NY-Long Island-4 bodies on Beach-Possible Serial Killer-Dec 2010 #2

[Reannan]

At least this article seems to contain some details, like JB's full name and age.

SBM -
"J. A. B., 46, of 8 The Fairway, Oak Island, N.Y. was the last man to see Shannon Gilbert alive on May 1, 2010. He contacted her through Craigslists to attend a party at his home that night.......

She first refused to leave his home and then left the home screaming. She knocked on several neighbor’s door and called police.....

The last time she was seen she was reportedly running into the weeds on the beach."

http://www.examiner.com/city-hall-i...f-long-island-man-serial-murder-investigation

 

[Lifted]

At least this article seems to contain some details, like JB's full name and age.

SBM -
"J. A. B., 46, of 8 The Fairway, Oak Island, N.Y. was the last man to see Shannon Gilbert alive on May 1, 2010. He contacted her through Craigslists to attend a party at his home that night.......

She first refused to leave his home and then left the home screaming. She knocked on several neighbor’s door and called police.....

The last time she was seen she was reportedly running into the weeds on the beach."

http://www.examiner.com/city-hall-i...f-long-island-man-serial-murder-investigation

I wonder if the party was over at that time?

Was she the last one in the house?

Or were there other people at this "party" that backed up what the john told police?

I haven't seen that talked about, and I think it is a pretty important detail.

 

[Javabean]

Hi everyone! I was directed to this thread from another WS member, who thought I may be of assistance to you guys in some small way. I am around the age of the murdered girls, live in NYC (Manhattan), and in the past did independent 'escorting' through CL, so know quite a bit about the 'scene' and am not shy about answering any questions you may have LOL. I also have a few girlfriends who do or did the same thing - we're all white, middle class, educated (we all have advanced degrees), upwardly mobile individuals. None of us, as far as I know, were sexually abused as children, and none of us were coerced into it - it is a choice we all made on our own.
Anyway, since i now have a more socially accepted, 'regular' job I'm pretty busy these days but will try to check in and answer any questions anyone has, if you have any.

Surprisingly I know very little about this case but am going to go back and read the first thread to get caught up, but from a cursory read of the information available I feel this is definitely a john who killed these girls, not a pimp, and he is one of the types who hates prostitutes, for whatever reason. I came across a couple of these types during the 3 years I was an escort, and ran far away fast but to this day am continually harassed by one of them through e-mail - what he has written to me through email (I never actually met this guy, thank goodness, only talked to him on the phone and corresponded briefly through e-mail) reminds me of the way the killer harassed Melissa's family.

Anyway, it's a wonderful thing you all are doing to help get justice for these young girls, which they certainly deserve, and again, I'd love to help in any way if I can.

Thank you Mia! How wonderful of you to be open to sharing your experiences. I really commend you for this. What a welcome addition

PS: I'm just catching up on this thread so sorry for commenting on an older post, I just really wanted you to know that your insight will be really valuable!

 

[AmandaReckonwith]

"Party" probably means "hookup" in this case.


Case archive contains pics, vids, articles:
http://s296.photobucket.com/albums/mm166/crankycrankerson/Ocean%20Parkway%20Murders%20-NY-/

 

[scandi]

I think in our minds sometimes we like to believe that serial killers must be freaky looking and unable to fit in with society but really in many cases we have seen that is just not the case.

A lot of them are very unassuming fitting in with their area surroundings and community.

Now some of them of course are misfits and loners.

Their main goal other than killing is to go without detection and for a long time it works and that is the reason they are able to kill multiple people before they finally are caught.........if they ever are.

The FBI states the US has about 50 serial killers every year. It takes many years to finally catch them.

Also this particular killer may be have moved on too with isn't uncommon either. Not all are like Ridgeway or BTK. A lot of them will kill a few and then move to another town or state to do it all over again. Or after the search for Shannon began he has picked him another disposal site.

He really could be anyone.

I have read that the FBI profilers say most serial killers were grossly abused by their mothers as a child and the mother may have looked like the victims at that age. He displaces his hatred and rage for his mother onto these women that may remind him of her. The mothers are often domineering, cruel, highly promiscuous or even had been prostitutes themselves and exposed the serial killer to that growing up.

While serial killers are some of the worst on earth it is fascinating to read why the profilers believe they turned out that way.

I think this particular killer puts them there when the grass and brush is always tall and treacherous terrain. It would not surprise me though if he returns to look at the bodies that he has placed there. Serial killers seem to have some sick obessive connection with the victim's dead bodies.

I sure hope this is not one of those cases that goes unsolved. They need to be checking all over the country to see if how he left the bodies displayed in this case is like any other unsolved cases in other states that have multiple similar murders that have remained unsolved. Most of the time they will stick to the one MO they like but not always.

IMO

Hi Oceanblueeyes, It is so good to see you and thanks for the HELLO post.

Got me thinkin' that maybe the writer of Criminal Minds can figure out the case ;} {Yust Yokin'} xox

 

[tfrohning]

I wonder if the party was over at that time?

Was she the last one in the house?

Or were there other people at this "party" that backed up what the john told police?

I haven't seen that talked about, and I think it is a pretty important detail.

What if Shannon got text about leaving the house he be waiting for her.

I not talking the pimp someone she might turn down before in the gated community. He could had been stalking her and maybe she had a date with him before and didn't like him. I can't remember if her cell was found.:banghead:

 

[MrsG728]

I have to clear up a few inaccuracies that I think will help get rid of some of the "extra" information everyone has- and may help us narrow down a list of events.

It is very important that we all know and remember that Fire Island is NOT accessible by car. It looks that way on a map, but it is not. Shannan could have been going to FIre Island. BUT
If she was, she'd be leaving Bay Shore or Sayville on a Ferry. She wasn't near the ferry, and none of this makes any sense. Once you arrive on Fire Island, the ONLY ways to get around are on foot or if you RENT a bicycle.

The only access to Fire Island by car is a private access road guarded by parks police. You have to drive over the Captree Island Bridge into the Robert Moses Beaches/Park. Then, you have to drive through parking field 5 toward the lighthouse. There is a one-lane access road by permit only. This area, called Kismet, has a handful of year-rounders who live there, and it is very closely guarded.


The pink arrow on this map is the approximate area in which the bodies were found. The purple arrow shows the area, Kismet and its approximate access point. Notice the secret road isn't even on the map? it's private

This is about 6-8 MILES from Oak Beach, where Shannan allegedly ran around banging on the doors.

We should really discount the Fire Island story. It seems to be a mistake. if not, they have to really get down to brass tacks and interview the people who live there. There aren't many.

 

[Soulmagent]

Has it ever been said if any of these girls knew eachother?

Melissa's family was called after she went missing. Shannon seems to be aware someone is after her. Is it possible the murderer played games with these girls before they went missing.

 

[gngr~snap]

I do agree he blended in. DOT worker makes sense. Landscaping business maybe. What about a tow truck owner/operator, or maybe he drove a van and just slid the side door open, tossed the bodies never needing to exit the vehicle? Plenty of jobs out there that require vans. painters, telephone co, cable co... dog catchers?
MOO

 

[scandi]

"Party" probably means "hookup" in this case.


Case archive contains pics, vids, articles:
http://s296.photobucket.com/albums/mm166/crankycrankerson/Ocean%20Parkway%20Murders%20-NY-/

Amanda, is the John the guy who hires her for sex?

 

[Reannan]

I have to clear up a few inaccuracies that I think will help get rid of some of the "extra" information everyone has- and may help us narrow down a list of events.....

SBM - Wow MrsG!!! You have been a fantastic source of local information in this saga. How do you think the Fire Island story got started?? This case - at least the SG part of it has been SO poorly reported!!! Why can't the media get it straight??? Who are they getting their information from?? Is LE that confused, or is erroneous information being given out?? :waitasec:

 

[ElizaAvalon]

A few things...

1) "The John" is now living with his mother. Why?

2) LE keeps going back to search for Shannon. Not for more bodies, but for Shannon. It sounds to me like they are convinced that her body is somewhere in that underbrush.

Now, what are the odds that if her body is found nearby that her death is not related to the other bodies? It is just way too much of a coincidence for my brain to comprehend.

3) Ocean Parkway is a highway. I really do think that whoever dumped the bodies had to have familiarity with the highway and it's traffic patterns. In summer, there is a lot of traffic on that stretch of road in the day time.

I'm going with the John. For now.

And, one more thing - I haven't had time to look through all of the posts but has anyone looked into the fire on Ocean Parkway this past summer? http://www.news12.com/articleDetail.jsp?articleId=255396&position=1&news_type=news Around 50 seconds in you can see the firefighters putting out the fire on the north side of the road. I'm curious to know if any of the bodies were found where this fire was. And a about 3:45 you get a really good perspective of the area.

 

[scandi]

Has it ever been said if any of these girls knew eachother?

Melissa's family was called after she went missing. Shannon seems to be aware someone is after her. Is it possible the murderer played games with these girls before they went missing.

I don't think we've learned that yet. I did hear on TV today all 8 girls are about the same size and look very much alike. {HLN or NG}

Questions:

Did they all use Craig's List to hook up?
Were they all the same caliber prostitute, high-end, charging $250 an hour?

 

[ElizaAvalon]

Mrs. G - I don't know the "fire island" story but I have always called Robert Moses park "fire island", even though it is accessible by car.

However, you are right, most people do say "fire island" to mean those places that are accessible by ferry.

But Shannon was not from Long Island. So in talking to the John he may have mentioned Fire Island to put it in perspective if she were asking where Oak Beach was. It's all Fire Island after all.

 

[MrsG728]

SBM - Wow MrsG!!! You have been a fantastic source of local information in this saga. How do you think the Fire Island story got started?? This case - at least the SG part of it has been SO poorly reported!!! Why can't the media get it straight??? Who are they getting their information from?? Is LE that confused, or is erroneous information being given out?? :waitasec:

Thanks!
Fire Island is full of nice families on one end, and party animals on the other. People rent houses for the summer, so I am sure girls work out there all the time. I just don't think it matches up with SG's location.

 

[katydid23]

I don't know. It is also entirely possible that Shannan is totally unrelated to the serial killer and it is a "domestic" situation with her driver/pimp/boyfriend. That really makes more sense to me than any other scenario.

However, it has been said that Joe (the man who hired her that night) has been fully cooperative and has taken a polygraph. I know he did move, but that wasn't suspicious. After everything that happened I can't blame him. I am guessing his neighbors weren't real friendly.

Perhaps the results of the polygraph have something to do with why they feel he didn't do anything? LE seems to use them pretty frequently. Not that it means he is innocent, just that LE might perceive it that way if he passed. Gary Ridgeway passed a polygraph after victim #1 and that's how he got away with it for so long.

The Long Island serial killer has gotten away with 8 murders, at least. We do not know who those women were meeting before they were murdered. A huge part of the reason he hasn't been caught.

Shannan's driver knew the house, the name and talked to the man. That is a completely different situation than the other 8 victims.

Even if he WAS the killer I don't think he would have risked getting caught by killing Shannan at that point. Once he realized everyone knew who he was.

I don't think we KNOW the true story of the night Shannan disappeared.

However, there are people with police scanners.

Those people would also know the area.

Those people could have easily HEARD Shannan's call and got there in far less than 45 minutes. Victim of opportunity... so different circumstances than the other 8.

So yes... she could have just run into a killer while running away from someone else. If there is a guy in this small area who has already killed 8 women, it isn't too hard for me to believe he might have been in the area when Shannan was running away. Given the time of night it was, he may have been dumping a body and then spotted her.

WOW. How ironic that would be if she was so paranoid that she left the safety of this house only to run into the arms of a local serial killer waiting outside in the dark. Poor baby.

And I agree that whoever it was that was burying those women in that beachfront , they might have been 'hanging out' in their little cemetery and been right there when she was running scared.

 

[Soulmagent]

A few things...

1) "The John" is now living with his mother. Why?

2) LE keeps going back to search for Shannon. Not for more bodies, but for Shannon. It sounds to me like they are convinced that her body is somewhere in that underbrush.

Now, what are the odds that if her body is found nearby that her death is not related to the other bodies? It is just way too much of a coincidence for my brain to comprehend.

3) Ocean Parkway is a highway. I really do think that whoever dumped the bodies had to have familiarity with the highway and it's traffic patterns. In summer, there is a lot of traffic on that stretch of road in the day time.

I'm going with the John. For now.

And, one more thing - I haven't had time to look through all of the posts but has anyone looked into the fire on Ocean Parkway this past summer? http://www.news12.com/articleDetail.jsp?articleId=255396&position=1&news_type=news Around 50 seconds in you can see the firefighters putting out the fire on the north side of the road. I'm curious to know if any of the bodies were found where this fire was. And a about 3:45 you get a really good perspective of the area.

You bought up a very interesting point about them looking for Shannon. I have to wonder who she named and if Shannon is what is needed to tie all these murders to that person.

 

[trigger]

Has it ever been said if any of these girls knew eachother?

Melissa's family was called after she went missing. Shannon seems to be aware someone is after her. Is it possible the murderer played games with these girls before they went missing.

Its never been said if they knew each other, but that is a good thought.

I feel Shannon while running away went into someones back yard and slipped and fell into the water. Maybe she fell off someones dock? Im hoping anyway better that then being killed by this monster.

I'm wondering how this SK feels if he had nothing to do with Shannon.

Prayers for all these girls tonight. Some at least are coming home to their families. raying:

I don't think they ever found her cell phone, but she was holding it when she an from GC's home.

 

[Soulmagent]

I have to clear up a few inaccuracies that I think will help get rid of some of the "extra" information everyone has- and may help us narrow down a list of events.

It is very important that we all know and remember that Fire Island is NOT accessible by car. It looks that way on a map, but it is not. Shannan could have been going to FIre Island. BUT
If she was, she'd be leaving Bay Shore or Sayville on a Ferry. She wasn't near the ferry, and none of this makes any sense. Once you arrive on Fire Island, the ONLY ways to get around are on foot or if you RENT a bicycle.

The only access to Fire Island by car is a private access road guarded by parks police. You have to drive over the Captree Island Bridge into the Robert Moses Beaches/Park. Then, you have to drive through parking field 5 toward the lighthouse. There is a one-lane access road by permit only. This area, called Kismet, has a handful of year-rounders who live there, and it is very closely guarded.


The pink arrow on this map is the approximate area in which the bodies were found. The purple arrow shows the area, Kismet and its approximate access point. Notice the secret road isn't even on the map? it's private

This is about 6-8 MILES from Oak Beach, where Shannan allegedly ran around banging on the doors.

We should really discount the Fire Island story. It seems to be a mistake. if not, they have to really get down to brass tacks and interview the people who live there. There aren't many.

I am waiting for the Nancy grace transcripts because apparently it was mentioned in her 911 but NG reported on it as jones beach.

Anyway the long responce time reported from the 911 was said to have been because of her stating her location at the time as jones beach (I think NG meant FI) but at this point I dont know who made the mistakes but SG did not think she was in OAK beach.

 

[scandi]

Its never been said if they knew each other, but that is a good thought.

I feel Shannon while running away went into someones back yard and slipped and fell into the water. Maybe she fell off someones dock? Im hoping anyway better that then being killed by this monster.

I'm wondering how this SK feels if he had nothing to do with Shannon.

Prayers for all these girls tonight. Some at least are coming home to their families. raying:

I don't think they ever found her cell phone, but she was holding it when she an from GC's home.

Thanks Trigger as I hadn't heard that about her cell phone. That could be why LE keeps going back to where she was last seen, to find that phone. It would be invaluable to the investigation IMO and also maybe help trace her footsteps. If she went missing last May that is 6 mos till Nov. I don't know if a live tracking dog could capture her 'running' live scent after all that time.