving a state parks system (which closes by 8pm) buses do not run after sundown.

"In the period from 1920 to 1970 the architect Robert Moses built overpasses across the parkways on Long Island by New York. Moses designed the overpasses to be so low that only cars could reach the recreational area of Jones Beach. That prevented African Americans and other low-income groups, who relied on buses for transportation, from going to Jones Beach"
http://www.dcdr.dk/uk/Menu/Update/Webzine/Articles/Designing+Means+Executing+Power

WOW!!! thank you for this...very interesting...

 

[carbuff]

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/child_slay_shock_F6ppvCWkouPkcrlTS608JL

BBM as young as an infant implies not a fetus.

But it is the Yellow link so who knows. Really the post was to correct the Baby fetus from the other case and not this one since as you said we dont know so I should have been specific but my opinoin was based on the wording of the yellow article.

The media makes it hard to be correct anymore.

You are right about it being hard to be correct. Just like the way the accurate map of where the bodies were found seems to have blown up most of the concerns about patterns of four.

And yes, it does imply a baby older than newborn, but on the other hand, if this information is coming from, say, the person at the morgue who held the door open while they brought the bodies in, the person might not have seen anything more than a very small body bag.

I think it's a mistake to read too much into the wording anybody uses in any of these articles or interviews. People in the grip of intense emotion don't always think about those implications; other people don't seem to have the language skills to be guilty of deliberately implying anything. Reporters in a rush to beat deadlines don't stop to think about the subtle distinctions among synonyms, even assuming they know the difference.

 

[nursebeeme]

http://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/119589259.html

 

[carbuff]

if it is not the positioning of the bodies, and not groups of four, then what is the nexxus between the AC murders , other than prostitution?:waitasec:

It's not even anything that's been made public about the way the bodies were left, which seems to be significantly different. Clothed versus not clothed, wrapped versus not wrapped (though maybe the wrapping was to replace the clothing?), call girls versus streetwalkers. They aren't even all petite and pretty.

But LE said they were looking into the connection almost as soon as they found the December bodies.

I assume -- there has to be -- something connecting them that was not released to the public.

 

[cluciano63]

I don't trust the NY Post at all. Will have to wait and see, but it is more controversial to indicate that a child's remains was found, than possibly an unborn fetus, so they may have run with that...

 

[carbuff]

I agree svpernin! I don't understand how in the world LE missed the 5th body (denoted in blue) which was so close to the 4 bodies they found in Dec. But there was snow on the ground at that time and it looks like it was placed further off the road than the others so maybe it was just hidden.

I am not so stuck on the groups of fours now that I have seen the maps of the LI and AC dumpsites. Ugh I hate that word...dumpsite.

MOO

wm

eta...I am no longer stuck on the bodies being evenly spaced even....

BBM, yes, I imagine it was just hidden. We had a very large blizzard in the northeast just a couple of days after Christmas. With the snow and dense brush, they probably couldn't even see the ground, let alone notice traces of evidence.

 

[MrsG728]

Snipped



Because it was widely reported that she was last seen going to met a client on fire island. Not oak beach now there has been reports of another client. Could have been a known client but I dont believe she had ever been though the gate before because she didnt say the name of the very well known place she was actually in.JMO
So if the only way to fire Island is by boat and foot then can one take a boat from fire island straight into Oakbeach without passing by a huge sign.

http://www.news12.com/articleDetail.jsp?regionId=2&articleId=268805&position=1&news_type=news

I dont know if it is important but it might be.

My Opinion Only:
She may have mistaken/not known where she was going, or where she was exactly. Relying on a driver does this to you.

However, previously mentioned, when a bunch of guys on FI rent a house and there is real "partying", sometimes they call for a girl or girls. So do some of the boaters who anchor in garbage cove, hemlock cove, etc. I know for a fact from Fire Island patrons and friends who have gone there during the summer that many of the girls are called at night and take a water taxi. These are little 17' motor boats that carry 3-4 people at most. They are expensive but it offers 24 hour transportation for people who aren't on a ferry schedule.
They order strippers too.

SG may have been to Fire Island earlier if her driver took her to Bay Shore for a water taxi. Possible? yes. Probable?....... :waitasec: