OH OH - Brian Shaffer, 27, Columbus, 1 April 2006 - #2

[Deleted member 192280]

While this video came out two years after Brian disappeared, it's very instructive as to why someone close to a crime might refuse a polygraph and lawyer up immediately -- and why they would ask for immunity as a condition to conduct an interview with investigators. I think Clint's behavior is conservative and reasonable -- lucky him for having pro-active and savvy parents (or other advisers) to suggest this route.

If you haven't seen it, it's worth the 30 minutes: Don't talk to the cops.

Well, that in no way indicate any likelihood that Clint was innocent. MOST innocent people agree to polygraphs. MOST guilty ones prefer to avoid them.

 

[Brainy]

Well, that in no way indicate any likelihood that Clint was innocent. MOST innocent people agree to polygraphs. MOST guilty ones prefer to avoid them.

Not taking a polygraph doesn't suggest guilt, but considering everything else about this case and everything surrounding Clint... He surely does look guilty. Whether he is or not... We may never find that out due to lack of evidence/motive/witnesses/etc.


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[Deleted member 192280]

Not taking a polygraph doesn't suggest guilt, but considering everything else about this case and everything surrounding Clint... He surely does look guilty. Whether he is or not... We may never find that out due to lack of evidence/motive/witnesses/etc.


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Could you (or anyone else) show me a link to the source that says Clint went to BS's apartment for 6 hours after his disappearance, please?

Also, some posts mentioned some video(?) in which Clint was speaking about the case, where is the video?

Also I googled and found Dateline page but the video is not working (it shows something else, O.J. Simpson etc)

To add:
I absolutely don't think he wanted to disappear, even less that Clint was helping him to disappear: it would be totally unnecessary for him/them to do so while in a bar with so many people around, and at least another friend Meredith. If he wanted to disappear, he could do so by simply leaving his apartment. And if Clint wanted to help him disappear, then doing that by first showing up together in the bars would be one of the most stupid way to accomplish it.

I suppose Meredith took lie detector test, since I read that everyone except Clint did? I wonder between the time Brian became separated from the Clint and Meredith and the bar closing time, was Meredith always with Clint? Did Clint disappear from the view of Meredith during that time?

 

[Deleted member 192280]

Not sure if this had been addressed in the thread:

From http://www.dispatch.com/content/sto...-years-later-brian-shaffer-still-missing.html

Looking back, she [Alexis Waggoner] finds it odd that a few days before that night in the bar, Brian told her to move on and find someone else, because he was struggling with his mom’s death. And that a couple of weeks before that, he asked her to “just go away” with him.
“It almost feels like this all happened to someone else,” she said. “It was all in a different life for me.”

Regardless, I still want to know more about Clint...

 

[Brainy]

Could you (or anyone else) show me a link to the source that says Clint went to BS's apartment for 6 hours after his disappearance, please?

Also, some posts mentioned some video(?) in which Clint was speaking about the case, where is the video?

Also I googled and found Dateline page but the video is not working (it shows something else, O.J. Simpson etc)

To add:
I absolutely don't think he wanted to disappear, even less that Clint was helping him to disappear: it would be totally unnecessary for him/them to do so while in a bar with so many people around, and at least another friend Meredith. If he wanted to disappear, he could do so by simply leaving his apartment. And if Clint wanted to help him disappear, then doing that by first showing up together in the bars would be one of the most stupid way to accomplish it.

I suppose Meredith took lie detector test, since I read that everyone except Clint did? I wonder between the time Brian became separated from the Clint and Meredith and the bar closing time, was Meredith always with Clint? Did Clint disappear from the view of Meredith during that time?

This thread is long. I don't know where all the links are on top of my head. I have to go back in the thread to find the sources you're talking about. I will try to find them once I'm on my PC.


Yes, I don't think Brian staged his own disappearance. There are just too many things that don't add up, and I think they are suggestive of foul play.


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[Brainy]

. Here is the picture of him and Clint from Brian's Facebook . Here's the link to his full profile: https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=12446335

This is a repost for anyone interested.
Clint & Brian, from Brian's FB page. I don't think I can access the page. Brian's fb doesn't seem to be available anymore.

 

[Brainy]

http://www.magcloud.com/browse/issue/900141

Neesaki posted this on 7-4-17, report comes from March 2015 edition of Ohio Missing Dispatch and this is what it says on page 16:

"Reports indicate that Clint went to Brian's apartment on the day of his disappearance and spent 6 hours waiting for him to come home. It is unknown why he did this or what he did at the apartment. Clint moved to Tennessee in May of 2006. In June of 2006 Randy took a polygraph test and passed. The test was also offered to Clint and Meredith. Clint refused to take the test . In 2008 Randy was told by Clint's attorney that he would speak on the case if he was granted immunity. The following year Clint referred an email to his lawyer that was sent by a private investigator that took on the case. The lawyer responded that they have no reason to believe that Brian is dead and did not have any further comments."

 

[Brainy]

COMPILED RELEVANT SOURCES

1. Brian’s facebook page – no longer available? It was available not that long ago. Wonder what happened to it. Can someone verify?

2. Clint’s facebook page
https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=12446836

3. Brian’s myspace page
https://myspace.com/sleepinggiant

4. Dateline video
http://www.nbcnews.com/id/12689476/ns/dateline_nbc/t/thin-air/#.WYb57ogrLIV

5. Jerry Revish’s article about Brian
http://www.10tv.com/article/search-brian-shaffer-enters-10th-year


Note: you can also search this thread if you’re looking for particular info. It’s in the right upper corner of this thread. That's what I did and that's what everyone does here. Smr, if you're truly researching, be prepared to spend countless hours of your time looking and digging into more info.

 

[neesaki]

I'm fairly sure this has already been brought up, I just don't recall for certain. But do we know if it was possible to mess with the video cameras, as in delete / erase footage?

 

[Brainy]

I'm fairly sure this has already been brought up, I just don't recall for certain. But do we know if it was possible to mess with the video cameras, as in delete / erase footage?

Neesaki - good point! I was just reading a thread on reddit and someone asked the same question. There doesn't seem to be any knowledge about missing footage from what we know so far from the LE. But again, I can't say for sure as I am not an individual who has directly worked on this case or have seen the actual footage.

 

[Rose554]

New here, even though this is an old case, something about it pulls me in deep. It may be because I relate to Brian as I am a medical student myself. I only heard of this case recently, I was young when it happened, but I have read pretty much all the theories.

It seems there are two types of people, the ones who love to use their imagination and take leaps of faith, and those who use logic and resort to Occam’s razor. Although every theory is possible, it is unlikely that Brian is still alive. I think the chance that he is still alive is so minuscule that it’s not worth putting too much thought into. I believe Brian died that night and has been dead ever since, and his girlfriend at the time, AW, also believes he is dead. I don’t think Brian wanted or planned to die that night, for some reason I think it was an unexpected and brief death, either by foul play or by accident, both are plausible.

Two things that throw people off with this case and leads them into all sorts of crazy theories are the cameras and his friend Clint, but I think those two are both red herrings. When you have alcohol and it’s late at night and you separate from your group, a lot of things can go wrong. Usually nothing too bad happens, but there are always cases where a drunken night of fun ends in tragedy, in this case, we simply haven’t found the body yet, and might not ever find the body. That to me is what makes the case so sad.

Let me know if there are any flaws, but I think something terrible happened to Brian that night, and he happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time. Just a few wrong -or even random- choices that night, led to the end of his life. The scary part is how things like that could happen to you or me, without any forewarning, here one minute and gone the next.

 

[Deleted member 192280]

http://www.magcloud.com/browse/issue/900141

Neesaki posted this on 7-4-17, report comes from March 2015 edition of Ohio Missing Dispatch and this is what it says on page 16:

"Reports indicate that Clint went to Brian's apartment on the day of his disappearance and spent 6 hours waiting for him to come home. It is unknown why he did this or what he did at the apartment. Clint moved to Tennessee in May of 2006. In June of 2006 Randy took a polygraph test and passed. The test was also offered to Clint and Meredith. Clint refused to take the test . In 2008 Randy was told by Clint's attorney that he would speak on the case if he was granted immunity. The following year Clint referred an email to his lawyer that was sent by a private investigator that took on the case. The lawyer responded that they have no reason to believe that Brian is dead and did not have any further comments."

Brainy, thanks a ton for digging out this and other important posts!! (I've colored and bold-faced it for easy future finding):gthanks:

But do we know if it was possible to mess with the video cameras, as in delete / erase footage?

I wondered about that, too, esp. I read somewhere last night that the bar told employees that anyone who tells anything about the case to outside would be fired. It's definitely possible to delete or edit footage, but it's up to the LE to find that out.

About the mysterious entry in Brian's father Randy's obituary guestbook in the name of Brian, from "Virgin Islands", even though it's not actually from Virgin Islands, I still wonder who would do that and why. I doubt it's some random stranger just did it for crazy reasons. The mysterious secrecy makes me think it could be someone who was either in some way involved in BS's disappearance, or was knowledgeable of what happened to BS or his whereabouts (dead or alive). Using public library computer to make Internet posts is a common thing for people to do who don't want to be identified as the author of the posts.

If it was someone involved in BS's disappearance, then it could be a guilty feeling that motivated the guestbook. It would be unlikely posted with malicious intent, since there had not been other mysterious "contact" made in Brian's name before (and after) that guestbook entry---why would a malicious-meaning person only choose this one occasion and by posting a mourning message?

Another observation: Between the last video of BS talking to 2 girls at 1:55am and the bar closing at 2 am, there were only 5 minutes. Whatever happened, happened during that very brief time period.

I read from the discussion at the Pear Jam site (a lot of discussions about the case as Brian was a fan) that both Meredith and Clint changed their stories many times about what happened. Also that Brian did not like Meredith, who's a friend of Clint, and that Brian once told Clint not to have her around him ("him", I suppose to be Brian himself).

 

[dotr]

Could you (or anyone else) show me a link to the source that says Clint went to BS's apartment for 6 hours after his disappearance, please?

Also, some posts mentioned some video(?) in which Clint was speaking about the case, where is the video?

Also I googled and found Dateline page but the video is not working (it shows something else, O.J. Simpson etc)

To add:
I absolutely don't think he wanted to disappear, even less that Clint was helping him to disappear: it would be totally unnecessary for him/them to do so while in a bar with so many people around, and at least another friend Meredith. If he wanted to disappear, he could do so by simply leaving his apartment. And if Clint wanted to help him disappear, then doing that by first showing up together in the bars would be one of the most stupid way to accomplish it.

I suppose Meredith took lie detector test, since I read that everyone except Clint did? I wonder between the time Brian became separated from the Clint and Meredith and the bar closing time, was Meredith always with Clint? Did Clint disappear from the view of Meredith during that time?

RBBM.
It came from neesaki's posted link

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...lumbus-1-April-2006-2&p=13476585#post13476585

Hi Brainy, this came from the March 2015 edition of the Ohio Missing Dispatch. On page 16, it states

Reports indicate that Clint went to Brian's apartment on the day of his disappearance and spent 6 hours waiting for him to come home. It is unknown why he did this or what he did at the apartment. Clint moved to Tennessee in May of 2006. In June of 2006 Randy took a polygraph test and passed. The test was also offered to Clint and Meredith. Clint refused to take the test . In 2008 Randy was told by Clint's attorney that he would speak on the case if he was granted immunity. The following year Clint referred an email to his lawyer that was sent by a private investigator that took on the case. The lawyer responded that they have no reason to believe that Brian is dead and did not have any further comments.

http://www.magcloud.com/webviewer/900141?__r=563315&s=w

ETA, Thanks, Just noticed that the link was already found, I type slowly!

 

[KeepCalm]

Does anybody know if the Greyhound bus station had camera's back then and if they ever looked there for clues?

 

[Deleted member 192280]

Here is one thought I have re the Randy obituary guestbook post from "Brian (US virgin Islands)", combined with member CARIIS's suspicion of gay relationship (about a month ago some 50 pages back):

It could be posted by (or on behalf of) Clint, where he chose "Virgin Islands" solely for the meaning of the word "virgin", whatever was in his mind that had to do with Brian's disappearance.

Or, however unlikely, we can't say for sure it's not possible that, it could be by or on behalf of Brian if he was, in fact, alive. If he was alive, it would make perfect sense that he mourned his dad's passing and wanted to express it in the guestbook. (The only fact making it a hoax is that it's not posted from the Virgin Islands.)

For anyone who was simply seeking attention, there had been million chances and occasions for them to do so other than posting on the obituary guestbook. Think about some other crime cases where the perp made mysterious phone calls or sent mysterious letters/stuffs to the victims' family every once in a while.

 

[Brainy]

Here is one thought I have re the Randy obituary guestbook post from "Brian (US virgin Islands)", combined with member CARIIS's suspicion of gay relationship (about a month ago some 50 pages back):

It could be posted by (or on behalf of) Clint, where he chose "Virgin Islands" solely for the meaning of the word "virgin", whatever was in his mind that had to do with Brian's disappearance.

Or, however unlikely, we can't say for sure it's not possible that, it could be by or on behalf of Brian if he was, in fact, alive. If he was alive, it would make perfect sense that he mourned his dad's passing and wanted to express it in the guestbook. (The only fact making it a hoax is that it's not posted from the Virgin Islands.)

For anyone who was simply seeking attention, there had been million chances and occasions for them to do so other than posting on the obituary guestbook. Think about some other crime cases where the perp made mysterious phone calls or sent mysterious letters/stuffs to the victims' family every once in a while.

Smr, I think you're missing the point here a bit... Just because there was a message claiming to be from Brian for one certain occasion and not another doesn't give a special meaning why there was a message in the first place.

People do some crazy **** for attention, be it good or bad intent. I remember there was a girl from NC abducted in the 80s and a sick person kept sending torturous letters to the family making one believe that he was the killed. Finally, he was caught and there was no way he could have been the killer. Some people just do things to just do those things, and there isn't a deep thoughtful answer to attach meaning to their bizarre behaviors. Some people just aren't right in their heads.

So, no, I personally don't believe that Brian (if alive, which I don't believe to be the case) sent that message. It was sent from a Columbus public library. I just think it was definitely someone local that wanted to draw attention for whatever reasons they had. Perhaps to cause people to talk about this case more or perhaps feel significant in some way. I don't know. This is just a speculation. Personally, I don't want to spend extra time on this idle obituary post... simply because it doesn't mean anything and accomplishes nothing but distraction.


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[Brainy]

Smr, regarding Meredith, Clint and Brian... Yes it looks like (from what I've read) that Brian certainly wasn't fond of Meredith but it wasn't like they were enemies, so I am not inclined to focus my attention in Meredith as much. She appears to be nothing more than a very distant acquaintance to offer nothing of substance to help this case.

It's possible that Clint and Meredith weren't next to each other at all times during that night which could be the reason why their stories contradict one another. To be honest, people remember things, especially routine, trivial things differently. So, I can see why there could have been some discrepancy in their stories. Look, I cannot tell you what they have exactly told the police, I'm just trying to be objective while remaining realistic considering everything involved.

Clint... Yeah, he is certainly an interesting character in all these, and some of this behavior is plain strange. I don't want to go long on this... I think the oddity of his behavior has been discussed to death here. But, yes, he is certainly someone that I can't let go as a person of interest.


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[Brainy]

Also, I can't tell you how reliable is the thought that the bar threatened to fire the employees if they shared any info. I can tell you for 100% that I saw this in a reddit comment, so I don't believe it's anything more than a rumor.

I have never seen any information from a bar worker that was employed there at the time who could confirm this info.


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[Brainy]

Does anybody know if the Greyhound bus station had camera's back then and if they ever looked there for clues?

No idea what was the extend of surveillance camera investigation beyond the bar, and Columbus PD has not been willing to share much either. No idea unless LE comes forward with info. Until then, it's all just questions... more questions...


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[Deleted member 192280]

I realize that it's highly unlikely, just wondering if anyone else sees a possible resemblance between "John" and Brian? As soon as I saw this, it reminded me of the photos of Brian with a beard.

http://www.missingpersonsofamerica.com/2016/12/05/missing-men-mexico-do-you-recognize-them/

That does resemble him, and the age is about right.

Clint and Brian were former roommates, had a long history of being friends, Alexis didn't like Clint, Clint didn't like Alexis. Brian had to break the news to his guy friends that evening... in the first year or two after the disappearance, there were rumors of a relationship (of some sort-it could've been one sided) between Clint and Brian. Of course these were only rumors… but In consideration of Clint's strange actions both the day after, and in the months after, it does raise some questions about what was going on there. One theory, is that Clint and Brian met up after leaving the bar... perhaps they did some drugs, or perhaps only alcohol...maybe a passion fueled fight occurred...and Brian could have died accidentally...Clint covered it all up beginning the night of and continuing during the 6 hours at Brian's apartment the following day.


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I wonder if LE checked the videos of other bars in the area that night? If they went to another bar they may be captured in the videos. Similarly, elsewhere...?